As a libertarian I support your choices.

[dblack]

We currently have we a massive, omnipresent, and very expensive central government. Why not use it for helping 99% of Americans, rather than the 1%? Our government is controlled by the wealthy for the wealthy of the wealthy. Seems to me changing this dynamic is far easier than attaining a libertarian society. Time for our government to enact policies that help the poor and MC.

And I think this is naive in the extreme. You cite the reason right in your post. Government will always be controlled by people who have the most to gain from controlling society. It will only ever placate the poor - just enough to keep the war machine running. But it will damned sure keep them poor. It will never act in their "interests".

This is the core conceit of liberalism: if we just give government more power they'll be able to solve all our problems. But it doesn't work that way. Government having too much power is the source of many of our problems as it is.

 

[Paulie]

So you think it's more humane to leave kids with people who can't or wont care for them

Got it

Sometimes yes, sometimes, no. Would you take a child from his family because his family can't afford life insurance?

I never said life insurance was a requirement but responsible parents do.

So here we go again

If you can't afford to provide food , shelter, clothing, and yes medical care for your children then you should not have kids.

Why should anyone expect other parents who do all of the above for their children to give money that could be used for the welfare of their own children to someone else who refuses to provide all those things for his own family?

I don't have kids so why should I have to pay more of the money I earn so people who have kids they never should have had can get a check?

Also, why should someone who doesn't have children pay the same in property taxes as someone who does? If you don't have children using the school system then you shouldn't pay as much. If you eventually have a child then your tax bill increases accordingly

Property taxes are based on the market value of the property. WHat the state uses those revenues for is irrelevant

God you're stupid. Property taxes are like any other tax the municipality has a tax percent they charge ON that property value. Maybe it's 1% or 2% or maybe it's even higher. That tax rate you're charged is based on the services your municipality provides.. schools, police, fire, rescue, etc. If your municipality doesn't have a full k-12 school system and for instance only has k-8 like mine does, your tax rate is typically lower than a municipality that has k-12. My municipality also doesn't have local police, they use the state police so that also mitigates the property tax rate. Yet another reason why the left is unqualified to speak on economic matters, you people don't know jack shit

 

[Paulie]

People make bad choices. It’s only human. Would you rather they not be supported and die in the gutter?

Here's a crazy thought. It's going to be a shock to your world view, so you might want to have a seat. The thing is - it's really not a choice between government dictating things and people dying in the gutter. Believe it or not, we can take care of ourselves, we can take care of our families, our friends, our community, without resorting to legal mandates. True story™.

The problem today is government and big business are one. Their goal is profit and power. The people have no protections from these two criminal enterprises.

Well, they're not quite "one", yet. But they're getting there. Business and government merging into one entity is called socialism.

I would love a libertarian society, but it ain’t going to happen in the quasi Fascist State we live in today.

Agreed. We need an awakening - a realization among the public that government is a terrible way to make most decisions. Without that, we're pretty much destined to go down the state socialism slavery route.

You missed my point about people. Yes most people can take care of themselves, but you must know that some can’t or they make dumb decisions, that result in living in poverty.

Right. And "we" can take care of those people without resorting to legal mandates. Which was my point. That you missed.

Secondly, the extreme wealthy are well cared for by big government. I find this reprehensible when we know millions of Americans are suffering. Socialism for the rich and capitalism for the poor. Is that your motto?

Nope. Government shouldn't be "taking care" of anyone. That's not its purpose. Using it for that is an abuse of the grant of sovereignty.

Socialism is the government taking control of business, rather than colluding.

And? The point is, they merge. Government and business become one. Business leaders will be politicians, and politicians will decide what kind of health care you get, what kind of food is available, what you do for a living, where you live, pretty much every. god. damned. thing.

We agree. The problem we have is our society is not going libertarian any time soon. I too would love to see government out of our lives and stick to it’s original mandate of solely protecting our rights. However, this is not going to happen.

This is my point.

