Any REAL evidence that Russian weapons were used to down the Malaysian flight or not?

[Discombobulated]

A lie by multiple sources is not evidence.

Evidently there's a massive, diabolical, international conspiracy designed to discredit the Russians. They are obviously the real victims here.

Just like Saddam Hussein and Gadhafi was when he decided to move away from the Dollar, so are Russians in response to BRICKS.

Through sarcasm or not you're catching on

Well thank you professor, that's quite a compliment coming from a man of your stature.....being privy to so much high level information and all.

 

[pvsi]

And with this, let us close this thread moderators. Thank you.

 

[Discombobulated]

And with this, let us close this thread moderators. Thank you.

Did the co-conspirators show you the secret handshake?

 

[Discombobulated]

Some people are evidently a little slow to understand that Russia is constantly being monitored by intelligence satellites. They already know exactly where the missile came from.

 

[pvsi]

Some people are evidently a little slow to understand that Russia is constantly being monitored by intelligence satellites. They already know exactly where the missile came from.

Yes I saw it on comedy central, but no one explained why the plane was derailed from Kiev controlled territory to instead fly over a war zone where military planes have been shot down over the last few weeks? (two more just today)

 

[Peach]

Two more Ukraine aircraft shot down, it didn't take the separatists long to give the finger to Putin, and the WORLD.

 

[pvsi]

I ask moderators to close this thread after half an hour if no evidence is posted, I am not interested in CNN type evidence along the lines of "But the world community is pointing all fingers at Putin" - does anyone have any REAL evidence that Russian weapons were used to down the Malaysian flight or not?

I wonder why Russian forces wouldn't allow international inspectors near the wreckage? Let's see if we can guess.

There are no Russian forces near the wreckage precisely because weeks and months before USA/EU demanded that Russian forces do not enter the region.

There are Russian speaking people, because that is the language they are speaking, and even Ukrainian I can understand because I speak Russian and Ukrainian "language" is like a drunk Mexican speaking American.

 

[JimH52]

You boss Vladimir needs to be patient. His missile fragments and a serial number will soon be found. Maybe he should go on a long horse ride....shirtless of course.

 

[pvsi]

You boss Vladimir needs to be patient. His missile fragments and a serial number will soon be found. Maybe he should go on a long horse ride....shirtless of course.

 

[peach174]

The Russian's supplied those missiles.
What reason would the Ukraine military have to shoot down any planes?
If the Ukraine military is ruled out, that means it was the separatists.
The Ukraine Government has photographic proof that the missile's crossed into the Russiaian boarder.

At a news conference in Kiev, Vitaly Nayda, the head of counterintelligence for the Ukrainian State Security Service, displayed photographs that he said showed three of the Buk-M1 missile systems on the road to the Russian border. Two of the devices, which are missile launchers mounted on an armored vehicle, crossed the border into Russia at about 2 a.m. Friday, or less than 10 hours after the jet, Flight 17, was blown apart in midair, he said. The third weapon crossed at about 4 a.m.
Ukraine Says It Has Proof Pro-Russian Separatists Shot Down MH17

The separatists said that they shot the plane down.
A well trained Russian had to have shot those missiles because it takes months to learn how to use them, two weeks is not enough time for separatists to have learned how.

 

[pvsi]

1. The Russian's supplied those missiles.
What reason would the Ukraine military have to shoot down any planes?
If the Ukraine military is ruled out, that means it was the separatists.
The Ukraine Government has photographic proof that the missile's crossed into the Russiaian boarder.

At a news conference in Kiev, Vitaly Nayda, the head of counterintelligence for the Ukrainian State Security Service, displayed photographs that he said showed three of the Buk-M1 missile systems on the road to the Russian border. Two of the devices, which are missile launchers mounted on an armored vehicle, crossed the border into Russia at about 2 a.m. Friday, or less than 10 hours after the jet, Flight 17, was blown apart in midair, he said. The third weapon crossed at about 4 a.m.
Ukraine Says It Has Proof Pro-Russian Separatists Shot Down MH17

2. The separatists said that they shot the plane down.
A well trained Russian had to have shot those missiles because it takes months to learn how to use them, two weeks is not enough time for separatists to have learned how.

1. That is not evidence, even if you have the whole world community thanking you
2. And eye witnesses say they saw a plane behind the plane that got shot down

 

[Dayton3]

I'm curious as to what the thread starter considers evidence?

Why all this defending of the Russians online anyway (across the web)?

 

[JimH52]

I'm curious as to what the thread starter considers evidence?

Why all this defending of the Russians online anyway (across the web)?

http://www.usmessageboard.com/current-events/366750-beware-of-russian-propoganda.html

 

[Valerie]

CASE CLOSED NO EVIDENCE HAS BEEN PRESENTED.most compelling evidence can be found here, particularly in the second video from the witnesses who actually were there and saw what happened: LiveLeak.com - MH17 Videos from Russian 1TV channel
I ask moderators to close this thread and carry on with your "Putin kills 298 people"

Peace out

^


a crime scene... an ongoing investigation...

U.S. intelligence followed “this specific missile” as it was fired from “a geographic area” controlled by Russia-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine, said the official, who requested anonymity. It followed the near-vertical flight path characteristic of an SA-11 surface-to-air missile launch.

“We did pick up a launch. We were able to have the ability to track this specific launch,” the official said.

...


“We don’t know who, like, pulled the trigger,” the official said. “We don’t know that a Russian was operating the system. However, that in no way precludes Russian involvement in the sense that they are the most likely source for this system.”

