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CDZ Discussion on Pfizer Covid Vaccine

gipper

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Getting the virus shot is a gamble, I factored in the possibility that by getting the shot I would not infect anyone or become infected. That the possibility of killing this virus to save more lives & a return to more normal life was worth the risk. 2 shots zero problems.
The problem with that conclusion is it’s not accurate. There are plenty of people who got the vaccine and then got covid and some have died.

because none are 100% effective. howeverrrrrrrrr............ statistically speaking, very few actually got the disease AND most that have after vaccinated, their symptoms were milder & avoided hospitalization.

You have any evidence to support your assertions? I have a study showing that, far from helping, those who got the Pfizer vaccine were more likely to get Covid variants:
Here in lies the problem. We are getting lots of conflicting information. Of course, the establishment restricts their information to sources which promote the vaccines and refuse or actively silence opposing viewpoints.

Now to intelligent thinking individuals, the fact the establishment does this means we must question the efficacy of the vaccines.
 

playtime

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got my 2nd shot of the pfizer vaccine on april 3 & i can't wait to see people being turned away if they aren't vaccinated.
LOL. The ugly tyrant rears his ugly head.

that's the free market baby!!!! if a damn bakery can turn away a gay couple for having the audacity to wanna have a <GASP!> wedding cake ... then any private biz'nez can choose to keep their patrons healthy.

no shirt, no shoes, no proof of vaccination ...

no entry.

btw, i'm female. born & raised.
 
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phoenyx

phoenyx

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Getting the virus shot is a gamble, I factored in the possibility that by getting the shot I would not infect anyone or become infected. That the possibility of killing this virus to save more lives & a return to more normal life was worth the risk. 2 shots zero problems.
The problem with that conclusion is it’s not accurate. There are plenty of people who got the vaccine and then got covid and some have died.

because none are 100% effective. howeverrrrrrrrr............ statistically speaking, very few actually got the disease AND most that have after vaccinated, their symptoms were milder & avoided hospitalization.

You have any evidence to support your assertions? I have a study showing that, far from helping, those who got the Pfizer vaccine were more likely to get Covid variants:
Here in lies the problem. We are getting lots of conflicting information. Of course, the establishment restricts their information to sources which promote the vaccines and refuse or actively silence opposing viewpoints.

Now to intelligent thinking individuals, the fact the establishment does this means we must question the efficacy of the vaccines.

I definitely agree that restricting information is generally bad. I believe that some ideas are definitely bad, but I think the solution isn't to try to censor them out of existence but to point out how they're bad. I just found an article on Forbes that has some good ideas as to how to do that:
 

playtime

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600,000 people have died from COVID.

I'll take my chances with 1/2,000,000 temporary paralysis.

People are really, really, really bad at math.
People really are bad at math.

For instance, the notion that 600k people have died from covid. Sensible people know this number is a lie.

Then let's start with the fact that if only 10% of the 600k people who have died of covid actually died of covid, that means that .000074% of the people will die from Covid.

That is 1.7 tenths of a percent of dying from Covid.

Far less than dying from the 'cure'.
People are also bad at history. Pfizer like most big pharma firms has a very long history of fines and criminal actions.

Would you take a jab from the Mafia or a Mexican drug cartel?
Pfizer's History of Crimes and Misdemeanors - Progressive Radio Network
Crimes of Covid Vaccine Maker Pfizer Documented
Pfizer - History of Pfizer, Products & Legal Claims
Pfizer Hit with Largest Criminal Fine in US History

Drug maker Pfizer, Inc. and one of its subsidiaries have agreed to pay $2.3 billion dollars to settle civil and criminal charges regarding its marketing of the drug Bextra. The criminal portion of the fine is the largest fine ever levied by the United States government for any matter. As part of the settlement, Pfizer pled guilty to felony violation of the Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act for marketing the drug with the intent to deceive and mislead the public.

Unfortunately, these records don't seem to last long -- Eli Lilly set the previous record with its illegal Viva Zyprexa campaign just last January.

I have no idea how people can still trust these vaccine companies. It is like trusting a psycopathic liar who has killed people in the past. I think most people are just unaware and or don't want to be aware.
Yes. It’s sad that so many people are sheep. They want to be told what to do.

What’s really hilarious are the sheep telling those of us unwilling to take a fake vaccine from a criminal entity, that we’re crazy.

The power of the media, big pharma, and the government (Axis of Evil) to deceive should never be underestimated.

Please gipper, I am hopping to make the Clean Debate Zone one where we don't insult each other with base insults. As I mentioned to Thoth, my father is generally a very intelligent man, but when it comes to vaccines, not so much. He's taken the first dose of one of the 2 dose Covid vaccines and is set to take his second. I'm trying to persuade him otherwise, not sure if I'll succeed. But what I do know is that he definitely didn't like my brother calling him a sheep. I'm thinking along the lines of my signature- we can't beat them over the head with the truth, we have to entice them to come look at the evidence we've seen.

did it occur to you that NOT getting the vaccine makes y'all, sheeple?

