Constitution???? What Constitution?

[Ernie S.]

“The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (Aaron and Melissa Klein) to cease and desist from publishing, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication to the effect that any of the accommodations … will be refused, withheld from or denied to, or that any discrimination be made against, any person on account of their sexual orientation,”

so they don't get to advertise that they discriminate... what's the problem?

exactly. Whats the BFD?

The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (a possible person known as Dot Com) to cease and desist from publishing, posting, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication regarding politics or religion"

What's the BFD?

Is Dot Com's politics or religion the same as a business discriminating?

LOL, you just thought you had a point.

No, but his right to express his opinions is just as sacrosanct.

 

[Carla_Danger]

so they don't get to advertise that they discriminate... what's the problem?

exactly. Whats the BFD?

The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (a possible person known as Dot Com) to cease and desist from publishing, posting, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication regarding politics or religion"

What's the BFD?

To state that you will refuse to serve gays is a refusal to serve gays. It is against the law in Oregon to discriminate against gays.

659A.409¹
Notice that discrimination will be made in place of public accommodation prohibited

• • age exceptions

Except as provided by laws governing the consumption of alcoholic beverages by minors and the frequenting by minors of places of public accommodation where alcoholic beverages are served, and except for special rates or services offered to persons 50 years of age or older,

“The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (Aaron and Melissa Klein) to cease and desist from publishing, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication to the effect that any of the accommodations … will be refused, withheld from or denied to, or that any discrimination be made against, any person on account of their sexual orientation,”

so they don't get to advertise that they discriminate... what's the problem?

exactly. Whats the BFD?

The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (a possible person known as Dot Com) to cease and desist from publishing, posting, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication regarding politics or religion"

What's the BFD?

Is Dot Com's politics or religion the same as a business discriminating?

LOL, you just thought you had a point.

No, but his right to express his opinions is just as sacrosanct.

Well, you idiot, The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries, deals with businesses, not random folks speaking their opinion.

 

[Carla_Danger]

“The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (Aaron and Melissa Klein) to cease and desist from publishing, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication to the effect that any of the accommodations … will be refused, withheld from or denied to, or that any discrimination be made against, any person on account of their sexual orientation,”

so they don't get to advertise that they discriminate... what's the problem?

exactly. Whats the BFD?

The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (a possible person known as Dot Com) to cease and desist from publishing, posting, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication regarding politics or religion"

What's the BFD?

Is Dot Com's politics or religion the same as a business discriminating?

LOL, you just thought you had a point.

No, but his right to express his opinions is just as sacrosanct.

Well, you idiot, The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries, deals with businesses, not random folks speaking their opinion.

 

[Ernie S.]

exactly. Whats the BFD?

The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (a possible person known as Dot Com) to cease and desist from publishing, posting, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication regarding politics or religion"

What's the BFD?

To state that you will refuse to serve gays is a refusal to serve gays. It is against the law in Oregon to discriminate against gays.

659A.409¹
Notice that discrimination will be made in place of public accommodation prohibited

• • age exceptions

Except as provided by laws governing the consumption of alcoholic beverages by minors and the frequenting by minors of places of public accommodation where alcoholic beverages are served, and except for special rates or services offered to persons 50 years of age or older,

The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (a possible person known as Dot Com) to cease and desist from publishing, posting, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication regarding politics or religion"

What's the BFD?

Is Dot Com's politics or religion the same as a business discriminating?

LOL, you just thought you had a point.

No, but his right to express his opinions is just as sacrosanct.

Well, you idiot, The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries, deals with businesses, not random folks speaking their opinion.

I can hardly wait for a case to go to SCOTUS. I see where actually discriminating against someone could be prosecuted, but saying you would hardly violates anyone's rights?

 

[Carla_Danger]

The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (a possible person known as Dot Com) to cease and desist from publishing, posting, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication regarding politics or religion"

What's the BFD?

To state that you will refuse to serve gays is a refusal to serve gays. It is against the law in Oregon to discriminate against gays.

