Fact about d day.....thousands of Americans died because

[Flash]

[Q

Sounds good on paper, so why did we incur the heavy losses?

I don't have the links but I read a lot about this a few months ago.

In relative terms the US (and Allied using the Pershing) tank losses were acceptable for the battlefield. "Only" about 1000 American tankers lost their lives. The German losses in the same theater was much greater.

There are a few accounts of a German heavy tanks defeating several of our tanks in one encounter but it it didn't happen as often as we think. Most of the time American air power or artillery was called in to deal with German armor and that proved to be effective.

If you want to bitch about WWII then bitch about the dumbasses that sent our men to be slaughtered in the Hurtzen Forrest campaign. That was a waste and complete failure.

 

[Frannie]

My point is that a few 500lb bombs would have cleared the beach, and with thousands of planes in the air nothing should have been alive on that beach when the allies arrived. This was the biggest fuckup ever

The larger guns would be easier to target with bombs

Yes or no...….………….boys died because pilots stayed in the clouds

Bombable

Bombable

Bombable

7000 planes did nothing so thousands got chopped up

 

[Maxdeath]

Nice to be able to be a Monday morning quarterback 75 years later.

It was a winning strategy even with all the tactical mistakes that were made.

At a TERRIBLY HIGH COST. It didn't have to be that way. Our troops were used as cannon fodder like the troops in WWI. We should have learned something over the years between the wars. Yes, we won IN SPITE of the awful tactics.

Then we put up medium tanks (M4's) designed for troop support against far superior armor so they could get slaughtered after the beach was secured. The only thing that eventually saved us was air supremacy as the Luftwaffe was gone. Little fuel, very few qualified pilots.

You seem to think everyone was playing games and sitting on their hands in between both world wars. We had reduced our military because some in DC felt WW1 had put an end to war. There were those that were convinced that every war would be fought trench ware fare. Look at the Maginot line as an example. Our tanks were no match for the Germans because some did not see the need for heavy armor.
In case you forgot we spent a portion of WW2 pretending that it was only over there and in no way affected us.

I agree with you, then we had from December 7th 1941, to June 6th 1944 to come up with better equipment and tactics to combat what we KNEW we were facing. In fact we could have copied it like the Russians did. Why didn't we?

We had the largest, and best unaffected by war industrial might in the world, and kept using crap that we had at, or near the beginning of the war. Yes, our airplane technology advanced, but that wasn't used to our advantage during D Day.

We had to ramp up production from one tank a month if even that. We had to ramp up production of planes, bombs bullets, uniforms, battleships every part of war. We had men who had previously been in the factories and ship yards volunteering. Drafts men and others were leaving to fight. We could have held off until we had better equipment but would England and Russia have still been there?
We were fighting wars on three fronts basically. We were fighting in Africa and Italy. We were fighting in the pacific. With DDay we were fighting in Europe. We lost how many ships at Pearl Harbor. We were losing cargo ships almost daily in the Atlantic. Later we lost ships almost daily in the Pacific.
We were loosing planes by the dozen in a week. Just replacing them was a major undertaking.

Considering that how long should we have held off? How many English and Russians should have died? How many more should have died in concentration camps? The Germans were continually updateding. Are you even aware how long it takes to conceptualize, draft, change over production for a change to a different type of tank? Do we stop building ships to build more and better tanks? We were supplying Russia and England with war material. How do you train people to handle new weapons? Now think about training Russians and the English.

7000 planes were in the air on d day that all missed the beach. The pilots flew high and in the clouds so they didn't get hurt letting thousands get chopped up

Once aonce again I think your number is wrong as are you. A little over 7000 was the total number of planes. That included fighters which did not have bombs, troop transports that do not carry bombs, and even gliders which again carry the nay men.

To think that everyone of those planes that were in the air was assigned a target on the beach is not only wrong but idiotic. They were also bombing miles inland. They were bombing German held towns. They were bombing railways, rail yards, ammo and fuel depots, gun emplacements, roads, command posts.

 

[Frannie]

At a TERRIBLY HIGH COST. It didn't have to be that way. Our troops were used as cannon fodder like the troops in WWI. We should have learned something over the years between the wars. Yes, we won IN SPITE of the awful tactics.

