Free to choose

[Intense]

Just curious Sweetie, what role do you think the State plays in the corruption of finance and banking??? Who do you think the silent partner is??? Who benefits on every side of the equation???

 

[masquerade]

More than any other American, Friedman, who won the Nobel Prize in economics in 1976, clearly warned the world about the unintended consequences of big government.


We all know how worthless a Nobel Prize is......its all political

Let us all know when you inform your buddy Gore of this.

"We've become increasingly dependent on government," said Friedman. "We've surrendered power to government; nobody has taken it from us. It's our doing. The results – monumental government spending, much of it wasted, little of it going to the people whom we would like to see helped."

That's from Friedman's PBS TV series "Free to Choose," which aired 30 years ago and became the basis of his No. 1 best-seller by the same name.

Friedman is right, we have become dependent on government....

To protect our food and water supplies
To provide a safe working environment
To ensure equal rights for all Americans
To provide our national defense
To provide basic protections if we become sick or injured

Nasty Gubmint

To your own detriment because you have essentially admitted that you are too much of a pussy to accept the fact that you have the god given ability to provide most of those things for yourself. And the fact is government has gone far beyond those things in terms of sticking its nose in the business of the people. It just amazes me that we have people in this country that actually defend having their freedom taken away.

Oh really??

I have a god given ability to stop industries from poluting the air and water?
I can protect my home from a foreign invasion?
I can prevent people from discriminating against me if I am black, gay or a woman?
If I become injured on the job or sick, I can prevent them from firing me?

Some god you have there

I'd rather deal with my life's problems, than have the government take care of me.

 

[sweetie]

INDENSE, you obvious republicrat monetary ignoramuss, you obviously have a problem with some of the MANY words i posted...could you please FOCUS and merely copy and paste those specific words so that i may expose you further as a brainwashed republicrat monetary ignoramus..

 

[Intense]

INDENSE, you obvious republicrat monetary ignoramuss, you obviously have a problem with some of the MANY words i posted...could you please FOCUS and merely copy and paste those specific words so that i may expose you further as a brainwashed republicrat monetary ignoramus..

First off Sparky, I'm independent, I lean Conservative. Second off you really do buy in, hook, line, and sinker, to the Oligarchy Puppet Masters. Individual Liberty and voice, as opposed to your programmed response.

Answer me what this document has to do with Federalism in any way??? Seems more like a smoking gun to me. The legitimization of an Unholy Marriage. You keep thinking that more Government is the answer, when it plays the role of the co-conspirator, outside of the consent of the governed. Got it. The consent of the governed. Sock Puppet.

Hamilton: The Constitutionality of the Bank of the United States, 1791

 

[Bern80]

..a brief primer for you republicrat monetary ignoramusses like BERN 80..

A Privatised Money Supply: Modern Banking and the Fractional Reserve System

"A Privatised Money Supply

Modern Banking and the Fractional Reserve System

Do you know where the bank gets the $160,000 for your mortgage? It's very simple. Someone walks over to a computer and types 160,000 beside your name. With only $27.93 of cash reserves for every $10,000 of assets (as of June 1999) the bank has just created the remaining $159,553 of that interest-earning money out of thin air. When, after 25 years of hard work, you pay off your mortgage, the $159,553 vanishes back into thin air. Not so the interest however. It vanishes into the banker's pocket. Chartered (i.e. privately owned) banks, such as The Bank of Montreal, The Royal Bank, The CIBC, etc. have created about 95 percent of our total money supply ($589.1 billion as of Sept 1999) in exactly this way. But the cash reserves in their vaults amount to only a paltry $3.893 billion. (About $32 billion of cash circulates in public hands.) This is called fractional reserve banking, and it's the greatest scam of all time because it creates debt for no reason other than to enrich the banking class. Its long term effect – as becomes clearer every day – is to steadily suck wealth out of the community and into the hands of a few people, a fact that bankers and most politicians stubbornly refuse to admit. Charging interest on money created out of nothing is, in the main, unjust and immoral, and Plato, Aristotle, Cicero, the Bible (Deuteronomy 23:19), the Koran (2:275-278), the Catholic Church, many codes of law and most writers on morals have condemned it for more than two thousand years. The historical name for this evil is usury. Nevertheless bankers enjoy peace of mind because they know that the public thinks they merely lend out the savings of their depositors. In fact, banks create more than 95 percent of all deposits, for when a bank creates a loan it simultaneously creates a deposit. What banks do to justify the accusation of being economic parasites is to lend out interest-bearing money of their own creation using a very thin sliver of legal tender (cash) to back it up.