We currently have we a massive, omnipresent, and very expensive central government. Why not use it for helping 99% of Americans, rather than the 1%? Our government is controlled by the wealthy for the wealthy of the wealthy. Seems to me changing this dynamic is far easier than attaining a libertarian society. Time for our government to enact policies that help the poor and MC.

Ouch. You've given up. Personally I just get happy to see any progress towards more freedom. Cut taxes? Yes please, no questions asked. Cut spending? Yes please. Deregulate? Yes please. Any small victory for freedom is fine with me, I'll find my niche in the economy and prosper however I can.

 

[Third Party]

The Ruling Class loves people like you. You see things along political party lines, unaware of the bigger picture. Sadly, there are way too many Americans just like you.

This is how the Ruling Class keeps winning. Americans are divided along party lines, when the reality is both parties are essentially the same. They do the bidding of the Ruling Class. If the people would come together, the Ruling Class is toast.

Workers of the world unite! Happily there are very few Americans just like you, wanting to burn it all down and replace it with anarchy. How many guns do you own?

Do Bernie and AOC do the bidding of the Ruling Class?

What don't you have that you want?

 

[Blues Man]

So you think it's more humane to leave kids with people who can't or wont care for them

Got it

Sometimes yes, sometimes, no. Would you take a child from his family because his family can't afford life insurance?

I never said life insurance was a requirement but responsible parents do.

So here we go again

If you can't afford to provide food , shelter, clothing, and yes medical care for your children then you should not have kids.

Why should anyone expect other parents who do all of the above for their children to give money that could be used for the welfare of their own children to someone else who refuses to provide all those things for his own family?

I don't have kids so why should I have to pay more of the money I earn so people who have kids they never should have had can get a check?

Also, why should someone who doesn't have children pay the same in property taxes as someone who does? If you don't have children using the school system then you shouldn't pay as much. If you eventually have a child then your tax bill increases accordingly

Property taxes are based on the market value of the property. WHat the state uses those revenues for is irrelevant

God you're stupid. Property taxes are like any other tax the municipality has a tax percent they charge ON that property value. Maybe it's 1% or 2% or maybe it's even higher. That tax rate you're charged is based on the services your municipality provides.. schools, police, fire, rescue, etc. If your municipality doesn't have a full k-12 school system and for instance only has k-8 like mine does, your tax rate is typically lower than a municipality that has k-12. My municipality also doesn't have local police, they use the state police so that also mitigates the property tax rate. Yet another reason why the left is unqualified to speak on economic matters, you people don't know jack shit

How Property Taxes Are Calculated

Calculating Property Taxes
Property taxes are calculated using the value of the property. This includes both the land and the buildings on it. Every one to five years, tax assessors will value the property and charge the owner-of-record the appropriate rate following the standards set by the taxing authority. Assessors calculate that value using either the mill levy or the assessed property value.


Mill Levy or Millage Tax
The mill levy is the tax rate levied on your property value, with one mill representing one-tenth of one cent. So, for $1,000 of assessed property value, one mill would be equal to $1.

 

[Paulie]

Sometimes yes, sometimes, no. Would you take a child from his family because his family can't afford life insurance?

I never said life insurance was a requirement but responsible parents do.

So here we go again

If you can't afford to provide food , shelter, clothing, and yes medical care for your children then you should not have kids.

Why should anyone expect other parents who do all of the above for their children to give money that could be used for the welfare of their own children to someone else who refuses to provide all those things for his own family?

I don't have kids so why should I have to pay more of the money I earn so people who have kids they never should have had can get a check?

