Confronting your history

[westwall]

A famous writer called Lytton Strachey once wrote a book called "Eminent Victorians" in which he re-examined the lives of the great Victorian figures such as Florence Nightingale.He found that they fell well short of their mythical status and in some cases they were downright monsters .

Of course this approach to history was not welcomed and in most cases, the stereotypes exist till this day. The media, Hollywood et al like simple truths to feed to simple people and this nonsense is backed up in school curriculums where kids are force fed a series of not quite truths and bullshit.

This starts to be a problem when it feeds a moronic sense of exceptionalism amongst the uneducated.

So the "empire" saw britain conquer a grateful world to bring them God, railways and cricket. Those darkies must love us because we stopped them eating each other. Our inbuilt racist superiority is stroked.

So we learn about Africa and India but we dont learn about America cos we got beaten over there and it spoils the narrative. The attitudes fostered by this ignorance become enshrined in things like Brexit where we clearly didnt need the EU because we were brits and better than a load of greasy frogs and spics.

It also taught us to look down on our darker skinned neighbours because it was the natural way of things. A whole sense of entitled britishness has been built around something that is a lot more nuanced than the standard history books would tell you.

A lot of our current problems can be traced back to this.

I see the opposition to the 1619 project in similar terms.There are uncomfortable truths being spelt out and they challenge the cosy notions that the likes of Tom Cotton has grown up with. It seems that the American right must be enormously fragile that it cannot admit that there are inconsistencies in the narrative.

That a slave owning nation is not the "land of the free" That the aspiration and the reality were two different things. I suspect that you need to confront this in the same way that we need to examine the baggage of empire. Because we will never move on until we do so.

Tom Cotton’s war on the 1619 Project is the real 'cancel culture' | Malaika Jabali

Conservatives like Cotton prefer we avoid looking critically at America at all, and anyone that falls out of line must be cancelled

www.theguardian.com

Ummmm, deal with YOUR history first. Hypocrite.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

You are a constant liar on these boards...........your purpose to stir the pot and create CHAOS and anger...........nothing more.............Your purpose now is to try to be COY and throw gas on the fire for the BLM nonsense.

You're attributing far more intelligence, order and purpose to Tainted Tommy than he has ever shown himself to be capable of.

He's not malicious, as you suggest; just some combination of mentally ill, and unimaginably ignorant, and just not very smart.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

So America is fighting two plagues now, one with Covid and the other Marxism.

The “Covid plague” is part of the Marxist disease. It is an ordinary seasonal flu outbreak, like we get every year, hyperbolized and exploited into a political crisis to be used to promote a willfully malevolent agenda.

 

[Pogo]

A famous writer called Lytton Strachey once wrote a book called "Eminent Victorians" in which he re-examined the lives of the great Victorian figures such as Florence Nightingale.He found that they fell well short of their mythical status and in some cases they were downright monsters .

Of course this approach to history was not welcomed and in most cases, the stereotypes exist till this day. The media, Hollywood et al like simple truths to feed to simple people and this nonsense is backed up in school curriculums where kids are force fed a series of not quite truths and bullshit.

This starts to be a problem when it feeds a moronic sense of exceptionalism amongst the uneducated.

So the "empire" saw britain conquer a grateful world to bring them God, railways and cricket. Those darkies must love us because we stopped them eating each other. Our inbuilt racist superiority is stroked.

So we learn about Africa and India but we dont learn about America cos we got beaten over there and it spoils the narrative. The attitudes fostered by this ignorance become enshrined in things like Brexit where we clearly didnt need the EU because we were brits and better than a load of greasy frogs and spics.

It also taught us to look down on our darker skinned neighbours because it was the natural way of things. A whole sense of entitled britishness has been built around something that is a lot more nuanced than the standard history books would tell you.

A lot of our current problems can be traced back to this.

I see the opposition to the 1619 project in similar terms.There are uncomfortable truths being spelt out and they challenge the cosy notions that the likes of Tom Cotton has grown up with. It seems that the American right must be enormously fragile that it cannot admit that there are inconsistencies in the narrative.

That a slave owning nation is not the "land of the free" That the aspiration and the reality were two different things. I suspect that you need to confront this in the same way that we need to examine the baggage of empire. Because we will never move on until we do so.

Tom Cotton’s war on the 1619 Project is the real 'cancel culture' | Malaika Jabali

Conservatives like Cotton prefer we avoid looking critically at America at all, and anyone that falls out of line must be cancelled

www.theguardian.com

Why the fuck are you still alive? If you are so "white guilt" then the only solution is..

View attachment 369810

Oh and by the way you Rag Head Camel Jockey lover, it was Great Britain who brought US the slaves of 1619. White, and Black...