How did the banks gain this oppressive power of charging interest on mere computer entries? Very simply they lobbied and hoodwinked our politicians into giving it to them. Before World War II cash reserves of 1:10 had been the norm in practice. This meant that if you deposited $100 of cash in a bank, the banking system (though not that one bank) would eventually use that $100 to create up to $900 of credit. That credit shows up in their books as $900 of interest-bearing loans (assets), and $900 of deposits (liabilities). Note that credit is not cash – only the Bank of Canada (BoC) can print and coin money – but it's money nonetheless because you can buy things with it as long as the bank honours your cheques. In 1991 legislation was quietly passed that eliminated required cash reserves by mid 1994. The result? Figures from the Bank of Canada Review show that by September 1998 the ratio of the banks' cash reserves ($3.893 billion) to their total assets ($1393 billion) had soared to 1:358, a ratio that was never more than 1:15 in the first half of this century. That means for every dollar of cash in their vaults or deposited with the central bank (i.e. the BoC) the banks have conjured up $357 from the void which they've invested or lent out with interest. Hence the record profits. Meanwhile not one person in a hundred grasps the fact that our government permits private banks to create about 95 percent of our money supply bringing huge profits to them and endless debt to us. Nowadays the big profits lie in government bonds, currency speculation, the stock market, and derivatives; and banks, with their power of money creation, are up to their eyeballs in all four. But there's always a day of reckoning. History teaches us that banks are forever finding new ways to commit financial suicide, and when they do they bring the public down with them. (With the collapse of their debt-pyramids the once mighty Japanese banks have been living off the public purse for years.) But what we witnessed in 1998 was unprecedented in human history. In South East Asia, Russia and Latin America, national economies were plundered and millions impoverished, almost overnight, through the deliberate manipulation of "free" market forces......

....I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. Already they have raised up a monied aristocracy that has set the Government at defiance. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people to whom it properly belongs.

Thomas Jefferson


Until the control of the issue of currency and credit is restored to government and recognized as its most conspicuous and sacred responsibility, all talk of sovereignty of Parliament and of democracy is idle and futile... Once a nation parts with control of its credit, it matters not who makes the nation's laws... Usury once in control will wreck any nation.

William Lyon Mackenzie King

Banking was conceived in iniquity and born in sin... Bankers own the earth. Take it away from them but leave them the power to create money, and, with a flick of the pen, they will create enough money to buy it back again... Take this great power away from them and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear, for then this would be a better and happier world to live in... But, if you want to be the slaves of the bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, then let bankers continue to create money and control credit.

Sir Josiah Stamp

(Governor of the Bank of England in the 1920s)

Okay most of that is pure drivel. It's pretty hard to have a conversation with someone that only communicates in random thoughts. So how about you actaully try answering some questions and we'll go from there.

Are you saying banks should not get to charge you interest for money you barrow from them?

What is the 'corrupt' money system doing to hurt you now? Please be specific and in your own words.

What do you propose we use to trade goods and services?

Lastly, what the fuck does it have to do with a free market?

 

[Bern80]

LOL it busts me up how many people incorrectly apply that label.

Okay, we'll go with "stupid corporatist" then. How's that? And only a handful are corrupt and greedy? Just look at the recent collapse of the WORLD ECONOMY and tell me that was a "handful" of corporations. I would say all corporations have the propensity for harm due to their "profit is the only thing that matters" mentality. It's the nature of the beast, and that beast will try to get away with whatever it can to any effect - as long as it makes money. Are you really going to play stupid and deny this? Thus, we (the people) want to be able to watch, and control somewhat, what these corporations are doing because you can not trust any for-profit entity. Youo just can't.

