Death by Wind Turbine.........

[elektra]

What are you, like, 10 years old?

No, just a lot smarter than you.

I say you exaggerate (I am being nice). Wind Turbines tower above trees. I could post dozens of pictures, like this one from Ontario.

So the concept of "nearby trees blocking a view" is really beyond your grasp?

You're the only one here talking about trees being taller than windmills.

Learn to read, mental giant, "science", right?

 

[Syriusly]

In a not so cheery story I am sad to report, there is a very real danger out there, Wind Turbines. I will not drag this out with my monologue, I will simply let people decide.
]

Youtube- the preferred 'citation' by those who don't have a real citation.

Every energy source that we have has potential negative consequences.

In 2013, energy sources and percent share of total electricity generation were

• Coal 39%
• Natural Gas 27%
• Nuclear 19%
• Hydropower 7%
• Other Renewable 6%
  • Biomass 1.48%
  • Geothermal 0.41%
  • Solar 0.23%
  • Wind 4.13%
• Petroleum 1%
• Other Gases < 1%

Every type injures or has the potential to injure someone or something.

I have yet to understand the sudden outrage some people have for birds when they are killed by wind turbines or solar generators.
I would prefer that no birds be killed accidentally at all by human actions- but we kill millions of birds a year by our activities.

Anyone interested in how fracking affects bird populations?

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/20/b...nite-to-protect-greater-sage-grouse.html?_r=0

How about power lines and how they kill raptors?
Utilities seek to save birds from power lines and vice versa Midwest Energy News
An academic paper endorsed by the FWS said that collisions with power lines and transmission towers kill hundreds of thousands to 175 million birds annually, while tens to hundreds of thousands of birds are electrocuted annually. The paper noted there is not comprehensive monitoring of the issue, so mortality estimates are rough.

I am all for taking measures to reduce bird kills.

Is that what you want- or do you just want to attack wind turbines?

Fracking is done to increase Oil production because we are building $36 Trillion dollars worth of the World's largest structures ever built to produce a tiny amount of Electricity.

No- thats not why fracking is being done.

You make the wierdest arguments.

Make arguments for nuclear power if you want.
Make arguments about why wind power is not a good idea.

But these alarmist threads- which appear to be nothing more than anti-alternative power propaganda pieces accomplish nothing.

 

[JFK_USA]

What real disasters are;

• April 5, 2010: Upper Big Branch Mine disaster, West Virginia, United States. An explosion occurred in Massey Energy's Upper Big Branch coal. Twenty-nine out of thirty-one miners at the site were killed.[9]
• November 19, 2010: Pike River Mine disaster in New Zealand. At 3:45pm, the coal mine exploded. Twenty-nine men underground died immediately, or shortly afterwards, from the blast or from the toxic atmosphere. Two men in the stone drift, some distance from the mine workings, managed to escape. (Extract from Royal Commission of Enquiry Report on Pike River.)
• May 13, 2014: Soma mine disaster took place in Soma, Turkey. The accident, called the worst mining accident ever in Turkey, and it is the worst mining accident in 21st century so far. 301 people died.

Mining accident - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

More killed in the Upper Big Branch Disaster than have been killed by by wind turbines in that whole period.

/thread.

 

[Derideo_Te]

None of the above is credible. It has all been debunked by credible research.

Studies show no health concerns.

The negligible threat posed by wind turbines from fires or accidents in in the order of 0.001% over the 20-25 year life span of a turbine.

Environmental impact of wind power - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

The OP is posting disingenuous canards.

NO danger? Is that why people are told of the danger with signs?

There are danger signs on electric substations and pylons too. There are danger signs all over nuclear power plants. There are danger signs in subways and construction zones and on ladders.

Your fallacious OP has already been proven to be utterly bogus.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Efficient? Not when one compares cost, size, and power output to Coal power.

BZZZT Wrong again!

Cost of Wind Power -- Kicks Coal s Butt Better than Natural Gas Could Power Your EV for 0.70 gallon CleanTechnica

More recently, AWEA told investors at a wind finance workshop the same thing as well as the fact that wind is now beating coal in this category and a little more on why and what’s expected in the near future (generally).

AWEA figures show that the average wind PPAs are now being priced at about 6 cents per kilowatt-hour, the same price for energy procurements from a combined cycle natural gas plant. The group says wind is actually about 2 cents cheaper than coal-fired electricity,

 

[Derideo_Te]

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

 

[westwall]

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Google is your friend as you so love to say, but here you go.... Funny how wind companies are suing to try and keep avian mortality rates secret.. No?


Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release
Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release



US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought

"By chance (if you believe in coincidences), a timely government study claims wind farms will kill “only” 1.4 million birds yearly by 2030 (1). This new report is just one of many, financed with taxpayers’ money, aimed at convincing the public that additional mortality caused by wind plants is sustainable. – It is not.

Dr. Shawn Smallwood’s 2004 study, spanning four years, estimated that California’s Altamont Pass wind “farm” killed an average of 116 Golden Eagles annually (2). This adds up to 2,900 dead “goldies” since it was built 25 years ago. Altamont is the biggest sinkhole for the species, but not the only one, and industry-financed research claiming that California’s GE population is stable is but a white-wash."

