Anybody want to discuss philosophy?

[Wiseacre]

" I think a major barrier to people being happy in this world is due to a lack of realism "

Are you saying a person can't be happy and realistic at the same time? Don't know as I'd subscribe to that, I can be very realistic about myself and still be happy with who I am.

I think the opposite is what is meant: that people who can't be realistic can't be happy because they cannot interpret matters as they are in time space.

However, we all know the person with whom we have all disagreed at one time or another, and not only are we wrong, we are evil, by that person's standards. That makes the person very happy in judging others, no matter how unrealistic that judgement may be.

LOL, I got confused, too many negatives. What about this, many people say that religious people are unrealistic but they seem to be happy with their faith.

 

[Unkotare]

" I think a major barrier to people being happy in this world is due to a lack of realism "

Are you saying a person can't be happy and realistic at the same time? Don't know as I'd subscribe to that, I can be very realistic about myself and still be happy with who I am.

Your lack of reading comprehension is a major barrier to understanding what you quote.

 

[Wiseacre]

" I think a major barrier to people being happy in this world is due to a lack of realism "

Are you saying a person can't be happy and realistic at the same time? Don't know as I'd subscribe to that, I can be very realistic about myself and still be happy with who I am.

Your lack of reading comprehension is a major barrier to understanding what you quote.

Thank God I've got you to tell me how dumb I am. Do you think such comments add to the discussion, or are you being an asshole for the fun of t?

 

[Unkotare]

" I think a major barrier to people being happy in this world is due to a lack of realism "

Are you saying a person can't be happy and realistic at the same time? Don't know as I'd subscribe to that, I can be very realistic about myself and still be happy with who I am.

Your lack of reading comprehension is a major barrier to understanding what you quote.

Thank God I've got you to tell me how dumb I am.

Come on now, don't be like that. I'm sure there are lots of people willing to do that for you.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Simply put him on ignore when you want to work with this thread. He is the type of person I described above. He is happy being unrealistic. If it works for him, ok.

" I think a major barrier to people being happy in this world is due to a lack of realism "

Are you saying a person can't be happy and realistic at the same time? Don't know as I'd subscribe to that, I can be very realistic about myself and still be happy with who I am.

Your lack of reading comprehension is a major barrier to understanding what you quote.

Thank God I've got you to tell me how dumb I am. Do you think such comments add to the discussion, or are you being an asshole for the fun of t?

 

[Unkotare]

That makes the person very happy in judging others, no matter how unrealistic that judgement may be.

Oh, you mean like the kind of person who judges everyone who disagrees with him not only in content but in degree as "extremist" and "not mainstream"? It would seem to make such a person very happy to do so if he repeated this unrealistic judgement over and over and over endlessly, right? Right?

 

[Indofred]

I was wondering if anyone around here was interested in a thread about philosophy.

I believe you have to have a happy outlook on life to live a happy life.
Hate and all the other negative emotions only serve to make a dog's breakfast your your own life.
Probably more than you hurt the people you hate.

Peace
Love
Understanding
and............

Smile a lot.

Muslim, Christian, Jew, Hindu, Buddhist..

I don't give a shit.
Are you a nice person?

 

[Something_Else]

What about this, many people say that religious people are unrealistic but they seem to be happy with their faith.

Earlier you mentioned that most people form in their first decade of life. Once these personality traits are formed, then I believe there is a certain calmness derived by living through those traits. If someone is prone to exaggeration she might find that need met through a religious community. But these people may only be "calming the waters" of their psyche, instead of accruing genuine moral foundations which still the compelling drive of the underdeveloped mind.

I think that people are against religion because religion is misused. Religion shouldn't be (in my opinion) used as a substitute for freethinking and moral development. If religion is actually used as a shortcut to "happiness" then I would claim it is a false happiness at best, and could easily become a barrier to progress.

Most people I know aren't very honest to themselves about their emotions. I think it makes life harder, but potentially more rewarding, to trade the socially expected superficial happiness only for a chance that something more authentic might be further down that difficult path. This reminds me of C. S. Lewis' (Christian) experience, which he noted in the autobiography Surprised by Joy. Also it seems to be a typical process in a serious practice of Buddhism. There are many pagan religions which also emphasis this process of breaking through an otherwise terminal "happiness" for a more stable joy.

But who knows, people find joy in different places. For example I love coffee and am literally going to go make a delicious latte right now!

 

[Wiseacre]

A religious person thinks he/she is being very realistic, and lives life accordingly. I don't think anyone else has the right to denigrate that, even if it's a loved one. And I wouldn't be making assumptions about an underdeveloped mind either, or whether the happiness they might attain is superficial or authentic. Assuming a person is of legal age that is.

Brings up a rather sticky question though: what about cults that ensnare young people into a life of relative servitude? Once a person has reached legal age, do we have to stand back and watch them make foolish decisions in this regard? Tough call, as long as no laws are broken I'm kinda big on personal responsibility for your actions and decisions. My only issue is allowing someone to leave or change their mind, free from undue pressure or even force to stay where they are.

 

[Unkotare]

I think that people are against religion because

Which people?

