Do You Support Federal Funding For California's High-Speed Rail?

[paulitician]

Looks like Non-Californians don't want to be forced to pay for their farce. And i'm pretty sure many many Californians don't want to either.

 

[Mr.Nick]

Poor short-sighted Conservatives. Always standing in the way of Progress. Always making it so easy for history to look back and laugh and point.

Quit parroting bullshit you hear from your masters...

This crap isn't progress its thievery - furthermore I highly doubt it's even economically viable.

If progressives didn't insist on using unions California could most likely afford the project on their own.....

If they want to be dumb and build a high speed rail they can do in on their own coin.....

 

[The T]

Poor short-sighted Conservatives. Always standing in the way of Progress. Always making it so easy for history to look back and laugh and point.

Quit parroting bullshit you hear from your masters...

This crap isn't progress its thievery - furthermore I highly doubt it's even economically viable.

If progressives didn't insist on using unions California could most likely afford the project on their own.....

If they want to be dumb and build a high speed rail they can do in on their own coin.....

100% legalized theft.

 

[paulitician]

Yeah overpaid union jobs..

If California wants a high speed rail then they can fund it themselves....

How does any of this shit benefit taxpayers in other states, yet they're footing the bill.

Furthermore your argument is stupid considering California could ask for federal taxpayer money to buy everyone in California a Chevy Volt then say "well it will create jobs."

Sure it will create jobs but at what expense????

You wouldn't pay 10 dollars for a loaf of bread would you?? so why the fuck should we as a nation fund a 70 billion dollar program that only helps one state???

I hear ya, but i'm pretty sure the Socialists/Progressives won't. They're addicted to spending other peoples' money. This is a State matter. Californians want more Debt and more Taxes? Good for them, but no Federal Tax Dollars. Period, end of story.

I'm perplexed as to why they even asked???

Of course Nancy Pelosi's logic is; "we want high speed rail in California, we cant afford it so everyone else can pay for it."

What are these snug elite progressives going to do next? call high speed rail a "basic human right?" Hell, I wouldn't put it past Pelosi to say or imply such a thing.

These progressives are totally out of line.

Yeah, you've summed up warped Socialist/Progressive mentality perfectly. They just love spending other peoples' money. They can't help themselves. Their own State is $30 Billion in Debt, while the Feds are $16 Trillion in Debt. Yet they demand more Debt & Taxes. They've completely lost it.

 

[The T]

I hear ya, but i'm pretty sure the Socialists/Progressives won't. They're addicted to spending other peoples' money. This is a State matter. Californians want more Debt and more Taxes? Good for them, but no Federal Tax Dollars. Period, end of story.

I'm perplexed as to why they even asked???

Of course Nancy Pelosi's logic is; "we want high speed rail in California, we cant afford it so everyone else can pay for it."

What are these snug elite progressives going to do next? call high speed rail a "basic human right?" Hell, I wouldn't put it past Pelosi to say or imply such a thing.

These progressives are totally out of line.

Yeah, you've summed up warped Socialist/Progressive mentality perfectly. They just love spending other peoples' money. They can't help themselves. Their own State is $30 Billion in Debt, while the Feds are $16 Trillion in Debt. Yet they demand more Debt & Taxes. They've completely lost it.

And add to that unfunded mandates...$116T +...

 

[Mr.Nick]

Yeah, fuck those 4000+ people getting a living wage!!

$17,000 a living wage? In California?

In all fairness, my original math was wrong. I used 68 million in stead of 68 BILLION. That would work out to 17 million per job.
When you consider the cost of property for the right of way will be in the billions, rolling stock, more billions, material for the rail bed more billions, California will be very lucky to have 68 million left to pay 4000 workers 17 grand a year.

And in what universe does a typical union employee make 17,000 a year?

More like 50-70k a year....

When progressives pull their heads out their asses and do the math they'll start discussing eminent domain - either that or beg for more federal funding...

 

[Ernie S.]