US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought Save the Eagles International


Fort Collins Science Center

Wind Turbines Kill More Than 600 000 Bats A Year. What Should We Do Popular Science

High bat mortality from wind turbines -- ScienceDaily

http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/windmills-600000-bats-0-69697


And these are just the US lower 48 deaths. It doesn't count ANY of the European or other continents deaths.

 

[Derideo_Te]

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Google is your friend as you so love to say, but here you go.... Funny how wind companies are suing to try and keep avian mortality rates secret.. No?


Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release
Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release



US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought

"By chance (if you believe in coincidences), a timely government study claims wind farms will kill “only” 1.4 million birds yearly by 2030 (1). This new report is just one of many, financed with taxpayers’ money, aimed at convincing the public that additional mortality caused by wind plants is sustainable. – It is not.

Dr. Shawn Smallwood’s 2004 study, spanning four years, estimated that California’s Altamont Pass wind “farm” killed an average of 116 Golden Eagles annually (2). This adds up to 2,900 dead “goldies” since it was built 25 years ago. Altamont is the biggest sinkhole for the species, but not the only one, and industry-financed research claiming that California’s GE population is stable is but a white-wash."

US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought Save the Eagles International


Fort Collins Science Center

Wind Turbines Kill More Than 600 000 Bats A Year. What Should We Do Popular Science

High bat mortality from wind turbines -- ScienceDaily

http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/windmills-600000-bats-0-69697


And these are just the US lower 48 deaths. It doesn't count ANY of the European or other continents deaths.

Once again no one is surprised to discover that you blatantly lied yet again!

Let's just put your lie back up here so that everyone can reference it;

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Now let's look at what the links you provided actually stated;

From the first link;

(Washington, DC, December 10, 2013) A new study shows that in spite of updated designs, U.S. wind turbines are killing hundreds of thousands of birds annually—a number that may balloon to about 1.4 million per year by 2030,​

The study does not say anything at all about bats and merely claims "hundreds of thousands of birds" without specifying exactly how many. The estimate for 2030 was made in 2010 so it was projecting out 20 years. Unfortunately no basis was provided for that projection.

The second link from USGS mentions bats but gives no statistics at all.

The 3rd link from Popular Science states "600,000 to 900,000 bats every year, according to a new study" but that is well below Westwall's claim. Note that the following article is about a bat species threatened by an oil pipeline. Don't see WW whining about those bats.

The Science Daily link states "bat deaths caused by wind turbines concludes that more than 600,000 of the mammals likely died this way in 2012 in the contiguous United States." Again this is well below Westwall's bogus claim.

The last link states "A new study published in the journal BioScience estimates that more than 600,000 bats died from interactions with wind turbines".

So from everything provided it is clear that Westwall was lying when he claimed that "windmills kill" "1.5 million bats per year at minimum".

But it gets even worse for Westwall since NONE of his links substantiated his claim that "windmills kill 600,000 birds".

Needless to say I don't expect anyone with Westwall's lack of honesty and integrity to admit that he lied.

He will probably want to delete this post so I will just remind him that I make copies of everything and since this post is directly on the OP topic of "death by wind turbine" he will have a hard time explaining it away if he does delete it because it exposes his lies.

 

[jc456]

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Google is your friend as you so love to say, but here you go.... Funny how wind companies are suing to try and keep avian mortality rates secret.. No?


Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release
Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release



US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought

"By chance (if you believe in coincidences), a timely government study claims wind farms will kill “only” 1.4 million birds yearly by 2030 (1). This new report is just one of many, financed with taxpayers’ money, aimed at convincing the public that additional mortality caused by wind plants is sustainable. – It is not.

Dr. Shawn Smallwood’s 2004 study, spanning four years, estimated that California’s Altamont Pass wind “farm” killed an average of 116 Golden Eagles annually (2). This adds up to 2,900 dead “goldies” since it was built 25 years ago. Altamont is the biggest sinkhole for the species, but not the only one, and industry-financed research claiming that California’s GE population is stable is but a white-wash."

US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought Save the Eagles International


Fort Collins Science Center

Wind Turbines Kill More Than 600 000 Bats A Year. What Should We Do Popular Science

High bat mortality from wind turbines -- ScienceDaily

http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/windmills-600000-bats-0-69697


And these are just the US lower 48 deaths. It doesn't count ANY of the European or other continents deaths.

Once again no one is surprised to discover that you blatantly lied yet again!

Let's just put your lie back up here so that everyone can reference it;

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Now let's look at what the links you provided actually stated;

From the first link;

(Washington, DC, December 10, 2013) A new study shows that in spite of updated designs, U.S. wind turbines are killing hundreds of thousands of birds annually—a number that may balloon to about 1.4 million per year by 2030,​

The study does not say anything at all about bats and merely claims "hundreds of thousands of birds" without specifying exactly how many. The estimate for 2030 was made in 2010 so it was projecting out 20 years. Unfortunately no basis was provided for that projection.

The second link from USGS mentions bats but gives no statistics at all.

The 3rd link from Popular Science states "600,000 to 900,000 bats every year, according to a new study" but that is well below Westwall's claim. Note that the following article is about a bat species threatened by an oil pipeline. Don't see WW whining about those bats.

