Do you think that if the blockade to Gaza was lifted today that the attacks against Israel would cea

[Roudy]

Hah? You aren't making any sense, which isn't unusual in your case. Here's the order of events:

Gaza ---> elects Hamas ----> Islamic terrorists ---------> shoot rockets at Israel ---------> Israel places blockade ----------> Big Mouth whines

In 2004 --->Hamas founder Sheik Ahmed Yassin----> said “that Hamas could accept a Palestinian state in the West Bank and Gaza Strip”, with Hamas offering a long-term truce in exchange for withdrawal from the territories ---------> Israel's response---------> It assassinates Hamas founder on March 22, 2004 ----------> Roudy wine's.

Even when peace is offered, Israel rejects it.

The question in the OP is directed at the wrong people. If the blockade ended, would the violence cease? No. Because Israel does not want peace.

Peace is not in Israel's 'best interest' and the sooner people start understanding why the better...

I guess all the arms and money that is sent to Hamas in order to kill more Jews is because Hamas wants peace. Sure.

 

[Humanity]

Hah? You aren't making any sense, which isn't unusual in your case. Here's the order of events:

Gaza ---> elects Hamas ----> Islamic terrorists ---------> shoot rockets at Israel ---------> Israel places blockade ----------> Big Mouth whines

In 2004 --->Hamas founder Sheik Ahmed Yassin----> said “that Hamas could accept a Palestinian state in the West Bank and Gaza Strip”, with Hamas offering a long-term truce in exchange for withdrawal from the territories ---------> Israel's response---------> It assassinates Hamas founder on March 22, 2004 ----------> Roudy wine's.

Even when peace is offered, Israel rejects it.

The question in the OP is directed at the wrong people. If the blockade ended, would the violence cease? No. Because Israel does not want peace.

Peace is not in Israel's 'best interest' and the sooner people start understanding why the better...

I guess all the arms and money that is sent to Hamas in order to kill more Jews is because Hamas wants peace. Sure.

Deflecting again Roodboy...

 

[Boston1]

I see a lot of petty bickering, but not much substance among those who think Israel should bare its throat to the Arab knife and see what happens.

The prudent move is to require that the Arab terrorists earn their way back into polite society through some reasonable period of peace. They have earned the restrictions and now are going to have to live with them until they earn their way out.

Cheers ;--)

 

[Dogmaphobe]

The desire for genocide of Jews expressed by Gazan leadership and the incessant attempts to kill any Jew possible is the cause. The blockade is the effect.

Islamic terrorist supporters like to pretend it is the other way around, but decent people know otherwise.

 

[Shusha]

Is a direct result of you shooting missiles at them and making their lives a living hell for the last 70 years.

No its not. You keep mixing up cause and consequence. The CAUSE of the conflict between Israel and Gaza is the belligerent, indiscriminate, illegal attacks on innocent Israeli citizens. The CONSEQUENCE of those attacks is the blockade and security perimeter which is put in place to prevent those attacks. No attacks, no blockade. Easy peasy.

What you are really arguing, though you seem reluctant to admit it, is that the CAUSE of the violence is the "occupation" (by which you mean ANY Jewish self-determination, self-rule or statehood). In other words, you are justifying the violence and terrorism committed by Arab Muslims as being a JUST WAR against people with no rights.

The reason I know you are arguing that above and not the EQUAL rights of Israelis (read: the Jewish people) and Palestinians is because the people of Gaza and the people of Israel have no conflict -- there is literally nothing to argue about -- there are no border disputes (the border is agreed upon), there is no 'settlement' problem, there is no Jew to offend them, there are no holy sites to argue over, there is no desire whatsoever for Israel to have sovereignty over either that land or those people, Israel has effectively entirely ceded that land to the Palestinians. There is not reason for any dispute. Except for the continued attacks by GAZANs on Israel.