Playtime's post is a perfect example of why we shouldn't be using insulting words like "sheeple" here. The focus on the evidence is gone, replaced by what amounts to flaming each other.

oops. however your 'evidence' is only supported by what apparently is quackery.



FDA Warns Mercola for Selling Bogus COVID Treatments ...
Medical News | Medpage Today › ... › Exclusives


Mar 8, 2021 — It also points out several pages on Mercola's websites displaying claims such as vitamin C is a "vastly underused antiviral drug" and that ...


FDA cites Mercola for alleged COVID-19 treatment claims
Daily news on dietary supplements, sports nutrition, functional foods, and herbals in North America. › 2021/03/08 › F...

Mar 8, 2021 — FDA cited two other articles posted on Mercola's website with his byline. The second article cited in the warning letter, which was published on ...


FDA warns Mercola: Stop selling fake COVID remedies and ...
Alliance for Science › blog › 2021/03


Mar 15, 2021 — The July letter requested federal legal action against Mercola for making false claims on his website that at least 22 vitamins, supplements and ...

seems that ' doctor ' is a modern day snake oil salesman. was it ok to call HIM a quack? now, don't get me wrong here, i believe homeopathy has its place & i take care of myself using natural means ... to a point. after that, i rely on hard cold science.
 
Last edited:
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phoenyx

phoenyx

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Be careful with the product. It works but is not fully verified or understood.

I actually don't think it works at all.
The evidence demonstrates clearly that it does.

Prove it then.
That's been long done.

So you assert. We are here to discuss different points of view. In any discussion, I think it's natural that it's up to those who make the assertions to provide the evidence of their assertions. Failing to do so damages the credibility of the person or people making the assertions.
 

playtime

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600,000 people have died from COVID.

I'll take my chances with 1/2,000,000 temporary paralysis.

People are really, really, really bad at math.
People really are bad at math.

For instance, the notion that 600k people have died from covid. Sensible people know this number is a lie.

Then let's start with the fact that if only 10% of the 600k people who have died of covid actually died of covid, that means that .000074% of the people will die from Covid.

That is 1.7 tenths of a percent of dying from Covid.

Far less than dying from the 'cure'.
People are also bad at history. Pfizer like most big pharma firms has a very long history of fines and criminal actions.

Would you take a jab from the Mafia or a Mexican drug cartel?
Pfizer's History of Crimes and Misdemeanors - Progressive Radio Network
Crimes of Covid Vaccine Maker Pfizer Documented
Pfizer - History of Pfizer, Products & Legal Claims
Pfizer Hit with Largest Criminal Fine in US History

Drug maker Pfizer, Inc. and one of its subsidiaries have agreed to pay $2.3 billion dollars to settle civil and criminal charges regarding its marketing of the drug Bextra. The criminal portion of the fine is the largest fine ever levied by the United States government for any matter. As part of the settlement, Pfizer pled guilty to felony violation of the Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act for marketing the drug with the intent to deceive and mislead the public.

Unfortunately, these records don't seem to last long -- Eli Lilly set the previous record with its illegal Viva Zyprexa campaign just last January.

I have no idea how people can still trust these vaccine companies. It is like trusting a psycopathic liar who has killed people in the past. I think most people are just unaware and or don't want to be aware.
Yes. It’s sad that so many people are sheep. They want to be told what to do.

What’s really hilarious are the sheep telling those of us unwilling to take a fake vaccine from a criminal entity, that we’re crazy.

The power of the media, big pharma, and the government (Axis of Evil) to deceive should never be underestimated.

Please gipper, I am hopping to make the Clean Debate Zone one where we don't insult each other with base insults. As I mentioned to Thoth, my father is generally a very intelligent man, but when it comes to vaccines, not so much. He's taken the first dose of one of the 2 dose Covid vaccines and is set to take his second. I'm trying to persuade him otherwise, not sure if I'll succeed. But what I do know is that he definitely didn't like my brother calling him a sheep. I'm thinking along the lines of my signature- we can't beat them over the head with the truth, we have to entice them to come look at the evidence we've seen.

did it occur to you that NOT getting the vaccine makes y'all, sheeple?
I don’t think you understand the meaning. Lol. You do as you’re told by the establishment. That makes you a little lamb. Those who oppose the establishment are brave courageous warriors. See the difference?

i see people that don't look at science as willfully ignorant.
 

StormAl

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Be careful with the product. It works but is not fully verified or understood.

I actually don't think it works at all.
The evidence demonstrates clearly that it does.

