"Bishop" Romney Urged Single Mother to give up Baby

[Katzndogz]

Except that the Church isn't in the Medical Business for the good of humanity.

They are in the medical business to make money. And they get a lot of special tax breaks to do so, which I personally have no problem with.

But here's the thing, they should follow the same fair labor practices everyone else has to follow when conducting business... and that means providing proper coverage for their employees.

Birth control is cheap. The Catholic entities do provide proper coverage- They are free, by the their first amendment rights, to not provide a product that contradicts their religious beliefs- No one in forcing said employee to work for such an organization.

My problem is, that shouldn't be their call. Proper medical treatment should be determined by the doctor and the patient, not government, churches, insurance companies or employers.

Unless you want to do the breathtakingly rational thing and have single payer for the whole country...

Let's follow your rationale to its logical conclusion. No planned parenthood counselor should give abortion counseling to women. It shouldn't be their call. It should be determined by the doctor and the patient without third party counselors.

 

[koshergrl]

It's certainly their call if they want to provide it or not.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Sure it is.

What part of it isn't?

How is giving money the same as passing a law?

How is it prohibiting the exercise of religion?

You have to put up legislation to allow funding to take place. It isn't one guy opening up his wallet. And this isn't about the exercise of religion..this is about supporting one.

Funding medical care is not funding the establishment of religion.

 

[clevergirl]

So you have proof while a governor of MA he tried to rule that state as a theocracy?

The state-sponsored atheism crowd promote the lie that if you believe in God and state that publicly, then you support theocracy.

It's all part of their propaganda...

What bullshit.

Nazis were Christian.

By the way..you hold that most Americans are Christian, right?

Well how do you account for the nearly 600K Filipinos slaughtered, the nearly 3 million Koreans slaughtered and the nearly 4 million Vietnamese slaughtered?

Christian Charity?

You're an idiot- Nazi's were not Christians.

<snip> Christianity had declined severely in Germany at the time the Nazis came to power, which is why the Nazis were able to come to power. In his book, The Dictators, Richard Overy states that in the decades preceding the First World War Germany was becoming increasingly secular, and that after that war, from 1918 to 1931, 2.4 million Evangelical Christians formally renounced their faith as well as almost half a million Catholics. In Prussia, only 21% of the population took communion and in Hamburg only five percent of the population took communion. Before Hitler, German religious leaders were publicly condemning the rise of moral relativism and decline of traditional religious values.

Weimar Germany largely had abandoned Christianity and increasingly was embracing hedonism, Marxism and paganism. There, decline of Christianity in Germany led directly to the rise of Nazism. Professor Henri Lichtenberger in his 1937 book, The Third Reich, describes the religious life of the Weimar Republic as a place in which the large cities were "spiritual cemeteries" with almost no believers at all, except for those who were members of the clergy. <snip>

 

[koshergrl]

It was one person's opinion.

No one advocated any laws. What's the big deal.

How many other single mothers have been asked by people if they thought about adoption?

It happens every day and to pretend that because Romney said it the thought is somehow abhorrent is ludicrous.

There Are Up To 36 Couples Waiting For Every One Baby Placed For Adoption

Exactly.

How many social workers counsel young single mothers in a bad situation to consider putting the kid up for adoption?

I guess when a government employee does it it's OK but in a person does the same while acting as a representative of a church it's a bad thing.

Hypocrisy at its best.

It's okay when the government does it...ESPECIALLY when the government is able to encourage the young mother to get an abortion!
Cigars all around!

 

[The T]

It was one person's opinion.

No one advocated any laws. What's the big deal.

How many other single mothers have been asked by people if they thought about adoption?

It happens every day and to pretend that because Romney said it the thought is somehow abhorrent is ludicrous.

There Are Up To 36 Couples Waiting For Every One Baby Placed For Adoption

Exactly.

How many social workers counsel young single mothers in a bad situation to consider putting the kid up for adoption?

I guess when a government employee does it it's OK but in a person does the same while acting as a representative of a church it's a bad thing.

Hypocrisy at its best.

Religious people aren't allowed...they aren't qualified...and thier intent is in question...(according to Statists).

It's ludicrous. An issue that shouldn't be politicized...but is...and the children suffer as a result.

 

[Sallow]

How is giving money the same as passing a law?

How is it prohibiting the exercise of religion?

You have to put up legislation to allow funding to take place. It isn't one guy opening up his wallet. And this isn't about the exercise of religion..this is about supporting one.

Funding medical care is not funding the establishment of religion.

Oh for damn sure it is. Especially if the it's for profit.

 

[Cowman]

What a shame. That young baby could have had seven wives.

 

[Skull Pilot]

You have to put up legislation to allow funding to take place. It isn't one guy opening up his wallet. And this isn't about the exercise of religion..this is about supporting one.

Funding medical care is not funding the establishment of religion.

Oh for damn sure it is. Especially if the it's for profit.

Tell me have you filed suit against every single politician who said "God bless America" over a publicly owned microphone? How about a politician who says God Bless America over a publicly owned microphone on publicly owned property while being guarded by publicly funded secret service agents?