They're building tunnels to bring in food and materials necessary to sustain life. According to the UN, if this immoral and illegal blockade doesn't end, the entire area will be unlivable by 2020.

Bullshit. Plenty of food and materials are brought in. 2200 calories a day -- far more than necessary to sustain life. You DO know about the obesity problem in Gaza, don't you?

And give me a source for your claim about Gaza being unlivable by 2020. Then let's talk about why that happened and who is responsible for it.

Wrong! Importing weapons into Israel is your business. What happens in areas that are not Israel, is not Israel's fucking business.

When people are importing weapons to attack Israel's civilians it sure as hell is our business. There are a number of ways to address these acts of war -- one of which, the most peaceful of which, is to prevent weapons from entering the area.

Do you think you have a right to come into my house and tell me what to do?

Nope. But I sure as hell have a right to prevent you from collecting guns that you use to shoot at me. Stop shooting at me and I'll stop collecting your mail.

Since August 2014, you attacked Gaza 696 times, they shot back 29 rockets; and yet, you claim, they're the terrorists?

Uh. No. You lie and misrepresent the facts. Gazans ATTACKED Israel 725 times. Israel responded 725 times. If Gaza stops attacking, then Israel will stop responding. Easy peasy.

 

[Billo_Really]

No its not. You keep mixing up cause and consequence. The CAUSE of the conflict between Israel and Gaza is the belligerent, indiscriminate, illegal attacks on innocent Israeli citizens. The CONSEQUENCE of those attacks is the blockade and security perimeter which is put in place to prevent those attacks. No attacks, no blockade. Easy peasy.

The blockade started as punishment to Gazan's for voting for Hamas. It has nothing to do with this bogus security perimeter.

What you are really arguing, though you seem reluctant to admit it, is that the CAUSE of the violence is the "occupation" (by which you mean ANY Jewish self-determination, self-rule or statehood). In other words, you are justifying the violence and terrorism committed by Arab Muslims as being a JUST WAR against people with no rights.

My comments have absolutely nothing to do with Judaism. This has nothing to do with religion. It is not a religious issue. It has nothing to do with Jews.

It has everything to do with this illegal and immoral occupation and blockade. You've never lived under the occupation of a foreign force, so you don't know what it is like to live that way. The violence is caused by the over 500 roadblocks and checkpoints restricting the movements of Palestinian's in the West Bank. Israel built these roadblocks on someone else's land. That's like you building a fence across my front lawn. So don't blame me for what happens next.

The reason I know you are arguing that above and not the EQUAL rights of Israelis (read: the Jewish people) and Palestinians is because the people of Gaza and the people of Israel have no conflict -- there is literally nothing to argue about -- there are no border disputes (the border is agreed upon), there is no 'settlement' problem, there is no Jew to offend them, there are no holy sites to argue over, there is no desire whatsoever for Israel to have sovereignty over either that land or those people, Israel has effectively entirely ceded that land to the Palestinians. There is not reason for any dispute. Except for the continued attacks by GAZANs on Israel.

You can't give what you don't have and that land was never Israel's to give.

Bullshit. Plenty of food and materials are brought in. 2200 calories a day -- far more than necessary to sustain life. You DO know about the obesity problem in Gaza, don't you?

2200 calories? Are you serious? What about medical supplies? Or building materials? Gazan's can't even fix their water treatment plant, because Israel won't allow the raw materials in needed to do it.

And give me a source for your claim about Gaza being unlivable by 2020. Then let's talk about why that happened and who is responsible for it.

Gaza could become uninhabitable by 2020, UN report warns

When people are importing weapons to attack Israel's civilians it sure as hell is our business. There are a number of ways to address these acts of war -- one of which, the most peaceful of which, is to prevent weapons from entering the area.

I think my country should give the Pals some real weapons. The same kind Israel has. A few predator drones, couple Raptors, a few M1A1's, some JDAMS and to top it off, throw in some Patriot missiles.