Then we put up medium tanks (M4's) designed for troop support against far superior armor so they could get slaughtered after the beach was secured. The only thing that eventually saved us was air supremacy as the Luftwaffe was gone. Little fuel, very few qualified pilots.

You seem to think everyone was playing games and sitting on their hands in between both world wars. We had reduced our military because some in DC felt WW1 had put an end to war. There were those that were convinced that every war would be fought trench ware fare. Look at the Maginot line as an example. Our tanks were no match for the Germans because some did not see the need for heavy armor.
In case you forgot we spent a portion of WW2 pretending that it was only over there and in no way affected us.

I agree with you, then we had from December 7th 1941, to June 6th 1944 to come up with better equipment and tactics to combat what we KNEW we were facing. In fact we could have copied it like the Russians did. Why didn't we?

We had the largest, and best unaffected by war industrial might in the world, and kept using crap that we had at, or near the beginning of the war. Yes, our airplane technology advanced, but that wasn't used to our advantage during D Day.

We had to ramp up production from one tank a month if even that. We had to ramp up production of planes, bombs bullets, uniforms, battleships every part of war. We had men who had previously been in the factories and ship yards volunteering. Drafts men and others were leaving to fight. We could have held off until we had better equipment but would England and Russia have still been there?
We were fighting wars on three fronts basically. We were fighting in Africa and Italy. We were fighting in the pacific. With DDay we were fighting in Europe. We lost how many ships at Pearl Harbor. We were losing cargo ships almost daily in the Atlantic. Later we lost ships almost daily in the Pacific.
We were loosing planes by the dozen in a week. Just replacing them was a major undertaking.

Considering that how long should we have held off? How many English and Russians should have died? How many more should have died in concentration camps? The Germans were continually updateding. Are you even aware how long it takes to conceptualize, draft, change over production for a change to a different type of tank? Do we stop building ships to build more and better tanks? We were supplying Russia and England with war material. How do you train people to handle new weapons? Now think about training Russians and the English.

7000 planes were in the air on d day that all missed the beach. The pilots flew high and in the clouds so they didn't get hurt letting thousands get chopped up

Once aonce again I think your number is wrong as are you. A little over 7000 was the total number of planes. That included fighters which did not have bombs, troop transports that do not carry bombs, and even gliders which again carry the nay men.

To think that everyone of those planes that were in the air was assigned a target on the beach is not only wrong but idiotic. They were also bombing miles inland. They were bombing German held towns. They were bombing railways, rail yards, ammo and fuel depots, gun emplacements, roads, command posts.

I understand that not all 7000 planes were beach clearing, but out of 7000 total planes zero hit the target resulting in the biggest pile of allied hamburger possible. 5 planes could have in theory cleared the entire beach, 100 if they had a 50 percent miss ratio would have killed every German there.

 

[Edgetho]

My point is that a few 500lb bombs would have cleared the beach, and with thousands of planes in the air nothing should have been alive on that beach when the allies arrived. This was the biggest fuckup ever

The larger guns would be easier to target with bombs

Yes or no...….………….boys died because pilots stayed in the clouds

Bombable

Bombable

Bombable

7000 planes did nothing so thousands got chopped up

The cloud cover during D-Day had a very low ceiling. Even if they'd wanted to, the bombers couldn't fly that low. No way. Not back then. Even today I don't think they'll fly that low.

Ike took the chance and launched the invasion. He reasoned that it would be less costly than if the Germans figured out exactly when and exactly where it was going to happen.

 

[task0778]

Back then, we had a nation of patriots. Everybody rallied after the bombing of Pearl Harbor. Politicians, corporations, even housewives got behind the war effort. We were producing weapons, transport, and ammo faster than we could ship it to Europe.
Would never happen today. Too many wimped out libstained leftist traitor democrats.

The only reason for that effort was that no one had a real job before the war

The ONLY reason? Bullshit, patriotism was a big thing back then, do you by chance remember how most Americans felt in the days after 9/11? Most of us were royally pissed, and so were most Americans during WWII after being attacked at Pearl Harbor.

