anti-israel sentiment of the democratic party, and why i cant support them.

[actsnoblemartin]

How treasonous, of the democrats to even propose such a thing, israel is out ally. My other problem with the democratic party is, it is political correct, and refuses to make moral judgments, it would rather make everything equal when it is not, for example the israeli military who has rules and regulations, and is held to account, equal to palestinian terrorists. I cant support a party like that. And to not support an ally, during the war on terrorism, is disgusting, it shows, the democrats, dont understand how terrorists hide out in large civilian populations, and how if the u.s. , britian and israel, didnt bomb and go after terrorists, they would be free to commit terrorist acts with impunity.

http://www.israpundit.com/2006/?p=3203

The Israel lobby, the ad says, was able to defeat a recent amendment to the defense appropriations bill introduced by Sens. Dianne Feinstein (D-CA) and Patrick Leahy (D-VT) that would ban the export of cluster bombs to countries that use such weapons in civilian areas, including Israel’s use of U.S.-made cluster weapons in Lebanon. As evidence, the ad points to the amount of money that several opponents of the amendment received from pro-Israel political action committees (PACs) over their career and in the current election cycle. Total donations to Congressional candidates, Republican and Democrat, from pro-Israel PACs was more than $2.4 million in the current election cycle, according to the Center for Responsive Politics. The ad concludes: “Why are [members of Congress] selling their vote and undermining peace for Israel and her neighbors?”

http://calledasseen.blogspot.com/2007/04/pelosi-sticks-it-to-israel.html

 

[maineman]

so...in your mind, cluster bombs are a good thing?

I would guess that you feel the same way about torture? genocide?

If we cannot and do not hold those nations that we support to some moral standard, why not support anyone who would claim to be our allies?

 

[Ninja]

Hold them to a moral standard? If we're exporting cluster bombs, it means we're making cluster bombs... And putatively using them.

WRT The Feinstein/Leahy amendment - it was proven that Hezbollah had been launching Katyusha rockets from densely populated areas in Lebanon. According to the Geneva Convention, the civilian deaths resulting from Israeli retaliations should have been attributed to Hezbollah - since they were effectively using human shields. Instead, Feinstein and Leahy tried to punish Israel by shitcanning the export of cluster bombs and Pelosi goes to Syria (Hezbollah backers). I won't go so far as to call the DNC anti-Israel. That would be a lie. I do think there are fringe elements within the DNC that have these sentiments, or at least pander to those who do, but the party leadership (i.e. the DLC) is staunchly pro-Israel. Given that American Jews are a Democrat voting bloc, they'd be foolish to not be.

 

[actsnoblemartin]

yes, whatever it takes to defeat the terrorists. I dont think the united states can or would have won any war with this moral snobbyness that we have to be the most moral, no, the mission of any war is to win. I respectfully disagree with your opinion, but i respect it.

Hezbollah is responsible for the civilian deaths, by

#1 hiding in large civilian populations, which makes them responsible, for well being of those citizens.

#2 launching attacks in those civilians areas, they bear that responsibility.

#3 Israel has moral responsibility to defend its civilians and its nation as whole by going after the terrorists, wherever they are, in any way, that will net israel the least number or losses, the same way america should be doing it.

Moral standards have no place in war, war is hell, no im no expert, and no i dont claim to be, but it doesnt take a phd to know that israel loses a war, they are all dead. And if europe loses a war to radical islam, then its only a matter of time, before they really come after us.

I prefer clarity to agreement, and I will support torture, genocide, (I wanna kill every terrorist, and if i have to kill millions of civilians to do it then so be it, because we will loses millions and millions more, if we continue fighting the p.c. war, out of fear of offending muslims)

so...in your mind, cluster bombs are a good thing?

I would guess that you feel the same way about torture? genocide?

If we cannot and do not hold those nations that we support to some moral standard, why not support anyone who would claim to be our allies?

 

[GHook93]

so...in your mind, cluster bombs are a good thing?