The Science Daily link states "bat deaths caused by wind turbines concludes that more than 600,000 of the mammals likely died this way in 2012 in the contiguous United States." Again this is well below Westwall's bogus claim.

The last link states "A new study published in the journal BioScience estimates that more than 600,000 bats died from interactions with wind turbines".

So from everything provided it is clear that Westwall was lying when he claimed that "windmills kill" "1.5 million bats per year at minimum".

But it gets even worse for Westwall since NONE of his links substantiated his claim that "windmills kill 600,000 birds".

Needless to say I don't expect anyone with Westwall's lack of honesty and integrity to admit that he lied.

He will probably want to delete this post so I will just remind him that I make copies of everything and since this post is directly on the OP topic of "death by wind turbine" he will have a hard time explaining it away if he does delete it because it exposes his lies.

he never lied. shame on you for misrepresenting him.

 

[westwall]

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Google is your friend as you so love to say, but here you go.... Funny how wind companies are suing to try and keep avian mortality rates secret.. No?


Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release
Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release



US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought

"By chance (if you believe in coincidences), a timely government study claims wind farms will kill “only” 1.4 million birds yearly by 2030 (1). This new report is just one of many, financed with taxpayers’ money, aimed at convincing the public that additional mortality caused by wind plants is sustainable. – It is not.

Dr. Shawn Smallwood’s 2004 study, spanning four years, estimated that California’s Altamont Pass wind “farm” killed an average of 116 Golden Eagles annually (2). This adds up to 2,900 dead “goldies” since it was built 25 years ago. Altamont is the biggest sinkhole for the species, but not the only one, and industry-financed research claiming that California’s GE population is stable is but a white-wash."

US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought Save the Eagles International


Fort Collins Science Center

Wind Turbines Kill More Than 600 000 Bats A Year. What Should We Do Popular Science

High bat mortality from wind turbines -- ScienceDaily

http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/windmills-600000-bats-0-69697


And these are just the US lower 48 deaths. It doesn't count ANY of the European or other continents deaths.

Once again no one is surprised to discover that you blatantly lied yet again!

Let's just put your lie back up here so that everyone can reference it;

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Now let's look at what the links you provided actually stated;

From the first link;

(Washington, DC, December 10, 2013) A new study shows that in spite of updated designs, U.S. wind turbines are killing hundreds of thousands of birds annually—a number that may balloon to about 1.4 million per year by 2030,​

The study does not say anything at all about bats and merely claims "hundreds of thousands of birds" without specifying exactly how many. The estimate for 2030 was made in 2010 so it was projecting out 20 years. Unfortunately no basis was provided for that projection.

The second link from USGS mentions bats but gives no statistics at all.

The 3rd link from Popular Science states "600,000 to 900,000 bats every year, according to a new study" but that is well below Westwall's claim. Note that the following article is about a bat species threatened by an oil pipeline. Don't see WW whining about those bats.

The Science Daily link states "bat deaths caused by wind turbines concludes that more than 600,000 of the mammals likely died this way in 2012 in the contiguous United States." Again this is well below Westwall's bogus claim.

The last link states "A new study published in the journal BioScience estimates that more than 600,000 bats died from interactions with wind turbines".

So from everything provided it is clear that Westwall was lying when he claimed that "windmills kill" "1.5 million bats per year at minimum".

But it gets even worse for Westwall since NONE of his links substantiated his claim that "windmills kill 600,000 birds".

Needless to say I don't expect anyone with Westwall's lack of honesty and integrity to admit that he lied.

He will probably want to delete this post so I will just remind him that I make copies of everything and since this post is directly on the OP topic of "death by wind turbine" he will have a hard time explaining it away if he does delete it because it exposes his lies.

My post was worldwide dipshit. The links I provided are ONLY for the USA. The only liar is you little petulant child. Grow the **** up.


Here is one study for Canada...

Avian Conservation and Ecology Canadian Estimate of Bird Mortality Due to Collisions and Direct Habitat Loss Associated with Wind Turbine Developments


Here's Germany
Deutschlands Energiewende kollidiert mit migrierenden Flederm usen Forschungsverbund Berlin

Here's the UK
Wind farms vs wildlife The Spectator

So, no I didn't lie. You CHOSE to ignore the statement I made that these figures were for ONLY THE LOWER 48 STATES of the USA.

Now, don't expect a dishonest, petulant child to admit that he was wrong, no, expect him to make untruthful claims about someone who provides links when asked, and thrashes him in every discussion they engage in.

Twit....

 

[Derideo_Te]

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Google is your friend as you so love to say, but here you go.... Funny how wind companies are suing to try and keep avian mortality rates secret.. No?


Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release
Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release



US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought

"By chance (if you believe in coincidences), a timely government study claims wind farms will kill “only” 1.4 million birds yearly by 2030 (1). This new report is just one of many, financed with taxpayers’ money, aimed at convincing the public that additional mortality caused by wind plants is sustainable. – It is not.

Dr. Shawn Smallwood’s 2004 study, spanning four years, estimated that California’s Altamont Pass wind “farm” killed an average of 116 Golden Eagles annually (2). This adds up to 2,900 dead “goldies” since it was built 25 years ago. Altamont is the biggest sinkhole for the species, but not the only one, and industry-financed research claiming that California’s GE population is stable is but a white-wash."