Also, why should someone who doesn't have children pay the same in property taxes as someone who does? If you don't have children using the school system then you shouldn't pay as much. If you eventually have a child then your tax bill increases accordingly

Property taxes are based on the market value of the property. WHat the state uses those revenues for is irrelevant

God you're stupid. Property taxes are like any other tax the municipality has a tax percent they charge ON that property value. Maybe it's 1% or 2% or maybe it's even higher. That tax rate you're charged is based on the services your municipality provides.. schools, police, fire, rescue, etc. If your municipality doesn't have a full k-12 school system and for instance only has k-8 like mine does, your tax rate is typically lower than a municipality that has k-12. My municipality also doesn't have local police, they use the state police so that also mitigates the property tax rate. Yet another reason why the left is unqualified to speak on economic matters, you people don't know jack shit

How Property Taxes Are Calculated

Calculating Property Taxes
Property taxes are calculated using the value of the property. This includes both the land and the buildings on it. Every one to five years, tax assessors will value the property and charge the owner-of-record the appropriate rate following the standards set by the taxing authority. Assessors calculate that value using either the mill levy or the assessed property value.


Mill Levy or Millage Tax
The mill levy is the tax rate levied on your property value, with one mill representing one-tenth of one cent. So, for $1,000 of assessed property value, one mill would be equal to $1.

You still don't get it. There is a tax rate which is literally just a rate charged based on the amount of services the municipality provides. And THEN the actual tax amount you personally owe is determined based on that tax rate multiplied by your property's value in a given year and then divided by 12. Holy fucking shit

 

[Blues Man]

I never said life insurance was a requirement but responsible parents do.

So here we go again

If you can't afford to provide food , shelter, clothing, and yes medical care for your children then you should not have kids.

Why should anyone expect other parents who do all of the above for their children to give money that could be used for the welfare of their own children to someone else who refuses to provide all those things for his own family?

I don't have kids so why should I have to pay more of the money I earn so people who have kids they never should have had can get a check?

Also, why should someone who doesn't have children pay the same in property taxes as someone who does? If you don't have children using the school system then you shouldn't pay as much. If you eventually have a child then your tax bill increases accordingly

Property taxes are based on the market value of the property. WHat the state uses those revenues for is irrelevant

God you're stupid. Property taxes are like any other tax the municipality has a tax percent they charge ON that property value. Maybe it's 1% or 2% or maybe it's even higher. That tax rate you're charged is based on the services your municipality provides.. schools, police, fire, rescue, etc. If your municipality doesn't have a full k-12 school system and for instance only has k-8 like mine does, your tax rate is typically lower than a municipality that has k-12. My municipality also doesn't have local police, they use the state police so that also mitigates the property tax rate. Yet another reason why the left is unqualified to speak on economic matters, you people don't know jack shit

How Property Taxes Are Calculated

Calculating Property Taxes
Property taxes are calculated using the value of the property. This includes both the land and the buildings on it. Every one to five years, tax assessors will value the property and charge the owner-of-record the appropriate rate following the standards set by the taxing authority. Assessors calculate that value using either the mill levy or the assessed property value.


Mill Levy or Millage Tax
The mill levy is the tax rate levied on your property value, with one mill representing one-tenth of one cent. So, for $1,000 of assessed property value, one mill would be equal to $1.

You still don't get it. There is a tax rate which is literally just a rate charged based on the amount of services the municipality provides. And THEN the actual tax amount you personally owe is determined based on that tax rate multiplied by your property's value in a given year and then divided by 12. Holy fucking shit

LINK

 

[Paulie]

Also, why should someone who doesn't have children pay the same in property taxes as someone who does? If you don't have children using the school system then you shouldn't pay as much. If you eventually have a child then your tax bill increases accordingly

Property taxes are based on the market value of the property. WHat the state uses those revenues for is irrelevant

God you're stupid. Property taxes are like any other tax the municipality has a tax percent they charge ON that property value. Maybe it's 1% or 2% or maybe it's even higher. That tax rate you're charged is based on the services your municipality provides.. schools, police, fire, rescue, etc. If your municipality doesn't have a full k-12 school system and for instance only has k-8 like mine does, your tax rate is typically lower than a municipality that has k-12. My municipality also doesn't have local police, they use the state police so that also mitigates the property tax rate. Yet another reason why the left is unqualified to speak on economic matters, you people don't know jack shit

How Property Taxes Are Calculated

Calculating Property Taxes
Property taxes are calculated using the value of the property. This includes both the land and the buildings on it. Every one to five years, tax assessors will value the property and charge the owner-of-record the appropriate rate following the standards set by the taxing authority. Assessors calculate that value using either the mill levy or the assessed property value.


