Euthanasia and/or assisted suicide

[Katzndogz]

Let's start with high school students. Many of them are commiting suicide now. Just have death vans pull up in the parking lot, line up get your shot.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

As I pointed out Christopher Reeve was very active, an athlete, he was paralyzed in a horse riding accident. He did not decide to die, he kept active until he died. Was he FORCED to endure his condition?
What right have YOU or anyone else to decide whose life is worthless and should be put to death and who should live? What right have you to say "I am so self-righteous that I believe your life is not worth living therefore in MY opinion, you should kill yourself and if you don't, we'll do it for you.?" It's really you that finds the crippled and those who are paralyzed repulsive. You don't want to look at them any more. They have lost the title of pretty people. Kill them and get them out of your sight.

My best friend, Tracy, got brain cancer. We were friends for more than 25 years, we were roommates for many years. Lacking any other family we became custodians for one another's health care decisions. She told me, many many MANY times that rather than live needing 24 hour care she'd prefer to die. "Just let me go" is what she said. At the end, she was living with a couple who provided 24/7 care. Most of her brain had been eaten away by cancer. She could not speak, walk, she was incontinent, she had some sort of neurological issue that led to her screaming which she could not control, much like a baby's crying. Her ex boyfriend stepped in and tried to get her removed to a hospice where she would be denied food and water until she died. A truly horrible death. Because I was the only one authorized to make her health care decisions I went to see her. She could only communicate by blinking or squeezing my hand. I told her that I had not forgotten that she made me promise to "let her go" if she ever got in this condition but I came to ask her if that was still what she wanted. No. She wanted to live. It was not up to me to ask what in life she found so valuable that accepted going from a dynamic, active lawyer to this. Her caregiver said that Tracy loved butterscotch pudding. If she wanted to live, it could be because she would again get to enjoy butterscotch pudding one more time. I refused to let her be moved to a hospice. She died peacefully in her sleep.

When you ask me what right I have to say that someone should not be put to death because it's more convenient to do so, what right do you have to get the pathetic and inconvenient out of the way because you are tired of looking at them?

With respect, you need to read posts more carfully. I have never used the term 'put to death' . You seem to think I want to execute people who are critically ill or infirm and that is not the case.
People should have CHOICE. Its their life, not anyone elses and if they want to have help in ending an existence that to them is so horrible they do not want it to continue but are physically unable to do anything about it themselves then why should you or anyone else deny them.
Your friend chose to live. That was her choice. Others would have chosen to die, that 'should' be their choice. Why do you want to prolong their suffering if they want to die?

Yes, that's what this is really about -

The choice to live and die as we each wish.

We each own our own body and should be able to make our own choices - not have them made for us.

Just one more area of our lives we need to keep government out of.

 

[Katzndogz]

Everytime some bimbo says "Bobby asked Alice to the dance I wish I was dead." That should be her last breath.

Is the pro death party so invested in killing that they believe people who once contemplated suicide have never, not even once, were later glad they didn't?

 

[Katzndogz]

If I say this very slowly you might understand.

There is no right to have someone else kill you. If there were it would be the number one defrnse to murder.

 

[emilynghiem]

I am for it. But it will never be allowed so I am fully prepared to not be a pussy and do it myself when the time comes.

I believe this issue will become moot once greater knowledge of spiritual healing is scientifically proven and available to more people. Not only will more diseases and pain be controlled or reduced, but people can develop spiritually where they are not trapped in a dying body. These conditions can be resolved spiritually without unnecessary measures.
Either restoring full health, or passing away naturally without lingering or forced killing.

As for euthanasia,
After seeing all the needless suffering caused by passing ACA without resolving conflicts first, I'd be more than happy to see that issue put to death! For the mercy of humanity!

 

[emilynghiem]

Yes, that's what this is really about -

The choice to live and die as we each wish.

We each own our own body and should be able to make our own choices - not have them made for us.

Just one more area of our lives we need to keep government out of.

....Says he who believes in federal ACA mandates penalizing free choice of health care???