US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought Save the Eagles International


Fort Collins Science Center

Wind Turbines Kill More Than 600 000 Bats A Year. What Should We Do Popular Science

High bat mortality from wind turbines -- ScienceDaily

http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/windmills-600000-bats-0-69697


And these are just the US lower 48 deaths. It doesn't count ANY of the European or other continents deaths.

Once again no one is surprised to discover that you blatantly lied yet again!

Let's just put your lie back up here so that everyone can reference it;

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Now let's look at what the links you provided actually stated;

From the first link;

(Washington, DC, December 10, 2013) A new study shows that in spite of updated designs, U.S. wind turbines are killing hundreds of thousands of birds annually—a number that may balloon to about 1.4 million per year by 2030,​

The study does not say anything at all about bats and merely claims "hundreds of thousands of birds" without specifying exactly how many. The estimate for 2030 was made in 2010 so it was projecting out 20 years. Unfortunately no basis was provided for that projection.

The second link from USGS mentions bats but gives no statistics at all.

The 3rd link from Popular Science states "600,000 to 900,000 bats every year, according to a new study" but that is well below Westwall's claim. Note that the following article is about a bat species threatened by an oil pipeline. Don't see WW whining about those bats.

The Science Daily link states "bat deaths caused by wind turbines concludes that more than 600,000 of the mammals likely died this way in 2012 in the contiguous United States." Again this is well below Westwall's bogus claim.

The last link states "A new study published in the journal BioScience estimates that more than 600,000 bats died from interactions with wind turbines".

So from everything provided it is clear that Westwall was lying when he claimed that "windmills kill" "1.5 million bats per year at minimum".

But it gets even worse for Westwall since NONE of his links substantiated his claim that "windmills kill 600,000 birds".

Needless to say I don't expect anyone with Westwall's lack of honesty and integrity to admit that he lied.

He will probably want to delete this post so I will just remind him that I make copies of everything and since this post is directly on the OP topic of "death by wind turbine" he will have a hard time explaining it away if he does delete it because it exposes his lies.

My post was worldwide dipshit. The links I provided are ONLY for the USA. The only liar is you little petulant child. Grow the **** up.


Here is one study for Canada...

Avian Conservation and Ecology Canadian Estimate of Bird Mortality Due to Collisions and Direct Habitat Loss Associated with Wind Turbine Developments


Here's Germany
Deutschlands Energiewende kollidiert mit migrierenden Flederm usen Forschungsverbund Berlin

Here's the UK
Wind farms vs wildlife The Spectator

So, no I didn't lie. You CHOSE to ignore the statement I made that these figures were for ONLY THE LOWER 48 STATES of the USA.

Now, don't expect a dishonest, petulant child to admit that he was wrong, no, expect him to make untruthful claims about someone who provides links when asked, and thrashes him in every discussion they engage in.

Twit....

You made no such qualifier in your original fallacious claim. Hardly surprising that you are now equivocating and posting links to hide your embarrassment at being caught lying again.

The mere fact that you resorted to puerile name calling proves that I have been right about you from the outset. You deserve to be consigned to Cyberia together with the rest of your dishonest ilk IMO.

The OP and this entire thread exposes the hypocrisy of the extremist hard right who are are merely trying to exploit these deaths. If you really cared about them you been against the oil pipelines and frakking because of the harm they are causing.

 

[westwall]

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Google is your friend as you so love to say, but here you go.... Funny how wind companies are suing to try and keep avian mortality rates secret.. No?


Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release
Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release



US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought

"By chance (if you believe in coincidences), a timely government study claims wind farms will kill “only” 1.4 million birds yearly by 2030 (1). This new report is just one of many, financed with taxpayers’ money, aimed at convincing the public that additional mortality caused by wind plants is sustainable. – It is not.

Dr. Shawn Smallwood’s 2004 study, spanning four years, estimated that California’s Altamont Pass wind “farm” killed an average of 116 Golden Eagles annually (2). This adds up to 2,900 dead “goldies” since it was built 25 years ago. Altamont is the biggest sinkhole for the species, but not the only one, and industry-financed research claiming that California’s GE population is stable is but a white-wash."

US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought Save the Eagles International


Fort Collins Science Center

Wind Turbines Kill More Than 600 000 Bats A Year. What Should We Do Popular Science

High bat mortality from wind turbines -- ScienceDaily

http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/windmills-600000-bats-0-69697


And these are just the US lower 48 deaths. It doesn't count ANY of the European or other continents deaths.

Once again no one is surprised to discover that you blatantly lied yet again!

Let's just put your lie back up here so that everyone can reference it;

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Now let's look at what the links you provided actually stated;

From the first link;

(Washington, DC, December 10, 2013) A new study shows that in spite of updated designs, U.S. wind turbines are killing hundreds of thousands of birds annually—a number that may balloon to about 1.4 million per year by 2030,​

The study does not say anything at all about bats and merely claims "hundreds of thousands of birds" without specifying exactly how many. The estimate for 2030 was made in 2010 so it was projecting out 20 years. Unfortunately no basis was provided for that projection.

The second link from USGS mentions bats but gives no statistics at all.

