Cuba

[bthoma91]

actually im against relations with all of those countries. Thanks for playing

Not relevant in the least. We aren't talking about YOU. This thread was not about your policy in regard to foreign nations. So while it's wonderful to hear your thoughts, let's try to stay on point.

you brought the others countries so i responded you fool.

 

[DavidS]

Why are we begining to open relations with the castros? why is obama becoming buddy-buddy with all the tyrants ?

Tell me what you think.

I dunno... what IS IT with the president of the United States of America becoming "friendly" with communist leaders??

 

[stekim]

you brought the others countries so i responded you fool.

I brought them in to show how AMERICA was hypocritical. Then you responded by stating your personal position, which is clearly not on topic. Fool indeed.

 

[rayboyusmc]

I guess the success of the last 50 years policy sort of proves that anything would be better.

We really made Castro suffer during those years.

 

[Toro]

I think its about frickin' time we put an end to this anachronism and let people freely travel to Cuba and do business with the country.

This policy is a complete and utter failure on so many levels. All it does is give a big stick to the regime to beat down the Yanquis with and justify their existence as guardians against the Yanqui imperialist.

 

[Toro]

What were we saying, and what did we actually do? your argument doesnt make sense.

It's not an argument. It's a simple statement of fact. It's not an opinion. We're hypocrites. Sorry. Ask yourself a simple question: Why do we have a trade embargo and travel restrictions regarding Cuba?

ok, hmm, are we a communist nation who force our people to do nothing but good for the government and only the government who is run my two brothers who dont give a damn about anyone but the wealth and power of themselves. does our government kill anyone who speaks out against them. did we almost bomb there capital with a nuclear missle? how are we hypocrites? becuase thats what we had no relations with them

Hypocrite - a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, esp. a person whose actions belie stated beliefs.

We did business with the Communists in eastern Europe, the USSR and China, not to mention with far more repugnant regimes in Asia and Latin America. So, yeah, it is hypocritical to not do business with Cuba because they are communist.

 

[Truthmatters]

Once we open up to Cuba they will be democratic in about ten years.

 

[Toro]

Once we open up to Cuba they will be democratic in about ten years.

Probably. Cuba will eventually become a democratic, somewhat capitalist nation. It is inevitable. And the faster we engage with them, the faster it will happen.

 

[midcan5]

Russia didn't eventually open up and change because Reagan maintained the same stupid policies of not communicating. Gorbachev and he talked and things changed. After 40 years of stupidity regarding Cuba, time to open up policy and hopefully civilize the political power there. Change is inevitable.

 

[stekim]

We did business with the Communists in eastern Europe, the USSR and China, not to mention with far more repugnant regimes in Asia and Latin America. So, yeah, it is hypocritical to not do business with Cuba because they are communist.

See how easy that is to understand? Middle East countries also have deplorable human rights records. We trade with them, too. We even kiss their leaders, walk hand in hand with them and bow before them. We even thought Saddam Hussein was just ducky. So spare me the whole moral highground shit.

 

[GHook93]

Why are we begining to open relations with the castros? why is obama becoming buddy-buddy with all the tyrants ?

Tell me what you think.

Why not I want my god damn cigars already! I personally believe we had a reason to embargo Cuba during the cold war. I mean they were prepared to allow Soviet Nukes in their country.

Yep Castro has been nothing less than a ruthless dictator that f'ed up his country via the flawed concept of Marxism. However, if we are going to stand on cermony and turn our backs to every country with human rights issues, then we will be isolated! I mean we have relations, both diplomatic and economic, with a far more ruthless, power-hungry and repressive dictator in Hugo Chavez, yep relations have been muddied recently but they are still there. Same with China, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia and pick any African Country we have relations with! Standing on cermony against Cuba makes little sense! First, they are not islamic terrorist. Second, they are not trying to forment relations with Islamic terrorist or Iran like Hugo Fatass is doing. Third, they are basically our neighbor. Fourth, they are relatively stable, unlike out neighbors South of the border and other Caribean nations aka Haiti. Fourth, Castro is on his way out and Raul is no spring chicken. We should start relations and then help influence them when the next guy comes to power. Have relations now gives us an upper hand when the new leader comes to power. Fifth, I want my god damn cigars!