I would guess that you feel the same way about torture? genocide?

If we cannot and do not hold those nations that we support to some moral standard, why not support anyone who would claim to be our allies?

Israel was attacked in the second Lebanon War and they responded. Then the Hezbollah cowards hide within the civilian population and fired missiles from within the populaton. Hezbollah had to objectives with this: (1) Kill as many Israeli citizens as possible by targeting civilian location in Israel (where no military targets are insight) and (2) Increase the Lebanese collateral damage and win the PR war.

 

[GHook93]

Hold them to a moral standard? If we're exporting cluster bombs, it means we're making cluster bombs... And putatively using them.

WRT The Feinstein/Leahy amendment - it was proven that Hezbollah had been launching Katyusha rockets from densely populated areas in Lebanon. According to the Geneva Convention, the civilian deaths resulting from Israeli retaliations should have been attributed to Hezbollah - since they were effectively using human shields. Instead, Feinstein and Leahy tried to punish Israel by shitcanning the export of cluster bombs and Pelosi goes to Syria (Hezbollah backers). I won't go so far as to call the DNC anti-Israel. That would be a lie. I do think there are fringe elements within the DNC that have these sentiments, or at least pander to those who do, but the party leadership (i.e. the DLC) is staunchly pro-Israel. Given that American Jews are a Democrat voting bloc, they'd be foolish to not be.

It is becoming PC on the left to hate on Israel, since the Leftist fools believe all the BS that Biden, Ron Paul etc. are feeding them about the why the Islamist want us dead. Bin Laden stated it himself, "America to save yourself convert to Islam." If Israel vanished, we left the ME and left Iraq and Afghanistan, they would still be at war with us. The Jihad is on our free culture and quoting Bin Laden on "Capitalism."

 

[DiogenesDog]

Do you know the difference between the State of Israel, the State of Zion or the culture of toleration that existed in the Levant before it became a religious doctrine of some Americans to have all that become a tinder box for the fever dream of Apocalypse?

I have spent enough time on the ground in Israel and surrounding countries to know that what is known in the US is crafted, edited, and passed on by committee before it becomes news here.

The enmity of which you speak is largely fabrication. Ask any Arab with any means at all if he wants to be seen by an Arab doctor or an Israeli doctor for something serious.

We also may ask . . . Why is there no great outpouring of relief for the beleaguered Palestinians from the Sauds, the Syrians, or the Egyptians?

I have also found that most jihadis are about as sympathetic to non-combatants as they are to dogs. Those here who would advocate for a tactic of "kill them all" are no better than any heartless jihadi.



This country has the capacity in treasure, intellect and energy to end the bloodshed in which it is complicit. The only limitation is those who do not step up to the challenge. I have noted some of the ages posted and the youth in some of your photo avatars. What have you to offer. I might suggest that your start with enlisting. I have done my time and then some. The shame of this nation is those who will not serve out of fear but will support the propaganda of fear from the administration.

Most of you folks here need to turn off that talk radio and read some books. Then those of age need to get on down to the recruiting office. It's only a free country if you make it so.

I AM

 

[Gunny]

Do you know the difference between the State of Israel, the State of Zion or the culture of toleration that existed in the Levant before it became a religious doctrine of some Americans to have all that become a tinder box for the fever dream of Apocalypse?

I have spent enough time on the ground in Israel and surrounding countries to know that what is known in the US is crafted, edited, and passed on by committee before it becomes news here.

The enmity of which you speak is largely fabrication. Ask any Arab with any means at all if he wants to be seen by an Arab doctor or an Israeli doctor for something serious.

We also may ask . . . Why is there no great outpouring of relief for the beleaguered Palestinians from the Sauds, the Syrians, or the Egyptians?

I have also found that most jihadis are about as sympathetic to non-combatants as they are to dogs. Those here who would advocate for a tactic of "kill them all" are no better than any heartless jihadi.