The 3rd link from Popular Science states "600,000 to 900,000 bats every year, according to a new study" but that is well below Westwall's claim. Note that the following article is about a bat species threatened by an oil pipeline. Don't see WW whining about those bats.

The Science Daily link states "bat deaths caused by wind turbines concludes that more than 600,000 of the mammals likely died this way in 2012 in the contiguous United States." Again this is well below Westwall's bogus claim.

The last link states "A new study published in the journal BioScience estimates that more than 600,000 bats died from interactions with wind turbines".

So from everything provided it is clear that Westwall was lying when he claimed that "windmills kill" "1.5 million bats per year at minimum".

But it gets even worse for Westwall since NONE of his links substantiated his claim that "windmills kill 600,000 birds".

Needless to say I don't expect anyone with Westwall's lack of honesty and integrity to admit that he lied.

He will probably want to delete this post so I will just remind him that I make copies of everything and since this post is directly on the OP topic of "death by wind turbine" he will have a hard time explaining it away if he does delete it because it exposes his lies.

My post was worldwide dipshit. The links I provided are ONLY for the USA. The only liar is you little petulant child. Grow the **** up.


Here is one study for Canada...

Avian Conservation and Ecology Canadian Estimate of Bird Mortality Due to Collisions and Direct Habitat Loss Associated with Wind Turbine Developments


Here's Germany
Deutschlands Energiewende kollidiert mit migrierenden Flederm usen Forschungsverbund Berlin

Here's the UK
Wind farms vs wildlife The Spectator

So, no I didn't lie. You CHOSE to ignore the statement I made that these figures were for ONLY THE LOWER 48 STATES of the USA.

Now, don't expect a dishonest, petulant child to admit that he was wrong, no, expect him to make untruthful claims about someone who provides links when asked, and thrashes him in every discussion they engage in.

Twit....

You made no such qualifier in your original fallacious claim. Hardly surprising that you are now equivocating and posting links to hide your embarrassment at being caught lying again.

The mere fact that you resorted to puerile name calling proves that I have been right about you from the outset. You deserve to be consigned to Cyberia together with the rest of your dishonest ilk IMO.

The OP and this entire thread exposes the hypocrisy of the extremist hard right who are are merely trying to exploit these deaths. If you really cared about them you been against the oil pipelines and frakking because of the harm they are causing.

Liar, liar, pants on fire. Yes I did. This is what I wrote, and that which you copy pasted..

"windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum"

You then asked for a link, and I provided several, and at the very end of the post I stated, quite clearly, so that even a moron like you could understand, that these figures were for the lower 48 States ONLY.

Then, liar that you are, you ignored what I said and called me all sorts of scurrilous names.

So screw you, you lying sack of shit, and grow the **** up.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Google is your friend as you so love to say, but here you go.... Funny how wind companies are suing to try and keep avian mortality rates secret.. No?


Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release
Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release



US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought

"By chance (if you believe in coincidences), a timely government study claims wind farms will kill “only” 1.4 million birds yearly by 2030 (1). This new report is just one of many, financed with taxpayers’ money, aimed at convincing the public that additional mortality caused by wind plants is sustainable. – It is not.

Dr. Shawn Smallwood’s 2004 study, spanning four years, estimated that California’s Altamont Pass wind “farm” killed an average of 116 Golden Eagles annually (2). This adds up to 2,900 dead “goldies” since it was built 25 years ago. Altamont is the biggest sinkhole for the species, but not the only one, and industry-financed research claiming that California’s GE population is stable is but a white-wash."

US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought Save the Eagles International


Fort Collins Science Center

Wind Turbines Kill More Than 600 000 Bats A Year. What Should We Do Popular Science

High bat mortality from wind turbines -- ScienceDaily

http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/windmills-600000-bats-0-69697


And these are just the US lower 48 deaths. It doesn't count ANY of the European or other continents deaths.

Once again no one is surprised to discover that you blatantly lied yet again!

Let's just put your lie back up here so that everyone can reference it;

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Now let's look at what the links you provided actually stated;

From the first link;

(Washington, DC, December 10, 2013) A new study shows that in spite of updated designs, U.S. wind turbines are killing hundreds of thousands of birds annually—a number that may balloon to about 1.4 million per year by 2030,​

The study does not say anything at all about bats and merely claims "hundreds of thousands of birds" without specifying exactly how many. The estimate for 2030 was made in 2010 so it was projecting out 20 years. Unfortunately no basis was provided for that projection.

The second link from USGS mentions bats but gives no statistics at all.

The 3rd link from Popular Science states "600,000 to 900,000 bats every year, according to a new study" but that is well below Westwall's claim. Note that the following article is about a bat species threatened by an oil pipeline. Don't see WW whining about those bats.

The Science Daily link states "bat deaths caused by wind turbines concludes that more than 600,000 of the mammals likely died this way in 2012 in the contiguous United States." Again this is well below Westwall's bogus claim.

The last link states "A new study published in the journal BioScience estimates that more than 600,000 bats died from interactions with wind turbines".

So from everything provided it is clear that Westwall was lying when he claimed that "windmills kill" "1.5 million bats per year at minimum".

But it gets even worse for Westwall since NONE of his links substantiated his claim that "windmills kill 600,000 birds".

