Constantine the Great: Politics and Religion

[PoliticalChic]

Another one of those defining characteristics that differentiates between Left and Right....the former gains it's perspective from the NYTimes, while the latter from an older tome, the Bible.

Leaping from hyperbole to hagiography, some Trump voters have invested huge amount of hope in Donald Trump...not quite the sort that claims him to be God...as the Obama supporters did in '08....
....but, as in the following.....seeing Trump as Constantine, the Caesar who installed Christianity in his empire.


Obama as God...Trump as Constantine
One of these biblical truths:
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Ecclesiastes 1:9



An example is this essay by Blaise Joseph, a contributor at Mercatornet, which you may find interesting: Donald Trump as a contemporary Constantine the Great:

1. "Christians are unable to speak freely. Religious freedom is under attack. Society is materialistic and immoral. Western civilisation is facing huge threats, from within and without. And apparently the one powerful emerging leader is no saint.
You’re thinking America 2016? No. Rome 312."


2. Who is 'running for office' at that time? A darn good administrator..... Flavius Valerius Aurelius Constantinus Augustus....Constantine the Great!
."Constantine had many defects: he had multiple wives and even put one of them to death, was extremely ambitious, and was a ruthless general and politician. But the legend remains that he had a “Road to Damascus” moment, saw a vision, converted to Christianity, triumphed over his opponents, and became a great emperor of Rome.
He not only saved "the Roman Empire, but also [championed] Christianity. He signed the Edict of Milan in 313, giving Christians the right to practice their faith and speak freely. This was enough to allow Christians to engage in the public sphere with freedom, thereby enabling them to spread the Christian message to the ends of the empire and Christianise a pagan culture.... gave Christians the freedom to influence society.."

3. And...here we are today:
" Conservatives do not lack will, good arguments, or articulate defenders; what they lack is the freedom to speak bluntly about social issues without being shouted down by the vindictive hordes of secular progressivism for “offending” particular groups of people. ....Conservative Christians have the solutions to many of those problems, but cannot articulate them freely in the public square due to endemic political correctness and cultural Marxism."

4. What makes Donald Trump stand out as a 'caesar' among the politicians we have become used to?
"Whatever else you might say about Trump, he is definitely politically incorrect, and prides himself on that attribute. He refuses to back down after making controversial statements. He does not apologise for offending groups after making arguments. He stands up to the media. He is defiant in spite of being vilified by political elites, journalists, and academics." MercatorNet: Is Trump the new Constantine?


It remains to be seen whether one man can change the course of the tidal wave of secular Marxism.
But....Trump does have the advantage of Barack Obama having revealed what a failure Leftist doctrine is.

 

[AVG-JOE]

Things that make humans look stupid from space, number four:

It's been 6,000 to 1,700 years since they were written, and three ancient Arab stories continue to tighten their grip on western thinking and politics.​

 

[PoliticalChic]

Things that make humans look stupid from space, number four:

It's been 6,000 to 1,700 years since they were written, and three ancient Arab stories continue to tighten their grip on western thinking and politics.​

Since the Founders based the Constitution and this nation on a biblical foundation....you outer-space aliens must find these 'stupid' as well....

...is that your position?

 

[OZman]

Yeah, and then Constantine had to convene the council of Nicea in 323 to stop you so called Christians from tearing each other apart.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Yeah, and then Constantine had to convene the council of Nicea in 323 to stop you so called Christians from tearing each other apart.

You seem to have missed the point of the OP.

Perhaps your bias and bigotry got in the way.

 

[Iceweasel]

History proves that the worse thing that can happen to a religion is for government to get involved. We don't need a Constantine, we need a businessman that knows money isn't manna from Heaven.

 

[OZman]

This was enough to allow Christians to engage in the public sphere with freedom, thereby enabling them to spread the Christian message to the ends of the empire and Christianise a pagan culture.... gave Christians the freedom to influence society.."

There was no common Christian "message" before Nicea.