Poor short-sighted Conservatives. Always standing in the way of Progress. Always making it so easy for history to look back and laugh and point.

Look, derp, digging a shithouse hole deeper is progress, but when you're up to your neck in shit, it would be wise to stop digging.
California has progressed well past their necks at this point.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Poor short-sighted Conservatives. Always standing in the way of Progress. Always making it so easy for history to look back and laugh and point.

Blind partisanship makes you look so stupid.

Oh yeah? What's that? Why don't you expound on that since ad hominem is fun and all, but I'd like you actually tell me what about my post sounds stupid? I mean, I guess if you're a Conservative you'd hate to be called out and told exactly what history thinks of your movement, but that's on you guys, not me.

Conservatives stood in the way of progress at every turn in this country. Abolition of slavery, Jim Crow Laws, keeping women out of the voting booths, interracial marriage, now marriage equality. By your movement's very DEFINITION you stand in the way of Progress because you're trying to "conserve" the old way of doing things.

This is poli-sci 101 folks. Oh wait, that's right. You guys hate higher education too. Never mind.

 

[Pho_King]

Says the guy who says this will hurt tourism. Because you know, our awesome weather, gorgeous beaches, Disneyland an other amusement parks and our world class entertainment wouldn't draw people here anymore.

Have another one, Barfly.

Taxing out of twners is a way of fostering TOURISM Gracie? Really?

Continue to drink the bong water son. Maybe it will further the brain damage YOU already suffer from.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Goddamn you really don't get how tourism works, do you? Or did you drink that brain cell away too? Of course tourists pay higher taxes. They always do. But again, until my beloved state stops having such awesome shit to bring people in by the millions, your claims will continue to be the drunken ramblings of a compete assclown.

Complete morons like yourself are doing a great job sending residents of california fleeing to other states.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Taxing out of twners is a way of fostering TOURISM Gracie? Really?

Continue to drink the bong water son. Maybe it will further the brain damage YOU already suffer from.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Goddamn you really don't get how tourism works, do you? Or did you drink that brain cell away too? Of course tourists pay higher taxes. They always do. But again, until my beloved state stops having such awesome shit to bring people in by the millions, your claims will continue to be the drunken ramblings of a compete assclown.

Complete morons like yourself are doing a great job sending residents of california fleeing to other states.

Oh yeah? Why's that, genius? Why don't you take this chance and drum up some reasons why you think people are leaving California. And then tell me how that ties into tourism, which is what my post was about.

Goddamn you're a fucking idiot, aren't you?

 

[flacaltenn]

Forget the argument about what it costs until you answer the question of "what it is" !!!

It is NOT HIGH-SPEED rail service from LA to SFran... We've already done that part in another thread....

-- from an acceptable source..

California High-Speed Rail Authority Releases Ambitious New Plan

The revised plan would save money by merging the bullet train with existing commuter rail lines in the San Francisco Bay area and Los Angeles basin, where tracks would be electrified. Nearly $1 billion in voter-approved bonds is available for upgrades to existing tracks, which officials say would speed up rail service and possibly generate more riders.

The bulk of the remaining cost would come from fares and private financing, with any shortfall filled by tapping into California's new industrial "cap-and-trade" program to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Environmentalists who supported that program and critics of high-speed rail have questioned whether that money can be used for such projects.

Dan Richard, chairman of the high-speed rail board, said the governor and Department of Finance believe the cap-and-trade fees are a legally viable funding source.

Sen. Doug LaMalfa, R-Willows, a critic of the high-speed rail plan, called the latest proposal a "bait-and-switch" with a $55 billion funding gap. He is promoting a ballot petition seeking to repeal the 2008 ballot measure.

"It is clear that this project is not the project that was presented to voters in 2008, and if it is to be pursued it needs to go back on the ballot," said Coupal, who co-authored the ballot arguments against the bonds in 2008.

The initial phase will link the Central Valley city of Merced and the San Fernando Valley by 2022, expanding on what originally had been proposed as a 130-mile Madera-to-Bakersfield section that critics had lampooned as a "train to nowhere."