Needless to say I don't expect anyone with Westwall's lack of honesty and integrity to admit that he lied.

He will probably want to delete this post so I will just remind him that I make copies of everything and since this post is directly on the OP topic of "death by wind turbine" he will have a hard time explaining it away if he does delete it because it exposes his lies.

My post was worldwide dipshit. The links I provided are ONLY for the USA. The only liar is you little petulant child. Grow the **** up.


Here is one study for Canada...

Avian Conservation and Ecology Canadian Estimate of Bird Mortality Due to Collisions and Direct Habitat Loss Associated with Wind Turbine Developments


Here's Germany
Deutschlands Energiewende kollidiert mit migrierenden Flederm usen Forschungsverbund Berlin

Here's the UK
Wind farms vs wildlife The Spectator

So, no I didn't lie. You CHOSE to ignore the statement I made that these figures were for ONLY THE LOWER 48 STATES of the USA.

Now, don't expect a dishonest, petulant child to admit that he was wrong, no, expect him to make untruthful claims about someone who provides links when asked, and thrashes him in every discussion they engage in.

Twit....

You made no such qualifier in your original fallacious claim. Hardly surprising that you are now equivocating and posting links to hide your embarrassment at being caught lying again.

The mere fact that you resorted to puerile name calling proves that I have been right about you from the outset. You deserve to be consigned to Cyberia together with the rest of your dishonest ilk IMO.

The OP and this entire thread exposes the hypocrisy of the extremist hard right who are are merely trying to exploit these deaths. If you really cared about them you been against the oil pipelines and frakking because of the harm they are causing.

Liar, liar, pants on fire. Yes I did. This is what I wrote, and that which you copy pasted..

"windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum"

You then asked for a link, and I provided several, and at the very end of the post I stated, quite clearly, so that even a moron like you could understand, that these figures were for the lower 48 States ONLY.

Then, liar that you are, you ignored what I said and called me all sorts of scurrilous names.

So screw you, you lying sack of shit, and grow the **** up.

Ironic coming from someone posting immature vulgarities.

Now try and get back on topic and defend your hypocrisy when it comes to the environment.

 

[westwall]

Google is your friend as you so love to say, but here you go.... Funny how wind companies are suing to try and keep avian mortality rates secret.. No?


Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release
Wind energy firm sues to block bird death data release



US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought

"By chance (if you believe in coincidences), a timely government study claims wind farms will kill “only” 1.4 million birds yearly by 2030 (1). This new report is just one of many, financed with taxpayers’ money, aimed at convincing the public that additional mortality caused by wind plants is sustainable. – It is not.

Dr. Shawn Smallwood’s 2004 study, spanning four years, estimated that California’s Altamont Pass wind “farm” killed an average of 116 Golden Eagles annually (2). This adds up to 2,900 dead “goldies” since it was built 25 years ago. Altamont is the biggest sinkhole for the species, but not the only one, and industry-financed research claiming that California’s GE population is stable is but a white-wash."

US windfarms kill 10-20 times more than previously thought Save the Eagles International


Fort Collins Science Center

Wind Turbines Kill More Than 600 000 Bats A Year. What Should We Do Popular Science

High bat mortality from wind turbines -- ScienceDaily

http://www.psmag.com/nature-and-technology/windmills-600000-bats-0-69697


And these are just the US lower 48 deaths. It doesn't count ANY of the European or other continents deaths.

Once again no one is surprised to discover that you blatantly lied yet again!

Let's just put your lie back up here so that everyone can reference it;

windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum

Now let's look at what the links you provided actually stated;

From the first link;

(Washington, DC, December 10, 2013) A new study shows that in spite of updated designs, U.S. wind turbines are killing hundreds of thousands of birds annually—a number that may balloon to about 1.4 million per year by 2030,​

The study does not say anything at all about bats and merely claims "hundreds of thousands of birds" without specifying exactly how many. The estimate for 2030 was made in 2010 so it was projecting out 20 years. Unfortunately no basis was provided for that projection.

The second link from USGS mentions bats but gives no statistics at all.

The 3rd link from Popular Science states "600,000 to 900,000 bats every year, according to a new study" but that is well below Westwall's claim. Note that the following article is about a bat species threatened by an oil pipeline. Don't see WW whining about those bats.

The Science Daily link states "bat deaths caused by wind turbines concludes that more than 600,000 of the mammals likely died this way in 2012 in the contiguous United States." Again this is well below Westwall's bogus claim.

The last link states "A new study published in the journal BioScience estimates that more than 600,000 bats died from interactions with wind turbines".

So from everything provided it is clear that Westwall was lying when he claimed that "windmills kill" "1.5 million bats per year at minimum".

But it gets even worse for Westwall since NONE of his links substantiated his claim that "windmills kill 600,000 birds".

Needless to say I don't expect anyone with Westwall's lack of honesty and integrity to admit that he lied.

He will probably want to delete this post so I will just remind him that I make copies of everything and since this post is directly on the OP topic of "death by wind turbine" he will have a hard time explaining it away if he does delete it because it exposes his lies.

My post was worldwide dipshit. The links I provided are ONLY for the USA. The only liar is you little petulant child. Grow the **** up.


Here is one study for Canada...

