Confronting your history

[Correll]

All societies tend to gild the lily of their histories to put a positive spin on their most distinguished sons and daughters. Not just Europeans (and those of us descended of from Europeans) but all societies.

Japanese History enshrined their national origins to heavenly intervention and didn't demote their Emperor from demi-god status until the mid 20th Century.

The Chinese word for China -- Chung Kuo -- literally means, nation at the heart of all others and they looked down on all nations (even that of Gordon) as inferior barbarians -- and idea that is still prominent in Chinese policies.

America refers to itself in song and history as "The Land of the Free" not because all men in it have always been free -- Blacks, Irish, and Asians can attest to the inaccuracy of that. It refers to itself that way because for most of the people seeking opportunities in the New World, it was a much more free society than the class and caste structures nations of Europe and elsewhere. A society that continuously evolves to embrace more freedoms.

Putting your Historical icons on a pedestal is a poetic license of course, but it very useful in setting a standard for others to attempt to follow in their footsteps, guided by their forward progress, and not distracted by their missteps.

Perhaps Ms Nightingale did look down on the fuzzy-wuzzies. One can hardly fault her with that considering the attitudes of the time. But, she did lay down many of the principles of modern nursing. Nursing that today is practiced in every country in the world by women and men of every race, creed, and color. Not because of the bad things she thought, but because of the good things she did.

You can say some really abysmal things about Gandhi. If you look closely, he was a bit of a bastard. So was Mother Theresa. But, we don't hold them up as examples of good because of their faults. We do so because of their many, many positive achievements.

If you degrade every name in History, every statue, every shrine to people who did a lot of good because, heaven forbid, they once didn't tip their servants, or held perfectly legitimate (from a contemporary perspective) opinions on unrelated subjects, then you remove all inspiration from their achievements.

Part of moving forward is acknowledging our mistakes. But, if we dwell on our mistakes to the point where we ignore the achievements, we make no progress at all.

The issue here is that Cotton and his mates do not want to move forward. They want to glory in a past that didnt exist. I would agree with your interpretation of land of the freeand certainly the US was a shining light when compared to Russia for example. Why are folk so sensitive about the rest of it ? We have the same issue over her amongst the uneducated. They cant accept a past that is not black and white.

i don't know if this was ever the case. it has certainly not been in my lifetime.

you are only focused on destroying the west.

 

[Votto]

A famous writer called Lytton Strachey once wrote a book called "Eminent Victorians" in which he re-examined the lives of the great Victorian figures such as Florence Nightingale.He found that they fell well short of their mythical status and in some cases they were downright monsters .

Of course this approach to history was not welcomed and in most cases, the stereotypes exist till this day. The media, Hollywood et al like simple truths to feed to simple people and this nonsense is backed up in school curriculums where kids are force fed a series of not quite truths and bullshit.

This starts to be a problem when it feeds a moronic sense of exceptionalism amongst the uneducated.

So the "empire" saw britain conquer a grateful world to bring them God, railways and cricket. Those darkies must love us because we stopped them eating each other. Our inbuilt racist superiority is stroked.

So we learn about Africa and India but we dont learn about America cos we got beaten over there and it spoils the narrative. The attitudes fostered by this ignorance become enshrined in things like Brexit where we clearly didnt need the EU because we were brits and better than a load of greasy frogs and spics.

It also taught us to look down on our darker skinned neighbours because it was the natural way of things. A whole sense of entitled britishness has been built around something that is a lot more nuanced than the standard history books would tell you.

A lot of our current problems can be traced back to this.

I see the opposition to the 1619 project in similar terms.There are uncomfortable truths being spelt out and they challenge the cosy notions that the likes of Tom Cotton has grown up with. It seems that the American right must be enormously fragile that it cannot admit that there are inconsistencies in the narrative.

That a slave owning nation is not the "land of the free" That the aspiration and the reality were two different things. I suspect that you need to confront this in the same way that we need to examine the baggage of empire. Because we will never move on until we do so.

Tom Cottonâs war on the 1619 Project is the real 'cancel culture' | Malaika Jabali

Conservatives like Cotton prefer we avoid looking critically at America at all, and anyone that falls out of line must be cancelled

www.theguardian.com

A famous writer called Lytton Strachey once wrote a book called "Eminent Victorians" in which he re-examined the lives of the great Victorian figures such as Florence Nightingale.He found that they fell well short of their mythical status and in some cases they were downright monsters .

Of course this approach to history was not welcomed and in most cases, the stereotypes exist till this day. The media, Hollywood et al like simple truths to feed to simple people and this nonsense is backed up in school curriculums where kids are force fed a series of not quite truths and bullshit.

This starts to be a problem when it feeds a moronic sense of exceptionalism amongst the uneducated.

So the "empire" saw britain conquer a grateful world to bring them God, railways and cricket. Those darkies must love us because we stopped them eating each other. Our inbuilt racist superiority is stroked.

So we learn about Africa and India but we dont learn about America cos we got beaten over there and it spoils the narrative. The attitudes fostered by this ignorance become enshrined in things like Brexit where we clearly didnt need the EU because we were brits and better than a load of greasy frogs and spics.

It also taught us to look down on our darker skinned neighbours because it was the natural way of things. A whole sense of entitled britishness has been built around something that is a lot more nuanced than the standard history books would tell you.

A lot of our current problems can be traced back to this.

