Are the Protestant work ethic and achievement ideology healthy...

[Pilate]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

 

[OldLady]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I'm not sure what that has to do with a strong work ethic?

 

[Dekster]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I think wages are depressed over time by women working.

 

[OldLady]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I think wages are depressed over time by women working.

Most households can't keep their heads above water without the women working. There is also the point that women have equal gifts and talents that they may want to utilize in some way other than vacuuming and changing diapers.

 

[Pilate]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I'm not sure what that has to do with a strong work ethic?

Protestant work ethic is an idea that encompasses more than just work ethic per-say. Please read up on it.

 

[OldLady]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I'm not sure what that has to do with a strong work ethic?

Protestant work ethic is an idea that encompasses more than just work ethic per-say. Please read up on it.

I don't have to. I was raised in it. I still don't understand how corporate power has changed it. Please explain

 

[Dekster]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I think wages are depressed over time by women working.

Most households can't keep their heads above water without the women working. There is also the point that women have equal gifts and talents that they may want to utilize in some way other than vacuuming and changing diapers.

The reason they can't keep their heads above water is because of both spouses working. It isn't about women per se, but that the influx of women into the labor pool allowed wages to be suppressed for all workers. Let me put it a slightly different way, if one member of every two-income household quit their jobs tomorrow, wages would quickly go through the roof because of the shortage of workers requiring employers to offer better pay and benefits to find someone to take a job with them instead of someone else.

 

[Pilate]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I'm not sure what that has to do with a strong work ethic?

Protestant work ethic is an idea that encompasses more than just work ethic per-say. Please read up on it.

I don't have to. I was raised in it. I still don't understand how corporate power has changed it. Please explain

Yes, you really do have to because it's apparent that you don't quite understand it in it's entirety. It has been impacted by corporations which rather than perceiving the ideas encompassed by the idea, twist the idea in and of itself into a tool for obedience. The idea that hard work is inherently good was formerly merely but a heartfelt and ultimately harmless belief. However, now it serves as a platform to make demands of laborers and to foster a certain mindset among laborers that work is actually good and necessary and not just a means for the said workers to pay bills.

 

[OldLady]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I'm not sure what that has to do with a strong work ethic?

Protestant work ethic is an idea that encompasses more than just work ethic per-say. Please read up on it.

I don't have to. I was raised in it. I still don't understand how corporate power has changed it. Please explain

Yes, you really do have to because it's apparent that you don't quite understand it in it's entirety. It has been impacted by corporations which rather than perceiving the ideas encompassed by the idea, twist the idea in and of itself into a tool for obedience. The idea that hard work is inherently good was formerly merely but a heartfelt and ultimately harmless belief. However, now it serves as a platform to make demands of laborers and to foster a certain mindset among laborers that work is actually good and necessary and not just a means for the said workers to pay bills.

The Protestant (Puritan) work ethic has always been that work is actually good and necessary in order for a person to be "good." It was fostered by some Puritan sect that believed work was somehow the key to heaven's gate and they moved here to New England. I don't know the specifics, but at that time, hard work was also necessary for survival, so it was a good fit for the situation.
Anyway, it was never just about a paycheck. It means idleness is unacceptable and the worst thing you can accuse someone of is laziness.
Don't be afraid of using your words, Pilate. So far you've been pretty fuzzy. I'm trying to understand it, but maybe if you could use some actual examples of what you're talking about, it would be more clear.

 

[Pilate]

I contend that they are no longer healthy and are begging to teeter into an almost slave like mentality. In an age where corporate power is arguably very far reaching, I believe that the above concepts have been twisted into tools used to control people for the financial gain of a small group. What do you guys think?

I'm not sure what that has to do with a strong work ethic?

Protestant work ethic is an idea that encompasses more than just work ethic per-say. Please read up on it.

I don't have to. I was raised in it. I still don't understand how corporate power has changed it. Please explain

Yes, you really do have to because it's apparent that you don't quite understand it in it's entirety. It has been impacted by corporations which rather than perceiving the ideas encompassed by the idea, twist the idea in and of itself into a tool for obedience. The idea that hard work is inherently good was formerly merely but a heartfelt and ultimately harmless belief. However, now it serves as a platform to make demands of laborers and to foster a certain mindset among laborers that work is actually good and necessary and not just a means for the said workers to pay bills.