Is a company's motive to make money? Sure. How does a company do that? In the simplest terms, by doing what their customers want. I imagine your actual exposure to the business world is fairly minimal otherwise you would know how important quality customer service is. You can have thousands of satisfied customers, but it only takes one to have one bad experience to make a court case or post something on a message board to tarnish a good reputation.

As the world economy failing as a result of the majority of businesses being corrupt. That is simply false. In a nutshell the problem was a lot of people barrowed and overspent money they couldn't pay back. And as I said before YOU are the police of corporations. Ultimately you are the one who decides whether the businesses you piss and moan about survive or not.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

QUANTUM WINDBAG: "Dollars might be a fiction of the government, but they work. They standardize barter rates and facilitate trade. What exactly is your beef with them?



...QUANTUM, INTENSE, BERN 80, etc. monetary/economics THEORISTS, etc. assorted monetary ignoramusses, 'money' is one of the basics of society..certainly even you monetary ignoramusses would have to agree that a corrupt, insane, etc.. 'money system' (money creation/issuance. etc..) would/might facilitate a corrupt, insane society..no?..

...furthermore, EVERYONE i know who has HONESTLY looked into 'the money (issuance, etc..) fraud' has come to the conclusion that thi$ $tinking $ystem is corrupt, insane, intolerable..

...i don't know where you 'are' as to 'monetary realism'...i sense you--like every republicrat monetary ignoramus i've met--when asked, 'how does a dollar originate?,' would look at me funny and utter some stooooooopid fuck answer like, 'they print them'..(revealing utter unconscious ignorance)

...here's one of many tool$ i use on monetary ignoramusses that might help:..

...in discussing 'money' with republicrats (the smartest ones!) will state something like, 'we could use ANYTHING for money and the system would still work'..

...to which i reply, 'you mean we could use, say, horseshit for money?!?'

...to which the republicrat monetary ignoramus replies something like, 'yes..it wouldn't be as good as 'the dollar system'..but it would work'

...to which i reply, could we use, say, human shit?..would that work too?

...to which the republicrat monetary ignoramus replies (after curling up his/her nose), 'why yes, that would/could work too'..

...then i ask the republicrat monetary knucklehead, 'how about if we had a system whereby only certain peoples' shit could/would serve as the money..that only certain people could 'issue' new money and spend it into the economy 'in the first round?'

...here the republicrat monetary ignoramus will inevitably say something like, 'no, that's not fair at all'..



...you see republicrats, if you honestly understood your current money system, you would understand that the privilege of money issuance/creation has been given to people about whom you are worse than ignorant..(but you republicrat money dummies haven't an honest fucking clue what's going on..and ignorance is indeed bli$$!)

...so one of my 'beefs,' quantum, is that 'money' creation/issuance (please refer to your unread constitutions--art. 1 sec. 8 clause 5) was meant to be PUBLIC AND TRANSPARENT ...it CERTAINLY is not..in fact, we can't even get an honest audit out of these stinking motherfucking private bankster$ for whom you espou$e munchkin-like apologie$..

...furthermore, the stinking stooooooooooooooooopid notion that we have some 'free market' (implied that it is 'fair' to/for all) is absolute fucking horse$hit!..

..but have a good day anyway!..

I see, money is evil, and all we have to do to eliminate evil is eliminate money.

 

[sweetie]

...windbags, bern 80 and indense!..I HAVE STATED/POSTED MANY THINGS ABOUT MONEY HERE THAT YOU APPARENT MONETARY IGNORAMUSSES FIND RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc.....COULD YOU FLAPPING YAPPING REPUBLICRAT MAROONS PLEASE MERELY COPY AND PASTE THE SPECIFIC SENTENCES ABOUT WHICH YOU ARE MOST CERTAIN I AM RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, ETC..

...AGAIN, PLEASE REFER TO MY ACTUAL WORDS...TRY CRITICIZING MY MOST RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc. THOUGHTS SENTENCE BY SENTENCE INSTEAD OF PASTING MY WHOLE POST AND THEN MERELY DISMISSING ME AS RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc..

(...as one wag puts it, 'i'll peel these republicrat money dummies like an onion'..)

..btw, you maria butt-aroma-watching republicrat maroons are waaaaaay out of your little league here with me..

