Conservatives, the fight is not over!

For the Trump supporters, here's an article on the die hard Rs who will never, ever vote for Trump. I guess they're the #NeverTrump crowd.

The author "invited lifelong Republicans who had decided that they couldn’t vote for Trump in the general, even if he got the nomination, to tell me their stories. Hundreds of e-mails poured in, and are still arriving. They're informative".

Perhaps this will give you an insight as to why many of us do not support Trump. Not that we're all die hard Rs, and we are fed up with 'business as usual in DC', and we are sick of the establishment ... but we also are not seeing Trump as the answer.

The Die-Hard Republicans Who Say #NeverTrump

This is just one that I can see eye to eye with,

“I agree with Donald Trump on virtually nothing and don't consider him a Republican. Not only won't I vote for him in a general election, but I'll vote for either Hillary or Sanders and will do so without a tad of guilt of voting for a Democrat. For that matter, if the election looks close, I'll even consider following Trump's example and donating money to Hillary. … As Americans, I think we have a moral obligation to choose between the lesser of two evils … or as Churchill said: ‘If Hitler invaded hell I would make at least a favourable reference to the devil in the House of Commons.’ ”

Dear Crixus: Some people on here don't think we the people have any say outside what the major political parties do with their power.
What do you think of this idea: what if we each contact our local precinct Democratic or Republican chairs, and ask for local conventions
to write up a special resolution to present to the major party candidates who win their nominations. Basically make a list of what we
will accept or not accept from them, regardless which of them wins nominations or office.

For example, regardless if they win or not, we will not accept to pay fines out of our income for not buying insurance.
Either the parties have to agree how to set up singlepayer care where it doesn't increase taxes or debt burden (such as reforming each
state prison system where funds saved there pay for health services for the general population instead of only paying for inmates and wards of the state),
or set up affordable care through free market choices, but not mandate costs to taxpayers without accountability in a way that ensures all the population is covered, and citizens are not penalized for choosing to invest in other means of providing health care that are still necessary if not more effective.

Regardless which of the party candidates wins nomination or office, we will not accept any Supreme Court Justices who do not recognize the difference between political beliefs and regular secular laws that don't require faith-based arguments. We the citizens demand justices and rulings that either satisfy both sides of conflicts between political beliefs,
and/or recognize the responsibility of the people and legislatures to write better policies that are neutral; and not take it upon themselves to make decisions favoring one side of a faith-based issue over the other, so as to discriminate on the basis of creed.

(Examples: the marriage issue, and whether political beliefs such as "right to marriage" or "right to health care" should be treated as inherent, as included under "religious freedom" which govt should NOT regulate without consent of the affected citizens, or as requiring Constitutional amendments to recognize at the same level that "right to bear arms" or "right to vote" are added in writing; the bathroom/gender orientation policy, whether or not people believe in treating internal gender identity as a behavior, creed, choice or inborn trait, and/or a faith-based decision that should remain up to individuals and not mandated by govt; and in general how to treat political beliefs equally including issues of "right to life" in comparison to "right to health care," "right to vote" with "states' rights of sovereignty unless expressly authorized to federal govt by written amendments," laws on arms, abortion, etc. written and passed by consensus instead of fear of politicized regulations or lack thereof that citizens don't consent to, etc.)

What if the citizens organize by party and co-sign a resolution demanding that whatever candidates win nominations or office, they agree to abide by Constitutional limits on govt and NOT pass any agenda constituting "political beliefs" based on their personal or partisan ideology, or abuse the judiciary or executive offices to push such agenda or discriminate, exclude or penalize the political beliefs and agenda of opposing parties or persons,
but only support neutral policies that the general public AGREES are in line with the duties of federal govt, are in the best interests of the public, and which do not discriminate on the basis of creed, political belief or party.

If people of one party or another disagree with a policy, it should be re-examined to resolve the inherent conflicts being protested, and not railroaded through by political bullying by coercion or exclusion, as is taking place now with the above issues; and/or set up a process to separate equal choices to fund alternatives if parties cannot agree based on their inherent political beliefs, creeds or ideologies that should be protected and represented equally and NOT be forced to change by govt.

