Census finds record gap between Rich and Poor

[Bern80]

Oh I see what you are talking about...

Based on your response below, clearly you don't.

Instead we should just widen the gap between the working class and the super wealthy.

So the best way to keep the gap from widening is tax the rich more? What does how much people are taxed have to do with the widening gap? Absolutely NOTHING. You couldn't close the gap by having the poor not pay taxes at all, so you think what is best for society is to take more money from the rich?

It all comes down to a complex economic principle called "trickle down" and "Supply side" that we were sold on 30 years ago. We restructured our tax structure to encourage more investment in our economy and a trickle down of wealth

Never happened.........I WANT MY MONEY BACK

What money?

 

[georgephillip]

I didn't realize you were in favor of a flat tax.

Ohhh wait... you're talking about stealing everything from them. yeah, that's even MORE fair! How about after we rob em blind we shoot em too so they won't tell on us?

No

I'm talking about differentiating between the super rich and the upper middle class. The Republicans succeeded in lumping those who make $250 K per year with those who make $250 million a year. That way, they protect the super wealthy from tax increases.

Time to go back to multiple indexed tax brackets that keep the wealthy from hiding

You lefties really miss the big picture. Have you never stopped to ask yourself why you argue so hard to give more money to a body that spends so inefficiently?

Lefties aren't necessarily talking about giving more to a government that can't (won't?) even keep track of defense spending.

We are talking about redistributing the tax burden.

For example, would you be in favor of eliminating ALL federal taxes on incomes below $20,000 a year by shifting that tax burden to those making more than a million/year?

How about a Financial Transaction Tax whose proceeds paid for higher education for all qualified US citizens?

 

[The T]

"Who are the top 0,01%? They are the top 10,000 income earners in the United States of America. If you THINK you are in the top 0.01%, you are not. People in the top 10,000 know only KNOW they are in the top 0.01% but they know where they rank as well.

"The median ANNUAL income of a person in the top 0.01% is $50,000,0000. They have $350,000,000 in assets and, since 1978, that is an increase of 550% - how have you done the past 30 years?"

Like Warren Buffett many of these elites pay taxes on capital gains and not on income.

BTW, the REALLY richest Americans (all 400 of them) have an average annual income about equal to the 0.01%ers' asset holdings.

Maybe we should open the next front in the class war at the top quintile of the richest 1%?

America is 234

Maybe we should stop having them pay taxes at the same rate as someone who makes $250K

I didn't realize you were in favor of a flat tax.

Ohhh wait... you're talking about stealing everything from them. yeah, that's even MORE fair! How about after we rob em blind we shoot em too so they won't tell on us?

Of course...RW didn't think as is his usual course. But then he's a Government worker, and therefore privelidged to other people's money.

 

[The T]

Maybe we should stop having them pay taxes at the same rate as someone who makes $250K

I didn't realize you were in favor of a flat tax.

Ohhh wait... you're talking about stealing everything from them. yeah, that's even MORE fair! How about after we rob em blind we shoot em too so they won't tell on us?

No

I'm talking about differentiating between the super rich and the upper middle class. The Republicans succeeded in lumping those who make $250 K per year with those who make $250 million a year. That way, they protect the super wealthy from tax increases.

Time to go back to multiple indexed tax brackets that keep the wealthy from hiding

In other words? RW is a Class Warfare whore that thinks Government has the RIGHT to dictate whom gets what. Free market...is a non-entity...Government all the way, eh, RW?

 

[8537]

Thanks for that rare breed: A civil and well-considered discussion on a political forum

Oh. I disagree. I think Luck is far under-rated, included the luck of where you were born and the circumstances surrounding that.

Yes that's true. But how much does it have to do with the widening gap between rich and poor? Are more people being born in shittier places? Are more kids being born to shitty parents?

Not much it was just a relevant observation.

Certainly not just luck, but motivation? Nah. Many (if not most) of them are more self motivated than I. They just either aren't as motivated by money or that motivation hasn't led to higher incomes. It happens.

That's true of a lot of people that aren't wealthy. For some enough is enough. It isn't that they wouldn't like more money. It's that apparently they are comfortable enough to not pursue more. You must have employees or at least co-workers that make less than you. What is holding them back from attaining the wealth you have? Among my co-workers I can tell you what it is; apathy. Some speak of wealth like attaining it for themselves simply isn't possible. The only walls that I see in the way are the excuses people make. None of us make more than $15.00/hr. Do any of us have a good excuse to blame on someone else that we aren't wealthier? No. If you asked that question of people the only barriers you will see are the one's they build themselves. [/quote]

well, it's probably a mix of apathy and people being content with what they have - understanding that they're are happier with the current balance of work, life and income than they would be if they aimed for a higher income category.