The Protestant (Puritan) work ethic has always been that work is actually good and necessary in order for a person to be "good." It was fostered by some Puritan sect that believed work was somehow the key to heaven's gate and they moved here to New England. I don't know the specifics, but at that time, hard work was also necessary for survival, so it was a good fit for the situation.
Anyway, it was never just about a paycheck. It means idleness is unacceptable and the worst thing you can accuse someone of is laziness.
Don't be afraid of using your words, Pilate. So far you've been pretty fuzzy. I'm trying to understand it, but maybe if you could use some actual examples of what you're talking about, it would be more clear.

Well for arguments sake, what is actually wrong with my decision to be lazy and why exactly is work good? "Work worship" as I call it has created a situation in which I've seen a man run through traffic to try and make a train so he could be on time. Sounds silly, right? But consider, that man put his life on the line to be on time for work. Doesn't that strike you as being at the very least...odd?

 

[koshergrl]

So you think people should just sit on their asses all day and wait to be fed, while pretending to be Great Thinkers on an internet messageboard.

Like you.

No, thank you. I was taught that working is good for body and soul, in and of itself.

And I taught my children that as well.

 

[Pilate]

So you think people should just sit on their asses all day and wait to be fed, while pretending to be Great Thinkers on an internet messageboard.

Like you.

No, thank you. I was taught that working is good for body and soul, in and of itself.

And I taught my children that as well.

Come on, Shylock. Just address the question and points I made.

 

[koshergrl]

So you think people should just sit on their asses all day and wait to be fed, while pretending to be Great Thinkers on an internet messageboard.

Like you.

No, thank you. I was taught that working is good for body and soul, in and of itself.

And I taught my children that as well.

Come on, Shylock. Just address the question and points I made.

I did, you poor, ignorant asshat.

 

[OldLady]

I'm not sure what that has to do with a strong work ethic?

Protestant work ethic is an idea that encompasses more than just work ethic per-say. Please read up on it.

I don't have to. I was raised in it. I still don't understand how corporate power has changed it. Please explain

Yes, you really do have to because it's apparent that you don't quite understand it in it's entirety. It has been impacted by corporations which rather than perceiving the ideas encompassed by the idea, twist the idea in and of itself into a tool for obedience. The idea that hard work is inherently good was formerly merely but a heartfelt and ultimately harmless belief. However, now it serves as a platform to make demands of laborers and to foster a certain mindset among laborers that work is actually good and necessary and not just a means for the said workers to pay bills.

The Protestant (Puritan) work ethic has always been that work is actually good and necessary in order for a person to be "good." It was fostered by some Puritan sect that believed work was somehow the key to heaven's gate and they moved here to New England. I don't know the specifics, but at that time, hard work was also necessary for survival, so it was a good fit for the situation.
Anyway, it was never just about a paycheck. It means idleness is unacceptable and the worst thing you can accuse someone of is laziness.
Don't be afraid of using your words, Pilate. So far you've been pretty fuzzy. I'm trying to understand it, but maybe if you could use some actual examples of what you're talking about, it would be more clear.

Well for arguments sake, what is actually wrong with my decision to be lazy and why exactly is work good? "Work worship" as I call it has created a situation in which I've seen a man run through traffic to try and make a train so he could be on time. Sounds silly, right? But consider, that man put his life on the line to be on time for work. Doesn't that strike you as being at the very least...odd?

No, not at all if the guy has been late before and the next time, he's fired. I already explained the ethos behind "work is good" and why "lazy is bad." I didn't say I agreed with it. The other thing that is important to keep in mind here is that from the employer's perspective, if showing up for work on time is not enforced, no one would show on a regular basis and the employer couldn't do all that was planned for the day. I've also worked jobs where if the next employee doesn't show, I'm stuck covering that shift regardless of what my own obligations for the day might be. That really sucks.
Not seeing how corporate power has changed anything. It's always been this way in this country. Are you from elsewhere?

 

[Pilate]

So you think people should just sit on their asses all day and wait to be fed, while pretending to be Great Thinkers on an internet messageboard.

Like you.

No, thank you. I was taught that working is good for body and soul, in and of itself.

And I taught my children that as well.

Come on, Shylock. Just address the question and points I made.

I did, you poor, ignorant asshat.

You really didn't. At all. You berated me and then provided a rather weak justification for your own method of behavior.