Either act in the best interest of the public, including all parties and all beliefs and creeds, or appoint mediators to resolve conflicts and write better laws, through the respective state or federal legislatures, that REMOVE or RESOLVE the objectionable biases so all sides agree these are neutral and universally represent the public without exception or discrimination.

(For an example of articles passed by consensus of Congress, please see the Code of Ethics for Govt Service Public Law 96-303,
noting the article on putting Constitutional public duty above loyalty to parties, person or dept. ethics-commission.net)

So everyone can sign this resolution, that if we are going to support X Y Z candidates, we only agree for these leaders to endorse policies that meet Constitutional standards, and do not violate, establish nor exclude the religions, personal or political beliefs of any person or party over any other.
 
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Sorry, not even understanding what you want to do. I don't want to be on a team... I am not helping form some coalition to talk about ways we can all get along and solve problems. I am a Constitutional Conservative and I stand for core Constitutional Conservative principles and millions upon millions of Americans are with me.... we don't need organizing. I'm sorry that you spent so much time typing out all of that... really, I think you need to work on honing down your points to one or two main things you'd like to throw out there and not try to reinvent the wheel with every post you make. No offense, but you're just all over the board here.

Hi Boss I'm more interested in what you ARE interested in doing, seeing and supporting.
Not what you are not interested in.

You cited Mark Levine. So does another Conservative in a Constitution group I'm in, who has a blog as the last conservative in Austin TX.
Why not follow up on the issues for a Constitutional Convention?
Especially if we don't agree the Constitution needs to be changed,
how do we address the abuses going on, by using the given system more effectively?

I think you are underchallenged and underutilized, Boss.

Even if you don't think anything needs to be changed, we need to use the system correctly.

One last question for you Boss:
Wouldn't it save taxpayers money if parties in offices didn't pass unconstitutional and/or poorly devised legislation to begin with?
Wouldn't it be more effective and cost-effective to resolve conflicts and objections, correct problems and even test out policies before pushing and passing them?

If you look at the Code of Ethics for Government Service (posted at ethics-commission.net)
one of the Articles is to seek to employ more economical means of accomplishing tasks.

Don't we owe it to ourselves to solve problems that otherwise cost us more money
over inept legislation efforts, wasteful bureaucracy, abusive corruption at taxpayers' expense.

Instead of "using the given system" to wait until AFTER the fact to check and correct things
AFTER the damage, losses, waste or abuse has occurred,
why not focus on PREVENTION by redressing grievances directly and more effectively IN ADVANCE?

Don't you think things could improve in that sense, instead of fighting the same battles over and over?
Why not resolve conflicts and problems to REDUCE the cause of political infighting and bullying?
 
I am sure there are a lot of very disappointed conservatives out there who are just throwing up their hands today and saying... well, now what? Trump is the GOP nominee and once again, Conservative voters are left in the lurch without a candidate to support for president of the United States. Today, we're having to endure the sickening gloating of the Trump brigade as they parade around on their victory lap, taking their final pot shots and being the smug and arrogant assholes they've learned to be under their leader.

Fear not, the battle may be over but the war rages on. This isn't over by a damn sight and it won't be over regardless of who wins in November. Our focus must now shift to the congressional races where we stand to make great headway in the house and senate. Now more than ever, our strength and resolve becomes crucial. We can't abandon this fight... not now... not ever. We've suffered a setback, that's for sure. It hurts, I know. But we have to press on for the sake of our children, our grandchildren and this country we love so much.

Naturally, we want to know what went wrong. How did we end up on the short end of the stick in this primary which started with such high hopes? The answer is not simple but it can be summed up easily. The establishment GOP is getting their just rewards for abandoning conservative values. Us conservatives would have liked for that to have come in the form of a new conservative revival and for the first time in 40 years, a conservative choice for president. We came close but no one could have estimated the level of anger from those who are simply fed up with politics as usual in Washington. Too many were simply so fed up they weren't willing to give anyone a chance with a message other than "burn the place to the ground and shake it to the foundation because we're fed up." They didn't really care about messages, they just wanted someone who isn't a political insider because that's all they believe they can trust now. And... some of this can be blamed on actual conservatives who were sent to Washington to change things then abandoned their conservatism.