Let's make it a fair fight.

Nope. But I sure as hell have a right to prevent you from collecting guns that you use to shoot at me. Stop shooting at me and I'll stop collecting your mail.

I'm shooting at you, because you won't stop taking my mail.

Uh. No. You lie and misrepresent the facts. Gazans ATTACKED Israel 725 times. Israel responded 725 times. If Gaza stops attacking, then Israel will stop responding. Easy peasy.

I provided the link for my 696 claim, where's yours for your 725 claim.

The biggest problem with you fuckers, is that you look people in the eye and say with a straight face, "The emperor has new clothes!"

 

[Shusha]

I'm shooting at you, because you won't stop taking my mail.

Sweetie, seriously? Let's take a look at the analogy of neighbors. I have a house and a yard. You have a house and a yard. We have a fence between our two houses. We agree that your house is your house and your yard is your yard. We agree that my house is my house and my yard is my yard. We agree that there should be a fence. We agree that the fence is in the right place. We have no argument and no conflict.

Why are you shooting at me? Why are you ordering more and more guns with which to shoot at me?

 

[Shusha]

I provided the link for my 696 claim, where's yours for your 725 claim.

Oh dear. Your link said that Israel "fired upon" Gaza 696 times PLUS responded to rocket fire 29 times. Do the math, sweetie.

"Fired upon", does not indicate who INSTIGATED the attack. Its kinda like the frequent media headlines which say, "Two Palestinians killed by IDF" while neglecting to mention that the two Palestinians killed were, at the time, thrusting knives into the bellies of innocent Israelis civilians. Its a misrepresentation designed to implicate and demonize one party while exonerating and victimizing the other -- even if the other is the actual instigator of the incident.

My point is that the Gazans violated the security barrier or attacked Israel 725 times. And Israel responded. No instigation, no response. The causation lies entirely with the instigator. No attack -- no response. Easy peasy.

 

[Hossfly]

Thought I would start this new thread rather than allowing the question to derail an ongoing OP...

The answer has to be, for me at least, I have no idea if Hamas would stop firing rockets into Israel...

However, it wouldn't be a bad first step by Israel would it, in an attempt to finding a peaceful solution.

Let's face it, the blockade could VERY easily be reimplemented should Hamas be found to be firing rockets into Israel once the blockade were lifted...

Lift the blockade on the condition that no rockets are fired into Israel by Hamas.

Any Hamas rockets fired into Israel results in an immediate implementation of the blockade.

Easy right?

Right after Israel handed the keys to a Jew free Gaza, the Palestinians elected Hamas, a terrorist organization who then started shooting rockets and suicide bombing Israelis, as a way to thank them for giving them their so called land back. So anybody who thinks that lifting the blockade would cause Hamas to stop shooting rockets is probably on hallucinatory drugs. Hamas animals only understand one language. Their ultimate stated goal is the total destruction of Israel, therefore no negotiation.

I love the way the 'peaceful pro Israelis' are able to have an open mind...

Rather than your racism, your Islamophobic hatred, why not come up with a peaceful solution?

Shit, I'm responding to Roodboy... That ain't ever gonna happen...

However, let me offer a little clause for this 'lifting of the blockade'....

How about, as a condition of lifting the blockade, part of the agreement is that there is a free and open election in Gaza...???

Who are they going to elect? ISIS?

 

[Billo_Really]

Sweetie, seriously? Let's take a look at the analogy of neighbors. I have a house and a yard. You have a house and a yard. We have a fence between our two houses. We agree that your house is your house and your yard is your yard. We agree that my house is my house and my yard is my yard. We agree that there should be a fence. We agree that the fence is in the right place. We have no argument and no conflict.

We agree that's the way things should normally work, but that's not the reality between our two houses.

Why are you shooting at me? Why are you ordering more and more guns with which to shoot at me?

I told you, you won't stop taking my mail.