After all a law was passed to pay for the microphone the property and the agents.

 

[JoeB131]

Birth control is cheap. The Catholic entities do provide proper coverage- They are free, by the their first amendment rights, to not provide a product that contradicts their religious beliefs- No one in forcing said employee to work for such an organization.

My problem is, that shouldn't be their call. Proper medical treatment should be determined by the doctor and the patient, not government, churches, insurance companies or employers.

Unless you want to do the breathtakingly rational thing and have single payer for the whole country...

Let's follow your rationale to its logical conclusion. No planned parenthood counselor should give abortion counseling to women. It shouldn't be their call. It should be determined by the doctor and the patient without third party counselors.

Ummm, no, since PP is a medical institution... Sorry, man, that's argument fail right there.

Okay, make it simple for you... If you went in for cancer treatment, you wouldn't ask Bible Boy for his suggestion. WHich is probably a good thing, too. YOu'd go to a trained medical specialist...

Churches have no business sticking their noses in this stuff.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Sallow believes all poor sick children should die. That way he is superior over any religious institution. Or so that future poor parents will opt for abortion. We just can't have people thanking religious institutions for saving the lives of their children when some democratic schmuck should get the gratitude instead.

 

[JoeB131]

You're an idiot- Nazi's were not Christians.

<snip> Christianity had declined severely in Germany at the time the Nazis came to power, which is why the Nazis were able to come to power. In his book, The Dictators, Richard Overy states that in the decades preceding the First World War Germany was becoming increasingly secular, and that after that war, from 1918 to 1931, 2.4 million Evangelical Christians formally renounced their faith as well as almost half a million Catholics. In Prussia, only 21% of the population took communion and in Hamburg only five percent of the population took communion. Before Hitler, German religious leaders were publicly condemning the rise of moral relativism and decline of traditional religious values.

Weimar Germany largely had abandoned Christianity and increasingly was embracing hedonism, Marxism and paganism. There, decline of Christianity in Germany led directly to the rise of Nazism. Professor Henri Lichtenberger in his 1937 book, The Third Reich, describes the religious life of the Weimar Republic as a place in which the large cities were "spiritual cemeteries" with almost no believers at all, except for those who were members of the clergy. <snip>

OH MY GOD, IT'S THE NO TRUE SCOTSMAN FALLACY!

If Christianity was so in decline, the Nazis wouldn't have had to invoke so many Christian imagry and themes to take power.

"My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.

-Adolf Hitler, in a speech on 12 April 1922 (Norman H. Baynes, ed. The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, April 1922-August 1939, Vol. 1 of 2, pp. 19-20, Oxford University Press, 1942)

 

[Sallow]

The state-sponsored atheism crowd promote the lie that if you believe in God and state that publicly, then you support theocracy.

It's all part of their propaganda...

What bullshit.

Nazis were Christian.

By the way..you hold that most Americans are Christian, right?

Well how do you account for the nearly 600K Filipinos slaughtered, the nearly 3 million Koreans slaughtered and the nearly 4 million Vietnamese slaughtered?

Christian Charity?

You're an idiot- Nazi's were not Christians.

<snip> Christianity had declined severely in Germany at the time the Nazis came to power, which is why the Nazis were able to come to power. In his book, The Dictators, Richard Overy states that in the decades preceding the First World War Germany was becoming increasingly secular, and that after that war, from 1918 to 1931, 2.4 million Evangelical Christians formally renounced their faith as well as almost half a million Catholics. In Prussia, only 21% of the population took communion and in Hamburg only five percent of the population took communion. Before Hitler, German religious leaders were publicly condemning the rise of moral relativism and decline of traditional religious values.

Weimar Germany largely had abandoned Christianity and increasingly was embracing hedonism, Marxism and paganism. There, decline of Christianity in Germany led directly to the rise of Nazism. Professor Henri Lichtenberger in his 1937 book, The Third Reich, describes the religious life of the Weimar Republic as a place in which the large cities were "spiritual cemeteries" with almost no believers at all, except for those who were members of the clergy. <snip>

Oh bullshit.

You gloss over the pact between the Nazis and the Catholic Church signed by Pope Pius.

But heck..lets hear from the man himself.

I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 2

Even today I am not ashamed to say that, overpowered by stormy enthusiasm, I fell down on my knees and thanked Heaven from an overflowing heart for granting me the good fortune of being permitted to live at this time.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 5

Once again the songs of the fatherland roared to the heavens along the endless marching columns, and for the last time the Lord's grace smiled on His ungrateful children.