So maybe this is for the best... maybe we needed this? Granted, it's not what seems the best... it's worse than taking a dose of bad tasting medicine. But maybe we need to get this out of our system so we can return to a clean slate and then start to rebuild a true and strong coalition of conservative values? Once the real Donald Trump becomes known, there will be many who regret their choice. He may or may not defeat Hillary in November and some of us may feel obligated to support him even though he makes their blood boil. I can't tell you what is the right thing to do because I think it's a personal decision you'll have to make.

For me personally, I am not ready to support Donald Trump. I think he needs to unify this party and to do so he needs to advance core conservative principles. It's not our obligation to abandon our beliefs and move toward him, it's his duty as the GOP nominee to reassure the base that we can be united under principles we can all be proud to support in November. If he can't do that or his ego won't let him do that, or his supporters refuse to embrace such a concept, they will do so at their own peril. Clearly, this is out of the control of conservatives now, we can't do anything about what Trump does going forward, that's entirely his prerogative. But there are millions and millions of American conservative voters who are listening and waiting for a reason they should vote for this man in November.

Forget about Trumps antagonistic and frenzied base of supporters... they really don't matter here. What they have to say doesn't matter. They are all giddy with excitement like they just won the championship football game and full of beans. They have already demonstrated they will support Trump no matter what he says or how many times he transitions from one side of a position to another. It's a proven quantity and we know that. What matters is what Trump does. He can either continue to alienate conservatives or he can attempt to bring them into the big tent. The course he takes will have a tremendous effect on his general election bid.


Mr Boss, let me help you out on that vote------------------> do NOT vote for Trump, period! Why? One name explains it all, George W Bush. How long if Trump is elected, do you think it will take the left to notice the ECONOMY SUCKS! If he puts in tariffs like his supporters want, what will that do to the economy? Add to that, we know he has no idea what he is doing, since he can't keep a policy stable longer than 24hrs.

And so, knowing that Trump would be a DISASTER, how would we ever get a conservative elected in the future? Just the name of GW sends the lefties into conniption fits now, what do you think would happen if Trump had his way........the way his supporters want, and the economy went South FURTHER, which we both know it would. 2020? 2024? Hell, you may as well forget about it!

And let us face reality for a second----------------->we could see our way to vote for him and take that chance, if he was going to do something worth while. Are tariffs worth while? Since he stated Reagans tax cuts were bad, should we assume he is going to raise taxes? He is a LIBERAL! So why should we get the blame when it heads further South by putting LEFTY calling himself a REPUBLICAN in there. Let Hilly take the heat.

The best thing that could happen for us is------->Hilly gets indicted, Biden takes her place. See what these 42 percenters have caused.........the best we can hope for is Biden, lolol. Now I will never vote for Hilly or Bernie nor Trump, I will vote 3rd party if I have to. But put Biden in place of Hillary, I would vote for him gladly, to hold place while we get it together for 2020!

I really can't argue with any of that and I've said the same thing.... Trump will effectively kill the Conservative movement for the next 30 years. Not because of Conservatism, but because everything this man does will be tied like a yolk around the neck of Conservatives. Just as Dubya was. Except, when Trump is through, anyone professing to be "right" politically may never get elected as dog catcher again.

I agree with what many are saying... Run as fast as you can away from the GOP. It's like in Titanic... you have to get away from the ship or it will suck you right down when it goes. This party is officially DONE. It ended abruptly the night Ted Cruz suspended his campaign. There is nothing here for Conservatives, it really doesn't matter that it's not going to be a Conservative party because it will be politically feckless going forward. It's time to run away from the GOP as fast as you can.
 
maybe not ki
I am sure there are a lot of very disappointed conservatives out there who are just throwing up their hands today and saying... well, now what? Trump is the GOP nominee and once again, Conservative voters are left in the lurch without a candidate to support for president of the United States. Today, we're having to endure the sickening gloating of the Trump brigade as they parade around on their victory lap, taking their final pot shots and being the smug and arrogant assholes they've learned to be under their leader.