Brown ordered the board to rethink its previous proposal as polls showed a majority of voters wanted to reconsider the $9 billion in startup funding they authorized four years ago.

NO ONE is gonna ride that as a COMMUTE mechanism. I used to jump onto a PSA flight every morning in San Jose and be in Santa Monica before 10AM.. Not gonna happen with a LOW-SPEED commuter link at Gilroy.. That's just mindless and painful to consider...

Doesn't EXIST in the plans. In no shape or fashion -- so you're debating a pink pony here. One that the taxpayers just purchased...

 

[CommonSense461]

This is just another example of politicians using our money to engratiate them selves with constituants and make profit our money too! I bet Pelosi Has property or investments that will increase in value because of this project.

 

[candycorn]

Taxing out of twners is a way of fostering TOURISM Gracie? Really?

Continue to drink the bong water son. Maybe it will further the brain damage YOU already suffer from.

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Goddamn you really don't get how tourism works, do you? Or did you drink that brain cell away too? Of course tourists pay higher taxes. They always do. But again, until my beloved state stops having such awesome shit to bring people in by the millions, your claims will continue to be the drunken ramblings of a compete assclown.

Complete morons like yourself are doing a great job sending residents of california fleeing to other states.

I've been in Cali several times; about 11 billion people live in Orange County alone <sarcasm>. If anyone is leaving CA, it's news to us who were on the 405 for 3 hours that one time, the 210 that other time for something like 2 hours, and crossing the Bay Bridge is where I spent most of my adult life.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Poor short-sighted Conservatives. Always standing in the way of Progress. Always making it so easy for history to look back and laugh and point.

Look, derp, digging a shithouse hole deeper is progress, but when you're up to your neck in shit, it would be wise to stop digging.
California has progressed well past their necks at this point.

You're right. We should continue our stupid addiction to fossil fuels, because you know, they'll be here forever. Look, I know when you get up to be in your sixties and seventies your time here is short. I get that. So for YOU, you may not care if we ever break our dependency on a limited energy source. But those of us who still have a few years more left on this planet, and more importantly, who understand the importance of a paradigm shift in energy production and consumption as a whole, projects like this are VITAL.

Like I said, stand in the way of Progress all you want. It's your own legacy that people are going to laugh their balls off about a hundred years from now, Gramps.

 

[The T]

Poor short-sighted Conservatives. Always standing in the way of Progress. Always making it so easy for history to look back and laugh and point.

Look, derp, digging a shithouse hole deeper is progress, but when you're up to your neck in shit, it would be wise to stop digging.
California has progressed well past their necks at this point.

they an either get thier house in order...or secede from the Union.

 

[The T]

This is just another example of politicians using our money to engratiate them selves with constituants and make profit our money too! I bet Pelosi Has property or investments that will increase in value because of this project.

ALL politicians have some underlying reason. Good point...

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Goddamn you really don't get how tourism works, do you? Or did you drink that brain cell away too? Of course tourists pay higher taxes. They always do. But again, until my beloved state stops having such awesome shit to bring people in by the millions, your claims will continue to be the drunken ramblings of a compete assclown.

Complete morons like yourself are doing a great job sending residents of california fleeing to other states.

I've been in Cali several times; about 11 billion people live in Orange County alone <sarcasm>. If anyone is leaving CA, it's news to us who were on the 405 for 3 hours that one time, the 210 that other time for something like 2 hours, and crossing the Bay Bridge is where I spent most of my adult life.

I've lived in California my entire life. I've seen people come and go. One reason people end up leaving is that it's really fucking expensive to live here. We bought our house at pretty much the BOTTOM of the market, and we still probably overpaid by about 20% compared to somewhere else in the country.

People will ALWAYS want to live here. Pho King is just pho king out of his pho king depths here is all.