- Adolf Hitler reflecting on World War I, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1, Chapter 7

What we have to fight for is the necessary security for the existence and increase of our race and people, the subsistence of its children and the maintenance of our racial stock unmixed, the freedom and independence of the Fatherland; so that our people may be enabled to fulfill the mission assigned to it by the Creator.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 8

But if out of smugness, or even cowardice, this battle is not fought to its end, then take a look at the peoples five hundred years from now. I think you will find but few images of God, unless you want to profane the Almighty.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 10

Anyone who dares to lay hands on the highest image of the Lord commits sacrilege against the benevolent creator of this miracle and contributes to the expulsion from paradise.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf Vol. 2 Chapter 1

But all that I heard had the effect of arousing the strongest antagonism in me. Everything was disparaged--the nation, because it was held to be an invention of the 'capitalist' class (how often I had to listen to that phrase!); the Fatherland, because it was held to be an instrument in the hands of the bourgeoisie for the exploitation of' the working masses; the authority of the law, because that was a means of holding down the proletariat; religion, as a means of doping the people, so as to exploit them afterwards; morality, as a badge of stupid and sheepish docility. There was nothing that they did not drag in the mud.

- Adolf Hitler, on listening to Social Democrats, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 2

This human world of ours would be inconceivable without the practical existence of a religious belief. The great masses of a nation are not composed of philosophers. For the masses of the people, especially faith is absolutely the only basis of a moral outlook on life. The various substitutes that have been offered have not shown any results that might warrant us in thinking that they might usefully replace the existing denominations. ...There may be a few hundreds of thousands of superior men who can live wisely and intelligently without depending on the general standards that prevail in everyday life, but the millions of others cannot do so.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 1 Chapter 10

The fact that the Vatican is concluding a treaty with the new Germany means the acknowledgment of the National Socialist state by the Catholic Church. This treaty shows the whole world clearly and unequivocally that the assertion that National Socialism is hostile to religion is a lie.

- Adolf Hitler, speech to members of the Nazi Party on the Nazi-Vatican Concordant, July 22, 1933

By helping to lift the human being above the level of mere animal existence, Faith really contributes to consolidate and safeguard its own existence. Taking humanity as it exists to-day and taking into consideration the fact that the religious beliefs which it generally holds and which have been consolidated through our education, so that they serve as moral standards in practical life, if we should now abolish religious teaching and not replace it by anything of equal value the result would be that the foundations of human existence would be seriously shaken.

- Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, Vol. 2 Chapter 1

I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so.

- Adolf Hitler, to General Gerhard Engel, 1941

 

[JoeB131]

Sallow believes all poor sick children should die. That way he is superior over any religious institution. Or so that future poor parents will opt for abortion. We just can't have people thanking religious institutions for saving the lives of their children when some democratic schmuck should get the gratitude instead.

Wow, guy, you like totally distorted his viewpoint...

Good going there..

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

What a shame. That young baby could have had seven wives.

Thanks but no thanks. One was enough.

 

[Sallow]

Sallow believes all poor sick children should die. That way he is superior over any religious institution. Or so that future poor parents will opt for abortion. We just can't have people thanking religious institutions for saving the lives of their children when some democratic schmuck should get the gratitude instead.

No.

I believe in the Constitution.

You..apparently believe in a cherry picked version.

 

[The T]

What a shame. That young baby could have had seven wives.

Bigamy is illegal.

*Idiot*

 

[clevergirl]

You're an idiot- Nazi's were not Christians.

<snip> Christianity had declined severely in Germany at the time the Nazis came to power, which is why the Nazis were able to come to power. In his book, The Dictators, Richard Overy states that in the decades preceding the First World War Germany was becoming increasingly secular, and that after that war, from 1918 to 1931, 2.4 million Evangelical Christians formally renounced their faith as well as almost half a million Catholics. In Prussia, only 21% of the population took communion and in Hamburg only five percent of the population took communion. Before Hitler, German religious leaders were publicly condemning the rise of moral relativism and decline of traditional religious values.

Weimar Germany largely had abandoned Christianity and increasingly was embracing hedonism, Marxism and paganism. There, decline of Christianity in Germany led directly to the rise of Nazism. Professor Henri Lichtenberger in his 1937 book, The Third Reich, describes the religious life of the Weimar Republic as a place in which the large cities were "spiritual cemeteries" with almost no believers at all, except for those who were members of the clergy. <snip>

OH MY GOD, IT'S THE NO TRUE SCOTSMAN FALLACY!

If Christianity was so in decline, the Nazis wouldn't have had to invoke so many Christian imagry and themes to take power.

"My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.

-Adolf Hitler, in a speech on 12 April 1922 (Norman H. Baynes, ed. The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, April 1922-August 1939, Vol. 1 of 2, pp. 19-20, Oxford University Press, 1942)

Thank you for supporting my proposition!

OMG! Yes another PROOF that Hitler USED the name of Christ- not that he was a Christian.

 

[JoeB131]

What a shame. That young baby could have had seven wives.

Bigamy is illegal.

*Idiot*

But... but.... but... God Told Joseph Smith and Brigham Young it was acceptable...

And Romney's Grand dad fled to mexico so he wouldn't be limited to one wife.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Sallow believes all poor sick children should die. That way he is superior over any religious institution. Or so that future poor parents will opt for abortion. We just can't have people thanking religious institutions for saving the lives of their children when some democratic schmuck should get the gratitude instead.

Wow, guy, you like totally distorted his viewpoint...

Good going there..

The only distortion of consequence going on in this thread is that of Romneys record. All the rest is just selfish liberal lies and nonsense.