But to use this to explain the widening gap, you would need an explanation of why that ideal was a rare breed among the middle class for 40 years and quite abruptly turned around in the late 1970's and early 1980s.

And why didn't other people do that? Was it impossible for them to go to grad school to learn more? "Be the change you want to see in your life."

well, they could have done it. but it was certainly a far easier choice for me than most - the opportunity cost of me going to grad school was quite low while most of my friends would have had to give up better paying jobs while trying to raise families etc...

and I love that quote.

 

[Cuyo]

I didn't realize you were in favor of a flat tax.

Ohhh wait... you're talking about stealing everything from them. yeah, that's even MORE fair! How about after we rob em blind we shoot em too so they won't tell on us?

No

I'm talking about differentiating between the super rich and the upper middle class. The Republicans succeeded in lumping those who make $250 K per year with those who make $250 million a year. That way, they protect the super wealthy from tax increases.

Time to go back to multiple indexed tax brackets that keep the wealthy from hiding

In other words? RW is a Class Warfare whore that thinks Government has the RIGHT to dictate whom gets what. Free market...is a non-entity...Government all the way, eh, RW?

Mark... Seriously man... Zoloft.

 

[The T]

No

I'm talking about differentiating between the super rich and the upper middle class. The Republicans succeeded in lumping those who make $250 K per year with those who make $250 million a year. That way, they protect the super wealthy from tax increases.

Time to go back to multiple indexed tax brackets that keep the wealthy from hiding

In other words? RW is a Class Warfare whore that thinks Government has the RIGHT to dictate whom gets what. Free market...is a non-entity...Government all the way, eh, RW?

Mark... Seriously man... Zoloft.

Cuyo? Seriously?

*Get a life*

 

[Cuyo]

In other words? RW is a Class Warfare whore that thinks Government has the RIGHT to dictate whom gets what. Free market...is a non-entity...Government all the way, eh, RW?

Mark... Seriously man... Zoloft.

Cuyo? Seriously?

*Get a life*

oooh that smarts.

You've hurt me deeply.

 

[The T]

Mark... Seriously man... Zoloft.

Cuyo? Seriously?

*Get a life*

oooh that smarts.

You've hurt me deeply.

NOT even close...

 

[Cuyo]

Cuyo? Seriously?

*Get a life*

oooh that smarts.

You've hurt me deeply.

NOT even close...

[neither leads, follows, nor goes away... simply stands and OBSTRUCTS...]

 

[The T]

oooh that smarts.

You've hurt me deeply.

NOT even close...

[neither leads, follows, nor goes away... simply stands and OBSTRUCTS...]

Whattever this means? [I don't even want to delve into your private little world]

 

[Big Fitz]

Maybe we should stop having them pay taxes at the same rate as someone who makes $250K

I didn't realize you were in favor of a flat tax.

Ohhh wait... you're talking about stealing everything from them. yeah, that's even MORE fair! How about after we rob em blind we shoot em too so they won't tell on us?

No

I'm talking about differentiating between the super rich and the upper middle class. The Republicans succeeded in lumping those who make $250 K per year with those who make $250 million a year. That way, they protect the super wealthy from tax increases.

Time to go back to multiple indexed tax brackets that keep the wealthy from hiding

You want to go after the truely rich? Fine. Tax wealth.

You'll never get it passed because they're smart enough to keep what is theirs out of your grubby little reach. That's why the super-rich never care about income tax. They don't have an income persay. They've evolved beyond that.

Of course, realize they supply the funds for pretty much every job in the world, so yeah, go after their wealth and see how fast they slit your throat, cutting their losses.

Then again, you are also violating the very concept of ownership and personal property. Is this what you really believe? If so, I'll be taking your money now please.

 

[rightwinger]

I didn't realize you were in favor of a flat tax.

Ohhh wait... you're talking about stealing everything from them. yeah, that's even MORE fair! How about after we rob em blind we shoot em too so they won't tell on us?

No

I'm talking about differentiating between the super rich and the upper middle class. The Republicans succeeded in lumping those who make $250 K per year with those who make $250 million a year. That way, they protect the super wealthy from tax increases.

Time to go back to multiple indexed tax brackets that keep the wealthy from hiding

In other words? RW is a Class Warfare whore that thinks Government has the RIGHT to dictate whom gets what. Free market...is a non-entity...Government all the way, eh, RW?

What the fuck are you talking about?