 

[JakeStarkey]

The question of agency and appropriate age are obviously important keys, Wiseacre. If one's religion and its practices embodies the person emotionally and mentally and physically, one should be careful to not intrude but rather enable where possible. I am neither LDS nor Jew, but have witnessed first hand how following the faith's paths have had wonderful influences on the lives of individuals and families. I can mentally envision that an agnostic or atheistic could be fulfilled by their beliefs though I cannot "feel" emotionally or spiritually.

A religious person thinks he/she is being very realistic, and lives life accordingly. I don't think anyone else has the right to denigrate that, even if it's a loved one. And I wouldn't be making assumptions about an underdeveloped mind either, or whether the happiness they might attain is superficial or authentic. Assuming a person is of legal age that is.

Brings up a rather sticky question though: what about cults that ensnare young people into a life of relative servitude? Once a person has reached legal age, do we have to stand back and watch them make foolish decisions in this regard? Tough call, as long as no laws are broken I'm kinda big on personal responsibility for your actions and decisions. My only issue is allowing someone to leave or change their mind, free from undue pressure or even force to stay where they are.

 

[Unkotare]

............

 

[Something_Else]

I think that people are against religion because

Which people?

All people of all time in all the world who have ever considered the question to any degree whatsoever.

 

[Unkotare]

I think that people are against religion because

Which people?

All people of all time in all the world who have ever considered the question to any degree whatsoever.

Considered what question?

 

[Something_Else]

Considered what question?

You came in this thread to harass the OP and ask ambiguous questions with broken English? You stop the flow of a conversation faster than an overused comma.

Answer: The question of religion.

 

[Unkotare]

Considered what question?

You came in this thread to harass the OP and ask ambiguous questions with broken English?

To what "broken English" are you referring?

 

[Unkotare]

[

Answer: The question of religion.

Are you trying to say that "All people of all time in all the world who have ever considered the question" of religion are against it?

 

[Wiseacre]

I think one of the major problems all over this world is the lack of a sense of worth. Too many people feeling like they've got nothing to lose and no help is on the way. Too many broken homes, broken relationships, broken societies. I didn't want to get into religion all that much, but this is one area where religion can be a positive: if we believe that God loves us, and we assemble with others who share that belief, then our sense of self-worth should improve. Has to be honest though, you can't fake this.

snippet:

The second major condition determining the quality of existence is the feeling one
develops about his self. In general, if things go right for us, then we develop positive
feelings:self-worth,self-esteem,self-love.Whatever the terms,we are referring to a clus-
ter of constructive feelings that we develop about the self and the things the self does.
One who has these positive feelings feels privileged at being who he is and what
he is; he enjoys living with himself.

How we feel about our selves strongly reflects how others felt about us during
our earliest years. If we were loved, then we feel lovable; we can love ourselves. If we
were accepted, then we feel acceptable; we can accept ourselves. If we were trusted,
then we feel trustworthy; we can trust ourselves. If our very existence was valued,
then we feel valuable; we value ourselves.

It is impossible to escape the severe fact that we are wholly dependent upon the
feeling-reflections of others during these early stages of development.

" The self concept, we know, is learned. People learn who they are and what they are from
the ways in which they have been treated by those who surround them in the process of
their growing up. This is what Sullivan called learning about self from the mirror of
other people. People discover their self concepts from the kinds of experiences they
have had with life—not from telling, but from experience. People develop feelings that
they are liked, wanted, acceptable and able from having been liked, wanted, accepted
and from having been successful. One learns that he is these things, not from being told
so but only through the experience of being treated as though he were so. " -- Arthur W. Combs

One who has been loved during his formative years will develop a love of self.
However, there is a common confusion between “self-love” and “selfishness.” Self-
love is neither a narcissistic obsession with one’s physical or intellectual qualities nor
egotism, the inordinate desire to look out for one’s own interests at the expense of
others. The psychologist Erich Fromm reminds us that “if it is a virtue to love my
neighbor as a human being,it must be a virtue—and not a vice—to love myself,since
I am a human being too.”Whatever qualities the category “human”includes apply to
me as well as to others; there is no concept of “human” that excludes me. The bibli-
cal mandate to “love your neighbor as yourself” implies that loving oneself is good
and honorable, and not a selfish act. And psychology has made it abundantly clear
that respect for the self, and love of the self, are prerequisites to respecting and lov-
ing others. If one hates one’s self, it follows that one will hate others, no matter how
much the love game is played. Love of others and love of self are not mutually exclu-
sive alternatives, despite the fact that our religious heritage has taught us they are.
“On the contrary,” writes Fromm, “an attitude of love toward themselves will be
found in all those who are capable of loving others.

page 99, Philosophy: An Introduction to the Fine Art of Wondering, by James L. Christian

 

[JakeStarkey]

We can certainly see the increasingly narcissism of certain board members the further they populate out to the furthest extremes. The personal fragility coupled to "I am the center" personality produces some skewed individuals. Many religions offer the opportunity to serve others as the fulfilling nurture of the inner individual, and I believe there is much merit in that thinking.

 

[Wiseacre]

We can certainly see the increasingly narcissism of certain board members the further they populate out to the furthest extremes. The personal fragility coupled to "I am the center" personality produces some skewed individuals. Many religions offer the opportunity to serve others as the fulfilling nurture of the inner individual, and I believe there is much merit in that thinking.

Nothing wrong with that kind of thinking IMHO.