Now lets get this metaphor closer to the reality that exists today in the ME...

Not only will you not stop taking my mail, you built a fence on my lawn across my driveway and now I have no access to my car. And with no access to my car, I have no way of getting to my job. Since I can't work, I can't provide for my family. Which keeps getting smaller, due to your constant incursions into my house and shooting my relatives to death as they go to the bathroom.

Then you walk across the street and tell all the other neighbor's, it's my fault we have problems between us. I can't even get the morning paper, because it lands in what's left of my driveway and you set up snipers to take pot shots at me anytime I get close to the fence, you built, on my property. If that wasn't enough, you blockaded the street leading to my house and now I can't even order a pizza delivered to my residence. No more milk deliveries. No more friends dropping over. I can't leave. It's as if I'm under house arrest, without being convicted of a crime.

And when I do call the authorities and try report you, they refuse to do anything about it, due to your many contributions to their police fund.

So, with no other recourse available, I get a gun and shoot back!

This whole thing started, because you think, you can do whatever you want, wherever and whenever you feel like doing it. And then, after all the shit you've done, you have the gall, to expect me, to put down my gun?

Now we're close to the reality Israel is doing to the Palestinian's.

 

[Boston1]

The embargo is protecting palestinians far more than its protecting Israeli's. Just look at the kill ratios. Israel is extremely effective in squashing palestinian violence, anything that encourages that violence merely results in more palestinian deaths. Allowing arms into Gaza is tantamount to encouraging more suicide attacks by palestinians.

The humanitarian thing to do is not encourage palestinian terrorists to engage the Israeli's. The inevitable outcome is a ridiculously lopsided kill ratio.

If for no other reason than that alone the embargo should not only be maintained but strengthened. The UNWRA should be sent home. I'd ban knives at this point as well as any metals and all cement for tunnels. The thing to do isn't lift the ban, hell its working like a charm. We should strengthen it, including removing all UNWRA influence from Gaza.

 

[Billo_Really]

Oh dear. Your link said that Israel "fired upon" Gaza 696 times PLUS responded to rocket fire 29 times. Do the math, sweetie.

"Fired upon", does not indicate who INSTIGATED the attack. Its kinda like the frequent media headlines which say, "Two Palestinians killed by IDF" while neglecting to mention that the two Palestinians killed were, at the time, thrusting knives into the bellies of innocent Israelis civilians. Its a misrepresentation designed to implicate and demonize one party while exonerating and victimizing the other -- even if the other is the actual instigator of the incident.

My point is that the Gazans violated the security barrier or attacked Israel 725 times. And Israel responded. No instigation, no response. The causation lies entirely with the instigator. No attack -- no response. Easy peasy.

Math wasn't your strong suit, was it? And it looks like you fell asleep in English comprehension to.

Israel attacked Gaza 696 times.
Gaza militants shot 29 rockets during that same period.

696 - 29 = 667 times Israel attacked that was not in response to rocket fire.

So your whole narrative stating the rockets are the problem, is total bullshit! YOU ARE THE PROBLEM! You are the problem 667 times, since August 2014, when you agreed to a ceasefire.

667 attacks, is some ceasefire?

 

[Billo_Really]

The embargo is protecting palestinians far more than its protecting Israeli's.

That's like saying its the girls fault for getting raped, because she was wearing a red dress.

 

[Two Thumbs]

Thought I would start this new thread rather than allowing the question to derail an ongoing OP...

The answer has to be, for me at least, I have no idea if Hamas would stop firing rockets into Israel...

However, it wouldn't be a bad first step by Israel would it, in an attempt to finding a peaceful solution.

Let's face it, the blockade could VERY easily be reimplemented should Hamas be found to be firing rockets into Israel once the blockade were lifted...

Lift the blockade on the condition that no rockets are fired into Israel by Hamas.

Any Hamas rockets fired into Israel results in an immediate implementation of the blockade.