Prove it then.
That's been long done.

So you assert. We are here to discuss different points of view. In any discussion, I think it's natural that it's up to those who make the assertions to provide the evidence of their assertions. Failing to do so damages the credibility of the person or people making the assertions.
So the experts assert. You are not qualified to make such assertions pro or con.
 

playtime

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Getting the virus shot is a gamble, I factored in the possibility that by getting the shot I would not infect anyone or become infected. That the possibility of killing this virus to save more lives & a return to more normal life was worth the risk. 2 shots zero problems.
The problem with that conclusion is it’s not accurate. There are plenty of people who got the vaccine and then got covid and some have died.

because none are 100% effective. howeverrrrrrrrr............ statistically speaking, very few actually got the disease AND most that have after vaccinated, their symptoms were milder & avoided hospitalization.

You have any evidence to support your assertions? I have a study showing that, far from helping, those who got the Pfizer vaccine were more likely to get Covid variants:

ummmm... every year we get a flu shot, based on the most prevalent strain(s) going around at the time.

virus' mutate. this is a brand spanking new one & the research is still evolving. tweeks & boosters will probably become the norm until/unless a cure happens.
 

StormAl

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Be careful with the product. It works but is not fully verified or understood.

I actually don't think it works at all.
The evidence demonstrates clearly that it does.

Prove it then.
That's been long done.

So you assert. We are here to discuss different points of view. In any discussion, I think it's natural that it's up to those who make the assertions to provide the evidence of their assertions. Failing to do so damages the credibility of the person or people making the assertions.
You believe what you believe, and that is at odd with the experts.

That is a fact.
 
OP
phoenyx

phoenyx

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did it occur to you that NOT getting the vaccine makes y'all, sheeple?

Playtime's post is a perfect example of why we shouldn't be using insulting words like "sheeple" here. The focus on the evidence is gone, replaced by what amounts to flaming each other.

oops. however your 'evidence' is only supported by what apparently is quackery.

I'm glad you used the word "apparently", because it suggests that appearances are not always the truth.


FDA Warns Mercola for Selling Bogus COVID Treatments ...
Medical News | Medpage Today › ... › Exclusives


Mar 8, 2021 — It also points out several pages on Mercola's websites displaying claims such as vitamin C is a "vastly underused antiviral drug" and that ...


FDA cites Mercola for alleged COVID-19 treatment claims
Daily news on dietary supplements, sports nutrition, functional foods, and herbals in North America. › 2021/03/08 › F...


FDA warns Mercola: Stop selling fake COVID remedies and ...
Alliance for Science › blog › 2021/03


Mar 15, 2021 — The July letter requested federal legal action against Mercola for making false claims on his website that at least 22 vitamins, supplements and ...

seems that ' doctor ' is a modern day snake oil salesman. was it ok to call HIM a quack? now, don't get me wrong here, i believe homeopathy has its place & i take care of myself using natural means ... to a point. after that, i rely on hard cold science.





Mar 8, 2021 — FDA cited two other articles posted on Mercola's website with his byline. The second article cited in the warning letter, which was published on ...

I am quite aware that the FDA wrote mercola.com a warning letter. Are you aware of the other side of the story though? If not, I encourage you to take a look at the following post I made:
 

playtime

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did it occur to you that NOT getting the vaccine makes y'all, sheeple?

Playtime's post is a perfect example of why we shouldn't be using insulting words like "sheeple" here. The focus on the evidence is gone, replaced by what amounts to flaming each other.

oops. however your 'evidence' is only supported by what apparently is quackery.

I'm glad you used the word "apparently", because it suggests that appearances are not always the truth.


FDA Warns Mercola for Selling Bogus COVID Treatments ...
Medical News | Medpage Today › ... › Exclusives


Mar 8, 2021 — It also points out several pages on Mercola's websites displaying claims such as vitamin C is a "vastly underused antiviral drug" and that ...


FDA cites Mercola for alleged COVID-19 treatment claims
Daily news on dietary supplements, sports nutrition, functional foods, and herbals in North America. › 2021/03/08 › F...


FDA warns Mercola: Stop selling fake COVID remedies and ...
Alliance for Science › blog › 2021/03


Mar 15, 2021 — The July letter requested federal legal action against Mercola for making false claims on his website that at least 22 vitamins, supplements and ...

seems that ' doctor ' is a modern day snake oil salesman. was it ok to call HIM a quack? now, don't get me wrong here, i believe homeopathy has its place & i take care of myself using natural means ... to a point. after that, i rely on hard cold science.





Mar 8, 2021 — FDA cited two other articles posted on Mercola's website with his byline. The second article cited in the warning letter, which was published on ...

I am quite aware that the FDA wrote mercola.com a warning letter. Are you aware of the other side of the story though? If not, I encourage you to take a look at the following post I made:

apparently if it walks like a duck ....

you know the rest.
 
