Are the numerous dog breeds proof of evolution?

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Opinion based on?

Well, I have read the Bible. Pretty gross, but interesting nonetheless. A peek into the primitive morality and ethics of ancient people, and their first and worst attempt to compile them.

Why did you just lie?
At least post 20 or 30 times before you lie.
If you have read the story, in context of the flood, you're not very bright.
The morality of 2021 is not much better but God promised Noach He would never again destroy almost all of mankind in a flood.

Meaningless rant. But thanks. To be continued in another thread and section of the board.

I agree; everything you post is a meaningless rant.

Cool.

You do know the silly Noah flood myth never happened, right?

 

[Indeependent]

Opinion based on?

Well, I have read the Bible. Pretty gross, but interesting nonetheless. A peek into the primitive morality and ethics of ancient people, and their first and worst attempt to compile them.

Why did you just lie?
At least post 20 or 30 times before you lie.
If you have read the story, in context of the flood, you're not very bright.
The morality of 2021 is not much better but God promised Noach He would never again destroy almost all of mankind in a flood.

Meaningless rant. But thanks. To be continued in another thread and section of the board.

I agree; everything you post is a meaningless rant.

Cool.

You do know the silly Noah flood myth never happened, right?

Prove it.

Malbim - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

He was a respected scientist among secularists who says it happened and wrote an entire explanation of how.
How many times do I have to make you look stupid?

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Opinion based on?

Well, I have read the Bible. Pretty gross, but interesting nonetheless. A peek into the primitive morality and ethics of ancient people, and their first and worst attempt to compile them.

Why did you just lie?
At least post 20 or 30 times before you lie.
If you have read the story, in context of the flood, you're not very bright.
The morality of 2021 is not much better but God promised Noach He would never again destroy almost all of mankind in a flood.

Meaningless rant. But thanks. To be continued in another thread and section of the board.

I agree; everything you post is a meaningless rant.

Cool.

You do know the silly Noah flood myth never happened, right?

Prove it.

Malbim - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

He was a respected scientist among secularists who says it happened and wrote an entire explanation of how.
How many times do I have to make you look stupid?

Prove it how? What would proof be, to you? Apparently the information that has convinced me and the global scientific community doesnt convince you. So then, what would be proof, to you?

Remember, i am not just proving it. Many people are convinced. I am being asked to prove ot to you.

So, what would be proof?

 

[Mushroom]

Opinion based on?

Well, I have read the Bible. Pretty gross, but interesting nonetheless. A peek into the primitive morality and ethics of ancient people, and their first and worst attempt to compile them.

Why did you just lie?
At least post 20 or 30 times before you lie.
If you have read the story, in context of the flood, you're not very bright.
The morality of 2021 is not much better but God promised Noach He would never again destroy almost all of mankind in a flood.

Meaningless rant. But thanks. To be continued in another thread and section of the board.

I agree; everything you post is a meaningless rant.

Cool.

You do know the silly Noah flood myth never happened, right?

Actually, you know it did, right?

One thing that is amazingly consistent in almost every mythology in that region of the world, is that they all have a flood myth. Every single one.

And in recent decades, discoveries in the Black Sea (including sites now underwater) have caused many to look at that as being the source of the flood, at roughly 5k BCE;.

There is still debate as to how fast this event happened, but the fact that every group in the region north of Egypt share a common belief screams that there is more to it than just a religious belief. The tales of Gilgamesh have a flood myth almost the exact same as the Bible. To the Greeks, Deucalion was warned by Zeus and Poseidon and built an ark almost the same as Noah and stocked it with animals. To the Zoroastrians, Ahura Mazda warned Yima who also built a large boat with 2 of every animal. Even the Hindu with Vishnu warning King Manu to do the exact same thing.

The fact that so many religions share almost the exact same myth shows that something catastrophic had happened in prehistoric times, and the survivors then incorporated that event into their mythologies. And as humans spread out they took that myth with them and told it in their own way. But the fact that they are so similar screams that there was a real event that they were all based on.

One thing I learned in taking a religion class is how similar most religions are. There are a great many striking things that faiths continents apart share, which ultimately points to their having been spawned from a single older faith. Simply look at how many religions share almost identical tales, but told in their own way. Like how for so many, the most popular "god" is the son of the "highest god". And invariably has an older brother. Who not only is known as a "trickster god", but also did things like bring forbidden knowledge to humans (specifically fire and/or agriculture). The Norse, Greeks, Babylonians, Egyptians, Jewish-Christians, Thai all share those beliefs. Even American Indians share them, which shows how far back this common belief extends. In almost every North American Tribe, Coyote is the older (but sometimes younger) brother of Wolf. A trickster, he is akin to Loki, a "frenemy" of Wolf. And many tales actually echo the relationship between Wolf and Coyote the exact same way as between Thor and Loki. Even echoing tales of Prometheus in stealing fire from the gods and giving it to humans.