Typical rightwing hysteria about how trying to go back to a tax structure that successfully worked ten years ago "destroys the free market" and causes "class warfare"
We borrowed money to pay for the Bush tax cuts.....added debt to pay for the Reagan tax cuts.
All for the promise of trickle down wealth and prosperity which was an empty promise. The earnings of the working class has been frozen all so the wealthiest Americans can amass more fortune

 

[Big Fitz]

And if the Federal Reserve is the central hub of insider trading on Wall Street...?

Then criminal investigations and prosecutions should begin and leave no stone unturned regardless of office or wealth. I am for everyone living under the same laws. I don't do special rights.

Your point about regulators is another good one.

Punishment for corrupt watchdogs should be more severe than that of the criminals. You cannot afford permissiveness in this.

Wall Street owns Republicans AND Democrats from Maine to Maui.

No. The DNC has been taken over by the revolutionaries who are trying to rob wall street. It's possible this could end that party in the next 3 elections if they can't succeed in creating a fascist state by then enslaving wall street. But if they fail it, the dems are done for, because wall street will never trust them again.

But that aside, that's why you want 100% transparent money reporting for all politics.

 

[The T]

And if the Federal Reserve is the central hub of insider trading on Wall Street...?

Then criminal investigations and prosecutions should begin and leave no stone unturned regardless of office or wealth. I am for everyone living under the same laws. I don't do special rights.

Your point about regulators is another good one.

Punishment for corrupt watchdogs should be more severe than that of the criminals. You cannot afford permissiveness in this.

Wall Street owns Republicans AND Democrats from Maine to Maui.

No. The DNC has been taken over by the revolutionaries who are trying to rob wall street. It's possible this could end that party in the next 3 elections if they can't succeed in creating a fascist state by then enslaving wall street. But if they fail it, the dems are done for, because wall street will never trust them again.

But that aside, that's why you want 100% transparent money reporting for all politics.

Is the Fed Pumping Up the Market?


Fool.com: Is Fed Buying Behind the Stock Rally?
• ZeroHedge: Fed Injects Record $5 Billion Into Stock Market With Today's POMO

 

[The T]

The FEDERAL RESERVE was something the Founders didn't want to see...they warned against it...because the damage they could do...

THOMAS JEFFERSON WARNED AGAINST A PUBLIC CENTRAL BANK

And we see how it is being used...To prop up Political figures.

-DANGER WILL ROBINSON...DANGER-

Odd that the "Party of the People" that professes so much to mirror Jefferson....Are haunted and BIT by his image.

The Modern Democrats [Progressives] have ZERO claim to Jefferson, or for that matter ANY of the Founders.

 

[georgephillip]

And if the Federal Reserve is the central hub of insider trading on Wall Street...?

Then criminal investigations and prosecutions should begin and leave no stone unturned regardless of office or wealth. I am for everyone living under the same laws. I don't do special rights.

Your point about regulators is another good one.

Punishment for corrupt watchdogs should be more severe than that of the criminals. You cannot afford permissiveness in this.

Wall Street owns Republicans AND Democrats from Maine to Maui.

No. The DNC has been taken over by the revolutionaries who are trying to rob wall street. It's possible this could end that party in the next 3 elections if they can't succeed in creating a fascist state by then enslaving wall street. But if they fail it, the dems are done for, because wall street will never trust them again.

But that aside, that's why you want 100% transparent money reporting for all politics.

Why haven't the revolutionaries in the DNC turned Eliot Spitzger loose on Wall Street? About 1500 bankers went to prison after the Savings and Loan scandal -- so far not a single banker has even been charged with securities fraud from our latest Wall Street crime wave.

Republicans AND Democrats need Wall Street every day.

They need voters every two to six years.

FLUSH the DC TOILET of ALL incumbents on November 2nd.

Fire another shot heard 'round the world.

 

[Big Fitz]

Thank you for the argument proving the need for term limits and caps in governemnt service.

 

[georgephillip]

The FEDERAL RESERVE was something the Founders didn't want to see...they warned against it...because the damage they could do...

THOMAS JEFFERSON WARNED AGAINST A PUBLIC CENTRAL BANK

And we see how it is being used...To prop up Political figures.

-DANGER WILL ROBINSON...DANGER-

Odd that the "Party of the People" that professes so much to mirror Jefferson....Are haunted and BIT by his image.

The Modern Democrats [Progressives] have ZERO claim to Jefferson, or for that matter ANY of the Founders.

Jefferson saw the corporations that would grow up around a central bank very clearly, and, as someone who has recently spent 14 months living on the streets, his warning about Americans someday waking up homeless on the continent their forefathers conquered seems very real to me.

 

[georgephillip]

Thank you for the argument proving the need for term limits and caps in governemnt service.

You will find it much easier to get term limits if you break the Republican/Democrat stranglehold on DC politics.

I think both parties have outlived any usefulness they ever had for 90% of Americans.