Assume Trump Committed Crimes

[Lisa558]

The country needs speedy justice.

It has a right to know as soon as possible.

The defendant needs time to prepare a defense. It took 2 years for the Trump-hating DA to come up with dozens of charges, some of which carry a sentence of life in prison; Trump should get 2 years to develop his defense.

 

[Lisa558]

Sure...

But it's prima facie risible.

No one denies that Grifty called Raffensperger looking for votes.

So? That’s not illegal. Gore asked to find more votes too.

 

[presonorek]

Read the indictments.
They're all publicly available.
Then comeback and list each charges with your "guilty of what?"

I wish somebody that is less lazy than me would do that.

 

[hjmick]

Why not? If that were the case, all the biased leftist DAs would just have to come up with outlandish charges against every viable political challenger to Biden.

Did you watch the video? The last line in my post was a quote from one of the biggest supporters of former President P01135809.

In the video she is arguing the reasons no one should vote for any candidate who is under investigation or indictment. At the time of her unhinged rant her main target was Hillary Clinton, as if there weren't already enough reasons to note vote for her, but good old Jeanine also went so far as to express that generic candidates should be ineligible and that the question of guilt or the lack thereof is irrelevant.

 

[Dadoalex]

LOL Busted. It ain't in the indictment

You asked the "other crime"
I gave it to you.

You're just an ignorant tiny minded MAGAT poop eating troll.

 

[presonorek]

Why can't we assume the charges are illegitimate?

Because it muddies the discussion. I am trying to make a different point. It is in the best interest of both sides to wait until after the November 2024 election to have a trial.

 

[Lisa558]

Did you watch the video? The last line in my post was a quote from one of the biggest supporters of former President P01135809.

In the video she is arguing the reasons no one should vote for any candidate who is under investigation or indictment. At the time of her unhinged rant her main target was Hillary Clinton, as if there weren't already enough reasons to note vote for her, but good old Jeanine also went so far as to express that generic candidates should be ineligible and that the question of guilt or the lack thereof is irrelevant.

That’s one person’s opinion, and it was years ago - before the Dems used indictments against their political opponents as part of a campaign strategy.

 

[Rawley]

You asked the "other crime"
I gave it to you.

You're just an ignorant tiny minded MAGAT poop eating troll.

You gave me scat. Scat that doesn't even make any sense. He paid the whore. There was no campaign contribution. Perhap is you read the indictment you would know. Bragg did not say what the other crime was.

Gadds! Is the one Bidenfluffer that has a fucking clue?

 

[presonorek]

Why can't we assume the charges are illegitimate?

If they are illegitimate then this is easy as pie. If there are charges that have tons of evidence, what is the best way to handle it? I’m not convinced one way or the other. I just think whatever the case is, this should wait until after the election. Trump could lose and it would be fine. If Trump wins it won’t be fine but it can all get sorted out. Trump is probably going to have a kick ass VP pick so it might not be so bad even if Trump goes to prison for life. In the course of world history this isn’t all that unusual. Sometimes innocent political rivals were executed or jailed unjustly. We have to consider that as a possible outcome too.

The reality is: nobody knows if Trump is guilty.

Nobody knows if Trump is innocent. Anybody who says they know is a complete 100% disgusting filthy rotten horrible piece of crap liar. I’m saying it doesn’t matter. The trial can wait.

 

[Independent thinker]

Because it muddies the discussion. I am trying to make a different point. It is in the best interest of both sides to wait until after the November 2024 election to have a trial.

LOL. You mean you don't want to talk about it because you are too interested in getting Trump.

 

[Independent thinker]

If they are illegitimate then this is easy as pie. If there are charges that have tons of evidence, what is the best way to handle it? I’m not convinced one way or the other. I just think whatever the case is, this should wait until after the election. Trump could lose and it would be fine. If Trump wins it won’t be fine but it can all get sorted out. Trump is probably going to have a kick ass VP pick so it might not be so bad even if Trump goes to prison for life. In the course of world history this isn’t all that unusual. Sometimes innocent political rivals were executed or jailed unjustly. We have to consider that as a possible outcome too.

The reality is: nobody knows if Trump is guilty.

Nobody knows if Trump is innocent. Anybody who says they know is a complete 100% disgusting filthy rotten horrible piece of crap liar. I’m saying it doesn’t matter. The trial can wait.

This is not a country where you find someone you you don't like or is a political enemy and purposely do investigations to get them and then make them prove their innocence. That's what Russia does and we are supposed to be better than that.

 

[presonorek]

LOL. You mean you don't want to talk about it because you are too interested in getting Trump.

Trump is going to win the nomination. The media will make sure of it. Biden will beat Trump. We already know that outcome but if Trump is prisoner justly or unjustly there is going to be a large portion of Americans that will lose complete trust in the system. That may be ok but why risk it? Lots of criminals get off even when they are proven guilty. Surely delaying the trial isn’t the worst thing a criminal or noncriminal ever got away with. It’s fine to talk about.

 

[presonorek]

This is not a country where you find someone you you don't like or is a political enemy and purposely do investigations to get them and then make them prove their innocence. That's what Russia does and we are supposed to be better than that.

Are you sure? By your logic the charges are legitimate and I’m not convinced that is true.

 

[The5thHorseman]

So? That’s not illegal. Gore asked to find more votes too.

Read the indictment.

 

[The5thHorseman]

I could care less what you believe, or not believe.
I'm not here to change your mind, Slugger.
Just stating some facts.

If you decline to support them, they are Assertions

 

[Seymour Flops]

He's guilty of every crime in each indictment.


But

conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding

Now pick your dem.

Easy as pie.

Hillary Clinton.

