Do you spank your kids?

[_dmp_]

Generally - I'm supportive of it. While I can't match this guy's enthusiasm...I share a lot of his views

http://maddox.xmission.com/beat.html

 

[Johnney]

i see its been a while since ive been to that site!!
your right, i agree with alot of what he stated...lol

The skull thump. A quick blow usually dealt to the side or back of the head. Simply flick them in the head with your finger.

Guilty!

 

[KLSuddeth]

Im seething; beyond pissed; insulted; infuriated and plain out MAD.

This is total and utter bullshit to the enth degree. The person who wrote this should have his ass beaten - preferably by ME.

Why am I this fucking angry? because I have 2 children. I do NOT beat them. And they are not 'worthless heathens'.

I feel I can speak about this with some authority - I know of what I speak. My father beat the shit out of me until I graduated high school, started college and then married. I never stayed out late, I never made a grade in my life UNDER a 95, AND I never started or ended a sentence without 'sir' or 'mam'. The list goes on. This man was so cruel that I spent MANY a day in the ER, once to have a retainer removed from the roof of my mouth due to him back handing me so severely. Why did he do that? I dont know. Neither does he. I confronted him on this years later (like just last year) and he regrets it because I cannot see my way past it to forgive him - I try - but Im just not there yet.

My first husband did the same thing to me - not the children. Until I left his sorry ass then laughed hysterically when he cried over it. Why did he do the same thing? My father said it would be good to 'keep me in line'.

When DK met me, I was a pathetic little person who couldnt even look people in the eyes. I chose to REFUSE to be a victim.

Victimization. Thats what beating your kids creates. If you think it creates respect, then your just a pathetic, ignorant MORON. Period. It creates fear. If you are so less of a person that your children cannot respect you out of love, then you have more problems then you thought.

Beat your children? HELL NO. Those that would beat their kids have obviously had them simply to gratify an over inflated ego which is PITIFUL enough as it is. ANYONE that does this (beating their kids - or any child for that matter), or who agrees with it OR who advocates it in ANY way should be ASHAMED of yourself. Then you should have the shit beat out of YOU. Preferably by ME.

The problem is that we live in a society of victimization. Either you are part of the answer or part of the problem. And even though Im contradicting myself to a degree, if youre part of the problem, then you deserve to be beaten within an inch of YOUR life for years on end by a person that looks 10 times bigger than you, to you. Thats what your kids see when you smack them.

This has been the first thing on this board Ive seen to really get my ire up. CHILD BEATERS SHOULD BE ASHAMED.....ASHAMED! And then, they should be taught a lesson.....slowly and painfully....and to be honest, I want to watch - then participate.

 

[KLSuddeth]

I forgot to finish the part where I brought up DK (I dont get mad often, but when I do, I get mad ALL over from the tips of my red hair, throughout my italian/cajun self and then I just EXPLODE)

DK worked with me to CONVINCE me that I didnt HAVE to be a victim. And the children are not afraid of him or me for that matter. ANd guess what? They behave WAY better over here than at their father's.

Im still seething MAD at the stupidity of this, the cruelty of this, etc. Great way to prove youre in control.....beat a child - someone way smaller and weaker than you....yeah. that makes you a REAL big, strong man (or woman for that matter)

 

[_dmp_]

You need to relax...it's just satire.

 

[KLSuddeth]

sorry.

there are very few things that get my ire up - this is one of the few.

 

[_dmp_]

Originally posted by KLSuddeth
sorry.

there are very few things that get my ire up - this is one of the few.

What the author, in my opinion, is doing is 180 degrees of what popular culture tells parents nowadays. He's taking the extreme opposite view for the shock value.

Generally, however, in principle, he's right on the money.

 

[KLSuddeth]

Please clarify for me your meaning regarding his being right on the money? Thanks.

 

[_dmp_]

Originally posted by KLSuddeth
Please clarify for me your meaning regarding his being right on the money? Thanks.

Kids need to be disciplined. Kids will learn best by corporal punishment. I believe the author is making a drastic case that by beating (appropriately - don't argue semantics here) our kids, we show we love them enough to care about what they do, how they behave. We make behaviour IMPORTANT...Fear is a GOOD motivator.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Fear is a GOOD motivator

I've learned that fear is NOT a good motivator, just a motivator. It only re-inforces the negative side of consequences and does not teach the child that good behavior is rewarded, only that bad behavior has consequences.

 

[_dmp_]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
I've learned that fear is NOT a good motivator, just a motivator. It only re-inforces the negative side of consequences and does not teach the child that good behavior is rewarded, only that bad behavior has consequences.

I think that 'negative reinforment' term is a bunch of hippy b.s.

Teaching kids that bad behavior has severe consequences is MORE important, while they are young, than rewards for good behaviour.

Id est, I'd rather have my kid NOT do bad, than to do GOOD for the sake of a reward.

 

[KLSuddeth]

hippy BS? Whatever.

Call me a hippy then.