This country has the capacity in treasure, intellect and energy to end the bloodshed in which it is complicit. The only limitation is those who do not step up to the challenge. I have noted some of the ages posted and the youth in some of your photo avatars. What have you to offer. I might suggest that your start with enlisting. I have done my time and then some. The shame of this nation is those who will not serve out of fear but will support the propaganda of fear from the administration.

Most of you folks here need to turn off that talk radio and read some books. Then those of age need to get on down to the recruiting office. It's only a free country if you make it so.

I AM

Beleaguered Palestinians? How about Arabs getting their asses kicked for being terrorists?

This country doesn't need to cowtow to the demands of a fabricated people, nor it's apologists, nor the terrorist organization these so-called beleaguered people voted in as their government.

 

[Annie]

I concur:

http://www.internationalwallofprayer.org/A-022-Martin-Luther-King-Zionism.html

"Anti-Zionism = Anti-Semitism"
- Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.
". . . You declare, my friend, that you do not hate the Jews, you are merely 'anti-Zionist.' And I say, let the truth ring forth from the high mountain tops, let it echo through the valleys of God's green earth: When people criticize Zionism, they mean Jews--this is God's own truth.

"Antisemitism, the hatred of the Jewish people, has been and remains a blot on the soul of mankind. In this we are in full agreement. So know also this: anti-Zionist is inherently antisemitic, and ever will be so.

"Why is this? You know that Zionism is nothing less than the dream and ideal of the Jewish people returning to live in their own land. The Jewish people, the Scriptures tell us, once enjoyed a flourishing Commonwealth in the Holy Land. From this they were expelled by the Roman tyrant, the same Romans who cruelly murdered Our Lord. Driven from their homeland, their nation in ashes, forced to wander the globe, the Jewish people time and again suffered the lash of whichever tyrant happened to rule over them.

"The Negro people, my friend, know what it is to suffer the torment of tyranny under rulers not of our choosing. Our brothers in Africa have begged, pleaded, requested--DEMANDED the recognition and realization of our inborn right to live in peace under our own sovereignty in our own country.

"How easy it should be, for anyone who holds dear this inalienable right of all mankind, to understand and support the right of the Jewish People to live in their ancient Land of Israel. All men of good will exult in the fulfilment of God's promise, that his People should return in joy to rebuild their plundered land.

This is Zionism, nothing more, nothing less.

"And what is anti-Zionist? It is the denial to the Jewish people of a fundamental right that we justly claim for the people of Africa and freely accord all other nations of the Globe. It is discrimination against Jews, my friend, because they are Jews. In short, it is antisemitism.

"The antisemite rejoices at any opportunity to vent his malice. The times have made it unpopular, in the West, to proclaim openly a hatred of the Jews. This being the case, the antisemite must constantly seek new forms and forums for his poison. How he must revel in the new masquerade! He does not hate the Jews, he is just 'anti-Zionist'!

"My friend, I do not accuse you of deliberate antisemitism. I know you feel, as I do, a deep love of truth and justice and a revulsion for racism, prejudice, and discrimination. But I know you have been misled--as others have been--into thinking you can be 'anti-Zionist' and yet remain true to these heartfelt principles that you and I share.

Let my words echo in the depths of your soul: When people criticize Zionism, they mean Jews--make no mistake about it."

From M.L. King Jr., "Letter to an Anti-Zionist Friend," Saturday Review_XLVII (Aug. 1967), p. 76.
Reprinted in M.L. King Jr., "This I Believe: Selections from the Writings of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr."

