Armed Security on Campus

[Canon Shooter]

TSA Lets Loaded Guns Past Security, on to Planes

Transportation Security Administration allowed a New Orleans Hornets executive to board a plane from New Orleans to Newark, N.J., with a loaded handgun in his baggage.

abcnews.go.com

Have you ever tried to get to your checked baggage while a plane is in flight?

Yeah, me neither.

It's not illegal to pack a firearm in checked luggage. The firearm needs to be declared, though, and unloaded. It would appear, according to your link, that loaded, undeclared firearms were stowed in checked luggage.

While that certainly should be addressed, the situation does not present a danger to passengers or crew...

 

[DigitalDrifter]

Sad day today.

But I hope that liberals will see the writing on the wall now. When you consider the downside--like we saw today--there are zero good reasons to not have armed security on campus. I don't know if Robb Elementary had an armed security guard on duty at the time of the shooting. This isn't specifically about today. It's a tragedy that is done...but will be repeated time and again as long as we continue down this insane course of allowing anyone who wants a gun to buy a gun.

What it is about is the next time and the time after that. What my argument boils down to is this. When the shooting starts, the first call that someone makes is to the police--the proverbial "good guy" with a gun. And you want that good guy to get there as fast as possible to stop the shooting. So...now...doesn't it make more sense to have a good guy there already...familiar with the lay out, familiar with the kids, knowing who is out of place, perhaps?

Will it stop every shooting in the future? Of course not. But it may limit the body count when it does happen.

Too many people on your side of the aisle will nix any possibility of having armed guards on school campuses. I wish that wasn't the case, because you would see a welcome response from my side to the idea.
We need police officers in every school, in every school district across this nation. We need teachers who will volunteer to be trained with the use of firearms, and allowed to carry.
It's beyond sad that it's come to this point, but it's the only solution we now have that has a chance to stop at least some of these horrific tragedies.

 

[Dogmaphobe]

What's this about "liberals"?

A group to which neither of you belong.

 

[BlackSand]

I'm not sure I argued that. I'm pretty sure I didn't.

.

You didn't argue anything ... You posted a link, to an empty excuse.

.​

 

[EvilCat Breath]

You did not answer my question. You just ranted. This is what we get in this country far too often.

Of course I answered the question. You just didn't like the answer.

 

[CarlinAnnArbor]

Why do you feel this need to label everything?

You calim one set of beliefs but support candidates who oppose your stated beliefs.

So are you just stupid, or a liar?

 

[bendog]

A group to which neither of you belong.

My daughter's school had armed guards. In the 1970s I was briefly assigned to a school where a teacher had been shot (robbery) and there was only one entrance (and emergency exits) that had metal detectors and armed guards.

I have no interest in being a teacher anymore, but I had no interest in being armed at school and I wouldn't now. I own firearms. I'm for background checks and I use trigger locks and/or place the firearms in storage

 

[DigitalDrifter]

My daughter's school had armed guards. In the 1970s I was briefly assigned to a school where a teacher had been shot (robbery) and there was only one entrance (and emergency exits) that had metal detectors and armed guards.

I have no interest in being a teacher anymore, but I had no interest in being armed at school and I wouldn't now. I own firearms. I'm for background checks and I use trigger locks and/or place the firearms in storage

And that was in the 70's?

 

[bendog]

And that was in the 70's?

yah. I didn't stick around. LOL

 

[Missourian]

But again. The argument is more guns will prevent such things. Ok. If we accept that as true how do we manage to identify the good guy with a gun over the bad guy with a gun when cops are responding?

https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2022-01-31/deputy-seeking-suspect-mistakenly-kills-off-duty-officer?context=amp

Police chief hails ‘good guy with a gun’ after officer kills him in tragic mistaken identity

Police say the man who shot the gunman prevented a larger loss of life.

thehill.com

Black Man Who Was ‘Good Guy With A Gun’ Shot By Police

K’aun Green was trying to disarm a shooter in a San Jose restaurant.

www.bet.com

Alabama police officer cleared in shooting of black man at mall

A police officer acted lawfully when he shot a 21-year-old black man to death last year because he mistook him for a suspect in an earlier shooting at a Birmingham-area shopping mall, the Alabama attorney general said on Tuesday.

www.reuters.com

I could post more. But by now you see my point. A madman enters a school and starts shooting. Cops are alerted. Armed civilians engage the baddie. The police show up and engage the armed civilians. Maybe the baddie gets shot. Maybe not.