 

[user_name_guest]

The Black Caucus that visited Cuba believe their people are better off than our own. They think the economic policy in Cuba would improve the quality of life in America.

 

[stekim]

Care to show us a link where they say that?

 

[Gunny]

How is us begining relations with cuba resulting in us no longer being "hypocrites"?

We'll still be hypocrites. There will just be one less example of it. And that's good. One of the numerous reasons we are disliked is because we are hypocrites who say one thing and do another all the time. Cuba was and is a clear example of that.

In other words, you're just one of those self-loathers with no real reason why ...

 

[GHook93]

How is us begining relations with cuba resulting in us no longer being "hypocrites"?

We'll still be hypocrites. There will just be one less example of it. And that's good. One of the numerous reasons we are disliked is because we are hypocrites who say one thing and do another all the time. Cuba was and is a clear example of that.

In other words, you're just one of those self-loathers with no real reason why ...

I think I stated some reason and I could hardly be called a self-loather or a leftist!

 

[mash107]

We're more collectivist than the Cubans... might as well open trade with our administration ideological buddies

 

[Old Rocks]

Why are we begining to open relations with the castros? why is obama becoming buddy-buddy with all the tyrants ?

Tell me what you think.

Why did we become buddy, buddy with Communist China under Nixon? Possibly because it was the sanest way of creating a safer situation for all of us.

You freakin' wingnuts never cease to amaze me!

 

[Diuretic]

I think we're preparing to see Cuba becoming something other than the pariah we've been trying to make it into.

We trade with China, and Russia and we've managed not to become a communist nation.

I think we'll survive if we have diplomatic relations with Cuba, again.

i see what you are saying, but what does cuba have that we neeed. you know? they are communist tryants threatening to nuc us a while back. whos needs them you know?

They have a boatload of doctors for one thing. That's one issue Fidel was crazy about...having enough doctors.

Sugar cane for the other.

Beautiful beaches, another.

The best cigars in the world.

Some of the best antique cars in the world.

Don't forget the rum.

Oh and the pharmaceutical industry they're developing.

Not the most beautiful beaches in the world, we have them, but their beaches are stunningly good.

And the people, very friendly, genuine people even in the tourist areas.

 

[Diuretic]

What I want to know is why to Cubans get to travel there but not "Americans".

That seems like some kind of BS discrimination. If anyone gets to go all should be able to.

I agree with you. The more Americans that travel there, the more the American way of life, as far as freedom, and choice is concerned, the more the Cuban people will be exposed to it and perhaps topple the Communist government. The US has helped to topple government leaders in other countries in the past, by backing the opposition in one way or another. This might be the best way to do it there, who knows?

Toppling isn't a good idea. What's a better idea is a mutl-party state and let the current rulers stand on their record in a multi-party electoral system.

 

[Diuretic]

Why are we begining to open relations with the castros? why is obama becoming buddy-buddy with all the tyrants ?

Tell me what you think.

Why not I want my god damn cigars already! I personally believe we had a reason to embargo Cuba during the cold war. I mean they were prepared to allow Soviet Nukes in their country.

Yep Castro has been nothing less than a ruthless dictator that f'ed up his country via the flawed concept of Marxism. However, if we are going to stand on cermony and turn our backs to every country with human rights issues, then we will be isolated! I mean we have relations, both diplomatic and economic, with a far more ruthless, power-hungry and repressive dictator in Hugo Chavez, yep relations have been muddied recently but they are still there. Same with China, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia and pick any African Country we have relations with! Standing on cermony against Cuba makes little sense! First, they are not islamic terrorist. Second, they are not trying to forment relations with Islamic terrorist or Iran like Hugo Fatass is doing. Third, they are basically our neighbor. Fourth, they are relatively stable, unlike out neighbors South of the border and other Caribean nations aka Haiti. Fourth, Castro is on his way out and Raul is no spring chicken. We should start relations and then help influence them when the next guy comes to power. Have relations now gives us an upper hand when the new leader comes to power. Fifth, I want my god damn cigars!

Some years ago Marxism-Leninism was removed from the constitution in Cuba. I think they would be amenable to more progression towards democracy but probably not until Fidel has gone.