 

[PoliticalChic]

History proves that the worse thing that can happen to a religion is for government to get involved. We don't need a Constantine, we need a businessman that knows money isn't manna from Heaven.

Of course, Constantine created a totalitarian entity in enforcing Christianity on all subjects...but that is hardly the point of the comparison of Constantine and Trump.

No one expects nor wishes any doctrine to be forced on Americans, and, in fact of the matter, that 'forcing' by the Leftists is a major explanation of for Trump's election.

But....there is this:
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
John Adams

 

[PoliticalChic]

This was enough to allow Christians to engage in the public sphere with freedom, thereby enabling them to spread the Christian message to the ends of the empire and Christianise a pagan culture.... gave Christians the freedom to influence society.."

There was no common Christian "message" before Nicea.

In your earlier post you lest slip your jaundiced view that Christianity is a barbaric religion, as is certain other contemporary...religions....

Here: "to stop you so called Christians from tearing each other apart."

Putting the spotlight on it seems to have forced you to back away from the suggestion.

Excellent.

 

[Iceweasel]

History proves that the worse thing that can happen to a religion is for government to get involved. We don't need a Constantine, we need a businessman that knows money isn't manna from Heaven.

Of course, Constantine created a totalitarian entity in enforcing Christianity on all subjects...but that is hardly the point of the comparison of Constantine and Trump.

No one expects nor wishes any doctrine to be forced on Americans, and, in fact of the matter, that 'forcing' by the Leftists is a major explanation of for Trump's election.

But....there is this:
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
John Adams

I just don't agree with the analogy and I'm not an Adams fan. He was a Federalist big central government kind of guy and I prefer Jefferson's way of thinking. Yes, no question Christianity was a big influence on men and the government they created but they were smart enough to create a secular guide book.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Another one of those defining characteristics that differentiates between Left and Right....the former gains it's perspective from the NYTimes, while the latter from an older tome, the Bible.

Leaping from hyperbole to hagiography, some Trump voters have invested huge amount of hope in Donald Trump...not quite the sort that claims him to be God...as the Obama supporters did in '08....
....but, as in the following.....seeing Trump as Constantine, the Caesar who installed Christianity in his empire.


Obama as God...Trump as Constantine
One of these biblical truths:
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Ecclesiastes 1:9



An example is this essay by Blaise Joseph, a contributor at Mercatornet, which you may find interesting: Donald Trump as a contemporary Constantine the Great:

1. "Christians are unable to speak freely. Religious freedom is under attack. Society is materialistic and immoral. Western civilisation is facing huge threats, from within and without. And apparently the one powerful emerging leader is no saint.
You’re thinking America 2016? No. Rome 312."


2. Who is 'running for office' at that time? A darn good administrator..... Flavius Valerius Aurelius Constantinus Augustus....Constantine the Great!
."Constantine had many defects: he had multiple wives and even put one of them to death, was extremely ambitious, and was a ruthless general and politician. But the legend remains that he had a “Road to Damascus” moment, saw a vision, converted to Christianity, triumphed over his opponents, and became a great emperor of Rome.
He not only saved "the Roman Empire, but also [championed] Christianity. He signed the Edict of Milan in 313, giving Christians the right to practice their faith and speak freely. This was enough to allow Christians to engage in the public sphere with freedom, thereby enabling them to spread the Christian message to the ends of the empire and Christianise a pagan culture.... gave Christians the freedom to influence society.."

3. And...here we are today:
" Conservatives do not lack will, good arguments, or articulate defenders; what they lack is the freedom to speak bluntly about social issues without being shouted down by the vindictive hordes of secular progressivism for “offending” particular groups of people. ....Conservative Christians have the solutions to many of those problems, but cannot articulate them freely in the public square due to endemic political correctness and cultural Marxism."