Mill Levy or Millage Tax
The mill levy is the tax rate levied on your property value, with one mill representing one-tenth of one cent. So, for $1,000 of assessed property value, one mill would be equal to $1.

You still don't get it. There is a tax rate which is literally just a rate charged based on the amount of services the municipality provides. And THEN the actual tax amount you personally owe is determined based on that tax rate multiplied by your property's value in a given year and then divided by 12. Holy fucking shit

LINK

You need a fucking link for that??? Go fucking ask your local tax collector. ANY tax collector. A municipality charges everyone a flat rate equally. And THEN your bill is based on your property's value. How are you a grown adult and don't know this? Do you not own property?

 

[Paulie]

The funniest part about this is the piece you just posted literally explains it, you just aren't comprehending what you're reading.

 

[Blues Man]

Property taxes are based on the market value of the property. WHat the state uses those revenues for is irrelevant

God you're stupid. Property taxes are like any other tax the municipality has a tax percent they charge ON that property value. Maybe it's 1% or 2% or maybe it's even higher. That tax rate you're charged is based on the services your municipality provides.. schools, police, fire, rescue, etc. If your municipality doesn't have a full k-12 school system and for instance only has k-8 like mine does, your tax rate is typically lower than a municipality that has k-12. My municipality also doesn't have local police, they use the state police so that also mitigates the property tax rate. Yet another reason why the left is unqualified to speak on economic matters, you people don't know jack shit

How Property Taxes Are Calculated

Calculating Property Taxes
Property taxes are calculated using the value of the property. This includes both the land and the buildings on it. Every one to five years, tax assessors will value the property and charge the owner-of-record the appropriate rate following the standards set by the taxing authority. Assessors calculate that value using either the mill levy or the assessed property value.


Mill Levy or Millage Tax
The mill levy is the tax rate levied on your property value, with one mill representing one-tenth of one cent. So, for $1,000 of assessed property value, one mill would be equal to $1.

You still don't get it. There is a tax rate which is literally just a rate charged based on the amount of services the municipality provides. And THEN the actual tax amount you personally owe is determined based on that tax rate multiplied by your property's value in a given year and then divided by 12. Holy fucking shit

LINK

You need a fucking link for that??? Go fucking ask your local tax collector. ANY tax collector. A municipality charges everyone a flat rate equally. And THEN your bill is based on your property's value. How are you a grown adult and don't know this? Do you not own property?

So you cannot prove your assertion.

I didn't think you could.

And you just agreed with me that property taxes are based on the assessed value of the property

 

[gipper]

The Ruling Class loves people like you. You see things along political party lines, unaware of the bigger picture. Sadly, there are way too many Americans just like you.

This is how the Ruling Class keeps winning. Americans are divided along party lines, when the reality is both parties are essentially the same. They do the bidding of the Ruling Class. If the people would come together, the Ruling Class is toast.

Workers of the world unite! Happily there are very few Americans just like you, wanting to burn it all down and replace it with anarchy. How many guns do you own?

Do Bernie and AOC do the bidding of the Ruling Class?

Your post is most typical. Call me a Commie to denigrate and ignore my opinion.

Do you work for the CIA?

 

[Blues Man]

The funniest part about this is the piece you just posted literally explains it, you just aren't comprehending what you're reading.

The funny part is that you say that property taxes are based on the assessed value of the property but you said I was stupid when I said the very same thing

 

[Paulie]

Here's the example:

My municipality charges a property tax rate of 1.2%. That's the rate everyone pays. Each property owners tax bill due is that rate multiplied by the property's value based on that year's assessment. Then it's divided into 12 monthly payments through your escrow with your mortgage lender. Or you can just pay it all yourself if you choose to but most people just include it into their mortgage payment each month because that's how most lenders do it.