Feel free to deny all you want, but you do not get an almost global echo telling almost the exact same story if nothing had happened historically. And ultimately, that is what we know of most religions today. Tales told orally for generation after generation, often distorted by time but having an actual event that inspired them.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Actually, you know it did, right?

No. It didn't, by every measure available. By all the evidence. You are in the wrong section of the board. The religion section is that way ->

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

One thing that is amazingly consistent in almost every mythology in that region of the world, is that they all have a flood myth. Every single one.

Yeah, it's almost like there were floods in lots of places.

 

[Mushroom]

One thing that is amazingly consistent in almost every mythology in that region of the world, is that they all have a flood myth. Every single one.

Yeah, it's almost like there were floods in lots of places.

With the same details over and over again?

Realize, I am not talking about "Religion" as in as "done by god", I am talking about oral tradition, which is what every religion started as. But your obvious bias has you failing to see this, so there is no point in continuing. I can see you will reject anything said out of hand without even consideration, so it is pointless.

 

[Turtlesoup]

occupied Their size......forced them to move into the water.....

 

[sealybobo]

Well we also took education to Africa. They didn have formal education until the missionaries.

A good measure then would be the literacy rate in Africa in the last few centuries, no? Do you think it will reflect and support your implication? I would bet a lot of money that it would not.

I do get what you are saying. It can't be ruled out, but we also have no known mechanism for such inheritance. How would you objectively isolate this effect and causality, over centuries? It cannot be done.

What could be done, however, it to demonstrate a causality and a mechanism by which (spitballing here) that kids with intensive education (would have to be sample representing the entire demo) have kids that are smarter than average. But you would have to rule out smarter parents, the education of the last generation (they all jave to receive the "average education). I don't see any way to make such a controlled environment.

Thank you for having an open mind.

Also, it's not like my father was smart, or his. Sure maybe they went to high school but what about my grandfather's father and his grandfather? It's not like they were doing math and science most likely they were fishing, farming or hunting. So you are probably right my theory is debunked. But that's okay. I'm so glad you didn't attack me for thinking this or pondering this could maybe possibly be true. Doesn't make me a racist.

 

[sealybobo]

One thing that is amazingly consistent in almost every mythology in that region of the world, is that they all have a flood myth. Every single one.

Yeah, it's almost like there were floods in lots of places.

With the same details over and over again?

Realize, I am not talking about "Religion" as in as "done by god", I am talking about oral tradition, which is what every religion started as. But your obvious bias has you failing to see this, so there is no point in continuing. I can see you will reject anything said out of hand without even consideration, so it is pointless.

He didn't do that to me. I'm assuming he's a black man? He didn't reject my hypothesis like other people did on another thread. They just kept coming back with "dogs aren't humans idiot" or "you're a racist". He did not do that to me so keep in mind he may be the most open minded guy you're going to find.

 

[sealybobo]

Opinion based on?

Well, I have read the Bible. Pretty gross, but interesting nonetheless. A peek into the primitive morality and ethics of ancient people, and their first and worst attempt to compile them.

Why did you just lie?
At least post 20 or 30 times before you lie.
If you have read the story, in context of the flood, you're not very bright.
The morality of 2021 is not much better but God promised Noach He would never again destroy almost all of mankind in a flood.

Meaningless rant. But thanks. To be continued in another thread and section of the board.

I agree; everything you post is a meaningless rant.

Cool.

You do know the silly Noah flood myth never happened, right?

Actually, you know it did, right?

One thing that is amazingly consistent in almost every mythology in that region of the world, is that they all have a flood myth. Every single one.

And in recent decades, discoveries in the Black Sea (including sites now underwater) have caused many to look at that as being the source of the flood, at roughly 5k BCE;.

There is still debate as to how fast this event happened, but the fact that every group in the region north of Egypt share a common belief screams that there is more to it than just a religious belief. The tales of Gilgamesh have a flood myth almost the exact same as the Bible. To the Greeks, Deucalion was warned by Zeus and Poseidon and built an ark almost the same as Noah and stocked it with animals. To the Zoroastrians, Ahura Mazda warned Yima who also built a large boat with 2 of every animal. Even the Hindu with Vishnu warning King Manu to do the exact same thing.

The fact that so many religions share almost the exact same myth shows that something catastrophic had happened in prehistoric times, and the survivors then incorporated that event into their mythologies. And as humans spread out they took that myth with them and told it in their own way. But the fact that they are so similar screams that there was a real event that they were all based on.