Actually, I think it was a Portuguese ship. But who cares? The first persons on the planet to denounce slavery in moral terms were white Christians in Europe and North America even though slavery is condoned in the Bible. Tommy Tainted is like the worst kind of human.

Actually it was a Spanish ship, in 1526. Landing in what is not South Carolina.

 

[flacaltenn]

A famous writer called Lytton Strachey once wrote a book called "Eminent Victorians" in which he re-examined the lives of the great Victorian figures such as Florence Nightingale.He found that they fell well short of their mythical status and in some cases they were downright monsters .

Of course this approach to history was not welcomed and in most cases, the stereotypes exist till this day. The media, Hollywood et al like simple truths to feed to simple people and this nonsense is backed up in school curriculums where kids are force fed a series of not quite truths and bullshit.

This starts to be a problem when it feeds a moronic sense of exceptionalism amongst the uneducated.

So the "empire" saw britain conquer a grateful world to bring them God, railways and cricket. Those darkies must love us because we stopped them eating each other. Our inbuilt racist superiority is stroked.

So we learn about Africa and India but we dont learn about America cos we got beaten over there and it spoils the narrative. The attitudes fostered by this ignorance become enshrined in things like Brexit where we clearly didnt need the EU because we were brits and better than a load of greasy frogs and spics.

It also taught us to look down on our darker skinned neighbours because it was the natural way of things. A whole sense of entitled britishness has been built around something that is a lot more nuanced than the standard history books would tell you.

A lot of our current problems can be traced back to this.

I see the opposition to the 1619 project in similar terms.There are uncomfortable truths being spelt out and they challenge the cosy notions that the likes of Tom Cotton has grown up with. It seems that the American right must be enormously fragile that it cannot admit that there are inconsistencies in the narrative.

That a slave owning nation is not the "land of the free" That the aspiration and the reality were two different things. I suspect that you need to confront this in the same way that we need to examine the baggage of empire. Because we will never move on until we do so.

Tom Cotton’s war on the 1619 Project is the real 'cancel culture' | Malaika Jabali

Conservatives like Cotton prefer we avoid looking critically at America at all, and anyone that falls out of line must be cancelled

www.theguardian.com

Logic and reason aint your strong suit. Maybe include American history as well..

ANYTHING happening in North America in 1619 was STILL YOUR "British Empire", the Spanish, Portugese, French empires as well..

And you're focus on the American right and putting the Repubs in proximity to either slavery, the Confederacy, Jim Crow abuses, 100 more years of racism after the Civil War or the Confederate monuments -- is stupid and uninformed...

ALL OF THAT is the HERITAGE of the Democrat party in America.. Almost 100% of the abuses I listed.. The name DEMOCRAT is the biggest abusive vestige of slavery, Confederacy and another 100 years of SEGREGATION after that..

And those Confed monuments that you've never seen?? All OF Democrats, commissioned and dedicated BY democrats and FOR Democrats... No wonder Nancy Pelosi wants to NOW remove all those Democrat statues/paintings from the halls of Congress.. Because TRUTH IS OUT on this.. And people are catching on..,.

I'm sure there's the "Big D" after their names on the plaques in Congress that EMBARRASS her...

 

[Sun Devil 92]

All societies tend to gild the lily of their histories to put a positive spin on their most distinguished sons and daughters. Not just Europeans (and those of us descended of from Europeans) but all societies.

Japanese History enshrined their national origins to heavenly intervention and didn't demote their Emperor from demi-god status until the mid 20th Century.

The Chinese word for China -- Chung Kuo -- literally means, nation at the heart of all others and they looked down on all nations (even that of Gordon) as inferior barbarians -- and idea that is still prominent in Chinese policies.

America refers to itself in song and history as "The Land of the Free" not because all men in it have always been free -- Blacks, Irish, and Asians can attest to the inaccuracy of that. It refers to itself that way because for most of the people seeking opportunities in the New World, it was a much more free society than the class and caste structures nations of Europe and elsewhere. A society that continuously evolves to embrace more freedoms.

Putting your Historical icons on a pedestal is a poetic license of course, but it very useful in setting a standard for others to attempt to follow in their footsteps, guided by their forward progress, and not distracted by their missteps.

Perhaps Ms Nightingale did look down on the fuzzy-wuzzies. One can hardly fault her with that considering the attitudes of the time. But, she did lay down many of the principles of modern nursing. Nursing that today is practiced in every country in the world by women and men of every race, creed, and color. Not because of the bad things she thought, but because of the good things she did.

You can say some really abysmal things about Gandhi. If you look closely, he was a bit of a bastard. So was Mother Theresa. But, we don't hold them up as examples of good because of their faults. We do so because of their many, many positive achievements.