Fear not, the battle may be over but the war rages on. This isn't over by a damn sight and it won't be over regardless of who wins in November. Our focus must now shift to the congressional races where we stand to make great headway in the house and senate. Now more than ever, our strength and resolve becomes crucial. We can't abandon this fight... not now... not ever. We've suffered a setback, that's for sure. It hurts, I know. But we have to press on for the sake of our children, our grandchildren and this country we love so much.

Naturally, we want to know what went wrong. How did we end up on the short end of the stick in this primary which started with such high hopes? The answer is not simple but it can be summed up easily. The establishment GOP is getting their just rewards for abandoning conservative values. Us conservatives would have liked for that to have come in the form of a new conservative revival and for the first time in 40 years, a conservative choice for president. We came close but no one could have estimated the level of anger from those who are simply fed up with politics as usual in Washington. Too many were simply so fed up they weren't willing to give anyone a chance with a message other than "burn the place to the ground and shake it to the foundation because we're fed up." They didn't really care about messages, they just wanted someone who isn't a political insider because that's all they believe they can trust now. And... some of this can be blamed on actual conservatives who were sent to Washington to change things then abandoned their conservatism.

So maybe this is for the best... maybe we needed this? Granted, it's not what seems the best... it's worse than taking a dose of bad tasting medicine. But maybe we need to get this out of our system so we can return to a clean slate and then start to rebuild a true and strong coalition of conservative values? Once the real Donald Trump becomes known, there will be many who regret their choice. He may or may not defeat Hillary in November and some of us may feel obligated to support him even though he makes their blood boil. I can't tell you what is the right thing to do because I think it's a personal decision you'll have to make.

For me personally, I am not ready to support Donald Trump. I think he needs to unify this party and to do so he needs to advance core conservative principles. It's not our obligation to abandon our beliefs and move toward him, it's his duty as the GOP nominee to reassure the base that we can be united under principles we can all be proud to support in November. If he can't do that or his ego won't let him do that, or his supporters refuse to embrace such a concept, they will do so at their own peril. Clearly, this is out of the control of conservatives now, we can't do anything about what Trump does going forward, that's entirely his prerogative. But there are millions and millions of American conservative voters who are listening and waiting for a reason they should vote for this man in November.

Forget about Trumps antagonistic and frenzied base of supporters... they really don't matter here. What they have to say doesn't matter. They are all giddy with excitement like they just won the championship football game and full of beans. They have already demonstrated they will support Trump no matter what he says or how many times he transitions from one side of a position to another. It's a proven quantity and we know that. What matters is what Trump does. He can either continue to alienate conservatives or he can attempt to bring them into the big tent. The course he takes will have a tremendous effect on his general election bid.


Mr Boss, let me help you out on that vote------------------> do NOT vote for Trump, period! Why? One name explains it all, George W Bush. How long if Trump is elected, do you think it will take the left to notice the ECONOMY SUCKS! If he puts in tariffs like his supporters want, what will that do to the economy? Add to that, we know he has no idea what he is doing, since he can't keep a policy stable longer than 24hrs.

And so, knowing that Trump would be a DISASTER, how would we ever get a conservative elected in the future? Just the name of GW sends the lefties into conniption fits now, what do you think would happen if Trump had his way........the way his supporters want, and the economy went South FURTHER, which we both know it would. 2020? 2024? Hell, you may as well forget about it!

And let us face reality for a second----------------->we could see our way to vote for him and take that chance, if he was going to do something worth while. Are tariffs worth while? Since he stated Reagans tax cuts were bad, should we assume he is going to raise taxes? He is a LIBERAL! So why should we get the blame when it heads further South by putting LEFTY calling himself a REPUBLICAN in there. Let Hilly take the heat.

The best thing that could happen for us is------->Hilly gets indicted, Biden takes her place. See what these 42 percenters have caused.........the best we can hope for is Biden, lolol. Now I will never vote for Hilly or Bernie nor Trump, I will vote 3rd party if I have to. But put Biden in place of Hillary, I would vote for him gladly, to hold place while we get it together for 2020!

I really can't argue with any of that and I've said the same thing.... Trump will effectively kill the Conservative movement for the next 30 years. Not because of Conservatism, but because everything this man does will be tied like a yolk around the neck of Conservatives. Just as Dubya was. Except, when Trump is through, anyone professing to be "right" politically may never get elected as dog catcher again.