 

[Frannie]

My point is that a few 500lb bombs would have cleared the beach, and with thousands of planes in the air nothing should have been alive on that beach when the allies arrived. This was the biggest fuckup ever

The larger guns would be easier to target with bombs

Yes or no...….………….boys died because pilots stayed in the clouds

Bombable

Bombable

Bombable

7000 planes did nothing so thousands got chopped up

The cloud cover during D-Day had a very low ceiling. Even if they'd wanted to, the bombers couldn't fly that low. No way. Not back then. Even today I don't think they'll fly that low.

Ike took the chance and launched the invasion. He reasoned that it would be less costly than if the Germans figured out exactly when and exactly where it was going to happen.

Then the imbecilic in charge says no go. What did those bomber pilots do except jerk off and stay safe. If the planes could not fly or hit the target they had no reason to be in the air in the first fucking place did they

 

[Frannie]

Back then, we had a nation of patriots. Everybody rallied after the bombing of Pearl Harbor. Politicians, corporations, even housewives got behind the war effort. We were producing weapons, transport, and ammo faster than we could ship it to Europe.
Would never happen today. Too many wimped out libstained leftist traitor democrats.

The only reason for that effort was that no one had a real job before the war

The ONLY reason? Bullshit, patriotism was a big thing back then, do you by chance remember how most Americans felt in the days after 9/11? Most of us were royally pissed, and so were most Americans during WWII after being attacked at Pearl Harbor.

Sure patriotism, the war ended the depression, with all the men fighting even the women had jobs now. There is no way to take the depression out of the picture

 

[BlindBoo]

this was the most pathetically planned military operation in history.

Pathetic comment of the day so far. A day when we celebrate those young men's heroism, not second guess why things went wrong, from 75 years on.

 

[task0778]

Again we just had more men to sacrifice, and more stuff to throw at them that were EXPENDABLE. That is the only reason we won, plus the Russians did a lot more heavy lifting than we give them credit for.

That was the part of the strategy we had the wealth, and manufacturing capability to AVOID. I guess lives are cheap. Talk to the Americans, British, and Canadians that had to fight using M4's and other crap we threw at the Germans. Yes, the Germans did not have the manufacturing capability to keep up, plus it was getting bombed daily along with their fuel supplies.

We had an unscathed, huge manufacturing complex. We could have provided better tanks to keep more tank crews alive, and more infantry alive. We CHOSE not to do so.

To suggest that American generals (except maybe for Patton) and the leadership in Washington considered men as sacrificial is 100% total bullshit. America then as now did not like heavy casualties, and the public sentiment could have had political consequences. That was one reason why the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor as they did, hoping to inflict major casualties that would keep America out of the war. There was a significant anti-war faction then, as now. But, people were totally pissed and Roosevelt and the pols went with it.

We did however have a huge manufacturing complex that quickly changed over to military equipment. Which we gave to the other allies and THAT did contribute bigly to the eventual victory. And our tanks did very well in support of our infantry, except for D-Day, when most of them never made it ashore.

 

[Pilot1]

My point is that a few 500lb bombs would have cleared the beach, and with thousands of planes in the air nothing should have been alive on that beach when the allies arrived. This was the biggest fuckup ever

The larger guns would be easier to target with bombs

Yes or no...….………….boys died because pilots stayed in the clouds

Bombable

Bombable

Bombable

7000 planes did nothing so thousands got chopped up

The cloud cover during D-Day had a very low ceiling. Even if they'd wanted to, the bombers couldn't fly that low. No way. Not back then. Even today I don't think they'll fly that low.

Ike took the chance and launched the invasion. He reasoned that it would be less costly than if the Germans figured out exactly when and exactly where it was going to happen.

Then the imbecilic in charge says no go. What did those bomber pilots do except jerk off and stay safe. If the planes could not fly or hit the target they had no reason to be in the air in the first fucking place did they

Agreed. It was a huge mistake to go if weather didn't allow us the use of our Air Assets. Bad call on Ike's part. D Day made Hamburger Hill look like a picnic in the park.

 

[Frannie]

this was the most pathetically planned military operation in history.

Pathetic comment of the day so far. A day when we celebrate those young men's heroism, not second guess why things went wrong, from 75 years on.