4. What makes Donald Trump stand out as a 'caesar' among the politicians we have become used to?
"Whatever else you might say about Trump, he is definitely politically incorrect, and prides himself on that attribute. He refuses to back down after making controversial statements. He does not apologise for offending groups after making arguments. He stands up to the media. He is defiant in spite of being vilified by political elites, journalists, and academics." MercatorNet: Is Trump the new Constantine?


It remains to be seen whether one man can change the course of the tidal wave of secular Marxism.
But....Trump does have the advantage of Barack Obama having revealed what a failure Leftist doctrine is.

Well, finally someone has stopped pretending they don't want the US to be a Christian theocracy.

 

[OZman]

This was enough to allow Christians to engage in the public sphere with freedom, thereby enabling them to spread the Christian message to the ends of the empire and Christianise a pagan culture.... gave Christians the freedom to influence society.."

There was no common Christian "message" before Nicea.

In your earlier post you lest slip your jaundiced view that Christianity is a barbaric religion, as is certain other contemporary...religions....

Here: "to stop you so called Christians from tearing each other apart."

Putting the spotlight on it seems to have forced you to back away from the suggestion.

Excellent.

Arius - Wikipedia

 

[PoliticalChic]

History proves that the worse thing that can happen to a religion is for government to get involved. We don't need a Constantine, we need a businessman that knows money isn't manna from Heaven.

Of course, Constantine created a totalitarian entity in enforcing Christianity on all subjects...but that is hardly the point of the comparison of Constantine and Trump.

No one expects nor wishes any doctrine to be forced on Americans, and, in fact of the matter, that 'forcing' by the Leftists is a major explanation of for Trump's election.

But....there is this:
Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.
John Adams

I just don't agree with the analogy and I'm not an Adams fan. He was a Federalist big central government kind of guy and I prefer Jefferson's way of thinking. Yes, no question Christianity was a big influence on men and the government they created but they were smart enough to create a secular guide book.

What is the 'secular guide book'?

 

[PoliticalChic]

This was enough to allow Christians to engage in the public sphere with freedom, thereby enabling them to spread the Christian message to the ends of the empire and Christianise a pagan culture.... gave Christians the freedom to influence society.."

There was no common Christian "message" before Nicea.

In your earlier post you lest slip your jaundiced view that Christianity is a barbaric religion, as is certain other contemporary...religions....

Here: "to stop you so called Christians from tearing each other apart."

Putting the spotlight on it seems to have forced you to back away from the suggestion.

Excellent.

Arius - Wikipedia

By your changing the subject, one can conclude that you were embarrassed over your earlier slander.

Excellent.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Trump is hardly a Christian theologian who will enforce doctrine on an unwilling public. He will stop cult doctrine from being forced on an unwilling public.

 

[Jantje_Smit]

....but, as in the following.....seeing Trump as Constantine, the Caesar who installed Christianity in his empire.

Yeah, and the Roman empire only went downhill after that

If you are desperate to compare Trump with a Roman emperor I think Caligula would be a better choice

 

[PoliticalChic]

Trump is hardly a Christian theologian who will enforce doctrine on an unwilling public. He will stop cult doctrine from being forced on an unwilling public.

To whom is this addressed, Tipsy?

 

[PoliticalChic]

....but, as in the following.....seeing Trump as Constantine, the Caesar who installed Christianity in his empire.

Yeah, and the Roman empire only went downhill after that

If you are desperate to compare Trump with a Roman emperor I think Caligula would be a better choice

1."If you are desperate to compare Trump with a Roman emperor..."

You should read more carefully....if that's possible.
Had this been a reading comprehension test....you would have fared as well as in every other endeavor of your life.


2. "...compare Trump with a Roman emperor I think Caligula..."
Please....defend yourself against the conclusion that you are a dunce by providing examples of the comparison you suggest.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Another one of those defining characteristics that differentiates between Left and Right....the former gains it's perspective from the NYTimes, while the latter from an older tome, the Bible.

Leaping from hyperbole to hagiography, some Trump voters have invested huge amount of hope in Donald Trump...not quite the sort that claims him to be God...as the Obama supporters did in '08....
....but, as in the following.....seeing Trump as Constantine, the Caesar who installed Christianity in his empire.