Avian Conservation and Ecology Canadian Estimate of Bird Mortality Due to Collisions and Direct Habitat Loss Associated with Wind Turbine Developments


Here's Germany
Deutschlands Energiewende kollidiert mit migrierenden Flederm usen Forschungsverbund Berlin

Here's the UK
Wind farms vs wildlife The Spectator

So, no I didn't lie. You CHOSE to ignore the statement I made that these figures were for ONLY THE LOWER 48 STATES of the USA.

Now, don't expect a dishonest, petulant child to admit that he was wrong, no, expect him to make untruthful claims about someone who provides links when asked, and thrashes him in every discussion they engage in.

Twit....

You made no such qualifier in your original fallacious claim. Hardly surprising that you are now equivocating and posting links to hide your embarrassment at being caught lying again.

The mere fact that you resorted to puerile name calling proves that I have been right about you from the outset. You deserve to be consigned to Cyberia together with the rest of your dishonest ilk IMO.

The OP and this entire thread exposes the hypocrisy of the extremist hard right who are are merely trying to exploit these deaths. If you really cared about them you been against the oil pipelines and frakking because of the harm they are causing.

Liar, liar, pants on fire. Yes I did. This is what I wrote, and that which you copy pasted..

"windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum"

You then asked for a link, and I provided several, and at the very end of the post I stated, quite clearly, so that even a moron like you could understand, that these figures were for the lower 48 States ONLY.

Then, liar that you are, you ignored what I said and called me all sorts of scurrilous names.

So screw you, you lying sack of shit, and grow the **** up.

Ironic coming from someone posting immature vulgarities.

Now try and get back on topic and defend your hypocrisy when it comes to the environment.

Notice how I post in small print? That means my words don't need any help. When you post nice big images like that, it means you've had your ass handed to you but you're to small a child to admit it.

Like I said. Grow up junior. This site is for adults.

 

[Derideo_Te]

Once again no one is surprised to discover that you blatantly lied yet again!

Let's just put your lie back up here so that everyone can reference it;

Now let's look at what the links you provided actually stated;

From the first link;

(Washington, DC, December 10, 2013) A new study shows that in spite of updated designs, U.S. wind turbines are killing hundreds of thousands of birds annually—a number that may balloon to about 1.4 million per year by 2030,​

The study does not say anything at all about bats and merely claims "hundreds of thousands of birds" without specifying exactly how many. The estimate for 2030 was made in 2010 so it was projecting out 20 years. Unfortunately no basis was provided for that projection.

The second link from USGS mentions bats but gives no statistics at all.

The 3rd link from Popular Science states "600,000 to 900,000 bats every year, according to a new study" but that is well below Westwall's claim. Note that the following article is about a bat species threatened by an oil pipeline. Don't see WW whining about those bats.

The Science Daily link states "bat deaths caused by wind turbines concludes that more than 600,000 of the mammals likely died this way in 2012 in the contiguous United States." Again this is well below Westwall's bogus claim.

The last link states "A new study published in the journal BioScience estimates that more than 600,000 bats died from interactions with wind turbines".

So from everything provided it is clear that Westwall was lying when he claimed that "windmills kill" "1.5 million bats per year at minimum".

But it gets even worse for Westwall since NONE of his links substantiated his claim that "windmills kill 600,000 birds".

Needless to say I don't expect anyone with Westwall's lack of honesty and integrity to admit that he lied.

He will probably want to delete this post so I will just remind him that I make copies of everything and since this post is directly on the OP topic of "death by wind turbine" he will have a hard time explaining it away if he does delete it because it exposes his lies.

My post was worldwide dipshit. The links I provided are ONLY for the USA. The only liar is you little petulant child. Grow the **** up.


Here is one study for Canada...

Avian Conservation and Ecology Canadian Estimate of Bird Mortality Due to Collisions and Direct Habitat Loss Associated with Wind Turbine Developments


Here's Germany
Deutschlands Energiewende kollidiert mit migrierenden Flederm usen Forschungsverbund Berlin

Here's the UK
Wind farms vs wildlife The Spectator

So, no I didn't lie. You CHOSE to ignore the statement I made that these figures were for ONLY THE LOWER 48 STATES of the USA.

Now, don't expect a dishonest, petulant child to admit that he was wrong, no, expect him to make untruthful claims about someone who provides links when asked, and thrashes him in every discussion they engage in.

Twit....

You made no such qualifier in your original fallacious claim. Hardly surprising that you are now equivocating and posting links to hide your embarrassment at being caught lying again.

The mere fact that you resorted to puerile name calling proves that I have been right about you from the outset. You deserve to be consigned to Cyberia together with the rest of your dishonest ilk IMO.

The OP and this entire thread exposes the hypocrisy of the extremist hard right who are are merely trying to exploit these deaths. If you really cared about them you been against the oil pipelines and frakking because of the harm they are causing.

Liar, liar, pants on fire. Yes I did. This is what I wrote, and that which you copy pasted..

"windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum"

You then asked for a link, and I provided several, and at the very end of the post I stated, quite clearly, so that even a moron like you could understand, that these figures were for the lower 48 States ONLY.

Then, liar that you are, you ignored what I said and called me all sorts of scurrilous names.