“We assign responsibility generally to Russia for how the separatists are armed and trained,” the official said. “What we have is a kind of picture of evidence that says the Russians have been providing these arms, these types of systems, and the Russians have been providing training — and that adds up to a picture that implicates Russia,” but “we’re going to be careful about saying who did it if we don’t know for certain.”

“We don’t know who literally was operating the system that day,” the official said. “That’s the hardest thing to determine.”


US tracked missile that brought down Malaysian Airlines Flight 17

 

[Valerie]

There is a "solid case it was an SA-11 fired from Eastern Ukraine under conditions created by Russia," a top U.S. intelligence official said.

The officials said that the U.S. detected a surface-to-air missile launch at the time that the airliner was hit, in roughly the same separatist-controlled area in Eastern Ukraine; that there has been a growing flow of weapons from Russia to separatists over the last month; that Russians have provided training for separatist fighters in southwest Russia on antiaircraft weapons and other arms; and that separatists have downed more than a dozen aircraft during the conflict.

U.S. officials who weren't part of the Tuesday briefing said American radar and space-based assets tracked the missile soon after its launch from rebel-held territory until its detonation near the Malaysian airliner.

From that data establishing the missile's track, intelligence analysts extrapolated the location of the SA-11 back to the area near the city of Snizhne, officials said. U.S. officials call this type of information measurement and signature intelligence, or MASINT.

...

Locals in the rebel-held city of Torez said on Tuesday that on the day Flight 17 went down, they spotted an SA-11, or Buk, missile on a flatbed truck traveling through the town center toward the alleged launch site.

One Torez resident who works on the main road said the SA-11 was notable because he hadn't seen such a sophisticated ground-to-air missile system among the many military vehicles that had rolled through Torez since fighting began. He said what looked like the same truck later came back through town going the other way, without the missile.

Another resident said he saw the installation pass through Torez toward Snizhne midday on Thursday with at least two cars, a jeep behind and another vehicle in front as a type of escort. He verified a photo of the SA-11 going through town, shot from the gas station on the main road, as what he had also seen on the day of the crash. U.S. officials noted the same photo, which had circulated on social-media sites.

...


Among new findings, U.S. intelligence officials said at the briefing on Tuesday that shrapnel damage to the Malaysian airliner visible in photographs is consistent with a surface-to-air missile, such as an SA-11.

The officials also said they had corroborated some of the Ukrainian communications intercepts that Kiev has said show separatists discussing the shootdown, using voiceprint analysis by the National Security Agency and the Central Intelligence Agency. They added that they are still going through their own databases of intercepts to find corroborating evidence, and that doing so could take time.

U.S. officials showed aerial photos of what they said was a training center in southwest Russia where separatists were taught to use air defense systems.

The intelligence officials also provided a map, released earlier Tuesday by the State Department, that showed the trajectory of the fatal missile and the launch site where it was allegedly fired.

The on-site investigation of the crash site is expected to provide more physical evidence of what happened to Flight 17.

U.S. Officials Lay Out Case Against Russians - WSJ

 

[Katzndogz]

You can't get evidence until investigators are allowed into crash area and the Russian backed separatist are keeping people out. Given the plane was shot down in a separatist controlled area which is near the Russian border do you have a better candidate for who's weapons could have been used?

If everyone is kept out, how do news crews get there to rifle through the debris?

 

[Katzndogz]

All Kiev has to do to end this civil war is recognize the vote by the people of Donetsk.

 

[westwall]

I ask moderators to close this thread after half an hour if no evidence is posted, I am not interested in CNN type evidence along the lines of "But the world community is pointing all fingers at Putin" - does anyone have any REAL evidence that Russian weapons were used to down the Malaysian flight or not?

So......how exactly do you sneak a missile in that is the size of a telephone pole? Plus it's launch truck, AND radar control track? No matter if it was Buk or an SA-2 Guideline from the 1960's, there is NO doubt that the missile that brought them down was of Russian origin.

This is why I asked moderators to close the thread after half an hour, because it devolves into all kinds of off topic discussions, and I keep checking into this thread to see if maybe someone has posted some evidence, wasting time.

It is a very topical question however, and DOES constitute evidence. The most compelling evidence that it was Russian separatists, is of course, their claim to have shot down a Ukrainian transport in the same area at the same time. Once they figured out it was a civilian jet they clammed up.

To a reasonable person (a legal definition used worldwide) that is enough evidence to warrant a trial all by itself.

 

[Discombobulated]

I ask moderators to close this thread after half an hour if no evidence is posted, I am not interested in CNN type evidence along the lines of "But the world community is pointing all fingers at Putin" - does anyone have any REAL evidence that Russian weapons were used to down the Malaysian flight or not?

I wonder why Russian forces wouldn't allow international inspectors near the wreckage? Let's see if we can guess.

There are no Russian forces near the wreckage precisely because weeks and months before USA/EU demanded that Russian forces do not enter the region.

There are Russian speaking people, because that is the language they are speaking, and even Ukrainian I can understand because I speak Russian and Ukrainian "language" is like a drunk Mexican speaking American.

Why do you people have to lie all the time?

Investigators Denied Full Access to Begin Crash Probe - WSJ

 

[Discombobulated]

I'm curious as to what the thread starter considers evidence?

Why all this defending of the Russians online anyway (across the web)?

He apparently has his own sources for evidence......I guess he just sort of likes to keep them to himself.