One thing I learned in taking a religion class is how similar most religions are. There are a great many striking things that faiths continents apart share, which ultimately points to their having been spawned from a single older faith. Simply look at how many religions share almost identical tales, but told in their own way. Like how for so many, the most popular "god" is the son of the "highest god". And invariably has an older brother. Who not only is known as a "trickster god", but also did things like bring forbidden knowledge to humans (specifically fire and/or agriculture). The Norse, Greeks, Babylonians, Egyptians, Jewish-Christians, Thai all share those beliefs. Even American Indians share them, which shows how far back this common belief extends. In almost every North American Tribe, Coyote is the older (but sometimes younger) brother of Wolf. A trickster, he is akin to Loki, a "frenemy" of Wolf. And many tales actually echo the relationship between Wolf and Coyote the exact same way as between Thor and Loki. Even echoing tales of Prometheus in stealing fire from the gods and giving it to humans.

Feel free to deny all you want, but you do not get an almost global echo telling almost the exact same story if nothing had happened historically. And ultimately, that is what we know of most religions today. Tales told orally for generation after generation, often distorted by time but having an actual event that inspired them.

So you think because everyone has heard of the boogy man that maybe one exists? Or Bigfoot?

Yea, I'm sure every society 10,000 years ago experienced floods and they passed those stories down to their kids. Some clearly embellished the story.

Oh, and funny when I suggest population control because our planet is overpopulated, cons accuse me of eugenics. Yet they are all ok with God wiping out every human and every other land creature to start over with 1 family (incest) and 2 of every animal.

You do understand the Noah story is impossible right? Who fucked Noah's grandkids?

 

[sealybobo]

You didn't answer the question, but you are correct as God did not forbid certain categories of incest until the giving of the 10 Commandments.

I think I did answer it. People people shagged their sisters regularly, back then. Maybe that's the wrong answer. What's the right answer? Is this a quiz?

It's not a quiz.
When the human race began and the population was small, people were immediate family obsessed.
This led to people treating each other with contempt and violence which resulted in God selecting a man whose family was immediate family and society oriented.
That person was Noach.

The experiment did not succeed as Nimrod was obsessed with being the supreme emperor of the world and was worse than immediate family obsessed; Nimrod was self obsessed.
God therefore dispersed the families of the Tower generation in order to at least refocus on family as opposed to self.

When God gave the Commandments, he wanted the Children of Israel, who were individual Tribe obsessed to be Children of Israel obsessed.

The experiment failed in part because, other than the kingship of Solomon, no nation ever became society obsessed.

So the god character wiped them out. Gross. In a good book, he gets his just desserts in the end. A hero should kill him.

I know full well you have never read, let alone studied, the verses that lead up to God's decision to start from one family, because it would upset your society centric (Liberal) view of the world.
When a society is entrenched in evil for over 120 years, which was the amount of time it took Noach to build the ark and explain to everyone why he was doing it, it's time for the rotten seeds to be cast aside.
I know you can't handle this; I can.

So you cons believe this world is screwed up. From us non believers to Muslims and this world being overpopulated (global warming) and gay sex and all, Hitler, I'm sure you would agree God should hit the reset button again right?

So then you are for Eugenics? Of course you are. I'm sure you agree our society have been entrenched in evil since at least the roaring 20's right?

 

[Blues Man]

I don't have a science background and don't know much about evolution but I believe the answer to my question is YES. What say you? Here's an article that delves into the topic.

From Wolves to Pugs and Great Danes – The History of Dog Breeds

Updated October 24, 2024 – Learn about the evolution of dogs and how they went from wolves to the loving pets we keep in our homes.

www.morrisanimalfoundation.org

Not really evolution it's more like deliberate genetic manipulation.

There are many physical characteristics of domestic dog breeds that offer absolutely no survival advantages.

For example the extremely short snouts of pugs and bulldogs make it harder for them to breathe, eat, and cool their bodies via panting. Bulldog females often have to have a veterinarian deliver its puppies surgically.

Really if you think about it wild dog breeds are products of evolution and domestic breeds are products of human whim.

 

[sealybobo]

I don't have a science background and don't know much about evolution but I believe the answer to my question is YES. What say you? Here's an article that delves into the topic.

From Wolves to Pugs and Great Danes – The History of Dog Breeds

Updated October 24, 2024 – Learn about the evolution of dogs and how they went from wolves to the loving pets we keep in our homes.

www.morrisanimalfoundation.org

Not really evolution it's more like deliberate genetic manipulation.

There are many physical characteristics of domestic dog breeds that offer absolutely no survival advantages.

For example the extremely short snouts of pugs and bulldogs make it harder for them to breathe, eat, and cool their bodies via panting. Bulldog females often have to have a veterinarian deliver its puppies surgically.