So screw you, you lying sack of shit, and grow the **** up.

Ironic coming from someone posting immature vulgarities.

Now try and get back on topic and defend your hypocrisy when it comes to the environment.

Notice how I post in small print? That means my words don't need any help. When you post nice big images like that, it means you've had your ass handed to you but you're to small a child to admit it.

Like I said. Grow up junior. This site is for adults.

Laughing out loud at your expense is one of the pleasures of this forum.

Now stop whining and get back to your futile hypocritical attempts to defend the feckless OP.

 

[Moonglow]

In a not so cheery story I am sad to report, there is a very real danger out there, Wind Turbines. I will not drag this out with my monologue, I will simply let people decide.

Killer!

 

[Judicial review]

My post was worldwide dipshit. The links I provided are ONLY for the USA. The only liar is you little petulant child. Grow the **** up.


Here is one study for Canada...

Avian Conservation and Ecology Canadian Estimate of Bird Mortality Due to Collisions and Direct Habitat Loss Associated with Wind Turbine Developments


Here's Germany
Deutschlands Energiewende kollidiert mit migrierenden Flederm usen Forschungsverbund Berlin

Here's the UK
Wind farms vs wildlife The Spectator

So, no I didn't lie. You CHOSE to ignore the statement I made that these figures were for ONLY THE LOWER 48 STATES of the USA.

Now, don't expect a dishonest, petulant child to admit that he was wrong, no, expect him to make untruthful claims about someone who provides links when asked, and thrashes him in every discussion they engage in.

Twit....

You made no such qualifier in your original fallacious claim. Hardly surprising that you are now equivocating and posting links to hide your embarrassment at being caught lying again.

The mere fact that you resorted to puerile name calling proves that I have been right about you from the outset. You deserve to be consigned to Cyberia together with the rest of your dishonest ilk IMO.

The OP and this entire thread exposes the hypocrisy of the extremist hard right who are are merely trying to exploit these deaths. If you really cared about them you been against the oil pipelines and frakking because of the harm they are causing.

Liar, liar, pants on fire. Yes I did. This is what I wrote, and that which you copy pasted..

"windmills kill 600,000 birds and 1.5 million bats per year at minimum"

You then asked for a link, and I provided several, and at the very end of the post I stated, quite clearly, so that even a moron like you could understand, that these figures were for the lower 48 States ONLY.

Then, liar that you are, you ignored what I said and called me all sorts of scurrilous names.

So screw you, you lying sack of shit, and grow the **** up.

Ironic coming from someone posting immature vulgarities.

Now try and get back on topic and defend your hypocrisy when it comes to the environment.

Notice how I post in small print? That means my words don't need any help. When you post nice big images like that, it means you've had your ass handed to you but you're to small a child to admit it.

Like I said. Grow up junior. This site is for adults.

Laughing out loud at your expense is one of the pleasures of this forum.

Now stop whining and get back to your futile hypocritical attempts to defend the feckless OP.

FYI, you mess with Westwall you mess with all of us. Be wise for you to back down.

 

[Old Rocks]

LOL. Back down from you ignorant asses? For what reason?

The wind industries record on industrial safety is excellent. That they kill some birds is a fact. As is the fact that the highways near them kill a lot more birds, even more raptors. And buildings, transmission lines, radio towers, feral cats, all kill more birds than do the towers. Go to the people that study birds, and look at their studies on it.

 

[Statistikhengst]

LOL. Back down from you ignorant asses? For what reason?

The wind industries record on industrial safety is excellent. That they kill some birds is a fact. As is the fact that the highways near them kill a lot more birds, even more raptors. And buildings, transmission lines, radio towers, feral cats, all kill more birds than do the towers. Go to the people that study birds, and look at their studies on it.

There you go. Finally, some sensibility in this argument.

Truth is, almost any kind of technology is bound to kill some wildlife.

How many birds have been killed here oil rigs and because of oil spills?

How many birds die from jets and planes and helicopters?

The only technology that I know of that will not kill bats or birds would be underwater turbines. Instead, they kill fish.

And then there is nuclear, which likely does not kill many birds at all. Instead, it could simply kill all of us at once.

The only way to have killed no birds at all would be to have practically no technology at all.

Apparently, the hatred of Obama is enough to cause conservatives to even go and hug trees.

Well, ok...

 

[westwall]

LOL. Back down from you ignorant asses? For what reason?

The wind industries record on industrial safety is excellent. That they kill some birds is a fact. As is the fact that the highways near them kill a lot more birds, even more raptors. And buildings, transmission lines, radio towers, feral cats, all kill more birds than do the towers. Go to the people that study birds, and look at their studies on it.

I live in eagle country. I have done so for over 30 years now. Guess how many eagles have been found dead on the side of the road. Zero. Eagles don't get killed by cars. Birds in general don't get killed by cars. It does indeed happen, but ask anyone you know how many birds they've seen hit by cars. The only times you see it happen is at racetracks where the vehicles are going really fast. The same go's for birds supposedly hitting buildings and dying. In my nearly 70 years, and the last 30 in the wild, it has NEVER happened. You would think that if it were so darn common, that there would be dead birds all over the place. But no. You don't see that either. What we do see though, are lots and lots of dead birds and bats around wind turbines.