It is also likely that there are other work-related e-mails that they did not produce to State and that we did not find elsewhere, and that are now gone because they deleted all e-mails they did not return to State, and the lawyers cleaned their devices in such a way as to preclude complete forensic recovery.

 

[Independent thinker]

Trump is going to win the nomination. The media will make sure of it. Biden will beat Trump. We already know that outcome but if Trump is prisoner justly or unjustly there is going to be a large portion of Americans that will lose complete trust in the system. That may be ok but why risk it? Lots of criminals get off even when they are proven guilty. Surely delaying the trial isn’t the worst thing a criminal or noncriminal ever got away with. It’s fine to talk about.

Most recent polling shows Trump on top and that doesn't even account for the electoral college or third party runs, which help Trump even more.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2024/president/us/general-election-trump-vs-biden-7383.html

 

[Independent thinker]

Are you sure? By your logic the charges are legitimate and I’m not convinced that is true.

Some are somewhat legitimate but it is very glaring how we have a two tiered justice system where Trump is charged but others doing the same thing are not. Biden's DOJ suppresses all information they can that is against the Bidens or Hillary, etc while they go after Trump full force. That is also apparent when the DOJ sues SpaceX for not hiring non-citizens while the DOJ itself does not hire non-citizens. The DOJ has a very obvious bias.

 

[Invisibleflash]

Let’s all pretend Trump committed crimes.

If Trump is guilty as can be is it better to hold the trial before November 6, 2024 or after November 6, 2024?

We are a country that values justice. We are also a country that values democracy. I think it would be a fine balance if we could hold the trials between November 6, 2024 and January 20, 2025. What do you guys think. This allows the public to trust the democratic process and their trust in the justice system.

I think Trump supporters fail to entertain the possibility that Trump possibly did commit crimes. I think the Trump haters fail to see how politically motivated this looks. I wish we had real judges. They’ll be the ones to dirty things by injecting their political preferences. The solution just seems so easy to me. Appease all sides and protect the dignity of America.

 

[SavannahMann]

Let’s all pretend Trump committed crimes.

If Trump is guilty as can be is it better to hold the trial before November 6, 2024 or after November 6, 2024?

We are a country that values justice. We are also a country that values democracy. I think it would be a fine balance if we could hold the trials between November 6, 2024 and January 20, 2025. What do you guys think. This allows the public to trust the democratic process and their trust in the justice system.

I think Trump supporters fail to entertain the possibility that Trump possibly did commit crimes. I think the Trump haters fail to see how politically motivated this looks. I wish we had real judges. They’ll be the ones to dirty things by injecting their political preferences. The solution just seems so easy to me. Appease all sides and protect the dignity of America.

It is curious. I didn’t know political ambition was an impenetrable shield against consequences. I’m not sure anyone knew it before.

Political careers have been ended before. Duke Cunningham. Vice President Rockefeller while he was in office. Nixon, while he was in office.

The principle is that the President can’t be held accountable while in office. That is a reasonable expectation in all honesty. The argument now, well that one is interesting.

Nixon was pardoned to end any possibility of any prosecution. Ford Pardoned him shortly after taking office. It later cost Ford the Presidency, because people wanted everyone to be held accountable to the justice system. They believed that if you committed a crime, you should face judgement.

Clinton signed a deal before leaving office to head off any prosecution. It was negotiated for months before he signed it.

So we have had the specter that a President could face consequences for his actions in office after leaving the Presidency for generations. It has been understood that it was always possible.

So what makes this different. Trump Supporters refuse to believe he lost the election of 2020. All of the investigations that have confirmed the loss are inevitably denounced as partisan, or part of some imaginary deep state. This creates for Trump in their eyes, an impenetrable victim shield. No matter what he does, they will always take his side. He is the victim.

Trump knows this, and plays up to them in public. Every sentence he whips out the words they want to hear. Failed, Fake, Fraudulent.

Thread after thread on this board continue to espouse that sentiment. And thread after thread are filled with screeds about Corrupt whomever and whatever crimes they are guilty of in the imagination of the Trump fanboy.

But here is the problem. They want to gut the Justice system, to protect Trump. They want to create a King, not a candidate for President. Because make no mistake, if Trump isn’t held to account for his criminal actions now, he never will be.

If he loses in 24, he won’t be tried, they’ll scream that he was set up and cheated out of the Presidency. They won’t accept a defeat. If they personally check every identification of every single voter on Election Day, and Trump loses, they’ll still scream that he was cheated.

Trump has done this to himself. He committed the crimes thinking he was untouchable. Because he is so adored by the fanboys. Trump knows he can do anything and they won’t abandon him, and the reality is he’s right. Trump is a godhead for them.

But Trump committed these acts. He tried to overturn the Georgia election through chicanery and intimidation. He pressured public officials to act unconstitutionally. Then in Florida, and New Jersey, he stored classified documents that he had no business still having.

If you aren’t supposed to have it, and it was included by accident in one of the boxes, ok. Mistakes happen, call and get someone to come and get it. Forget it. That’s what was done with both Biden and Pence. Accidents that were acknowledged are forgivable. We are all only human after all.

Hiding them, deleting surveillance footage, or trying to, and lying to the Agents isn’t inadvertent. It is intentional. Intentional includes a vital word doesn’t it? Intent. Intent to hold onto documents he had no business having. Intent to deceive, intent to obstruct.

The trials should be held as soon as practical for the scheduling of the court. No special preference should be given. Otherwise, hell some dolt will file to run for President and murder his wife and announce he can’t be tried for these spurious charges until after the election. We will have to let him go. We will have to let him campaign, because that is the standard we are setting with Trump.

The secret to preventing abuse of power is accountability. Trump doesn’t want accountability. He wants power. Honestly, when I voted for him in 2016, I assumed Hillary would be the one doing this sort of corrupt bullshit. I had hoped he wouldn’t, I was wrong.