 

[Plasmaball]

Looks like Non-Californians don't want to be forced to pay for their farce. And i'm pretty sure many many Californians don't want to either.

I don't mind paying for it....I like the future, it has wonderful things in it.

 

[ConservaDerrps]

Forget the argument about what it costs until you answer the question of "what it is" !!!

It is NOT HIGH-SPEED rail service from LA to SFran... We've already done that part in another thread....

-- from an acceptable source..

California High-Speed Rail Authority Releases Ambitious New Plan

The revised plan would save money by merging the bullet train with existing commuter rail lines in the San Francisco Bay area and Los Angeles basin, where tracks would be electrified. Nearly $1 billion in voter-approved bonds is available for upgrades to existing tracks, which officials say would speed up rail service and possibly generate more riders.

The bulk of the remaining cost would come from fares and private financing, with any shortfall filled by tapping into California's new industrial "cap-and-trade" program to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Environmentalists who supported that program and critics of high-speed rail have questioned whether that money can be used for such projects.

Dan Richard, chairman of the high-speed rail board, said the governor and Department of Finance believe the cap-and-trade fees are a legally viable funding source.

Sen. Doug LaMalfa, R-Willows, a critic of the high-speed rail plan, called the latest proposal a "bait-and-switch" with a $55 billion funding gap. He is promoting a ballot petition seeking to repeal the 2008 ballot measure.

"It is clear that this project is not the project that was presented to voters in 2008, and if it is to be pursued it needs to go back on the ballot," said Coupal, who co-authored the ballot arguments against the bonds in 2008.

The initial phase will link the Central Valley city of Merced and the San Fernando Valley by 2022, expanding on what originally had been proposed as a 130-mile Madera-to-Bakersfield section that critics had lampooned as a "train to nowhere."

Brown ordered the board to rethink its previous proposal as polls showed a majority of voters wanted to reconsider the $9 billion in startup funding they authorized four years ago.

NO ONE is gonna ride that as a COMMUTE mechanism. I used to jump onto a PSA flight every morning in San Jose and be in Santa Monica before 10AM.. Not gonna happen with a LOW-SPEED commuter link at Gilroy.. That's just mindless and painful to consider...

Doesn't EXIST in the plans. In no shape or fashion -- so you're debating a pink pony here. One that the taxpayers just purchased...

I think they'll use it, if the travel time isn't that much more. And you just make a good argument for expanding the project sooner than later to include more high-speed links.

I've traveled high-speed rails in Europe. The ride under the chunnel was fucking EPIC cool and super fast. There's no reason this country can't do the same. I mean, other than Conservatives being short-sighted pricks and pretending that infrastructure spending is ever a bad thing, I mean.

 

[flacaltenn]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha! Goddamn you really don't get how tourism works, do you? Or did you drink that brain cell away too? Of course tourists pay higher taxes. They always do. But again, until my beloved state stops having such awesome shit to bring people in by the millions, your claims will continue to be the drunken ramblings of a compete assclown.

Complete morons like yourself are doing a great job sending residents of california fleeing to other states.

Oh yeah? Why's that, genius? Why don't you take this chance and drum up some reasons why you think people are leaving California. And then tell me how that ties into tourism, which is what my post was about.

Goddamn you're a fucking idiot, aren't you?

Well Derps --- flaCAL--->TENN can tell you that.. I left because I owned a $1M cal home (1200 sq ft shack) sitting 1 mile from the San Andreas faultline WITH NO EARTHQUAKE insurance. I HAD earthquake insurance until the state of Cali took it over and screwed up the premiums and the coverage.. Number of UNINSURED like me, DOUBLED in just 4 years.

That and my daughter was getting close to high school and the choices in Cali sucked.

And there were roving bands of Hispanic walking down the center of a main street whacking my wife's Bimmer.

And I could own a couple acres of Tenn paradise with a newer larger home for 1/3 of what my Cali "estate" costs.

And I could use all those savings to go visit Cali once a year and confirm how disgusting and unfriendly and DARK the place has become..