CDZ Charity is a failure of government - Discuss

[JoeB131]

The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.

Guy, we've been over this... the UK counts violent crime differently than the US... Any unwanted touching is considered sexual assault (as opposed to the US, where you have to penetrate someone to be charged with it.) and every pub fight is counted as an assault.

Apples and oranges.

The ONLY quanitifable that can't really be disputed is murder. We have 19,000 of them, they have 600.

 

[JoeB131]

It is endlessly amusing to hear someone spout about it being easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to get into heaven. Really? How about the thief. Where does it say blessed is the thief who steals from the rich? There is nothing in the Bible advocating theft. There is nothing noble about stealing. In order for the government to dispense charity it must first steal it from the productive. Steal as it taking it from those who are unwilling to give it. Leave charity to the charitable.

Robin Hood did not steal from the rich to give to the poor. He stole from the King's tax collectors. He took taxes and gave them back to the tax payers.

Robin Hood, like Jesus, never existed.

 

[JoeB131]

It does need to be noted that none of them went to jail because Obama refused to hold any of them accountable despite his promise to do so.

Yes, Yes, Comrade Supreme Leader Bernie would have held People's Tribunals for the Great Glory of the Socialist State....

 

[JoeB131]

"Hey guys I'm Jewish and were Gods chosen people so fuck you!"

You weren't chosen for a reason.

When God let's half of you get turned into Lampshades and Bars of Soap, he's just not that into you.

Or he doesn't exist.

 

[JoeB131]

The Bible teaches that charity should come from the heart, family and church. Nothing about giving your money to a Roman bureaucrat to dole it out for you.

Actually, Jesus was pretty clear... "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's" Caesar's picture was on the coins. You give him his coins back when he asks for them. Render unto Washington what is Washington's, he'd say today.

 

[there4eyeM]

That social agencies connected to government have to take care of such things is rather the failure of religious and other institutions to do so. Some things need doing and, though rightly ought to be done 'privately', must have assistance for the general welfare.

 

[there4eyeM]

Tory DWP chief says food banks are 'perfect way' to help the poor

The Tory Minister made the controversial comment replying to a question from Labour MP Zarah Sultana

www.mirror.co.uk

In this story the tory minister is praising the efforts of foodbanks in helping folk to not starve.

But we pay taxes to live in a society where people are not going to starve. People should not be at the mercy of charity to put some food on the table.

Everybody pays taxes so they have a right to expect help when they go through bad times. Welfare has a dignity that charity has not got. It is time to move on from Victorian era social policy.

The government is incompetent, and never does anything well or even adequately.......they have no investment in doing things well....no matter how badly they do things, the bureaucrats always have their jobs, the tax money keeps coming in and no one holds them accountable for their screw ups........that is the the problem with those who support bigger and bigger government...they can't see that simple truth.

Guess we were lucky that private enterprise stepped in and beat the Empire of Japan and Nazi Germany.

 

[fncceo]

"Hey guys I'm Jewish and were Gods chosen people so fuck you!"

You weren't chosen for a reason.

When God let's half of you get turned into Lampshades and Bars of Soap, he's just not that into you.

Or he doesn't exist.

G-d didn't do that, people did. Where are those people today?

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.

Guy, we've been over this... the UK counts violent crime differently than the US... Any unwanted touching is considered sexual assault (as opposed to the US, where you have to penetrate someone to be charged with it.) and every pub fight is counted as an assault.

Apples and oranges.

The ONLY quanitifable that can't really be disputed is murder. We have 19,000 of them, they have 600.

The article he is quoting has been debunked. If you check out the source it actually says conservative party. They produced it to attack the labour government at the time. It wasnt true 10 years ago and it isnt true now.

 

[2aguy]

The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.

Guy, we've been over this... the UK counts violent crime differently than the US... Any unwanted touching is considered sexual assault (as opposed to the US, where you have to penetrate someone to be charged with it.) and every pub fight is counted as an assault.

Apples and oranges.

The ONLY quanitifable that can't really be disputed is murder. We have 19,000 of them, they have 600.

Wrong.......from politifact...apples to apples comparison...

For England and Wales, we added together three crime categories: "violence against the person, with injury," "most serious sexual crime," and "robbery." This produced a rate of 775 violent crimes per 100,000 people.

For the United States, we used the FBI’s four standard categories for violent crime that Bier cited. We came up with a rate of 383 violent crimes per 100,000 people.

Social media post says U.K. has far higher violent crime rate than U.S. does

The debate over gun policy has inspired a blizzard of messages on social media, from both supporters and opponents of gu

www.politifact.com

 

[2aguy]

The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.

Guy, we've been over this... the UK counts violent crime differently than the US... Any unwanted touching is considered sexual assault (as opposed to the US, where you have to penetrate someone to be charged with it.) and every pub fight is counted as an assault.