...have a a good night!..

 

[sweetie]

...a little treat for monetary enthusiasts...even some republicrat monetary ignoramusses might like thi$...enjoy:

American Monetary Institute

ODDER THAN OZ

Copyright 1998 by Mr. Hugh Downs

Following is a transcript of Mr. Downs radio presentation, which he has graciously allowed us to reprint.

What do you suppose Alan Greenspan, Judy Garland, and the American Civil war have in common? Give up? They are all connected to turn-of-the-century U.S. monetary policy, of course! Not so obvious? Let me explain.

Just before the American Civil War broke out, Americans used dollar bills that had been issued by banks. The government didn't make any money, except coins. When the war began, the government (like all governments at war,) needed a great deal of money fast. President Lincoln decided to print it just like banks did. These early government notes were called "greenbacks" and, as you might expect, printing all those greenbacks led to rampant inflation.

Eventually, about 15 years after the war was over, people who held Federal notes, the greenbacks, could redeem them for gold coin. Few people bothered to make this trade because the war was long over, gold reserves were healthy, and people had faith in the government. Money was once again backed by real gold, but this created a new problem. The government could not print any more money that was not backed by gold, and that constricted the money supply.

People who already had money, that is rich people, didn't want any more money added to the supply because an inflated money supply, devalues savings. Inflation is always bad for people with money because their money becomes less valuable. But people without money, especially poor farmers, were clamoring for the government to print more. Inflation always helps the poor because debts can be repaid in cheaper dollars and money becomes more available for loans, investments, for everything. By 1874 a new political party called the Greenback Party demanded that the government mint unlimited amounts of coin, print more paper money and give $50 to every U.S. citizen. Poor farmers were demanding an inflationary monetary policy.

The Greenback Party dissolved in about 10 years, but a new party emerged and took up the inflationary baton. They were known as the Populist Party and legions of Midwestern and Southern farmers joined. The Populists eventually supported the Democrats because both parties were part of the Free Silver Movement. Remember the problem with the gold standard: the government couldn't print any more without discovering more gold to back it up. The Free Silver Movement wanted the government to add silver as yet another standard, in addition to gold. Having two standards would allow the government to inflate the money supply and provide relief to farmers. The price of crops had plummeted but debts still had to be paid in gold backed currency.

On July 8, 1896, during the Democratic national convention, a young 36 year old congressman named william Jennings Bryan gave a brilliant rhetorical flourish to the crowd's sentiments. Bryan exclaimed: "You shall not press down upon the brow of labor this crown of thorns, you shall not crucify mankind on a cross of gold." The ecstatic crowd elected William Jennings Bryan as their presidential candidate.

The "cross of gold," of course, referred to the single standard; the rigid link between gold and money. The gold standard, favored by Eastern bankers and financiers, was also known as the "hard money policy." Bryan and his friends championed bi-metallism instead. With two standards, the government could create and back more money - a policy known as "easy money." Farmers were burdened by bank mortgages on their farms. They were forced to borrow gold backed notes. But the price of gold continued to go up, while the price for crops continued to go down. If U.S. monetary policy eased the money supply, farmers might have a chance to survive.

William Jennings Bryan lost the 1896 election to William McKinley. He lost again to McKinley in 1900 and then, in 1908, Bryan lost yet another presidential election to William Howard Taft. But the dream of a looser money supply, and hatred of Eastern bankers lingered on. The Democratic and Progressive Parties, and others, adopted some of the economic principles forged in the Greenback and Populist Parties. Most interesting, though, is that the spirit of the Free Silver Movement and its resentment for Eastern bankers found its way into one of America's most original fairy tales: the Wonderful Wizard of Oz.

In 1900, Frank Baum, the author of the Wizard of Oz, was a staunch supporter of the Free Silver Movement and, like many Americans at the time, he distrusted the East coast banking establishment. And now we learn a fascinating story told to us by anthropologist Jack Weatherford. Weatherford tells us, in his new book THE HISTORY OF MONEY, that Baum's tale of Oz is a thinly disguised parable of turn-of-the-century monetary policy. The Wizard of Oz is the wizard of the gold ounce, the abbreviation of ounce is, of course, oz.

