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Do those with employer sponsored HC have a right to force others to pay for it?

JoeMoma

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Others are not necessarily paying more in taxes because of someone else's tax break. If I am able to build a billion dollar company aided by getting a tax break on a legal deduction, I have created a tax base that did not exist before, adding to the countries tax revenues.
 
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bendog

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Others are not necessarily paying more in taxes because of someone else's tax break. If I am able to build a billion dollar company aided by getting a tax break on a legal deduction, I have created a tax base that did not exist before, adding to the countries tax revenues.
Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?
 

JoeMoma

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Others are not necessarily paying more in taxes because of someone else's tax break. If I am able to build a billion dollar company aided by getting a tax break on a legal deduction, I have created a tax base that did not exist before, adding to the countries tax revenues.
Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?
No.
 
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bendog

bendog

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Others are not necessarily paying more in taxes because of someone else's tax break. If I am able to build a billion dollar company aided by getting a tax break on a legal deduction, I have created a tax base that did not exist before, adding to the countries tax revenues.
Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?
No.
Actually, you did, if you paid for health insurance. The only way you couldn't have is if the fed govt chose not to expend tax receipts or deficit dollars to make up for your tax expenditure.

However, I'd argue that's not uncivil or even immoral, unless you got a tax expenditure but then cry "foul" when you're taxed for obamacare.
 

WorldWatcher

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Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?


Ummm...

All businesses pay employees with other peoples money. Unless it's not really a business and someone is just handing out cash.

A store buys a widget from ACME Manufacturing. It cost's them $10, they sell it for $12. They pay ACME the $10 for the widget. That leaves them with $2. Now sell a whole bunch of widgets, thingys, do-dads, and nick-a-brick. You now have money to pay expenses such as rent, utilities, employees, etc.

In each case the money comes from other people. Therefore all businesses pay their employee with money that comes from other people.


>>>>
 

Soggy in NOLA

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In 2008, employers with employer sponsored health insurance got 131 BILLION dollars in tax breaks.

What are the largest tax expenditures?

That tax break was paid for either with taxes on employers and employees without healthcare insurance, or deficit dollars passed on to children, who didn't get a vote.

That's only relevant if we were to assume the government is entitled to 100% of what corporations make.
 

Arianrhod

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Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?


Ummm...

All businesses pay employees with other peoples money. Unless it's not really a business and someone is just handing out cash.

A store buys a widget from ACME Manufacturing. It cost's them $10, they sell it for $12. They pay ACME the $10 for the widget. That leaves them with $2. Now sell a whole bunch of widgets, thingys, do-dads, and nick-a-brick. You now have money to pay expenses such as rent, utilities, employees, etc.

In each case the money comes from other people. Therefore all businesses pay their employee with money that comes from other people.


>>>>

Soooo, getting back to the takers cruising along on their employers' tax break-provided health insurance and bitching about "paying for somebody else" - i.e., those who provide their own insurance...what say you?
 
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bendog

bendog

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Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?


Ummm...

All businesses pay employees with other peoples money. Unless it's not really a business and someone is just handing out cash.

A store buys a widget from ACME Manufacturing. It cost's them $10, they sell it for $12. They pay ACME the $10 for the widget. That leaves them with $2. Now sell a whole bunch of widgets, thingys, do-dads, and nick-a-brick. You now have money to pay expenses such as rent, utilities, employees, etc.

In each case the money comes from other people. Therefore all businesses pay their employee with money that comes from other people.


>>>>
yes, but the money used to pay for healthcare benefits is refunded by the fed govt. Your analysis ignores the impact of corporate welfare in the form of the HC tax expenditure. that is, the gummit subsidises one guys wages by taxing others.
 

Arianrhod

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JoeMoma

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Others are not necessarily paying more in taxes because of someone else's tax break. If I am able to build a billion dollar company aided by getting a tax break on a legal deduction, I have created a tax base that did not exist before, adding to the countries tax revenues.
Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?
No.
That being said, I am for scraping Obama care. And then as part of the new health care law allow everyone to deduct the expense of health insurance. We need to get out of the habit of depending on employer provider health insurance and allow individuals to shop for the insurance that best fits their needs can of like we do now for auto insurance.
 
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bendog

bendog

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In 2008, employers with employer sponsored health insurance got 131 BILLION dollars in tax breaks.

What are the largest tax expenditures?

