Genetic bottleneck and Noah's ark

[fncceo]

Genetic bottle neck makes sense if the human population was, tens of thousands of years ago, reduced to a few thousands.

It wouldn't make sense if it was reduced to eight people six thousand years ago.

 

[Newtonian]

Genetic bottle neck makes sense if the human population was, tens of thousands of years ago, reduced to a few thousands.

It wouldn't make sense if it was reduced to eight people six thousand years ago.

As the link I posted noted, the evidence is not clear on this. However a bottleneck of a few thousand people is not much of a bottleneck.

I am off to sleep dreaming of flowers- why not take a break and note the flowers in my previous post!

Botany is a wonderful science!

 

[harmonica]

n

god just did it .....didn't he ? like a Star Trek Energizer??
View attachment 340757

Hmmm harmonica - maybe there was a harmonica on Noah's ark! I like star trek too, btw.

Well, actually, God did not construct the ark and he only gave Noah very basic instructions.

Noah was free to build the ark within those guidelines and he could even renovate it while on the ark!

Bottom line: Noah did it, not God.

Noah had several hundred years as a master woodworker and plenty of money(used to be called gold/silver)

Not so sure about money vs. barter. But the tools Noah likely had access to are hinted at here:

Genesis 4:22
Also, Zilʹlah gave birth to Tuʹbal-cain, who forged every sort of tool of copper and iron. And the sister of Tuʹbal-cain was Naʹa·mah.

Now what tools were available at Noah's time is a subject for historical research - feel free you all to post on that. But "every sort of tool of copper and iron" likely included hammers among many other possible tools.

The main point is that Noah had the means and materials to build the ark.

However, as I am tired but having trouble sleeping, I would prefer posting at this moment about flowers rather than hammers or a genetic bottleneck! So, in my next post I will post on the organic gardening Noah and his family likely enjoyed.

why are you quoting the bible?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

As the link I posted noted, the evidence is not clear on this.

Oh, it's pretty clear, but it occured more than 100,000 years ago. Before boats and such.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

However a bottleneck of a few thousand people is not much of a bottleneck.

Yes it is. A bottleneck of 10,000 is significant. And it is something we could detect today, if it only happened 10,000 years ago.

 

[Asclepias]

If one uses the bible the only conclusion you can come to is that Noah was Black. There is no way in hell a white family is going to give rise to the Black people in Africa. Recessive genes dont make dominant ones. Its the other way around. Before the white supremacist model came into being the ME was considered part of Africa by the Greeks.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

If one uses the bible the only conclusion you can come to is that Noah was Black. There is no way in hell a white family is going to give rise to the Black people in Africa. Recessive genes dont make dominant ones. Its the other way around. Before the white supremacist model came into being the ME was considered part of Africa by the Greeks.

Oh, but you see, you are forgetting about magic! The Tower of Babel incident explains that. It also helped white people believe they were superior to brown people for...well, until now, in many cases.

 

[fncceo]

If one uses the bible the only conclusion you can come to is that Noah was Black. There is no way in hell a white family is going to give rise to the Black people in Africa. Recessive genes dont make dominant ones. Its the other way around. Before the white supremacist model came into being the ME was considered part of Africa by the Greeks.

Good job, Man

 

[Asclepias]

If one uses the bible the only conclusion you can come to is that Noah was Black. There is no way in hell a white family is going to give rise to the Black people in Africa. Recessive genes dont make dominant ones. Its the other way around. Before the white supremacist model came into being the ME was considered part of Africa by the Greeks.

Good job, Man

View attachment 341419

Well he had to be darker than that. His sons were Ham and Cush. Both names mean burnt Black and Black as a raven. Canaan was a little lighter maybe like most African and African american families.

 

[fncceo]

If one uses the bible the only conclusion you can come to is that Noah was Black. There is no way in hell a white family is going to give rise to the Black people in Africa. Recessive genes dont make dominant ones. Its the other way around. Before the white supremacist model came into being the ME was considered part of Africa by the Greeks.

Good job, Man

View attachment 341419

Well he had to be darker than that. His sons were Ham and Cush. Both names mean burnt Black and Black as a raven. Canaan was a little lighter maybe like most African and African american families.

He had a high yellow mama.

 

[Newtonian]

n

god just did it .....didn't he ? like a Star Trek Energizer??
View attachment 340757

Hmmm harmonica - maybe there was a harmonica on Noah's ark! I like star trek too, btw.

Well, actually, God did not construct the ark and he only gave Noah very basic instructions.

Noah was free to build the ark within those guidelines and he could even renovate it while on the ark!

Bottom line: Noah did it, not God.