Dorothy, the lead character made famous in the screen version by Judy Garland, represented the average rural American. Dorothy, says Weatherford, was probably modeled on the populist orator Leslie Kelsey who was known as "the Kansas Tornado." Dorothy, and Toto, are flung by the tornado to the East where they discover the Yellow Brick Road - meaning a gold road. The road leads to Oz "where the wicked witches and wizards of banking operate."

The Scarecrow is the American farmer. The Tin Woodman is the American factory worker, and the Cowardly Lion is William Jennings Bryan. Weatherford says: "The party's march on Oz is a re-creation of the 1894 march of Coxey's Army, a group of unemployed men led by ... Jacob S. Coxey to demand (a) public issue of 500 million greenbacks...for (the) common people." The Wizard himself represented Marcus Hanna who controlled both the Republican Party and the McKinley administration. The Munchkins "were the simpleminded people of the East who did not understand how the wizard ... pulled the levers ... that controlled the money, the economy, and the government."

The simpleminded residents of Oz were required to wear green tinted glasses fastened by gold buckles. Off to the West, the Wicked Witch of the West had enslaved the yellow Winkies, which Weatherford explains, "is a reference to the imperialist aims of the Republican administration, which had captured the Phillipines from Spain and refused to grant them independence."

At the end of the story the Wizard and the Witches are exposed as crude fakes. This dramatic revelation makes everything better. The scarecrow, who represents the farmer, discovers that he is really intelligent and not stupid. The Cowardly Lion, who is really William Jennings Bryan, finds courage. And the Tin Woodman, actually the American factory worker, "received a new source of strength in a bimetallic tool - a golden axe with a blade of silver."

In the original edition of The Wonderful Wizard of Oz, Dorothy returns to Kansas by clicking the heels of her silver slippers together. The moviemakers decided that red looked better on screen than silver and that's the way most of us remember the tale. As you can see, and thanks to Jack Weatherford for pointing it out, most of us have completely forgotten the secret story behind the Wizard of Oz.

Today, the Federal Reserve Bank determines America's monetary policy, but the Fed wasn't created until 1913. The modern equivelent of the Wizard of Oz - or Marcus Hanna - is, of course, the ever-charming Alan Greenspan. So now you know. The Civil War, Judy Garland and Alan Greenspan, really are connected.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Really? Been on a segregated bus lately? Been treated by a woman doctor? Remember the time when gays were beaten up "because they were asking for it"??

Yes, really. Remember Jim Crow laws? Remember separate but equal? Do you also remember that all of those were sanctioned by the government, and that it took an uprising by citizens to end it?

actually, it took a supreme court case to end it.

FindLaw | Cases and Codes

Yes, and the Supreme Court made that decision in a total vacuum, completely divorced from the civil uprisings going on around the country.

 

[Bern80]

...windbags, bern 80 and indense!..I HAVE STATED/POSTED MANY THINGS ABOUT MONEY HERE THAT YOU APPARENT MONETARY IGNORAMUSSES FIND RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc.....COULD YOU FLAPPING YAPPING REPUBLICRAT MAROONS PLEASE MERELY COPY AND PASTE THE SPECIFIC SENTENCES ABOUT WHICH YOU ARE MOST CERTAIN I AM RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, ETC..

...AGAIN, PLEASE REFER TO MY ACTUAL WORDS...TRY CRITICIZING MY MOST RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc. THOUGHTS SENTENCE BY SENTENCE INSTEAD OF PASTING MY WHOLE POST AND THEN MERELY DISMISSING ME AS RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc..

(...as one wag puts it, 'i'll peel these republicrat money dummies like an onion'..)

..btw, you maria butt-aroma-watching republicrat maroons are waaaaaay out of your little league here with me..

You profess to be intelligent while riddling a post with name calling? I asked YOU first. Your overal theme seems to be that the dollar is some invention designed to deprive you of wealth. I asked you exactly how it is doing that. You have yet to answer. That is as specific as I can be in terms of my arguments against what is mostly mindless rambling.

Most of what you claim we (or I at least) believe is just plain not true, so it doesn't really warrant a response. I am not a bank apologist, I frankly see the point as irrelevent. The bank has zero role in forceably taking anything I've earned without a contract (i.e. an agreement to pay back what you barrow from them with interest (how unreasonable of them)).