Apples and oranges.

The ONLY quanitifable that can't really be disputed is murder. We have 19,000 of them, they have 600.

The article he is quoting has been debunked. If you check out the source it actually says conservative party. They produced it to attack the labour government at the time. It wasnt true 10 years ago and it isnt true now.

From politifact, comparing apples to apples....

For England and Wales, we added together three crime categories: "violence against the person, with injury," "most serious sexual crime," and "robbery." This produced a rate of 775 violent crimes per 100,000 people.

For the United States, we used the FBI’s four standard categories for violent crime that Bier cited. We came up with a rate of 383 violent crimes per 100,000 people.

Social media post says U.K. has far higher violent crime rate than U.S. does

The debate over gun policy has inspired a blizzard of messages on social media, from both supporters and opponents of gu

www.politifact.com

 

[2aguy]

Tory DWP chief says food banks are 'perfect way' to help the poor

The Tory Minister made the controversial comment replying to a question from Labour MP Zarah Sultana

www.mirror.co.uk

In this story the tory minister is praising the efforts of foodbanks in helping folk to not starve.

But we pay taxes to live in a society where people are not going to starve. People should not be at the mercy of charity to put some food on the table.

Everybody pays taxes so they have a right to expect help when they go through bad times. Welfare has a dignity that charity has not got. It is time to move on from Victorian era social policy.

The government is incompetent, and never does anything well or even adequately.......they have no investment in doing things well....no matter how badly they do things, the bureaucrats always have their jobs, the tax money keeps coming in and no one holds them accountable for their screw ups........that is the the problem with those who support bigger and bigger government...they can't see that simple truth.

Guess we were lucky that private enterprise stepped in and beat the Empire of Japan and Nazi Germany.

Yes....they did....private business leaders created the infrastructure and manufacturing base we needed to not only supply our troops but Britain and Russia as well.......

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.

Guy, we've been over this... the UK counts violent crime differently than the US... Any unwanted touching is considered sexual assault (as opposed to the US, where you have to penetrate someone to be charged with it.) and every pub fight is counted as an assault.

Apples and oranges.

The ONLY quanitifable that can't really be disputed is murder. We have 19,000 of them, they have 600.

The article he is quoting has been debunked. If you check out the source it actually says conservative party. They produced it to attack the labour government at the time. It wasnt true 10 years ago and it isnt true now.

From politifact, comparing apples to apples....

For England and Wales, we added together three crime categories: "violence against the person, with injury," "most serious sexual crime," and "robbery." This produced a rate of 775 violent crimes per 100,000 people.

For the United States, we used the FBI’s four standard categories for violent crime that Bier cited. We came up with a rate of 383 violent crimes per 100,000 people.

Social media post says U.K. has far higher violent crime rate than U.S. does

The debate over gun policy has inspired a blizzard of messages on social media, from both supporters and opponents of gu

www.politifact.com

Lol.

Our ruling
The meme said "there are over 2,000 crimes recorded per 100,000 population in the U.K.," compared to "466 violent crimes per 100,000" in the United States. Our preliminary attempt to make an apples-to-apples comparison shows a much smaller difference in violent crime rates between the two countries, but criminologists say differences in how the statistics are collected make it impossible to produce a truly valid comparison. We rate the claim False.

Dear me, your own link states that its bollox. Did you read it ?

 

[beautress]

Tory DWP chief says food banks are 'perfect way' to help the poor

The Tory Minister made the controversial comment replying to a question from Labour MP Zarah Sultana

www.mirror.co.uk

In this story the tory minister is praising the efforts of foodbanks in helping folk to not starve.

But we pay taxes to live in a society where people are not going to starve. People should not be at the mercy of charity to put some food on the table.

Everybody pays taxes so they have a right to expect help when they go through bad times. Welfare has a dignity that charity has not got. It is time to move on from Victorian era social policy.

You'd be surprised to know that drug problems can tear up a family with a deadbeat dad and a single mom with 4 little children, one of whom chants gibberish all day long at age 8, and has to be monitored like a 2 year old to prevent her from harming herself and other siblings. I bought 4 sweaters and 4 winter coats for the 4 kids whose mother helps me two days a week because she is tied down with them while her drugged out man takes occasional jobs at minimum wage so he can spend their rent money on drugs. The gibberish daughter is not allowed to go to school with her gibbertalk issues. Its prayer time for that family. Later, loves...

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The Irish Potato Famine proved that charity is not adequate to save a starving population.
1 million men, women and children died from starvation and related disease. Another 1 million would have faced the same fate but fled the country. Under such circumstances, only national governments have the resources and logistics to alleviate such a problem but historically have failed.