Noah had several hundred years as a master woodworker and plenty of money(used to be called gold/silver)

Not so sure about money vs. barter. But the tools Noah likely had access to are hinted at here:

Genesis 4:22
Also, Zilʹlah gave birth to Tuʹbal-cain, who forged every sort of tool of copper and iron. And the sister of Tuʹbal-cain was Naʹa·mah.

Now what tools were available at Noah's time is a subject for historical research - feel free you all to post on that. But "every sort of tool of copper and iron" likely included hammers among many other possible tools.

The main point is that Noah had the means and materials to build the ark.

However, as I am tired but having trouble sleeping, I would prefer posting at this moment about flowers rather than hammers or a genetic bottleneck! So, in my next post I will post on the organic gardening Noah and his family likely enjoyed.

why are you quoting the bible?

You are actually asking that question of one of Jehovah's Witnesses?

The dimensions and other details about Noah's ark are in the Bible, as is the genetic bottleneck at the last catastrophy.

 

[fncceo]

You are actually asking that question of one of Jehovah's Witnesses?

Good thing you don't live in Jersey ... they don't like witnesses there.

 

[Newtonian]

If one uses the bible the only conclusion you can come to is that Noah was Black. There is no way in hell a white family is going to give rise to the Black people in Africa. Recessive genes dont make dominant ones. Its the other way around. Before the white supremacist model came into being the ME was considered part of Africa by the Greeks.

Actually, no race is black - rather various shades of brown.

There is no white race either - just put a so-called white persons hand net to newly fallen snow for proof.

The reference to white and black may be due to racism - I'm not sure why even the United States Census refers to a white race since no such race exists on planet earth, let alone in the United States!

The genetic bottleneck forced all kinds of traits out but you are correct that mostly recessive traits are forced out. There are also semi-dominant traits. And epigenetic coding needs to be factored in as well.

The 3 major branches of races are from Shem. Ham and Japheth. However, the differences are primarily due to their wives since these brothers were of the same family.

 

[Newtonian]

A

You are actually asking that question of one of Jehovah's Witnesses?

Good thing you don't live in Jersey ... they don't like witnesses there.

View attachment 341498

Are you a witness to that fact?

 

[Newtonian]

However a bottleneck of a few thousand people is not much of a bottleneck.

Yes it is. A bottleneck of 10,000 is significant. And it is something we could detect today, if it only happened 10,000 years ago.

I think you are forgetting that all human races descend from two people: the mitochondrial Eve and the Y-chromosomal Adam. (Acts 17:26) Of course, there are also extinct races that came from them as well. That all current races come from 6 people is consistent with all original races coming from two people.

 

[Newtonian]

Well, I see most you are not into organic gardening since my posts on organic gardening on Noah's ark have not been responded to. Maybe I should transfer to a thread in the gardening forum section - what do you all think?

Perhaps some of you are into food? Noah and his family had to bring food onto the ark as well - all kinds of food!

Genesis 6:21,22
For your part, you are to collect and take with you every kind of food to eat,+ to serve as food for you and for the animals.”
22 And Noah did according to all that God had commanded him. He did just so.+

Every kind of food - yum! Note that all animals and man were only authorized to eat vegetation - see Genesis 1:29,30. Good thing, because vegetarian manures are excellent fertilizers for those window boxes!

Now, it may be that Noah brought 2 Apple pies onto the ark (or 7?) but how would they have apple pies for a whole year? Apple pies are perishable - no doubt they had a veritable feast for a week with perishable foods. And there are foods like tomatoes that can last for up to a month as they can ripen over that time period. Other fruits can last longer - including apples. But a year is pushing it for apples!

I think the answer for pies is jellies and jams. Sugar is a good preservative - including honey. So is salt. I think Noah likely brought plenty of honey onto the ark. Honey can easily last a full year.

And perishable is relative. Most fruits can be made to 'perish' by fermentation into all kinds of alchoholic beverages! Not sure how much wine or other fermented drinks Noah brought onto the ark.

There are also dried fruits that keep well - raisins, prunes, dates, figs, apricots, etc.

And, like honey, they take less space. I mean, how much wine could fit into 1,400,000 cubic feet of space???

 

[harmonica]

n

god just did it .....didn't he ? like a Star Trek Energizer??
View attachment 340757

Hmmm harmonica - maybe there was a harmonica on Noah's ark! I like star trek too, btw.

Well, actually, God did not construct the ark and he only gave Noah very basic instructions.

Noah was free to build the ark within those guidelines and he could even renovate it while on the ark!

Bottom line: Noah did it, not God.

Noah had several hundred years as a master woodworker and plenty of money(used to be called gold/silver)

Not so sure about money vs. barter. But the tools Noah likely had access to are hinted at here:

Genesis 4:22
Also, Zilʹlah gave birth to Tuʹbal-cain, who forged every sort of tool of copper and iron. And the sister of Tuʹbal-cain was Naʹa·mah.