Nor has anyone ever claimed the playing field is equal in a free market. That is the fundamental difference between libertarians and the left. YOU want equal outcomes (which is different from equal opportunity). And to make up for the fact that it's just life that some people will have advantages that others do not, you hobble those with the advantages. The people most capable of producing for society. And THEN have the balls to wonder why society is where it is.

 

[gettingold]

Thought this was a good article by John Stossel.

Free to choose

here are 15 videos by friedman about free to choose

IdeaChannel.tv

 

[Intense]

...windbags, bern 80 and indense!..I HAVE STATED/POSTED MANY THINGS ABOUT MONEY HERE THAT YOU APPARENT MONETARY IGNORAMUSSES FIND RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc.....COULD YOU FLAPPING YAPPING REPUBLICRAT MAROONS PLEASE MERELY COPY AND PASTE THE SPECIFIC SENTENCES ABOUT WHICH YOU ARE MOST CERTAIN I AM RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, ETC..

...AGAIN, PLEASE REFER TO MY ACTUAL WORDS...TRY CRITICIZING MY MOST RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc. THOUGHTS SENTENCE BY SENTENCE INSTEAD OF PASTING MY WHOLE POST AND THEN MERELY DISMISSING ME AS RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc..

(...as one wag puts it, 'i'll peel these republicrat money dummies like an onion'..)

..btw, you maria butt-aroma-watching republicrat maroons are waaaaaay out of your little league here with me..

You profess to be intelligent while riddling a post with name calling? I asked YOU first. Your overal theme seems to be that the dollar is some invention designed to deprive you of wealth. I asked you exactly how it is doing that. You have yet to answer. That is as specific as I can be in terms of my arguments against what is mostly mindless rambling.

Most of what you claim we (or I at least) believe is just plain not true, so it doesn't really warrant a response. I am not a bank apologist, I frankly see the point as irrelevent. The bank has zero role in forceably taking anything I've earned without a contract (i.e. an agreement to pay back what you barrow from them with interest (how unreasonable of them)).

Nor has anyone ever claimed the playing field is equal in a free market. That is the fundamental difference between libertarians and the left. YOU want equal outcomes (which is different from equal opportunity). And to make up for the fact that it's just life that some people will have advantages that others do not, you hobble those with the advantages. The people most capable of producing for society. And THEN have the balls to wonder why society is where it is.

Value for Value. There is no substitute, Under any name, by any means or form.

You wanting to take something of value from me, and compensate me with a watered down exchange, benefits who??? You. You make the value of what you offer in exchange go up and down at will. It's all about perception and manipulation in the end, how many you can control and fool, through schemes. Traps that siphon off the true worth, steal value. Fortunately, Natures remedy, for those that learn to live within their means, that control the lust for greed, gain, are smaller targets and harder for you to bleed dry. You have tilted the scales through deceit and now have yourselves become the prime targets, the new middle class, Government workers and union workers. In the end, you have only yourselves to rob. That's what we need, more administrators and regulators to tax. We need more surcharges on your surcharges.

You don't always have to jerk off in public you know.

 

[sweetie]

Your overal theme seems to be that the dollar is some invention designed to deprive you of wealth.



....good god, you're a stoooooooooooopid brainwashed republicrat fuck!..WHERE DID I SAY WHAT YOU ATTRIBUTED TO ME ABOVE, YOU STOOOOOPID FUCK??..PLEASE USE MY WORDS, YOU STOOOOOPID FUCK..not your bizarre interpretations!!

...(it's hard talking 'monetary realism' with stoooopid fucks like bern 80 and indense who don't have an honest clue how 'our' stinking money (issuance/creation) system works)..

 

[Intense]

Your overal theme seems to be that the dollar is some invention designed to deprive you of wealth.



....good god, you're a stoooooooooooopid brainwashed republicrat fuck!..WHERE DID I SAY WHAT YOU ATTRIBUTED TO ME ABOVE, YOU STOOOOOPID FUCK??..PLEASE USE MY WORDS, YOU STOOOOOPID FUCK..not your bizarre interpretations!!