If you degrade every name in History, every statue, every shrine to people who did a lot of good because, heaven forbid, they once didn't tip their servants, or held perfectly legitimate (from a contemporary perspective) opinions on unrelated subjects, then you remove all inspiration from their achievements.

Part of moving forward is acknowledging our mistakes. But, if we dwell on our mistakes to the point where we ignore the achievements, we make no progress at all.

The issue here is that Cotton and his mates do not want to move forward. They want to glory in a past that didnt exist. I would agree with your interpretation of land of the freeand certainly the US was a shining light when compared to Russia for example. Why are folk so sensitive about the rest of it ? We have the same issue over her amongst the uneducated. They cant accept a past that is not black and white.

No you stupid motherfucker.

They don't want to abolish history, they want to rewrite it.

Sorry, but George Washington was not evil and the Civil War was justified for many reasons.

So fuck off.

 

[flacaltenn]

All societies tend to gild the lily of their histories to put a positive spin on their most distinguished sons and daughters. Not just Europeans (and those of us descended of from Europeans) but all societies.

Japanese History enshrined their national origins to heavenly intervention and didn't demote their Emperor from demi-god status until the mid 20th Century.

The Chinese word for China -- Chung Kuo -- literally means, nation at the heart of all others and they looked down on all nations (even that of Gordon) as inferior barbarians -- and idea that is still prominent in Chinese policies.

America refers to itself in song and history as "The Land of the Free" not because all men in it have always been free -- Blacks, Irish, and Asians can attest to the inaccuracy of that. It refers to itself that way because for most of the people seeking opportunities in the New World, it was a much more free society than the class and caste structures nations of Europe and elsewhere. A society that continuously evolves to embrace more freedoms.

Putting your Historical icons on a pedestal is a poetic license of course, but it very useful in setting a standard for others to attempt to follow in their footsteps, guided by their forward progress, and not distracted by their missteps.

Perhaps Ms Nightingale did look down on the fuzzy-wuzzies. One can hardly fault her with that considering the attitudes of the time. But, she did lay down many of the principles of modern nursing. Nursing that today is practiced in every country in the world by women and men of every race, creed, and color. Not because of the bad things she thought, but because of the good things she did.

You can say some really abysmal things about Gandhi. If you look closely, he was a bit of a bastard. So was Mother Theresa. But, we don't hold them up as examples of good because of their faults. We do so because of their many, many positive achievements.

If you degrade every name in History, every statue, every shrine to people who did a lot of good because, heaven forbid, they once didn't tip their servants, or held perfectly legitimate (from a contemporary perspective) opinions on unrelated subjects, then you remove all inspiration from their achievements.

Part of moving forward is acknowledging our mistakes. But, if we dwell on our mistakes to the point where we ignore the achievements, we make no progress at all.

The issue here is that Cotton and his mates do not want to move forward. They want to glory in a past that didnt exist. I would agree with your interpretation of land of the freeand certainly the US was a shining light when compared to Russia for example. Why are folk so sensitive about the rest of it ? We have the same issue over her amongst the uneducated. They cant accept a past that is not black and white.

No you stupid motherfucker.

They don't want to abolish history, they want to rewrite it.

Sorry, but George Washington was not evil and the Civil War was justified for many reasons.

So fuck off.

George Washington is evil to HIM -- because otherwise, we'd all still be mates.. And just fighting amongst the ruins of the former British Empire... He'd very much like to DEFEAT US politically IF Tommy could vote.... But he can't.. So Ta Ta and Tally Ho.. And mind the curb on your way back out of the US..



Maybe we should take turns posting nasty threads about socialism and decay in Jolly Olde England.. LOL....

 

[Asclepias]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

You really havent read my post.

You are projecting HATE ..........White Guilt...........I don't have any........I never owned a slave......You didn't either..........and the blacks protesting kill their own at a higher rate than anyone else........but ignore it.

History is written by WINNERS and not losers...............We need to break their heads and end this current Social Warrior BS.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

You cannot maintain racism, slavery etc when the low brows accept the truth.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

You really havent read my post.

You are projecting HATE ..........White Guilt...........I don't have any........I never owned a slave......You didn't either..........and the blacks protesting kill their own at a higher rate than anyone else........but ignore it.

History is written by WINNERS and not losers...............We need to break their heads and end this current Social Warrior BS.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

You cannot maintain racism, slavery etc when the low brows accept the truth.

I understand that I am not dealing with educated people here but this refusal to accept history is perverse. There used to be a political party called the "know nothings" and maybe it should be resurrected and called the "trump rump".

 

[westwall]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

You really havent read my post.