Now what tools were available at Noah's time is a subject for historical research - feel free you all to post on that. But "every sort of tool of copper and iron" likely included hammers among many other possible tools.

The main point is that Noah had the means and materials to build the ark.

However, as I am tired but having trouble sleeping, I would prefer posting at this moment about flowers rather than hammers or a genetic bottleneck! So, in my next post I will post on the organic gardening Noah and his family likely enjoyed.

why are you quoting the bible?

You are actually asking that question of one of Jehovah's Witnesses?

The dimensions and other details about Noah's ark are in the Bible, as is the genetic bottleneck at the last catastrophy.

the bible is just a book of fairytales....

 

[Newtonian]

And flour - guess what my favorite flower is? Would you believe whole wheat?

Many forget there are other ways to bring food into the ark - at Christmas many use cut trees which last a considerable time - especially if the base is in water (or a solution). Besides the 4 rooted trees, I think Noah may have brought 100 or more cut trees of various sizes and varieties onto the ark. These could have served multiple purposes:

1. For food - Koalas like Eucalyptus which also have health benefits for humans - see:

Eucalyptus: What are the health benefits?

Eucalyptus may have antioxidant and antibacterial properties, and has potential uses in dentistry, pain relief, and the relief of cold symptoms. Learn more here.

www.medicalnewstoday.com

Also fruits will keep better on cut trees and branches.

Likewise, vines with fruit.

2. For perching (birds) and climbing (cats, sloths, monkeys, etc.)

3. After dying and drying -they could serve as lumber for window boxes and rafts.

4. For fuel. to bake those apple pies - ah - the fragrance!

SAVEPIN ITSEE MORE IMAGES
Credit: jaboo2foto/Shutterstock
Imagine being able to walk into your backyard, pick a fresh avocado,

Or, walk into the middle level huge tree room on Noah's ark and pick avocados from cut branches laden with fruit! Just click on the + for the image.

 

[Hollie]

If one uses the bible the only conclusion you can come to is that Noah was Black. There is no way in hell a white family is going to give rise to the Black people in Africa. Recessive genes dont make dominant ones. Its the other way around. Before the white supremacist model came into being the ME was considered part of Africa by the Greeks.

Good job, Man

View attachment 341419

Westerners are much more comfortable with the white guy they invented as the jeebus.

 

[Newtonian]

If one uses the bible the only conclusion you can come to is that Noah was Black. There is no way in hell a white family is going to give rise to the Black people in Africa. Recessive genes dont make dominant ones. Its the other way around. Before the white supremacist model came into being the ME was considered part of Africa by the Greeks.

Good job, Man

View attachment 341419

Westerners are much more comfortable with the white guy they invented as the jeebus.

View attachment 341540

As your illustration illustrates, there are no white races. Or black races for that matter.

But what about flowers? Daylily varieties approach both white and black as well, but no pure white or pure black daylily flowers have been bred so far.

Back to topic: Noah may have brought some daylilies onto the ark including bare root for later planting as well as small seedlings more easily fit in the c. 333 window boxes. I propose seedlings 6'' apart in one of the rows of 3 window boxes and 4 full grown daylilies in bloom, in one row 1 foot apart in each of 3 other window boxes. The latter will be on the inner edge of the boxes with leaves trailing over the inner edge into the 6' high gardening path (the other 9 feet will be for mostly mushroom gardens though the top of these may have extremely shade tolerant plants like philodendron, snake plant and ivy. Plenty of cream of mushroom soup on Noah's ark! Not to mention salads with mushrooms, mushroom topped Pizza, etc.

Most daylily cultivars today are bred for color - but there are highly fragrant varieties as well. They are shade tolerant but for best blooms considerable light is necessary. Some continue blooming at night - but, as their name suggests, most bloom only during daylight - each flower lasts just one day but there are many buds on each flower spike. Note:

Edible Daylilies - Identifying and Gathering Edible Day Lilies

Edible daylilies, Hemerocallis fulva, grow wild in most of the US. You can eat the flowers, flower buds, young stalks and tubers.

honest-food.net

"
Photo by Holly A. Heyser
Daylilies are not only edible, they are spectacular. After sampling the flowers, flower buds, young stalks and root tubers, I’ve come to the conclusion that they’re so tasty I may grow them as a food crop.

Let me start by saying that edible daylilies are the common daylily, Hemerocallis fulva, as well as its various Hemerocallis friends and relatives; there are thousands. What I am most definitely not talking about are bona fide lilies, like the Easter lily, which, if you are unfortunate enough to eat, you had better hope that the Resurrection is real…"

A few cultivars from:

Products Archive

www.gilberthwild.com

Daylily Bela Lugosi




Daylily Always Afternoon


Daylily Belle Cook


Daylily August Frost


Daylily Tiger Blood

And there are near black varieties as well.