I agree with what many are saying... Run as fast as you can away from the GOP. It's like in Titanic... you have to get away from the ship or it will suck you right down when it goes. This party is officially DONE. It ended abruptly the night Ted Cruz suspended his campaign. There is nothing here for Conservatives, it really doesn't matter that it's not going to be a Conservative party because it will be politically feckless going forward. It's time to run away from the GOP as fast as you can.


Maybe not kill it, but a growing pain of some type. "The conservative" movement is old and stale just like the "liberal" movement is. For me a change is needed. This social engineering bull shit from both sides is and was retarded. To borrow a famous quote, "it's the economy stupid"! Hopefully Trump and Hillery are not the end of the change, but just a stepping stone
 
Maybe not kill it, but a growing pain of some type. "The conservative" movement is old and stale just like the "liberal" movement is. For me a change is needed. This social engineering bull shit from both sides is and was retarded. To borrow a famous quote, "it's the economy stupid"! Hopefully Trump and Hillery are not the end of the change, but just a stepping stone
No it will kill it for at least a generation if Conservatives allow Conservatism to be tied to Trump. If the new Conservatism is defined by Trump, the Conservative movement is over. At least in our lifetimes.

In any event, the GOP is finished. The establishment is getting schlonged up the ass from Trump as we speak. They are talking about changing the initials to GOT... Grand Old Trump...or Government of Trump! They're going to change the party symbol from an elephant to a comb-over swoosh. It's gunna be yuge, this I can tell you!

Not this Conservative... I distance myself from this man and can't support him at this time. Sorry... not going to happen.
 
Assuming you consider that an alternative, which I do not. I don't want Hillary, Bernie, OR the Orange Jesus picking the Supreme Court justices.


Well feel free to share with the rest of us what you consider a plausible alternative at this point in time.

A plausible alternative, as in "How do we get someone else to nominate Justices", or a plausible alternative, as in "Who I'm voting for instead"?

It's a simple proposition, only one of two possible people will have the opportunity to nominate anyone, voting for a non-viable third party, for me is not an option, the court is too important.

So you're not going to answer my question, and you were just looking for a chance to pontificate on your OWN point of view, rather than actually having any interest in what I thought. Got it. Glad I took the time to clarify before bothering to compose an answer.

I thought I answered both questions quite nicely. There is no one else, with any chance of winning, to nominate justices except the major party candidates, and I simply said voting for a nonviable third party wouldn't be an option for me, what you do with your vote is your business, if you chose to make it mine, that's up to you.

Um, I didn't have two questions. I had one question: which one are you asking me?
 
Well feel free to share with the rest of us what you consider a plausible alternative at this point in time.

A plausible alternative, as in "How do we get someone else to nominate Justices", or a plausible alternative, as in "Who I'm voting for instead"?

It's a simple proposition, only one of two possible people will have the opportunity to nominate anyone, voting for a non-viable third party, for me is not an option, the court is too important.

So you're not going to answer my question, and you were just looking for a chance to pontificate on your OWN point of view, rather than actually having any interest in what I thought. Got it. Glad I took the time to clarify before bothering to compose an answer.

I thought I answered both questions quite nicely. There is no one else, with any chance of winning, to nominate justices except the major party candidates, and I simply said voting for a nonviable third party wouldn't be an option for me, what you do with your vote is your business, if you chose to make it mine, that's up to you.

Um, I didn't have two questions. I had one question: which one are you asking me?

Ok, I'll bite, "How do we get someone else to nominate Justices"?
 
Anti-Abortion Group Once "Disgusted" by Donald...
During the Iowa caucuses in January, Marjorie Dannenfelser, the head of the anti-abortion advocacy group the Susan B. Anthony List, joined other pro-life women leaders in writing a letter to Iowa voters to warn against Trump, saying they were "disgusted" by his treatment of women.

"America will only be a great nation when we have leaders of strong character who will defend both unborn children and the dignity of women," they wrote, poking at Trump's campaign slogan, "Make America Great Again." They continued: "We cannot trust Donald Trump to do either. Therefore we urge our fellow citizens to support an alternative candidate."