I see the opposition to the 1619 project in similar terms.There are uncomfortable truths being spelt out and they challenge the cosy notions that the likes of Tom Cotton has grown up with. It seems that the American right must be enormously fragile that it cannot admit that there are inconsistencies in the narrative.

That a slave owning nation is not the "land of the free" That the aspiration and the reality were two different things. I suspect that you need to confront this in the same way that we need to examine the baggage of empire. Because we will never move on until we do so.

Tom Cottonâs war on the 1619 Project is the real 'cancel culture' | Malaika Jabali

Conservatives like Cotton prefer we avoid looking critically at America at all, and anyone that falls out of line must be cancelled

www.theguardian.com

The Left really needs to take account of their own history before pointing fingers.

Consider the following:

1. Karl Marx, the father of Leftism was a racist against blacks and anti-Semitic The entire ideology of Leftism is based in systemic racism

2. Charles Darwin, Mr. Science, that provided Marxists a scientific means to divorce the idea of God thought blacks were inferior and was an ardent racist.

3. Margaret Sanger, the creator of Planned Parenthood and the forefather of abortion on demand thought blacks were destroying the gene pool and, therefore, should stop breeding. In fact, today abortion clinics are strategically positioned around black communities.

 

[Mac-7]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

You are a foreigner who comes here to bash America

you’re lucky to be noticed at all

 

[Tommy Tainant]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

 

[Correll]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

 

[Votto]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

America has been infiltrated by Marxists and Marxists are all about destruction and death. That is their history

So America is fighting two plagues now, one with Covid and the other Marxism.

 

[Correll]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

America has been infiltrated by Marxists and Marxists are all about destruction and death. That is their history

So America is fighting two plagues now, one with Covid and the other Marxism.

and marxism is by far the more deadly.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

America has been infiltrated by Marxists and Marxists are all about destruction and death. That is their history

So America is fighting two plagues now, one with Covid and the other Marxism.

and marxism is by far the more deadly.

It really isnt. There is no left wing in the US. You are fighting a fake enemy.

 

[Correll]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

America has been infiltrated by Marxists and Marxists are all about destruction and death. That is their history

So America is fighting two plagues now, one with Covid and the other Marxism.

and marxism is by far the more deadly.

It really isnt. There is no left wing in the US. You are fighting a fake enemy.

the dead killed by the mobs, might disagree with you. if you, know, they could. they can't because the marxist led mobs killed them.


you are a vile soulless monster.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

Orwell was an optimist. Most socialists are optimists.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

This is a history forum and yet folk are talking about the decline of the West and the NWO. Why cant you discuss the history ?
1619 makes some pertinent points. Cotton doesnt. America isnt going to implode because you acknowledge slavery and the UK will survive an examination of Empire.

america is imploding because of an excessive focus on past injustices. race riots are killing people in the streets.


you support that, and you are part of that. meanwhile your people are so afraid of being called "racist" that they can't speak up when brown people rape your own white children.


the uk might survive this. it might not. at the very least it has already been a human tragedy. yet you want more of it.

America has been infiltrated by Marxists and Marxists are all about destruction and death. That is their history

So America is fighting two plagues now, one with Covid and the other Marxism.

and marxism is by far the more deadly.

It really isnt. There is no left wing in the US. You are fighting a fake enemy.

True, there's a neo-Marxist Party where the American left used to be

 

[Correll]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

he could never had imagined the rotherham rape ring.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

he could never had imagined the rotherham rape ring.

I dont think any of us could Frank. Nor the church corrupting kids or a pussy grabbing Pres. We live in different times.

 

[Correll]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

he could never had imagined the rotherham rape ring.

I dont think any of us could Frank. Nor the church corrupting kids or a pussy grabbing Pres. We live in different times.

you truly try to pretend that a president having consensual sex is equal to a government permitted slave ring that raped, literally thousands of your white children?

you are fucking insane. and utterly evil.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

Orwell was an optimist. Most socialists are optimists.

LOL! Yeah Orwell was a "Socialist" LOL

And 1984 was very uplifting

Good Job, Chap!

I'll tell the mods someone hacked your account to make you look like a lunatic

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

he could never had imagined the rotherham rape ring.

I dont think any of us could Frank. Nor the church corrupting kids or a pussy grabbing Pres. We live in different times.

NAMBLA and the Communists made a concerted effort to destroy the Catholics Church and they finally succeeded in getting a legitimate Anti-Pope as Pope.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Three posters with nothing to say about the subject. I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance. Its like you revel in your right to not know.

Glad we threw your sorry asses out............Britain used to be the shit..........stood alone in WWII against Hitler............now they listen to idiots like you.........Social Justice Warriors saying WE SUCK just like the left here...........perhaps we can take the English whose Back bone hasn't been removed yet ....and trade you for these nutbag PROGS here.............

That would be swell.

Looking at the shell of GB today, Orwell was an optimist

Orwell was an optimist. Most socialists are optimists.

LOL! Yeah Orwell was a "Socialist" LOL

And 1984 was very uplifting

Good Job, Chap!

I'll tell the mods someone hacked your account to make you look like a lunatic

Orwell was a socialist who fought against the fascist trash in the Civil War. Did you not know that ?

 

[Bob Blaylock]

I wonder why you bother to display your ignorance.

You seem intent on perpetuating lies. Why are you so afraid to accept the truth ?

 

[Bob Blaylock]

You really havent read my post.

We did read your post. It was bullshit, just like everything else that you ever post.