OP
phoenyx

phoenyx

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Getting the virus shot is a gamble, I factored in the possibility that by getting the shot I would not infect anyone or become infected. That the possibility of killing this virus to save more lives & a return to more normal life was worth the risk. 2 shots zero problems.
The problem with that conclusion is it’s not accurate. There are plenty of people who got the vaccine and then got covid and some have died.

because none are 100% effective. howeverrrrrrrrr............ statistically speaking, very few actually got the disease AND most that have after vaccinated, their symptoms were milder & avoided hospitalization.

You have any evidence to support your assertions? I have a study showing that, far from helping, those who got the Pfizer vaccine were more likely to get Covid variants:

ummmm... every year we get a flu shot, based on the most prevalent strain(s) going around at the time.

virus' mutate. this is a brand spanking new one & the research is still evolving. tweeks & boosters will probably become the norm until/unless a cure happens.

You're missing the point- the study found that people who took the Pfizer vaccine were 8 times more likely to get a Covid 19 variant. Which means that far from helping defend against this variant, the Pfizer vaccine was actually making things worse.
 
OP
phoenyx

phoenyx

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did it occur to you that NOT getting the vaccine makes y'all, sheeple?

Playtime's post is a perfect example of why we shouldn't be using insulting words like "sheeple" here. The focus on the evidence is gone, replaced by what amounts to flaming each other.

oops. however your 'evidence' is only supported by what apparently is quackery.

I'm glad you used the word "apparently", because it suggests that appearances are not always the truth.


FDA Warns Mercola for Selling Bogus COVID Treatments ...
Medical News | Medpage Today › ... › Exclusives


Mar 8, 2021 — It also points out several pages on Mercola's websites displaying claims such as vitamin C is a "vastly underused antiviral drug" and that ...


FDA cites Mercola for alleged COVID-19 treatment claims
Daily news on dietary supplements, sports nutrition, functional foods, and herbals in North America. › 2021/03/08 › F...


FDA warns Mercola: Stop selling fake COVID remedies and ...
Alliance for Science › blog › 2021/03


Mar 15, 2021 — The July letter requested federal legal action against Mercola for making false claims on his website that at least 22 vitamins, supplements and ...

seems that ' doctor ' is a modern day snake oil salesman. was it ok to call HIM a quack? now, don't get me wrong here, i believe homeopathy has its place & i take care of myself using natural means ... to a point. after that, i rely on hard cold science.





Mar 8, 2021 — FDA cited two other articles posted on Mercola's website with his byline. The second article cited in the warning letter, which was published on ...

I am quite aware that the FDA wrote mercola.com a warning letter. Are you aware of the other side of the story though? If not, I encourage you to take a look at the following post I made:

apparently if it walks like a duck ....

you know the rest.

Yes, I do. Did you read the post I linked to?
 

gipper

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got my 2nd shot of the pfizer vaccine on april 3 & i can't wait to see people being turned away if they aren't vaccinated.
LOL. The ugly tyrant rears his ugly head.

that's the free market baby!!!! if a damn bakery can turn away a gay couple for having the audacity to wanna have a <GASP!> wedding cake ... then any private biz'nez can choose to keep their patrons healthy.

no shirt, no shoes, no proof of vaccination ...

no entry.

btw, i'm female. born & raised.
So now you don’t know you’re a little lamb plus you don’t understand the free market.
 
OP
phoenyx

phoenyx

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got my 2nd shot of the pfizer vaccine on april 3 & i can't wait to see people being turned away if they aren't vaccinated.
LOL. The ugly tyrant rears his ugly head.

that's the free market baby!!!! if a damn bakery can turn away a gay couple for having the audacity to wanna have a <GASP!> wedding cake ... then any private biz'nez can choose to keep their patrons healthy.

no shirt, no shoes, no proof of vaccination ...

no entry.

btw, i'm female. born & raised.
So now you don’t know you’re a little lamb plus you don’t understand the free market.

Come on gipper, how is it helping the discussion to continue with these ad hominem attacks?
 

gipper

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got my 2nd shot of the pfizer vaccine on april 3 & i can't wait to see people being turned away if they aren't vaccinated.
LOL. The ugly tyrant rears his ugly head.

that's the free market baby!!!! if a damn bakery can turn away a gay couple for having the audacity to wanna have a <GASP!> wedding cake ... then any private biz'nez can choose to keep their patrons healthy.

no shirt, no shoes, no proof of vaccination ...

no entry.

btw, i'm female. born & raised.
So now you don’t know you’re a little lamb plus you don’t understand the free market.

Come on gipper, how is it helping the discussion to continue with these ad hominem attacks?
Sorry. It’s not personal. Just business.
 

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