 

[Paulie]

The funniest part about this is the piece you just posted literally explains it, you just aren't comprehending what you're reading.

The funny part is that you say that property taxes are based on the assessed value of the property but you said I was stupid when I said the very same thing

Oh my fucking god do you not understand the tax rate? It's a flat rate. You definitely don't own property because this is literally the basics of property tax that any homeowner understands.

 

[Blues Man]

Here's the example:

My municipality charges a property tax rate of 1.2%. That's the rate everyone pays. Each property owners tax bill due is that rate multiplied by the property's value based on that year's assessment. Then it's divided into 12 monthly payments through your escrow with your mortgage lender. Or you can just pay it all yourself if you choose to but most people just include it into their mortgage payment each month because that's how most lenders do it.

And you are again repeating exactly what i said when I said property taxes are based on the assessed value of the property

ANd you call me stupid

 

[Blues Man]

The funniest part about this is the piece you just posted literally explains it, you just aren't comprehending what you're reading.

The funny part is that you say that property taxes are based on the assessed value of the property but you said I was stupid when I said the very same thing

Oh my fucking god do you not understand the tax rate? It's a flat rate. You definitely don't own property because this is literally the basics of property tax that any homeowner understands.

It doesn't fucking matter if it's a flat rate

and I guarantee I pay more than you in property taxes annually

Nothing I said has been incorrect.

Property taxes are based on the assessed value of the property

 

[Paulie]

The funniest part about this is the piece you just posted literally explains it, you just aren't comprehending what you're reading.

The funny part is that you say that property taxes are based on the assessed value of the property but you said I was stupid when I said the very same thing

Oh my fucking god do you not understand the tax rate? It's a flat rate. You definitely don't own property because this is literally the basics of property tax that any homeowner understands.

It doesn't fucking matter if it's a flat rate

No fucking shit!! So my point is that someone who burdens their municipality with less usage of the services should get a lower rate. That's literally all I'm saying. Your bill is clearly still gojng to be based on your property value but at a lower RATE than someone else who uses more.

 

[gipper]

We currently have we a massive, omnipresent, and very expensive central government. Why not use it for helping 99% of Americans, rather than the 1%? Our government is controlled by the wealthy for the wealthy of the wealthy. Seems to me changing this dynamic is far easier than attaining a libertarian society. Time for our government to enact policies that help the poor and MC.

And I think this is naive in the extreme. You cite the reason right in your post. Government will always be controlled by people who have the most to gain from controlling society. It will only ever placate the poor - just enough to keep the war machine running. But it will damned sure keep them poor. It will never act in their "interests".

This is the core conceit of liberalism: if we just give government more power they'll be able to solve all our problems. But it doesn't work that way. Government having too much power is the source of many of our problems as it is.

I never stated nor believe the government needs more power. They have way too much now. How could they possibly attain more?

Government sucks wherever it is tried. The thing is you are the naive one, thinking we can somehow get rid of government.

If the people would unite and demand government do their bidding, rather than the bidding of the extreme wealthy, government would be forced to respond.

 

[Paulie]

Flat rate taxation is totally unfair. Your tax should be based on your usage of services provided by that tax collection.

 

[Blues Man]

The funniest part about this is the piece you just posted literally explains it, you just aren't comprehending what you're reading.

The funny part is that you say that property taxes are based on the assessed value of the property but you said I was stupid when I said the very same thing

Oh my fucking god do you not understand the tax rate? It's a flat rate. You definitely don't own property because this is literally the basics of property tax that any homeowner understands.

It doesn't fucking matter if it's a flat rate

No fucking shit!! So my point is that someone who burdens their municipality with less usage of the services should get a lower rate. That's literally all I'm saying. Your bill is clearly still gojng to be based on your property value but at a lower RATE than someone else who uses more.

That's not how the real world works, Moron