 

[BreezeWood]

.
how about not starving to death as an underlying, unavoidable value where stealing from someone else for your food is not an option - and yes the capitalist system is flawed when people and churches use it as a religion.

for sustenance and Spiritual wellbeing a manageable game plan is virtually an unavoidable necessity.


the alliance of church and bushiness vs government is a clue.

.

 

[Pilate]

Protestant work ethic is an idea that encompasses more than just work ethic per-say. Please read up on it.

I don't have to. I was raised in it. I still don't understand how corporate power has changed it. Please explain

Yes, you really do have to because it's apparent that you don't quite understand it in it's entirety. It has been impacted by corporations which rather than perceiving the ideas encompassed by the idea, twist the idea in and of itself into a tool for obedience. The idea that hard work is inherently good was formerly merely but a heartfelt and ultimately harmless belief. However, now it serves as a platform to make demands of laborers and to foster a certain mindset among laborers that work is actually good and necessary and not just a means for the said workers to pay bills.

The Protestant (Puritan) work ethic has always been that work is actually good and necessary in order for a person to be "good." It was fostered by some Puritan sect that believed work was somehow the key to heaven's gate and they moved here to New England. I don't know the specifics, but at that time, hard work was also necessary for survival, so it was a good fit for the situation.
Anyway, it was never just about a paycheck. It means idleness is unacceptable and the worst thing you can accuse someone of is laziness.
Don't be afraid of using your words, Pilate. So far you've been pretty fuzzy. I'm trying to understand it, but maybe if you could use some actual examples of what you're talking about, it would be more clear.

Well for arguments sake, what is actually wrong with my decision to be lazy and why exactly is work good? "Work worship" as I call it has created a situation in which I've seen a man run through traffic to try and make a train so he could be on time. Sounds silly, right? But consider, that man put his life on the line to be on time for work. Doesn't that strike you as being at the very least...odd?

No, not at all if the guy has been late before and the next time, he's fired. I already explained the ethos behind "work is good" and why "lazy is bad." I didn't say I agreed with it. The other thing that is important to keep in mind here is that from the employer's perspective, if showing up for work on time is not enforced, no one would show on a regular basis and the employer couldn't do all that was planned for the day. I've also worked jobs where if the next employee doesn't show, I'm stuck covering that shift regardless of what my own obligations for the day might be. That really sucks.
Not seeing how corporate power has changed anything. It's always been this way in this country. Are you from elsewhere?

But he could have died. His life literally could have ended then and there. He thinks timeliness is more valuable than his own life. I couldn't describe that as being anything other than repulsive. Your justifications revolved around something some religious people said which really doesn't hold all that much water. I can't just assert that "work is good because religion says so."

 

[Pilate]

.
how about not starving to death as an underlying, unavoidable value where stealing from someone else for your food is not an option - and yes the capitalist system is flawed when people and churches use it as a religion.

for sustenance and Spiritual wellbeing a manageable game plan is virtually an unavoidable necessity.


the alliance of church and bushiness vs government is a clue.

.

Saying "do it or you die" doesn't address the ethical aspect of the situation. Or it does...but really just confirms my belief that there is something unethical at work here. No pun intended.

 

[koshergrl]

So you think people should just sit on their asses all day and wait to be fed, while pretending to be Great Thinkers on an internet messageboard.

Like you.

No, thank you. I was taught that working is good for body and soul, in and of itself.

And I taught my children that as well.

Come on, Shylock. Just address the question and points I made.

I did, you poor, ignorant asshat.

You really didn't. At all. You berated me and then provided a rather weak justification for your own method of behavior.

No, I said I didn't agree with your assessment and that there is value in working for the sake of working.

What more is there to say than that?

Your feelings are just hurt that your stupidity looks like stupidity when someone speaks plainly to it.

 

[Pilate]

So you think people should just sit on their asses all day and wait to be fed, while pretending to be Great Thinkers on an internet messageboard.

Like you.

No, thank you. I was taught that working is good for body and soul, in and of itself.

And I taught my children that as well.

Come on, Shylock. Just address the question and points I made.

I did, you poor, ignorant asshat.

You really didn't. At all. You berated me and then provided a rather weak justification for your own method of behavior.

No, I said I didn't agree with your assessment and that there is value in working for the sake of working.

What more is there to say than that?

Working for the sake of working? You jest, surely you must. And pray tell, what is the actual value?