 

[thanatos144]

You support Obamacare, I don't. You want to control others, I don't.

Actually, I have consistently posted that no one has the right to control what other people do with their bodies. Period. No exceptions. No restrictions.

We each own our body and we each have the sovereign right to do as we wish with that body.

There are no exceptions to that fact.

You support Obamacare, that negates your assertion that no one can control my body. Actions speak louder than words.

I oppose Obamacare, the death penalty, think prisons should be pretty much emptied, all pre trial confinement ended, and believe in the power of my words to change people's opinions without writing laws that force other people to do what I believe.

You lose.

So you're a anarchist

 

[MikeK]

I've lived in a retirement community since 1966. The average age here is around 75. About a year or two after moving here I heard about a fellow who committed suicide by untying a rowboat late at night, rowing out to the middle of the lake, and shooting himself through the forehead with a hunting rifle.

Some time later I met someone who knew him. She told me he was reclusive, had no family or close friends, and once told her he wished he was dead.

Over the years I've heard about a few more suicides in this community of 2,400 units. None as remarkable as the rowboat fellow but one can only assume the motivation was pretty much the same. Intolerable loneliness, a sense of futility, possibly medical problems, and no wish to face each barren day.

This is not the only retirement community in America. There are hundreds. And I'm sure there are suicides in all of them. What it means to me is some people are not so fortunate as to grow old in good health with loving relatives and good friends. When life becomes no longer worth living, why should these unfortunates be forced to put an end to it in such terribly unpleasant, even more gruesome, messy, and socially disruptive ways as the rowboat fellow? Why should there not be some place where such individuals could go after settling all their legal affairs and be allowed to pass through a brief state of narcotic ecstasy to a calm and peaceful end to their unhappy, probably miserable lives?

There also are many thousands of people who are serving long prison sentences whom I am sure would prefer to go to sleep knowing they will never wake to spend another day in the miseries of penal confinement. Their suicides would be beneficial to all concerned.

I agree with the point you've made but I've just gotta ask ...

You've lived in a retirement community since 1966???

How old ARE you????

Sorry. Typo. 1996. (I'm 77.)

 

[Quantum Windbag]

Actually, I have consistently posted that no one has the right to control what other people do with their bodies. Period. No exceptions. No restrictions.

We each own our body and we each have the sovereign right to do as we wish with that body.

There are no exceptions to that fact.

You support Obamacare, that negates your assertion that no one can control my body. Actions speak louder than words.

I oppose Obamacare, the death penalty, think prisons should be pretty much emptied, all pre trial confinement ended, and believe in the power of my words to change people's opinions without writing laws that force other people to do what I believe.

You lose.

So you're a anarchist

Not at all. You can have government, just leave me alone.

 

[Octarine]

If I say this very slowly you might understand.

There is no right to have someone else kill you. If there were it would be the number one defrnse to murder.

That is the point of this discussion is it not? There SHOULD be a 'right' to have someone assist you in ending your own life if you wish to do so. We are not talking about flippant unthought out statements but rather the wishes of people such as Mr.Nicklinson, those with a condition that the medical profession cannot improve or cure, those who have suffered for years and do not wish to continue their existence in that state anymore. It's not called 'putting to death' or 'murder' , it's compassion.

 

[Octarine]

Everytime some bimbo says "Bobby asked Alice to the dance I wish I was dead." That should be her last breath.

Is the pro death party so invested in killing that they believe people who once contemplated suicide have never, not even once, were later glad they didn't?

You do know that suicide and euthanasia are not the same thing don't you?

 

[thanatos144]

You support Obamacare, that negates your assertion that no one can control my body. Actions speak louder than words.

I oppose Obamacare, the death penalty, think prisons should be pretty much emptied, all pre trial confinement ended, and believe in the power of my words to change people's opinions without writing laws that force other people to do what I believe.

You lose.

So you're a anarchist

Not at all. You can have government, just leave me alone.

How does that work with all the rapist and murderers roaming free?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

So you're a anarchist

Not at all. You can have government, just leave me alone.