No one cleared the beach, The defenses were well understood, this was a fuckup that killed thousands of boys not even men yet. You expect the government to admit their idiocy. 7000 planes did not clear the beach

 

[task0778]

Back then, we had a nation of patriots. Everybody rallied after the bombing of Pearl Harbor. Politicians, corporations, even housewives got behind the war effort. We were producing weapons, transport, and ammo faster than we could ship it to Europe.
Would never happen today. Too many wimped out libstained leftist traitor democrats.

The only reason for that effort was that no one had a real job before the war

The ONLY reason? Bullshit, patriotism was a big thing back then, do you by chance remember how most Americans felt in the days after 9/11? Most of us were royally pissed, and so were most Americans during WWII after being attacked at Pearl Harbor.

Sure patriotism, the war ended the depression, with all the men fighting even the women had jobs now. There is no way to take the depression out of the picture

The American people would have supported the war with or without the ongoing depression. That depression had nothing to do with the way in which most people supported the war effort in any way they could.

 

[Edgetho]

Then the imbecilic in charge says no go. What did those bomber pilots do except jerk off and stay safe. If the planes could not fly or hit the target they had no reason to be in the air in the first fucking place did they

Jun 6, 1944 is considered the most successful amphibious landing in all of history.

Is that not good enough for you?

And a significant number of the dead on D-Day were Paratroopers.

Could it have been better? Certainly. the socialist scumbag Hitler could have surrendered earlier

 

[task0778]

this was the most pathetically planned military operation in history.

Pathetic comment of the day so far. A day when we celebrate those young men's heroism, not second guess why things went wrong, from 75 years on.

No one cleared the beach, The defenses were well understood, this was a fuckup that killed thousands of boys not even men yet. You expect the government to admit their idiocy. 7000 planes did not clear the beach

The US gov't was not in charge of military operations then, Roosevelt allowed his generals in the field to conduct the war as they saw fit.

 

[BlindBoo]

You expect the government to admit their idiocy.

Do you think they didn't investigate why the bombs missed, or the navy bombardment was ineffective, or that that information was not released? To me, it only makes what those boys accomplished that day even more amazing.

 

[Frannie]

Back then, we had a nation of patriots. Everybody rallied after the bombing of Pearl Harbor. Politicians, corporations, even housewives got behind the war effort. We were producing weapons, transport, and ammo faster than we could ship it to Europe.
Would never happen today. Too many wimped out libstained leftist traitor democrats.

The only reason for that effort was that no one had a real job before the war

The ONLY reason? Bullshit, patriotism was a big thing back then, do you by chance remember how most Americans felt in the days after 9/11? Most of us were royally pissed, and so were most Americans during WWII after being attacked at Pearl Harbor.

Sure patriotism, the war ended the depression, with all the men fighting even the women had jobs now. There is no way to take the depression out of the picture

The American people would have supported the war with or without the ongoing depression. That depression had nothing to do with the way in which most people supported the war effort in any way they could.

Men left women took factory jobs, the depression effected every American

 

[Frannie]

You expect the government to admit their idiocy.

Do you think they didn't investigate why the bombs missed, or the navy bombardment was ineffective, or that that information was not released? To me, it only makes what those boys accomplished that day even more amazing.

They investigated JFK too. Why would they say we screwed up and killed how many thousand boys....BOYS NOT MEN

The planes had no chance because of cloud cover, so why were they in the air wasting fuel

 

[Pilot1]

Then the imbecilic in charge says no go. What did those bomber pilots do except jerk off and stay safe. If the planes could not fly or hit the target they had no reason to be in the air in the first fucking place did they

Jun 6, 1944 is considered the most successful amphibious landing in all of history.

Is that not good enough for you?

And a significant number of the dead on D-Day were Paratroopers.

Could it have been better? Certainly. the socialist scumbag Hitler could have surrendered earlier

Most successful from an objectives viewpoint, but at what cost? The large number of dead was totally irresponsible and unnecessary. Yes, hindsight is 20/20, but I don't understand why you'd want to start an invasion like that if you could not maximize the one total advantage you had. Air supremacy.

 

[rightwinger]

7000 planes all missed their targets on the landing beaches......

Why should any German machine gun have survived 7000 planes attacking?

Who planned this Charlie Brown

They were in concrete pill boxes and hunkered down during the naval and air bombardment