So how do we eliminate the risk of friendly fire casualties?

If you carry a gun... You've already asked yourself this question...

Shooting in Self Defense: What to Do When the Police Arrive

After surviving a fight for your life, the next most dangerous moment will be when police arrive to the scene of the shooting. Here's how to make sure you and the cops stay safe after the gun fight has ended.

www.range365.com

 

[SavannahMann]

If you carry a gun... You've already asked yourself this question...

Shooting in Self Defense: What to Do When the Police Arrive

After surviving a fight for your life, the next most dangerous moment will be when police arrive to the scene of the shooting. Here's how to make sure you and the cops stay safe after the gun fight has ended.

www.range365.com

The problem is not when you have had a few seconds to consider your situation and put the gun down. Ok. That might be a problem with a school shooting. The problem is when you are still dealing with the threat.

Ok. Realistic scenario for a school shooting. Gunshots ring out. Mrs. Brown the conservative teacher pulls out her gun. She gets the kids to cover and hunkers down behind her desk for cover. She dials 911 on her phone and says active shooter at Bobs Middle School. Cops come running.

The shots continue to ring out. Mrs. Brown decides to go proactive. She sticks her head and gun around the corner the cops see a person with a gun and shoot.

In the meantime Mr. Smith has killed the baddie. But Mr. Davis doesn’t know that and is still armed. The cops announce one baddie down. They turn and see Mr. Davis in the doorway to his classroom also armed.

Or Mr. Davis and Smith are engaged in a firefight with a Baddie hiding behind a wall. The police see them shooting and kill them both.

Before you do it you have to answer a lot of questions.

Yes. I considered a lot of options. And the first decision I made was that I would not come to the rescue of a cop. Because his backup doesn’t know I am a good guy.

My weapon would be strictly limited to defending me and mine.

If I watch you get shot I’m not pulling my gun. First it is dumb to draw on a drawn weapon. Second I don’t know who else is armed and will see me with a gun and assume I am the bad guy. Third. I don’t have the power to detain the guy. So if I pull I say drop the gun and he does. Now all I can legally do is watch him leave. Why pull my gun if I’m going to watch him leave anyway?

If he is shooting at me. First seek cover. Then assess the situation before pulling Sam Colt. Third. Keep looking around. First sign of cops drop the gun and hands on head.

Surviving the situation is more than a quick draw and accurate fire. It is surviving those around you who may be armed and operating on incomplete information. It doesn’t end when the baddie drops.

 

[candycorn]

What's this about "liberals"? Some states don't permit TEAchers to be armed, and not all teachers WANT to be armed. The only complaint about putting armed security/cops in schools that I've heard of is .... not willing to pay taxes

Guns in school? Here’s a list of states that allow armed teachers

Tamaqua School District’s controversial decision to allow teachers and staff to carry guns raises the question: Can school districts simply decide to allow teachers to possess guns on school …

www.mcall.com

The argument I've heard most often was that liberals and others who are politically left of center do not want the schools to become some fashion of an armed fortress where guns are all around. Yeah, I have heard the tax argument as well. Gee, maybe we can get rid of the Defensive line coach on the football team and actually hire someone that will be there to serve all of the students?

 

[candycorn]

Too many people on your side of the aisle will nix any possibility of having armed guards on school campuses.

True.

I"m still dead set against the idea of teachers having guns in the classroom. The same people you guys don't trust to teach your kid...now you want them armed next to your kid? Really?

It gets into the fine details on the topic but there are 13,000+ districts in the US. Each district has like what, 3-15 schools? So lets say you "certify" a teacher today using whatever means that is to certify the teacher. Then they don't even touch a weapon for 8 years. An attack in 2030 happens...do they still recall the training?