Really if you think about it wild dog breeds are products of evolution and domestic breeds are products of human whim.

Yea but we just changed their evolutionary path through genetic manipulation. The point is we know this can be done.

 

[Blues Man]

I don't have a science background and don't know much about evolution but I believe the answer to my question is YES. What say you? Here's an article that delves into the topic.

From Wolves to Pugs and Great Danes – The History of Dog Breeds

Updated October 24, 2024 – Learn about the evolution of dogs and how they went from wolves to the loving pets we keep in our homes.

www.morrisanimalfoundation.org

Not really evolution it's more like deliberate genetic manipulation.

There are many physical characteristics of domestic dog breeds that offer absolutely no survival advantages.

For example the extremely short snouts of pugs and bulldogs make it harder for them to breathe, eat, and cool their bodies via panting. Bulldog females often have to have a veterinarian deliver its puppies surgically.

Really if you think about it wild dog breeds are products of evolution and domestic breeds are products of human whim.

Yea but we just changed their evolutionary path through genetic manipulation. The point is we know this can be done.

We manipulated their genetics.

That's not evolution

 

[sealybobo]

I don't have a science background and don't know much about evolution but I believe the answer to my question is YES. What say you? Here's an article that delves into the topic.

From Wolves to Pugs and Great Danes – The History of Dog Breeds

Updated October 24, 2024 – Learn about the evolution of dogs and how they went from wolves to the loving pets we keep in our homes.

www.morrisanimalfoundation.org

Not really evolution it's more like deliberate genetic manipulation.

There are many physical characteristics of domestic dog breeds that offer absolutely no survival advantages.

For example the extremely short snouts of pugs and bulldogs make it harder for them to breathe, eat, and cool their bodies via panting. Bulldog females often have to have a veterinarian deliver its puppies surgically.

Really if you think about it wild dog breeds are products of evolution and domestic breeds are products of human whim.

Yea but we just changed their evolutionary path through genetic manipulation. The point is we know this can be done.

We manipulated their genetics.

That's not evolution

Sorry but you are wrong

In living biological species, DNA can either change by a process known as mutation or by gene editing. Since genes affect the body and behavior of any living species, gene editing and genetically inherited characteristics can influence the likelihood of any living biological species' evolution or extinction.

IN FACT, this isn't even what we did with dogs.

Genome editing (also called gene editing) is a group of technologies that give scientists the ability to change an organism's DNA. These technologies allow genetic material to be added, removed, or altered at particular locations in the genome. Several approaches to genome editing have been developed.

All we did was mix breeds and selectively breed dogs with the traits we liked and fixed the ones we didn't.

 

[Indeependent]

Opinion based on?

Well, I have read the Bible. Pretty gross, but interesting nonetheless. A peek into the primitive morality and ethics of ancient people, and their first and worst attempt to compile them.

Why did you just lie?
At least post 20 or 30 times before you lie.
If you have read the story, in context of the flood, you're not very bright.
The morality of 2021 is not much better but God promised Noach He would never again destroy almost all of mankind in a flood.

Meaningless rant. But thanks. To be continued in another thread and section of the board.

I agree; everything you post is a meaningless rant.

Cool.

You do know the silly Noah flood myth never happened, right?

Prove it.

Malbim - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

He was a respected scientist among secularists who says it happened and wrote an entire explanation of how.
How many times do I have to make you look stupid?

Prove it how? What would proof be, to you? Apparently the information that has convinced me and the global scientific community doesnt convince you. So then, what would be proof, to you?

Remember, i am not just proving it. Many people are convinced. I am being asked to prove ot to you.

So, what would be proof?

Yet scientists not on the payroll of universities disagree.
Neither one of is proving anything because neither one of us is a scientist.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I’m asking. If we could make a border collie the smartest dog in a couple hundred years, smarter than other breeds of dogs, could we have held blacks back by not allowing them to learn for 400 years?

And that is because we took the "smartest" two dogs from two litters and bred them. Then did it again 100s of times. That is not analogous to what you are describing.

So, by what mechanism?

One could make an argument that by disallowing and de-emphasizing the need for intelligence and education in the black community, society thereby set up a culture which devalues both characteristics, so that the community's members then selectively bred away from those traits.

However, that wouldn't explain why, during the decades between emancipation and the civil rights upheaval of the 1960s, the black community itself valued and strove for the ability to be educated the same as whites.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

With the same details over and over again?

That's not true at all.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

One could make an argument that by disallowing and de-emphasizing the need for intelligence and education in the black community, society thereby set up a culture which devalues both characteristics, so that the community's members then selectively bred away from those traits.

One could argue just about anything. But the our arguments are Whimsical and useless without some kind of data to back them up. And even then you will have only demonstrated some kind of correlation.