 

[Dan]

There's nothing wrong with a smack on the butt or something, but actually BEATING a kid is in the same category as molesting a kid, in my opinion.

BTW, I know the site was satire, I was just throwing my 2 cents out there. KL, I'm sorry to hear what you've gone through, but it seems to me that you've become a much stronger person now, which is a very good thing!

 

[remie]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
...... It only re-inforces the negative side of consequences and does not teach the child that good behavior is rewarded, only that bad behavior has consequences. [/B]

I dont mean to butt in on this but feel like saying something on the subject. While I agree that only negative reinforcement is very unhealthy, the occasional swat on the rear is not unhealthy. As the parent of two grown and two young children, my experience tells me that positive reinforcement works most of the time. Having said that, when a child knowingly and willingly disobeys it is ok for them to understand something about negative consequences. While I would NEVER dream of beating or abusing my children, there are times when the best attention getter is a swat on the butt.

I do agree with dmp that this drips with satire and is in response to what so many parents allow in their homes with their children. The path of least resistance is not always best.

I am happy to report that my grown daughters are outstanding young ladies that were very little trouble to rear. My relationship with them could not be better and it is not because they always got their way. Rather because ground rules were explained to them. All in all I think kids want to know what the boundries are and go astray when the parent doesnt insist that they respect the boundries.

Court is still out on my two young sons!!!

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by dmp
I think that 'negative reinforment' term is a bunch of hippy b.s.

Teaching kids that bad behavior has severe consequences is MORE important, while they are young, than rewards for good behaviour.

Id est, I'd rather have my kid NOT do bad, than to do GOOD for the sake of a reward.

and thats why we have moral decay and a spoiled rotten generation growing up now. We don't have kids and young adults treating each other with respect and kindness today because theres no reward for being kind. All we have is bullies in the schoolyard, street gangs, drive by shootings, and columbine type incidents all with the childs outlook of trying not to get caught and suffer bad consequences.

Call it hippy BS all you like, it won't change the fact that positive reinforcement has better results than negative reinforcement.

While its necessary to teach children that bad behaviour has consequences, its not as important as teaching them good behaviour has its own rewards. It also leads to the 'I'm not responsible' or 'victim mentality' that pervades our society now.

negative reinforcement as a primary source of discipline only enforces the belief that its better not to get caught than it is to be good.

 

[_dmp_]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
and thats why we have moral decay and a spoiled rotten generation growing up now. We don't have kids and young adults treating each other with respect and kindness today because theres no reward for being kind. All we have is bullies in the schoolyard, street gangs, drive by shootings, and columbine type incidents all with the childs outlook of trying not to get caught and suffer bad consequences.

Call it hippy BS all you like, it won't change the fact that positive reinforcement has better results than negative reinforcement.

While its necessary to teach children that bad behaviour has consequences, its not as important as teaching them good behaviour has its own rewards. It also leads to the 'I'm not responsible' or 'victim mentality' that pervades our society now.

negative reinforcement as a primary source of discipline only enforces the belief that its better not to get caught than it is to be good.

Lemme get this straight...you feel we have moral decay, yet fewer parents are SPANKING nowadays? The moral decay is from NOT spanking kids...in part.

I can PROMISE you that if Bullies were spanked at home, they'd not be bullies. I can promise you if parents of gang members showed their kids the belt more often, the kid would likely NOT be in a gang.

The "Positive Reinforcement" is NOWHERE near strong enough to keep kids from poor choices. Usually, kids do something bad because their reward (if not caught) is greater than if they didn't do it.

Pascifism never solved anything.

You are 180 degrees from right thinking about this...



Darin

 

[KLSuddeth]

how old are your children Darin?

 

[_dmp_]

2 and 4

 

[KLSuddeth]

I see.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by dmp
Lemme get this straight...you feel we have moral decay, yet fewer parents are SPANKING nowadays? The moral decay is from NOT spanking kids...in part.

I can PROMISE you that if Bullies were spanked at home, they'd not be bullies. I can promise you if parents of gang members showed their kids the belt more often, the kid would likely NOT be in a gang.

The "Positive Reinforcement" is NOWHERE near strong enough to keep kids from poor choices. Usually, kids do something bad because their reward (if not caught) is greater than if they didn't do it.

Pascifism never solved anything.

You are 180 degrees from right thinking about this...



Darin

No, we have a decaying moral youth because these kids are being beat as a form of discipline instead of being taught that good behavior has better rewards. And I did not say to avoid corporal punishment, a spanking can certainly be warranted from time to time, just not as a primary tool.

I can ALSO promise you that most of those 'gang' kids that you are referring to are receiving neither positive or negative reinforcement. There are many example of inner city kids that become decent citizens because of a good positive home. More so than those who are in fear of a belt.

Pacifism DID solve some things, as evidenced by Doctor King, however, I didn't say that we shouldn completely withhold corporal punishment, it just shouldn't be your primary form of teaching behaviour.

When all you have is fear of physical abuse, you've failed the greatest teachings that god gave mankind.