I'd much rather have someone dedicated to one job--campus security. And multiple "someones" at that.

Still..a teacher with access to a gun is I suppose, better than nothing.

 

[scruffy]

The person would shoot out a window and climb in that way. Stop being an idiot and making up dumbass arguments like "A steel door oughtta do the trick!"

You seem to know little to nothing about physical security.

 

[PinktheFloyd88]

You seem to know little to nothing about physical security.

Who cares, quit getting away from my point: ban assault weapons. Add universal background checks to gun shows. Raise taxes on ammunition. And require X hours a year of gun training, to be signed-off by an instructor.

I don't give a fuck about your Masters Degree in Security. No one cares. Stop dodging the crux of the matter with bullshit.

 

[Superbadbrutha]

"Armed security" is just going to be a diversity, affirmative action hire who will most likely hide if a savage runs around with a weapon of any sort.

Tough ass, redneck, racist coward talking tough behind the computer screen. When I was in the Army I saw many tough talking, white boys like you piss their pants when the shit hit the fan.

 

[scruffy]

You did not answer my question. You just ranted. This is what we get in this country far too often.

Hey - listen up.

We all agree that we want to keep the kids safe, yes?

And... we all agree that the shooters are a bad thing, yes? And we want to keep them "out", away from the kids?

Okay - what we're dealing with here, is an issue of PHYSICAL SECURITY.

I'm a credentialed security expert, I can help.

The easy (er) part of this, is securing the premises.

The harder part is securing the person's. Because the person's aren't always on the premises. The kids may walk to school, or they may walk to the car when mommy picks them up.

The solution for the premises is ACCESS CONTROL. That means only "allowed" people get in. In principle it's like swipe your card, type in your pin, and the door opens. You want the two factor authentication just in case someone loses their card.

That solves the first problem - the shooter actually got in. But he also got in "with a weapon", and you can't entirely plug that hole. Metal detectors may pick up guns, but they won't pick up plastic explosives.

The best solution for the persons is armed escort, but that's hardly practical in a school environment. And security "presence" only goes so far.

So then, understanding that there are gaps that are impossible to fill, the good strategy becomes "don't make it easy". Make them work for it.

 

[scruffy]

Who cares, quit getting away from my point: ban assault weapons. Add universal background checks to gun shows. Raise taxes on ammunition. And require X hours a year of gun training, to be signed-off by an instructor.

I don't give a fuck about your Masters Degree in Security. No one cares. Stop dodging the crux of the matter with bullshit.

You don't give a fuck because you're a bleedin fuckin idiot.

You should pay attention, but I suppose it's too much to ask a libtard like you to learn anything

 

[pknopp]

Hey - listen up.

We all agree that we want to keep the kids safe, yes?

And... we all agree that the shooters are a bad thing, yes? And we want to keep them "out", away from the kids?

Okay - what we're dealing with here, is an issue of PHYSICAL SECURITY.

I'm a credentialed security expert, I can help.

The easy (er) part of this, is securing the premises.

The harder part is securing the person's. Because the person's aren't always on the premises. The kids may walk to school, or they may walk to the car when mommy picks them up.

The solution for the premises is ACCESS CONTROL. That means only "allowed" people get in. In principle it's like swipe your card, type in your pin, and the door opens. You want the two factor authentication just in case someone loses their card.

That solves the first problem - the shooter actually got in. But he also got in "with a weapon", and you can't entirely plug that hole. Metal detectors may pick up guns, but they won't pick up plastic explosives.

The best solution for the persons is armed escort, but that's hardly practical in a school environment. And security "presence" only goes so far.

So then, understanding that there are gaps that are impossible to fill, the good strategy becomes "don't make it easy". Make them work for it.

Reports are the "armed security" ran away again just like in Parkland.

 

[pknopp]

Not only that, one mom was put in handcuffs for begging those with guns to do something and after getting released being forced to do something on her own.

Cops Handcuffed, Arrested a Uvalde Mom for Trying To Rescue Her Kids

These "brave" men are the answer to school shootings?