Zone1 Christian Zionism

[alang1216]

The indigenous people were Jews who lived there3000 years before Islam existed.

As I understand it, a number of nomadic tribes, Hebrews, settled in parts of Palestine back then. They were almost certainly pagan and very unlike the Jews of today. There were already peoples living there that coexisted them, peacefully and/or not peacefully. The religion of Islam has held sway over Palestine for almost 1,400 years, probably as long as the Hebrews held sway.

 

[alang1216]

I just proved you wrong again......get lost.

You're so Trumpian. Declare victory and move on, regardless of the facts.

 

[Hafar1014]

As I understand it, a number of nomadic tribes, Hebrews, settled in parts of Palestine back then. They were almost certainly pagan and very unlike the Jews of today. There were already peoples living there that coexisted them, peacefully and/or not peacefully. The religion of Islam has held sway over Palestine for almost 1,400 years, probably as long as the Hebrews held sway.

Thats long before 5000 years ago. Rome controlled the land called Judea and Samara. There never was nation called Palestine. The Romans invented that name for the region

 

[Dogmaphobe]

The original Zionist movement was a secular one and involved self-determination for Jewish people.

Jews are an ethnicity, and don't all follow Judaism as a religion in any particular manner. In fact, 40% of Israeli Jews do not believe in God. They are certainly Zionist, though, since all people who believe in Jewish self-determination are Zionist by definition.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

There was constant mixing of people so Jews and Arabs have ALWAYS lived side by side.

.......With Jews having to live as second-class citizens with sharply curtailed rights wherever Islam prevailed due to the supremacist nature of Islam.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Jesus said Judaism and Christianity are the same tradition? Where?

Christianity wasn't even a tradition during Christ's ministry.

The Decalogue? Yes, Jewish custom.

Jesus was born a Jew, died a Jew and never denied his lineage.

Matthew 5:18, the eighteenth verse of the fifth chapter of the Gospel of Matthew in the New Testament and is part of the Sermon on the Mount. Jesus has just reported that he came not to destroy the law, but fulfil it. In this verse this claim is reinforced.

Matthew 5:17–18 is a key text for interpreting the Sermon on the Mount and the entire gospel of Matthew:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.

Here Jesus says that not one iota (jot) or dot (tittle) will pass away from the law. These most likely refer to the smallest strokes of the Hebrew alphabet, indicating that the Old Testament is completely trustworthy, even to the smallest detail. This is consistent with Jesus’ attitude elsewhere. Never do we find Jesus disagreeing with Scripture.




There is a single religion based on the Ten Commandments......the Judeo-Christian faith.




Clearly Jesus said the very opposite of what you say.


Why is that?

 

[PoliticalChic]

Thats long before 5000 years ago. Rome controlled the land called Judea and Samara. There never was nation called Palestine. The Romans invented that name for the region

In a 2017 speech during his visit to settlements in the occupied West Bank, (Huckabee) said:

There are certain words I refuse to use. There is no such thing as a “West Bank.” It’s Judea and Samaria. There’s no such thing as a “settlement.” They’re communities. They’re neighborhoods. They’re cities. There’s no such thing as an “occupation.”

Christian Zionism Is on the March

Mike Huckabee began his confirmation hearings to become Donald Trump’s ambassador to Israel this week. He has a long history of close association with the Christian Zionist movement and its degradation of Palestinian lives.

jacobin.com

 

[PoliticalChic]

You're so Trumpian. Declare victory and move on, regardless of the facts.

I provided facts, you parrot the propagana from your masters.

As usual.

 

[Hafar1014]

Jesus was born a Jew, died a Jew and never denied his lineage.

Matthew 5:18, the eighteenth verse of the fifth chapter of the Gospel of Matthew in the New Testament and is part of the Sermon on the Mount. Jesus has just reported that he came not to destroy the law, but fulfil it. In this verse this claim is reinforced.

Matthew 5:17–18 is a key text for interpreting the Sermon on the Mount and the entire gospel of Matthew:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.

Here Jesus says that not one iota (jot) or dot (tittle) will pass away from the law. These most likely refer to the smallest strokes of the Hebrew alphabet, indicating that the Old Testament is completely trustworthy, even to the smallest detail. This is consistent with Jesus’ attitude elsewhere. Never do we find Jesus disagreeing with Scripture.




There is a single religion based on the Ten Commandments......the Judeo-Christian faith.




Clearly Jesus said the very opposite of what you say.


Why is that?

Christianity and Judaism are very different. It begins by the Christian distortion of Genesis. There is no devil hell Fall of man or original sin in Genesis.

This was created to use as a threat to force people to be obedient.

The message in Genesis is God gave Adam morals and free will so he could choose to come to God. Not be forced by threats of hell and eternal damnation.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Christianity and Judaism are very different. It begins by the Christian distortion of Genesis. There is no devil hell Fall of man or original sin in Genesis.