Obama as God...Trump as Constantine
One of these biblical truths:
The thing that hath been, it is that which shall be; and that which is done is that which shall be done: and there is no new thing under the sun.
Ecclesiastes 1:9



An example is this essay by Blaise Joseph, a contributor at Mercatornet, which you may find interesting: Donald Trump as a contemporary Constantine the Great:

1. "Christians are unable to speak freely. Religious freedom is under attack. Society is materialistic and immoral. Western civilisation is facing huge threats, from within and without. And apparently the one powerful emerging leader is no saint.
You’re thinking America 2016? No. Rome 312."


2. Who is 'running for office' at that time? A darn good administrator..... Flavius Valerius Aurelius Constantinus Augustus....Constantine the Great!
."Constantine had many defects: he had multiple wives and even put one of them to death, was extremely ambitious, and was a ruthless general and politician. But the legend remains that he had a “Road to Damascus” moment, saw a vision, converted to Christianity, triumphed over his opponents, and became a great emperor of Rome.
He not only saved "the Roman Empire, but also [championed] Christianity. He signed the Edict of Milan in 313, giving Christians the right to practice their faith and speak freely. This was enough to allow Christians to engage in the public sphere with freedom, thereby enabling them to spread the Christian message to the ends of the empire and Christianise a pagan culture.... gave Christians the freedom to influence society.."

3. And...here we are today:
" Conservatives do not lack will, good arguments, or articulate defenders; what they lack is the freedom to speak bluntly about social issues without being shouted down by the vindictive hordes of secular progressivism for “offending” particular groups of people. ....Conservative Christians have the solutions to many of those problems, but cannot articulate them freely in the public square due to endemic political correctness and cultural Marxism."

4. What makes Donald Trump stand out as a 'caesar' among the politicians we have become used to?
"Whatever else you might say about Trump, he is definitely politically incorrect, and prides himself on that attribute. He refuses to back down after making controversial statements. He does not apologise for offending groups after making arguments. He stands up to the media. He is defiant in spite of being vilified by political elites, journalists, and academics." MercatorNet: Is Trump the new Constantine?


It remains to be seen whether one man can change the course of the tidal wave of secular Marxism.
But....Trump does have the advantage of Barack Obama having revealed what a failure Leftist doctrine is.

Trump the gambling den building, fornicating, rapist is the face of America's New Christianity?

Jesus Christ!!

 

[PoliticalChic]

5. The author of the piece, Mr. Joseph, has stated that conservatives have the correct answers to many of society's problems, but are shouted down and marginalized by 'secular Marxists.'

What are the sorts of statements and issues on which the Right is clearly correct...but are met with rage and vituperation from the elites, the media and the inculcated?


• "Stating that children should ideally have a mother and father because on average they will do best in that environment (as supported overwhelmingly by the relevant social science) renders you “homophobic” (even though the statement has nothing to do homosexuality) and a “hater of single mothers”;

• Explaining that there is actually a biological and societal reason that marriage has been promoted and protected as between a man and a woman for millennia (hint: it's about children) makes you “bigoted”;

• Arguing that the high divorce rate hurts children, and that no-fault divorce is responsible for many social problems, makes you “living in the 1950s” and a “dinosaur” (even though the social data on the effects of divorce is indisputable and President Obama himself has said as much);

• Affirming the biological fact that men and women are inherently different makes you “transphobic” (something that no one knew existed just a few years ago);

• Pointing out that babies do not simply magically appear out of nothing after nine months, and may in fact have a right to life and dignity before birth, makes you an extremist (just because) and a sexist (even though this statement says nothing about women)." MercatorNet: Is Trump the new Constantine?



The above are corollary to the Trump-Clinton Debate in which Bill's wife admitted that wrenching a child from its mother's womb the day of its birth, and puncturing its brain is her political position.
I wonder how many votes that single elucidation brought to Trump.