The IPF and the abject poverty, disease and scarcity of jobs during the Great Depression of the 1930s in Britain were two of the many influences that caused the Labour Government under Clement Atlee to introduce the Welfare State by 1948.-

"The wartime coalition , and the introduction of family allowances.[11] Many people welcomed this government intervention and wanted it to go further.[5]

The Beveridge Report of 1942, (which identified five "Giant Evils" in society: squalor, ignorance, want, idleness and disease) essentially recommended a national, compulsory, flat rate insurance scheme which would combine health care, unemployment and retirement benefits. Beveridge himself was careful to emphasise that unemployment benefits should be held to a subsistence level, and after six months would be conditional on work or training, so as not to encourage abuse of the system.[12] That was however predicated on the concept of the "maintenance of employment" which meant ‘it should be possible to make unemployment of any individual for more than 26 weeks continuously a rare thing in normal times’ [12] and recognised that the imposition of a training condition would be impractical if the unemployed were numbered by the million.[12] After its victory in the 1945 general election, the Labour Party pledged to eradicate the Giant Evils, and undertook policy measures to provide for the people of the United Kingdom "from the cradle to the grave."

"Included among the laws passed were the National Assistance Act 1948, National Insurance Act 1946, and National Insurance (Industrial Injuries) Act 1946". Wikipedia.

Today the Welfare State and in particular the National Health Service is generally acknowledged by all political parties and the British public as the UK's greatest asset.

Had such a system been in place in Ireland in the mid 19 century, a million lives would have been saved and a million would never have had to flee.

Our American friends see poverty as a sin and therefore poor folk should be punished not helped. They have this mortal fear that they may be helping somebody who is lazy and unworthy. Its very much a Daily Mail perspective.

 

[JoeB131]

G-d didn't do that, people did. Where are those people today?

I agree. God didn't to that. He also didn't prevent it. Because he was too busy "Not Existing".

 

[JoeB131]

You'd be surprised to know that drug problems can tear up a family with a deadbeat dad and a single mom with 4 little children, one of whom chants gibberish all day long at age 8, and has to be monitored like a 2 year old to prevent her from harming herself and other siblings. I bought 4 sweaters and 4 winter coats for the 4 kids whose mother helps me two days a week because she is tied down with them while her drugged out man takes occasional jobs at minimum wage so he can spend their rent money on drugs. The gibberish daughter is not allowed to go to school with her gibbertalk issues. Its prayer time for that family. Later, loves...

Maybe instead of praying to an Imaginary Sky Pixie, you could do something useful.

The 8 year old sounds like she has severe developmental disabilities... she probably needs professional help, not prayer.

The man in that situation needs rehabilitation... That's what he'd get if he were a rich white drug addict like Rush Limbaugh, Cindy McCain or Hunter Biden (see, I'm being non-partisan there, and listing all sides with this issue).

 

[Oz and the Orchestra]

When people are helped through charity, they often know or come to understand what they received was made by the willing sacrifices of others. In turn they are more likely to preform acts of charity or make sacrifices of their own to helps others.

I grew up in the very worst kind of poverty you could possibly imagine. From time to time people thought they were helping out. The government wasn't in the welfare business in those days. Individuals gave us food, sometimes money, sometimes even a place to stay. By the time I was ten years old I had grown to despise these self righteous do gooders. Our family problem wasn't poverty. The problem was that poverty wasn't painful enough. When poverty hurts so much that you will do anything to alleviate that poverty the poverty will end. The charitable made sure we stayed in that kind of poverty.

As a child of abject poverty and homelessness, rather than be more likely to perform acts of charity to others I would not help someone bleeding in the street if I had the very last bandaid on earth.

Thanks for sharing your experience growing up.

I think it often comes down to people being self-motivated and disciplined while utilizing help from others as a way to improve their situation.

The Grapes of Wrath.

You have lived in the post-WWll USA, The wealthiest country in the world, and poverty is still a blight on your society.
It was only after FDR New Deal and the profits made from arms manufacture that delivered the US from mass unemployment. Go back to the thirties and folk having to leave their homes and travel to California as in "The Grapes of Wrath" to try and find work and a future and of course finding things no better there.
People don't, in general, refuse to work as you try to make out, sometimes circumstances - No available employment.
Family breakup, Mental Health issues put them in that position. If they have paid tax while they were working then that should provide insurance for if they fall on hard times.
The problem in the US is your taxes are too low especially for the rich to fund a welfare state.
You should look at the taxes people in some Scandanavian countries pay.
Your "I'm all right jack" attitude is not just anti-social it is anti-Christian.

 

[fncceo]

G-d didn't do that, people did. Where are those people today?

I agree. God didn't to that. He also didn't prevent it. Because he was too busy "Not Existing".

"There are more things in heaven and Earth, Horatio, / Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

-- Hamlet

 

[fncceo]

Your "I'm all right jack" attitude is not just anti-social it is anti-Christian.

I'm not a xtian.