You are projecting HATE ..........White Guilt...........I don't have any........I never owned a slave......You didn't either..........and the blacks protesting kill their own at a higher rate than anyone else........but ignore it.

History is written by WINNERS and not losers...............We need to break their heads and end this current Social Warrior BS.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

You cannot maintain racism, slavery etc when the low brows accept the truth.

I understand that I am not dealing with educated people here but this refusal to accept history is perverse. There used to be a political party called the "know nothings" and maybe it should be resurrected and called the "trump rump".

Pot, meet kettle.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

I understand that I am not dealing with educated people here but this refusal to accept history is perverse.

“I understand that I am not dealing with educated people here…”​

Fixed it for you.

 

[Asclepias]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

You really havent read my post.

You are projecting HATE ..........White Guilt...........I don't have any........I never owned a slave......You didn't either..........and the blacks protesting kill their own at a higher rate than anyone else........but ignore it.

History is written by WINNERS and not losers...............We need to break their heads and end this current Social Warrior BS.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

You cannot maintain racism, slavery etc when the low brows accept the truth.

I understand that I am not dealing with educated people here but this refusal to accept history is perverse. There used to be a political party called the "know nothings" and maybe it should be resurrected and called the "trump rump".

I would agree. I have noticed that throughout history there has never been a time when someone didnt know the truth. That truth was simply changed, omitted, ridiculed, or out right denied. The low brows are being led around like baby ducklings that have imprinted.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

Because you fucking moron, in 1619 the colonies were under British Rule. Why did the Brits bring slaves to America, is it because those fuckers were just as lazy as you are?

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

Orwell was an optimist. Most socialists are optimists.

Yeah Adolf Hitler was very optimistic but his 1000 year reign, well it didnt go over well with the rest of the world.

 

[flacaltenn]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

You really havent read my post.

You are projecting HATE ..........White Guilt...........I don't have any........I never owned a slave......You didn't either..........and the blacks protesting kill their own at a higher rate than anyone else........but ignore it.

History is written by WINNERS and not losers...............We need to break their heads and end this current Social Warrior BS.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

You cannot maintain racism, slavery etc when the low brows accept the truth.

I understand that I am not dealing with educated people here but this refusal to accept history is perverse. There used to be a political party called the "know nothings" and maybe it should be resurrected and called the "trump rump".

Right after you march in FORCE the Democrat party of the Confederacy and everything else historically racist in the US -- to change THEIR name../

I noticed besides lack of logic, reason, and US history -- you also are a bit weak at debating anyone that actually tries to educate you about American history and "political parties"...

 

[flacaltenn]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

Because you fucking moron, in 1619 the colonies were under British Rule. Why did the Brits bring slaves to America, is it because those fuckers were just as lazy as you are?

In 1619, I wouldn't even call them "colonies".. They were discovery and trade outposts..

 

[Dick Foster]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

It seems to me that you're the one flinging ignorance all over the place around here. That is if you accept the simple fact that if you belive it to be true then thats all the evidence needed to establish it as fact.
Let me put it blutly and in no uncertain terms, you're one dumb mother fucking drooling idiot.

 

[Mikeoxenormous]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

You really havent read my post.

You are projecting HATE ..........White Guilt...........I don't have any........I never owned a slave......You didn't either..........and the blacks protesting kill their own at a higher rate than anyone else........but ignore it.

History is written by WINNERS and not losers...............We need to break their heads and end this current Social Warrior BS.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

You cannot maintain racism, slavery etc when the low brows accept the truth.

Lowbrows, like you?

 

[Asclepias]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

You really havent read my post.

You are projecting HATE ..........White Guilt...........I don't have any........I never owned a slave......You didn't either..........and the blacks protesting kill their own at a higher rate than anyone else........but ignore it.

History is written by WINNERS and not losers...............We need to break their heads and end this current Social Warrior BS.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

You cannot maintain racism, slavery etc when the low brows accept the truth.

Lowbrows, like you?

No...I'm talking about like you.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

You really havent read my post.

You are projecting HATE ..........White Guilt...........I don't have any........I never owned a slave......You didn't either..........and the blacks protesting kill their own at a higher rate than anyone else........but ignore it.

History is written by WINNERS and not losers...............We need to break their heads and end this current Social Warrior BS.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

You cannot maintain racism, slavery etc when the low brows accept the truth.

I understand that I am not dealing with educated people here but this refusal to accept history is perverse. There used to be a political party called the "know nothings" and maybe it should be resurrected and called the "trump rump".

You are not dealing with anyone.

You are simply dropping little dumb-bombs on the board.

Educated people have educated you....but you seem bereft of answers other than to call them names.