That tax break was paid for either with taxes on employers and employees without healthcare insurance, or deficit dollars passed on to children, who didn't get a vote.

That's only relevant if we were to assume the government is entitled to 100% of what corporations make.
Well. aren't you one who's arguing it's unfair to tax you to pay for others' healthcare?
 

OKTexas

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In 2008, employers with employer sponsored health insurance got 131 BILLION dollars in tax breaks.

What are the largest tax expenditures?

That tax break was paid for either with taxes on employers and employees without healthcare insurance, or deficit dollars passed on to children, who didn't get a vote.

Great, you push for the employees to pay taxes on their benefits packages and then sit back and watch every union abandon your party.
 
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bendog

bendog

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Others are not necessarily paying more in taxes because of someone else's tax break. If I am able to build a billion dollar company aided by getting a tax break on a legal deduction, I have created a tax base that did not exist before, adding to the countries tax revenues.
Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?
No.
That being said, I am for scraping Obama care. And then as part of the new health care law allow everyone to deduct the expense of health insurance. We need to get out of the habit of depending on employer provider health insurance and allow individuals to shop for the insurance that best fits their needs can of like we do now for auto insurance.
I'd agree partly. We should get rid of the corp welfare of letting employers get the tax deduction from their corp profits. Then, use the money to fund tax credits for individuals to purchase HC privately.
 
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bendog

bendog

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In 2008, employers with employer sponsored health insurance got 131 BILLION dollars in tax breaks.

What are the largest tax expenditures?

That tax break was paid for either with taxes on employers and employees without healthcare insurance, or deficit dollars passed on to children, who didn't get a vote.

Great, you push for the employees to pay taxes on their benefits packages and then sit back and watch every union abandon your party.
No, I'd get rid of the packages in exchange for tax credits to individuals. Partly because if an individual is purchasing a service in a free market, they'll typically chose the most efficient service.

But the point of the thread is to expose the hypocrisy of those complaining their taxes go to obamacare, when in fact, their employer sponsored plans are paid for with taxes.
 

Siete

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2008 ?


uh huh, allllllrrrrriiiightie then.
 

depotoo

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How did I know where you were headed with this?
Others are not necessarily paying more in taxes because of someone else's tax break. If I am able to build a billion dollar company aided by getting a tax break on a legal deduction, I have created a tax base that did not exist before, adding to the countries tax revenues.
Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?
No.
That being said, I am for scraping Obama care. And then as part of the new health care law allow everyone to deduct the expense of health insurance. We need to get out of the habit of depending on employer provider health insurance and allow individuals to shop for the insurance that best fits their needs can of like we do now for auto insurance.
I'd agree partly. We should get rid of the corp welfare of letting employers get the tax deduction from their corp profits. Then, use the money to fund tax credits for individuals to purchase HC privately.
 

depotoo

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And here...
In 2008, employers with employer sponsored health insurance got 131 BILLION dollars in tax breaks.

What are the largest tax expenditures?

That tax break was paid for either with taxes on employers and employees without healthcare insurance, or deficit dollars passed on to children, who didn't get a vote.

Great, you push for the employees to pay taxes on their benefits packages and then sit back and watch every union abandon your party.
No, I'd get rid of the packages in exchange for tax credits to individuals. Partly because if an individual is purchasing a service in a free market, they'll typically chose the most efficient service.

But the point of the thread is to expose the hypocrisy of those complaining their taxes go to obamacare, when in fact, their employer sponsored plans are paid for with taxes.
 

JoeMoma

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Ah, but did you pay your employees with other people's money?


Ummm...

All businesses pay employees with other peoples money. Unless it's not really a business and someone is just handing out cash.

A store buys a widget from ACME Manufacturing. It cost's them $10, they sell it for $12. They pay ACME the $10 for the widget. That leaves them with $2. Now sell a whole bunch of widgets, thingys, do-dads, and nick-a-brick. You now have money to pay expenses such as rent, utilities, employees, etc.

In each case the money comes from other people. Therefore all businesses pay their employee with money that comes from other people.


>>>>
yes, but the money used to pay for healthcare benefits is refunded by the fed govt. Your analysis ignores the impact of corporate welfare in the form of the HC tax expenditure. that is, the gummit subsidises one guys wages by taxing others.
No. Money used to pay for health care benifits results in a reduction in my income which results in a reduction of the tax I pay the government. If I happen to overpay the tax, then some of the money I payed in is refunded to me.
 

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