This was created to use as a threat to force people to be obedient.

The message in Genesis is God gave Adam morals and free will so he could choose to come to God. Not be forced by threats of hell and eternal damnation.

Same Geneis based on God.
Same 10 Commandments
Same morality
Messiah of the New Testament bows to the Old Testament

Same religion.

 

[PoliticalChic]

"...rhetoric is rooted in the broader movement of Christian Zionism, which includes organizations like Christians United for Israel (CUFI), a group with close ties to Huckabee. CUFI was founded by pastor John Hagee, one of the most powerful televangelists in America, in 2006. Today it boasts over ten million members and a well-oiled political machine that it uses to influence US policy and politicians on many issues, but Israel is front and center.



Under Donald Trump, CUFI made major strides, taking credit for several of the first Trump administration’s hawkish projects including Israel’s annexation of the Golan Heights, moving the US embassy to Jerusalem, and cutting aid to UNRWA, the United Nations body tasked with serving Palestinian refugees."

Christian Zionism Is on the March

Mike Huckabee began his confirmation hearings to become Donald Trump’s ambassador to Israel this week. He has a long history of close association with the Christian Zionist movement and its degradation of Palestinian lives.

jacobin.com

 

[norwegen]

The original Zionist movement was a secular one and involved self-determination for Jewish people.

Jews are an ethnicity, and don't all follow Judaism as a religion in any particular manner. In fact, 40% of Israeli Jews do not believe in God. They are certainly Zionist, though, since all people who believe in Jewish self-determination are Zionist by definition.

Just to be sure, this thread isn't about Zionism. It's about Christian Zionism.

 

[norwegen]

Jesus was born a Jew, died a Jew and never denied his lineage.

Matthew 5:18, the eighteenth verse of the fifth chapter of the Gospel of Matthew in the New Testament and is part of the Sermon on the Mount. Jesus has just reported that he came not to destroy the law, but fulfil it. In this verse this claim is reinforced.

Matthew 5:17–18 is a key text for interpreting the Sermon on the Mount and the entire gospel of Matthew:

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.

Here Jesus says that not one iota (jot) or dot (tittle) will pass away from the law. These most likely refer to the smallest strokes of the Hebrew alphabet, indicating that the Old Testament is completely trustworthy, even to the smallest detail. This is consistent with Jesus’ attitude elsewhere. Never do we find Jesus disagreeing with Scripture.




There is a single religion based on the Ten Commandments......the Judeo-Christian faith.




Clearly Jesus said the very opposite of what you say.


Why is that?

I've been over this already.

 

[ding]

I recognize the fact of evolution but that doesn't mean I necessarily appreciate it or approve of the results of it in every case.


Just because I don't believe in absolutes of good or evil doesn't mean I don't have my personal values of what is good and what is evil.

There it is. You have preferences. Preferences can change.

You really have no leg to stand on to keep making moral arguments. The fact that you can't stop yourself from doing so ought to give you pause for concern. I doubt that it will just as I doubt you will ever stop making moral arguments like you did in this thread.

 

[PoliticalChic]

I've been over this already.

I believe you have missed its message.

Do you have some bias with respect to Jews?

If so, why?

 

[norwegen]

I believe you have missed its message.

Do you have some bias with respect to Jews?

If so, why?

Why would you think that? I've never said anything disparaging about Jews. Certainly not about post-bar Kokhba Jews.

Anything about biblical Jews that sounds disparaging isn't me; it's the Bible. Don't shoot the messenger.

 

[alang1216]

Thats long before 5000 years ago. Rome controlled the land called Judea and Samara. There never was nation called Palestine. The Romans invented that name for the region

Your history is wrong. Hebrew tribes began entering the Canaanite highlands, what I called Palestine, the area later known as Israel, around 1200 BCE, evolving from local Canaanite groups, with the earliest non-biblical mention of "Israel" appearing on the Egyptian Merneptah Stele around 1208 BCE, marking their emergence as distinct, though still Canaanite, people before unified kingdoms formed centuries later.

 

[Hafar1014]

Your history is wrong. Hebrew tribes began entering the Canaanite highlands, what I called Palestine, the area later known as Israel, around 1200 BCE, evolving from local Canaanite groups, with the earliest non-biblical mention of "Israel" appearing on the Egyptian Merneptah Stele around 1208 BCE, marking their emergence as distinct, though still Canaanite, people before unified kingdoms formed centuries later.

The Jewish year is 5780

 

[alang1216]

.......With Jews having to live as second-class citizens with sharply curtailed rights wherever Islam prevailed due to the supremacist nature of Islam.

Which religion has gained political power and NOT treated other religions as second-class citizens with sharply curtailed rights? (Don't judge Christianity only by the last century.)

 

[alang1216]

The Jewish year is 5780

The Jewish calendar counts the years from the creation of the world (according to Jewish tradition), therefore the year according the Jewish calendar, is 5783.