659A.409¹
Notice that discrimination will be made in place of public accommodation prohibited

• • age exceptions

Except as provided by laws governing the consumption of alcoholic beverages by minors and the frequenting by minors of places of public accommodation where alcoholic beverages are served, and except for special rates or services offered to persons 50 years of age or older,

Is Dot Com's politics or religion the same as a business discriminating?

LOL, you just thought you had a point.

No, but his right to express his opinions is just as sacrosanct.

Well, you idiot, The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries, deals with businesses, not random folks speaking their opinion.

I can hardly wait for a case to go to SCOTUS. I see where actually discriminating against someone could be prosecuted, but saying you would hardly violates anyone's rights?

What kind of case? WTF are you blabbering about?

 

[Ernie S.]

If you can't read, I can't help you.

 

[Dot Com]

If they can't abide by the 14th Amendment, they never should have moved out of the church basement bake sale area PERIOD.

End of story.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

So I can yell FIRE in a crowded theater.....

Where is the danger to life and limb " from speaking publicly about not wanting to bake cakes for same-sex weddings based on their Christian beliefs"?


Shall I wait for an intuitive response from you, drop-draws, or shall I go on with a full and exciting life?


Later in the thread I will cover the 'test' for restrictions on free speech.

You can talk about not wanting to bake cakes all day long, Dingbat. See, you're doing it right now.

Are you really THAT stupid?
The Kleins apparently can't talk about not wanting to bake cakes.

“The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders [Aaron and Melissa Klein] to cease and desist from publishing, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication to the effect that any of the accommodations … will be refused, withheld from or denied to, or that any discrimination be made against, any person on account of their sexual orientation,” [Administrative Law Judge Alan] Avakian wrote."

Final Order, right here: http://www.oregon.gov/boli/SiteAssets/pages/press/Sweet Cakes FO.pdf

You big dummy.

The Kleins are not under any Gag Order, in any way, shape, or form.

What you're talking about is a law that dates back 30 years, you freaking moron.

The ignorance and stupidity of the OP and those on the right who agree with her is remarkable.

The OP again demonstrates that she's a liar, this is yet another ridiculous lie from the right, and another failed thread by the OP.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Brandenburg is not on your side PC. Nor does it support the OP. The Klein's, by advertising that they intended to continue to discriminate were advocating an imminent lawless action. Your cut and paste is working against you. Free speech does not give one the freedom to advocate breaking the law.
It should be noted that after this recent development the Klein's have stopped promoting a home operated business and claim to be baking only for friends. No doubt legal advice has convinced them that failure to follow the cease and desist order will end up costing them huge legal fees and fines that will gobble up all the very substantial funds donated to them.

1. "Brandenburg is not on your side PC. Nor does it support the OP."

Actually, Brandenburg is supporting of my position, and, more to the point, my point is that of the United States Constitution.

You anti-freedom, anti-American, anti-Constitution fascists scamper around like the cockroaches that you are when the spotlight is turned on.


2. "Free speech does not give one the freedom to advocate breaking the law."
Wrong, fascist.
That is exactly what free speech does.
Brandenburg says exactly that.


3. Your fabrications are totally understandable. You simply cannot admit, even to yourself, that you have been so fooled, for so many years, to accept and endorse the very same beliefs as Stalin, Hitler, and pretty much every totalitarian in modern history. Even when the proof is right before your eyes.


4. But I do so appreciate your taking time away from polishing FDR's tombstone to drop by.

Nope, your caught. Anyone can read in your cut and paste quotes that Brandenburg specifically excludes promotion of speech that incites imminent lawless action as being covered under free speech. Your lie about the gag order is biting you back now. The cease and desist order told the Klein's to stop breaking the law, not to stop their free speech. The free speech was never recognized as free speech or at issue by the court. It was recognized as inciting imminent lawless action, discrimination specifically. Take away the private aspect and the Klein's get to say whatever they want. People are allowed to discriminate, businesses are not.