How does that work with all the rapist and murderers roaming free?

Anyone tries to rape you, kill them.

 

[thanatos144]

Not at all. You can have government, just leave me alone.

How does that work with all the rapist and murderers roaming free?

Anyone tries to rape you, kill them.

again anarchy. Ever think if you didnt let out the rapist none of this would be necessary?

 

[CandySlice]

If I say this very slowly you might understand.

There is no right to have someone else kill you. If there were it would be the number one defrnse to murder.

That is the point of this discussion is it not? There SHOULD be a 'right' to have someone assist you in ending your own life if you wish to do so. We are not talking about flippant unthought out statements but rather the wishes of people such as Mr.Nicklinson, those with a condition that the medical profession cannot improve or cure, those who have suffered for years and do not wish to continue their existence in that state anymore. It's not called 'putting to death' or 'murder' , it's compassion.

The thing is, medicine and science have most certainly made it possible to live longer. What they cannot do is give us QUALITY of life to go along with those extre years. My mother passed recently and her wishes were no life support at a certain point. It was in her will and was posted above her bed as a DNR, which means 'do not resuscitate'. We three daughters had no choice but to accede to her wishes.
In Moms case her heart, lungs and urinary tract were failing. Fixing one or even two of those conditions would not have given her the life she would have wanted, what with endless rounds of dialysis, urinary and bladder control treatment, respitory failure and the inevitable stroke that, after all, would have rendered her powerless.
She was 85 when she died, a full and happy life lived and no regrets.
We kids had no regrets either. She died peacefully after support was pulled and we held onto her hands as she passed.

Don't confuse murder with life choices and compassion. It's ridiculous.

 

[CandySlice]

I have never heard of anyone being denied burial anywhere in the USA on the grounds of their having committed suicide, Luddly. Can you give me a source for that one? I have never heard of it before. - Jeri

I've never heard of anyone "being denied burial anywhere in the USA on the grounds of their having committed suicide" either but I have certainly heard of what I said in my post which was - "... If you kill yourself you can't be buried in consecrated ground..."

If I am incorrect, I apologize.

It used to be common practice, I am not sure it really applies now.

That said, I would say you were, essentially, right.

The Catholic and Jewish religions had at one time (don't know about now) a rule about suicides being buried in consecrated ground. It went all the way from not being allowed in the cemetary itself to banishment to the back lot or sometimes even more extreme

 

[CandySlice]

Hospitals and doctors cannot actively participate in someones actual death but they can keep you in a deep painless sleep and in my dads case when the end was very near our dr gave us a full bottle of injectable opiates to take home with us (his wish was to die at home and he only lasted one more day after being released from the medical facility) It was cancer (non-hodgkins lymphoma) agressive and painfull even in optimum circumstances.

Point being : it isnt all black and white out there. There are some things never spoken about in the name of compassion.

 

[thanatos144]

First I will do no harm. When did we stop holding Doctors to this pledge?

 

[CandySlice]

Hospitals and doctors cannot actively participate in someones actual death but they can keep you in a deep painless sleep and in my dads case when the end was very near our dr gave us a full bottle of injectable opiates to take home with us (his wish was to die at home and he only lasted one more day after being released from the medical facility) It was cancer (non-hodgkins lymphoma) agressive and painfull even in optimum circumstances.

Point being : it isnt all black and white out there. There are some things never spoken about in the name of compassion.

 

[thanatos144]

Hospitals and doctors cannot actively participate in someones actual death but they can keep you in a deep painless sleep and in my dads case when the end was very near our dr gave us a full bottle of injectable opiates to take home with us (his wish was to die at home and he only lasted one more day after being released from the medical facility) It was cancer (non-hodgkins lymphoma) agressive and painfull even in optimum circumstances.

Point being : it isnt all black and white out there. There are some things never spoken about in the name of compassion.

There is also reasons doctors give the oath. They are taught many deadly things and the oath Id to insure us patients that we can trust them. Hoe do you trust people who seem to only want to end life?