Easy right?

Israel traded land for peace and got no peace

muslims never keep their word

no matter what israel does, muslims will keep attacking.



and really, Pals kill people and the retaliation should be a blockade?

 

[Boston1]

Given that the entire terrorist diatribe has been proven false I'd be damn curious just where you got these numbers from you are running up the flagpole here.

 

[Billo_Really]

Israel traded land for peace and got no peace

You call shooting at Palestinian fishermen and farmers, peace?

BTW, it wasn't Israel's land to trade.

muslims never keep their word

The Israeli's gave their word in August 2014 that there would be a ceasefire and since then, have attacked Gaza 696 times. Yet its the Muslims, who don't keep their word?

no matter what israel does, muslims will keep attacking.

If that was the case, why is Israel the one breaking the ceasefires?

and really, Pals kill people and the retaliation should be a blockade?

The blockade was in retaliation for the Pals voting for people Israel didn't like.

 

[Boston1]

The typical overemotional response Billo lends nothing to the conversation.

The embargo is extremely effective and benefits the palestinians more than the Israeli's give that it saves the lives so many Arab terrorists. Lets take a look at the kill ratios and ask yourself. Is it really worth throwing away tens of thousands of palestinian lives for such a small return.

The simple reality is the Arabs have lost this war and its just a matter of how many more must die before they sue for peace

 

[Roudy]

^^^^^
You're right, Israel should just leave them alone and let them self destruct, just like the other Arab Muslim societies across the ME.

 

[Two Thumbs]

Israel traded land for peace and got no peace

You call shooting at Palestinian fishermen and farmers, peace?

BTW, it wasn't Israel's land to trade.

muslims never keep their word

The Israeli's gave their word in August 2014 that there would be a ceasefire and since then, have attacked Gaza 696 times. Yet its the Muslims, who don't keep their word?

no matter what israel does, muslims will keep attacking.

If that was the case, why is Israel the one breaking the ceasefires?

and really, Pals kill people and the retaliation should be a blockade?

The blockade was in retaliation for the Pals voting for people Israel didn't like.

bullshit

yes it was

all in retaliation
they never have

they don't, you know it's a lie

you mean a terror organization? yea, nobody liked them

pals are nothing but a bunch of fucking degenerates that other muslims hate. Hell, their own country wouldn't take them in

 

[Lipush]

Thought I would start this new thread rather than allowing the question to derail an ongoing OP...

The answer has to be, for me at least, I have no idea if Hamas would stop firing rockets into Israel...

However, it wouldn't be a bad first step by Israel would it, in an attempt to finding a peaceful solution.

Let's face it, the blockade could VERY easily be reimplemented should Hamas be found to be firing rockets into Israel once the blockade were lifted...

Lift the blockade on the condition that no rockets are fired into Israel by Hamas.

Any Hamas rockets fired into Israel results in an immediate implementation of the blockade.

Easy right?

Hamas will, certainly. Their main objective is to get the siege lifted so they can start rebuilding Gaza in earnest, getting a port and airport functioning, etc. The same can't be said for the more extreme groups in Gaza, or for that matter Mossad operatives, both of which would prefer the status quo in place. The ocassional rocket landing in the desert has always been used by the Zionists to "reimpose a blockade" so your idea wouldn't necessarily work, regardless of who fired what, where.

The saddest part is that you really believe that Hamas' goal is improving Gaza.

Hamas' goal is to destroy Israel. Period

Hamas immediate objective is as I have stated above, to get the siege lifted, rebuild the place and get a functioning port and airport working. Hamas' ultimate goal is the dismantling of the Zionist Paradise in favour of a free Palestinian state, that is not in dispute.

So you basically saying what I'm saying. As an Israeli and as a Zionist, I'm under a risk, since what Hamas is seeking is to destroy me.

So long live Zionism, and may we all witness quick annihilation to Hamas and anyone who supports it.