"Anyone can read in your cut and paste quotes that Brandenburg specifically excludes promotion of speech that incites imminent lawless action as being covered under free speech."

Well, you lying sack of drool....let's examine what the gag order intended:
"ordering them to“cease and desist” from speaking publicly about not wanting to bake cakes for same-sex weddings based on their Christian beliefs."


This: "incites imminent lawless action"....talking about their beliefs?????

We can't have that, can we, you fascist.

 

[PoliticalChic]

in reality, gag orders occur all the time...sometimes they might be questionable or troublesome enough to be challenged, but most times perfectly appropriate and routine within our system of justice which has built in legal mechanisms to remedy any and every circumstance in order to insure our constitution is ultimately upheld...


"Constitution???? What Constitution? "



hysterical hyperbolic cries of FASCISM over pending cases in the daily news are hysterical.



just watch, I can prove that ^ ...effortlessly. >

You're begging for an education???

No prob......here it comes......I'll do it effortlessly:



Gag orders: unconstitutional
http://scholarship.law.duke.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2165&context=faculty_scholarship


.

That has nothing to do with what the judge ordered.

Gee....you, of all people in favor of restricting the liberty of Americansw.

What a shocker.

Next thing you know, you'll be wanting to fire folks who don't vote Democrat.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Gag orders are unconstitutional? Prove it.

Have someone with a higher level than you have, explain the thread to you.

Any third grader will do.


Start here:
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

But congress did make a law inspiring gag orders! They have been issued from the bench for years! Get another third grader to explain the words of the amendment to you.

Shocker!

Congress making laws that infract the Constitution.

And there are judges who say black is white and up is down....and 'established by the state' means 'established by the federal government.'


I honor the Constitution as the law of the land.

You don't.

And as long as there are more folks like you than like me.....America is doomed.

 

[PoliticalChic]

So I can yell FIRE in a crowded theater.....

Where is the danger to life and limb " from speaking publicly about not wanting to bake cakes for same-sex weddings based on their Christian beliefs"?


Shall I wait for an intuitive response from you, drop-draws, or shall I go on with a full and exciting life?


Later in the thread I will cover the 'test' for restrictions on free speech.

When you do, cover this ruling too:

Morse v. Frederick - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

If gag orders ever applied to you.....imagine how much amusement I would forfeit.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Your education coming right up!


During the Democrat Lyndon Johnson administration, basically FDR-redux, the freedom of religious leaders to avail themselves of free speech was restricted.

4. " Churches and other nonprofits are strictly prohibited from engaging in political campaigning. This prohibition stems from the requirements of Section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code (“Code”).

In order to remain tax-exempt under 501(c)(3), churches must abide by strict guidelines that prohibit election activity.

Churches cannot engage in any of the following activities under the federal tax law:

· Cannot endorse or oppose candidates for public office

· Cannot make any communication—either from the pulpit, in a newsletter, or church bulletin—which expressly advocates for the election or defeat of a candidate for public office

· Cannot ask a candidate for public office to sign a pledge or other promise to support a particular issue
Churches and Political Lobbying Activities - Freedom From Religion Foundation




"... make no law ...abridging the freedom of speech,...."

So, a church could not do political campaigning. The question here is, when a preacher is not working in an official capacity for a church, can they do political activity?
Maybe if a church registered as a political organisation instead of a charity then the preacher could say political stuff.

But again, I'm asking what you can't say. Seems to me that an individual can say what they like. When they work for a company that is different. I can't tell my boss to "go fuck off" for example, does that mean my free speech is being limited? No it does not. A company doesn't have the right to free speech. It's individuals that have the right to free speech. When you work for a company, on company pay, during company hours and officially representing a company you have to abide by different laws than when you're at home.

It's not difficult. You still have your freedom of speech.

"The question here is, blah blah blah....."

No....that's not the question.

1. The question is where all of you Liberal fascists come from, espousing some totalitarian view that it is good for people to be penalized for speaking their minds.


That's the question.