...(it's hard talking 'monetary realism' with stoooopid fucks like bern 80 and indense who don't have an honest clue how 'our' stinking money (issuance/creation) system works)..

Love it when you talk dirty Sweetie!!!! It's not a good idea to skip on medication. Try not to drool too much on the key pad.

 

[rightwinger]

Let us all know when you inform your buddy Gore of this.



To your own detriment because you have essentially admitted that you are too much of a pussy to accept the fact that you have the god given ability to provide most of those things for yourself. And the fact is government has gone far beyond those things in terms of sticking its nose in the business of the people. It just amazes me that we have people in this country that actually defend having their freedom taken away.

Oh really??

I have a god given ability to stop industries from poluting the air and water?
I can protect my home from a foreign invasion?
I can prevent people from discriminating against me if I am black, gay or a woman?
If I become injured on the job or sick, I can prevent them from firing me?

Some god you have there

I'd rather deal with my life's problems, than have the government take care of me.

Good...

Be sure to remember that if your house ever catches on fire

 

[Bern80]

...windbags, bern 80 and indense!..I HAVE STATED/POSTED MANY THINGS ABOUT MONEY HERE THAT YOU APPARENT MONETARY IGNORAMUSSES FIND RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc.....COULD YOU FLAPPING YAPPING REPUBLICRAT MAROONS PLEASE MERELY COPY AND PASTE THE SPECIFIC SENTENCES ABOUT WHICH YOU ARE MOST CERTAIN I AM RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, ETC..

...AGAIN, PLEASE REFER TO MY ACTUAL WORDS...TRY CRITICIZING MY MOST RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc. THOUGHTS SENTENCE BY SENTENCE INSTEAD OF PASTING MY WHOLE POST AND THEN MERELY DISMISSING ME AS RIDICULOUS, WRONGHEADED, etc..

(...as one wag puts it, 'i'll peel these republicrat money dummies like an onion'..)

..btw, you maria butt-aroma-watching republicrat maroons are waaaaaay out of your little league here with me..

You profess to be intelligent while riddling a post with name calling? I asked YOU first. Your overal theme seems to be that the dollar is some invention designed to deprive you of wealth. I asked you exactly how it is doing that. You have yet to answer. That is as specific as I can be in terms of my arguments against what is mostly mindless rambling.

Most of what you claim we (or I at least) believe is just plain not true, so it doesn't really warrant a response. I am not a bank apologist, I frankly see the point as irrelevent. The bank has zero role in forceably taking anything I've earned without a contract (i.e. an agreement to pay back what you barrow from them with interest (how unreasonable of them)).

Nor has anyone ever claimed the playing field is equal in a free market. That is the fundamental difference between libertarians and the left. YOU want equal outcomes (which is different from equal opportunity). And to make up for the fact that it's just life that some people will have advantages that others do not, you hobble those with the advantages. The people most capable of producing for society. And THEN have the balls to wonder why society is where it is.

Value for Value. There is no substitute, Under any name, by any means or form.

You wanting to take something of value from me, and compensate me with a watered down exchange, benefits who??? You. You make the value of what you offer in exchange go up and down at will. It's all about perception and manipulation in the end, how many you can control and fool, through schemes. Traps that siphon off the true worth, steal value. Fortunately, Natures remedy, for those that learn to live within their means, that control the lust for greed, gain, are smaller targets and harder for you to bleed dry. You have tilted the scales through deceit and now have yourselves become the prime targets, the new middle class, Government workers and union workers. In the end, you have only yourselves to rob. That's what we need, more administrators and regulators to tax. We need more surcharges on your surcharges.

You don't always have to jerk off in public you know.

Could you attempt a semi-coherrent thought, please? I ask AGAIN, what should we be exchanging en lieu of the 'evil' dollar?

Bleed people dry? What sense does that make from the perspective of someone trying to sell goods and services? Businesses can't continue to make money if people don't have anything to spend. Your problem as a typical lib is that you refuse to account for the control YOU have in any transaction. If you don't think it's fair, don't do it. It's that simple. No private business is forceably depriving you of money. The only institution that does that is the government.