When Trump flip-flopped on abortion in March, first stating that he believed women who got the procedure should be punished, but then backtracking, Dannenfelser told Breitbart News that Trump "has completely contradicted himself. If this is his position, he has just disqualified himself as the GOP nominee."

But Trump's rise to becoming the presumptive Republican nominee seems to have inspired Dannenfelser to flip her position on the real estate mogul.
 
Ok, I'll bite, "How do we get someone else to nominate Justices"?

I think Conservatives have to stop freaking out about the justices. Look... it wouldn't have mattered if we had gotten Ted Cruz elected president, this US Congress is never going to approve another justice like Scalia.... that's just a given. Without a Scalia, we really have no "known quantity" with regard to SCOTUS. Just as we saw with Roberts, what you see isn't always what you get. But... best case scenario... the liberals and progressives on both sides in Congress are never going to approve a staunch Constitutional Conservative to the court.

For me personally, any concerns I had about SCOTUS justices left the stage with Cruz. There is literally nothing that tells me Trump would make any better nomination picks than Hillary. In fact, an embattled Hillary might actually be more malleable in who she picks because of tenuous political pressure and her need to gain some political capital. What better way to silence her critics and take some of the heat off her ass than by nominating a conservative? Hell, Trump might nominate Amarosa or his gay sister.... who knows with Trump? :dunno:

But really... you gotta put the SCOTUS off the table now. I don't think any scenario gives us the caliber of justice we had in Antonin Scalia and without that, the court is lost. It doesn't matter if Liberalism is upheld 5-4 or 9-0.
 
Ok, I'll bite, "How do we get someone else to nominate Justices"?

I think Conservatives have to stop freaking out about the justices. Look... it wouldn't have mattered if we had gotten Ted Cruz elected president, this US Congress is never going to approve another justice like Scalia.... that's just a given. Without a Scalia, we really have no "known quantity" with regard to SCOTUS. Just as we saw with Roberts, what you see isn't always what you get. But... best case scenario... the liberals and progressives on both sides in Congress are never going to approve a staunch Constitutional Conservative to the court.

For me personally, any concerns I had about SCOTUS justices left the stage with Cruz. There is literally nothing that tells me Trump would make any better nomination picks than Hillary. In fact, an embattled Hillary might actually be more malleable in who she picks because of tenuous political pressure and her need to gain some political capital. What better way to silence her critics and take some of the heat off her ass than by nominating a conservative? Hell, Trump might nominate Amarosa or his gay sister.... who knows with Trump? :dunno:

But really... you gotta put the SCOTUS off the table now. I don't think any scenario gives us the caliber of justice we had in Antonin Scalia and without that, the court is lost. It doesn't matter if Liberalism is upheld 5-4 or 9-0.

Feel free to think that way, I chose not to, I don't want the hildabitch within a thousand miles of a SCOTUS nomination.
 
Feel free to think that way, I chose not to, I don't want the hildabitch within a thousand miles of a SCOTUS nomination.

Well I don't PREFER it but I'm also not about to sell out my principles to prevent it from happening.
 
Feel free to think that way, I chose not to, I don't want the hildabitch within a thousand miles of a SCOTUS nomination.

Then you should confirm the guy Obama nominated and hope none of the rest of them die.

No thanks, that sob should have never gotten close to any bench, much less the supreme court.
You base this on what rw hack boi?

I'll be happy to answer if you ask in a civil manner. Otherwise fuck off.
 
She'll still have to get them confirmed, so I guess we'll see what happens.

I doubt that will be an issue. First, the democrats are probably going to retake the Senate this year.

Secondly, grandstanding aside, once the election is over, they'll stop grandstanding.

Once Hillary beats Trump, you are going to see most of the Senate going back to "business as usual".
 
She'll still have to get them confirmed, so I guess we'll see what happens.

I doubt that will be an issue. First, the democrats are probably going to retake the Senate this year.

Secondly, grandstanding aside, once the election is over, they'll stop grandstanding.

Once Hillary beats Trump, you are going to see most of the Senate going back to "business as usual".

They'll do it at their own peril.
 

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