2. "Seems to me that an individual can say what they like. When they work for a company that is different."
You really are this stupid, aren't you.


3. ". I can't tell my boss....."
You moron....this is about government!!!!!


4. "A company doesn't have the right to free speech."
Citizens United v. FEC -


As I've said before.....Totalitarians include not just fascists, Nazis, communists, socialists.....
....but, as you prove....Liberals, Progressives, Democrats.


Where the heck are the real Americans?

 

[PoliticalChic]

So I can yell FIRE in a crowded theater.....

Where is the danger to life and limb " from speaking publicly about not wanting to bake cakes for same-sex weddings based on their Christian beliefs"?


Shall I wait for an intuitive response from you, drop-draws, or shall I go on with a full and exciting life?


Later in the thread I will cover the 'test' for restrictions on free speech.

You can talk about not wanting to bake cakes all day long, Dingbat. See, you're doing it right now.

Are you really THAT stupid?
The Kleins apparently can't talk about not wanting to bake cakes.

“The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders [Aaron and Melissa Klein] to cease and desist from publishing, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication to the effect that any of the accommodations … will be refused, withheld from or denied to, or that any discrimination be made against, any person on account of their sexual orientation,” [Administrative Law Judge Alan] Avakian wrote."

Final Order, right here: http://www.oregon.gov/boli/SiteAssets/pages/press/Sweet Cakes FO.pdf

You big dummy.

The Kleins are not under any Gag Order, in any way, shape, or form.

What you're talking about is a law that dates back 30 years, you freaking moron.

The ignorance and stupidity of the OP and those on the right who agree with her is remarkable.

The OP again demonstrates that she's a liar, this is yet another ridiculous lie from the right, and another failed thread by the OP.

Shouldn't you be home practicing your "Sieg Heils!"??

 

[Nosmo King]

Gag orders are unconstitutional? Prove it.

Have someone with a higher level than you have, explain the thread to you.

Any third grader will do.


Start here:
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

But congress did make a law inspiring gag orders! They have been issued from the bench for years! Get another third grader to explain the words of the amendment to you.

Shocker!

Congress making laws that infract the Constitution.

And there are judges who say black is white and up is down....and 'established by the state' means 'established by the federal government.'


I honor the Constitution as the law of the land.

You don't.

And as long as there are more folks like you than like me.....America is doomed.

State, county and municipal judges invoke gag rules. Federal judges do as well. And gag orders have been upheld by higher courts upon appeal. Congress did not make laws that "infract" the constitution which you claim to honor but fail to understand.

As long as there are folks like you, folks like me will have to slowly and simply explain the folly of your warped thinking.

 

[Carla_Danger]

If you can't read, I can't help you.

I can read your immature postings, and have determined that you don't have a clue.

 

[Carla_Danger]

Gag orders are unconstitutional? Prove it.

Have someone with a higher level than you have, explain the thread to you.

Any third grader will do.


Start here:
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

But congress did make a law inspiring gag orders! They have been issued from the bench for years! Get another third grader to explain the words of the amendment to you.

Shocker!

Congress making laws that infract the Constitution.

And there are judges who say black is white and up is down....and 'established by the state' means 'established by the federal government.'


I honor the Constitution as the law of the land.

You don't.

And as long as there are more folks like you than like me.....America is doomed.

We have laws against discrimination, and in Oregon specifically, there are laws against businesses discriminating against same sex couples. That is the law of the land. Do you honor it, Dingbat?

 

[NYcarbineer]

in reality, gag orders occur all the time...sometimes they might be questionable or troublesome enough to be challenged, but most times perfectly appropriate and routine within our system of justice which has built in legal mechanisms to remedy any and every circumstance in order to insure our constitution is ultimately upheld...


"Constitution???? What Constitution? "



hysterical hyperbolic cries of FASCISM over pending cases in the daily news are hysterical.



just watch, I can prove that ^ ...effortlessly. >

You're begging for an education???

No prob......here it comes......I'll do it effortlessly:



Gag orders: unconstitutional
http://scholarship.law.duke.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2165&context=faculty_scholarship


.