 

[Bern80]

Your overal theme seems to be that the dollar is some invention designed to deprive you of wealth.



....good god, you're a stoooooooooooopid brainwashed republicrat fuck!..WHERE DID I SAY WHAT YOU ATTRIBUTED TO ME ABOVE, YOU STOOOOOPID FUCK??..PLEASE USE MY WORDS, YOU STOOOOOPID FUCK..not your bizarre interpretations!!

...(it's hard talking 'monetary realism' with stoooopid fucks like bern 80 and indense who don't have an honest clue how 'our' stinking money (issuance/creation) system works)..

What I am saying is that is my best guess as to what you are attempting to say through mindless blathering and irrelevant name calling. Perhaps you can explain more specifically how our monetary system is hurting me and how it should be.

 

[Bern80]

Oh really??

I have a god given ability to stop industries from poluting the air and water?
I can protect my home from a foreign invasion?
I can prevent people from discriminating against me if I am black, gay or a woman?
If I become injured on the job or sick, I can prevent them from firing me?

Some god you have there

I'd rather deal with my life's problems, than have the government take care of me.

Good...

Be sure to remember that if your house ever catches on fire

Where are you going with this? The only way someone can get on with their life after a house fire is if government helps them? SHIT HAPPENS. It isn't the role of government to correct every curveball life might throw at you.

 

[Intense]

You profess to be intelligent while riddling a post with name calling? I asked YOU first. Your overal theme seems to be that the dollar is some invention designed to deprive you of wealth. I asked you exactly how it is doing that. You have yet to answer. That is as specific as I can be in terms of my arguments against what is mostly mindless rambling.

Most of what you claim we (or I at least) believe is just plain not true, so it doesn't really warrant a response. I am not a bank apologist, I frankly see the point as irrelevent. The bank has zero role in forceably taking anything I've earned without a contract (i.e. an agreement to pay back what you barrow from them with interest (how unreasonable of them)).

Nor has anyone ever claimed the playing field is equal in a free market. That is the fundamental difference between libertarians and the left. YOU want equal outcomes (which is different from equal opportunity). And to make up for the fact that it's just life that some people will have advantages that others do not, you hobble those with the advantages. The people most capable of producing for society. And THEN have the balls to wonder why society is where it is.

Value for Value. There is no substitute, Under any name, by any means or form.

You wanting to take something of value from me, and compensate me with a watered down exchange, benefits who??? You. You make the value of what you offer in exchange go up and down at will. It's all about perception and manipulation in the end, how many you can control and fool, through schemes. Traps that siphon off the true worth, steal value. Fortunately, Natures remedy, for those that learn to live within their means, that control the lust for greed, gain, are smaller targets and harder for you to bleed dry. You have tilted the scales through deceit and now have yourselves become the prime targets, the new middle class, Government workers and union workers. In the end, you have only yourselves to rob. That's what we need, more administrators and regulators to tax. We need more surcharges on your surcharges.

You don't always have to jerk off in public you know.

Could you attempt a semi-coherrent thought, please? I ask AGAIN, what should we be exchanging en lieu of the 'evil' dollar?

Bleed people dry? What sense does that make from the perspective of someone trying to sell goods and services? Businesses can't continue to make money if people don't have anything to spend. Your problem as a typical lib is that you refuse to account for the control YOU have in any transaction. If you don't think it's fair, don't do it. It's that simple. No private business is forceably depriving you of money. The only institution that does that is the government.

Bern80, We are more on the same side here. I believe in the Free Market, as the best way of civilized exchange. I would even argue for the Gold Standard, seeing the result as less manipulative in relations to the ups and downs of the value of currency, which is subject to scheme after scheme. This makes the dollar too unstable. There are those that profit greatly from that, and I find the ethics questionable. In a free exchange where both sides are in agreement be it trade, barter, or purchase, I find nothing wrong at all, within the law.

Contracts can forcibly deprive you of your money, while even giving you substandard service, the government protecting the Corporation over you. Be it problems with Cell Phones, Cable, Leases, Etc... it is easy to find yourself paying for something that could have even been misrepresented, with little or no recourse. Usually you will find the Government is involved with regulation, that makes it harder and more expensive for you.