That has nothing to do with what the judge ordered.

Gee....you, of all people in favor of restricting the liberty of Americansw.

What a shocker.

Next thing you know, you'll be wanting to fire folks who don't vote Democrat.

You don't have the 'liberty' to discriminate in the US, mostly because of our Constitution.

 

[NYcarbineer]

The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries hereby orders (a possible person known as Dot Com) to cease and desist from publishing, posting, circulating, issuing or displaying, or causing to be published … any communication regarding politics or religion"

What's the BFD?

To state that you will refuse to serve gays is a refusal to serve gays. It is against the law in Oregon to discriminate against gays.

659A.409¹
Notice that discrimination will be made in place of public accommodation prohibited

• • age exceptions

Except as provided by laws governing the consumption of alcoholic beverages by minors and the frequenting by minors of places of public accommodation where alcoholic beverages are served, and except for special rates or services offered to persons 50 years of age or older,

Is Dot Com's politics or religion the same as a business discriminating?

LOL, you just thought you had a point.

No, but his right to express his opinions is just as sacrosanct.

Well, you idiot, The Commissioner of the Bureau of Labor and Industries, deals with businesses, not random folks speaking their opinion.

I can hardly wait for a case to go to SCOTUS. I see where actually discriminating against someone could be prosecuted, but saying you would hardly violates anyone's rights?

This is about whether you can put a sign in the window of your business saying 'We don't serve blacks'.

My guess would be that the Supreme Court will say no, you can't.

 

[frigidweirdo]

Your education coming right up!


During the Democrat Lyndon Johnson administration, basically FDR-redux, the freedom of religious leaders to avail themselves of free speech was restricted.

4. " Churches and other nonprofits are strictly prohibited from engaging in political campaigning. This prohibition stems from the requirements of Section 501(c)(3) of the Internal Revenue Code (“Code”).

In order to remain tax-exempt under 501(c)(3), churches must abide by strict guidelines that prohibit election activity.

Churches cannot engage in any of the following activities under the federal tax law:

· Cannot endorse or oppose candidates for public office

· Cannot make any communication—either from the pulpit, in a newsletter, or church bulletin—which expressly advocates for the election or defeat of a candidate for public office

· Cannot ask a candidate for public office to sign a pledge or other promise to support a particular issue
Churches and Political Lobbying Activities - Freedom From Religion Foundation




"... make no law ...abridging the freedom of speech,...."

So, a church could not do political campaigning. The question here is, when a preacher is not working in an official capacity for a church, can they do political activity?
Maybe if a church registered as a political organisation instead of a charity then the preacher could say political stuff.

But again, I'm asking what you can't say. Seems to me that an individual can say what they like. When they work for a company that is different. I can't tell my boss to "go fuck off" for example, does that mean my free speech is being limited? No it does not. A company doesn't have the right to free speech. It's individuals that have the right to free speech. When you work for a company, on company pay, during company hours and officially representing a company you have to abide by different laws than when you're at home.

It's not difficult. You still have your freedom of speech.

"The question here is, blah blah blah....."

No....that's not the question.

1. The question is where all of you Liberal fascists come from, espousing some totalitarian view that it is good for people to be penalized for speaking their minds.


That's the question.



2. "Seems to me that an individual can say what they like. When they work for a company that is different."
You really are this stupid, aren't you.


3. ". I can't tell my boss....."
You moron....this is about government!!!!!


4. "A company doesn't have the right to free speech."
Citizens United v. FEC -


As I've said before.....Totalitarians include not just fascists, Nazis, communists, socialists.....
....but, as you prove....Liberals, Progressives, Democrats.


Where the heck are the real Americans?

So your argument is just to insult. You want proper Americans. By "proper Americans" I assume you mean, Americans without the brains to be able to hold down an argument, but can drink a bottle of beer in under 5 seconds. Proper Americans who could name every state in the country, but struggle to find the United Kingdom on a map?

You're looking for thick people?