 

[Shogun]

oh well.. THATS an easy answer.

anti-zionist=anti-semite.


say, YOu hate it when your anti-illegal imigrant opinion simply gets tossed into the racist basket, dont you? meanwhile you play the same strategy by ignoring a valid concern for humans in palestine.


why don't you muslim hating fuckers just cut to the chase and rationalize an israeli verwsion of their own Final Solution, eh? Please, PLEASE don't figure out how ironic it is to demonize anything that even lightly criticizes israel while having night terrors about mexicans flooding into OUR nation. I'd hate for that cold splash of irony to interupt your Second Coming of Jesus hardon.





ps... if ISRAEL is your main concern over the US then so be it. Go vote for a republican hellbent on forcing the tribulation. Strange bedfellows, indeed. Go read Revelations while you are at it and find out what role a disposable Israel plays.

 

[Denton]

What role does a "disposable" Israel play? I have read Evelation (singular, it is not RevelationS and do not see it as anymore dispoable than the whole world.

The whole concept of saying that Israel has some Final Solution for the Arabs doesn't make any logical sense, considering it is not the Arabs who have been continuously attacked since they have been in the region. Even to the level of discussing the Arab-Palestinians, if any "Final Solution" were to be connected to any group it'd be to the rest of the Arab World who placed the Arab-Palestinians in the position that there are in and have kept them there in order to use them as political pawns and walking bombs against the little Jewish state that only wishes to be left alone in peace.

Could you explain your post, Shogun?

 

[Shogun]

What role does a "disposable" Israel play? I have read Evelation (singular, it is not RevelationS and do not see it as anymore dispoable than the whole world.

The whole concept of saying that Israel has some Final Solution for the Arabs doesn't make any logical sense, considering it is not the Arabs who have been continuously attacked since they have been in the region. Even to the level of discussing the Arab-Palestinians, if any "Final Solution" were to be connected to any group it'd be to the rest of the Arab World who placed the Arab-Palestinians in the position that there are in and have kept them there in order to use them as political pawns and walking bombs against the little Jewish state that only wishes to be left alone in peace.

Could you explain your post, Shogun?

Revelation 2
"To the angel of the church in Smyrna write:
These are the words of him who is the First and the Last, who died and came to life again. 9I know your afflictions and your poverty—yet you are rich! I know the slander of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan. 10Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you the crown of life. 11He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes will not be hurt at all by the second death.



Revelation 3
7"To the angel of the church in Philadelphia write:
These are the words of him who is holy and true, who holds the key of David. What he opens no one can shut, and what he shuts no one can open. 8I know your deeds. See, I have placed before you an open door that no one can shut. I know that you have little strength, yet you have kept my word and have not denied my name. 9I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you. 10Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth. 11I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one will take your crown. 12Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name. 13He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.


Indeed, remind me how America's christians aren't pawing their hands together since the creation of Israel as a sign of the second coming of their lord where the jews conform to christianity or go strait to hell with the rest of us... So, DISPOSABLE? yes.

I tellya, nothing says Final Solution quite like an aparthied wall, eh? ooops, sorry, Id hate to insult the jewish version of a concentration camp-in-training. Again, you can bend over backwards to ignore the humanity in palestine and their valid resentment at being treated how white euros treated the natives in north America but at the end of the day you are still enabling the marginalization of an ethnicity. Even if it falls in line with your interpretation of Evelation (hehehehehehehe)

 

[doniston]

yes, whatever it takes to defeat the terrorists. I dont think the united states can or would have won any war with this moral snobbyness that we have to be the most moral, no, the mission of any war is to win. I respectfully disagree with your opinion, but i respect it.

Hezbollah is responsible for the civilian deaths, by

#1 hiding in large civilian populations, which makes them responsible, for well being of those citizens.

#2 launching attacks in those civilians areas, they bear that responsibility.

#3 Israel has moral responsibility to defend its civilians and its nation as whole by going after the terrorists, wherever they are, in any way, that will net israel the least number or losses, the same way america should be doing it.

Moral standards have no place in war, war is hell, no im no expert, and no i dont claim to be, but it doesnt take a phd to know that israel loses a war, they are all dead. And if europe loses a war to radical islam, then its only a matter of time, before they really come after us.

I prefer clarity to agreement, and I will support torture, genocide, (I wanna kill every terrorist, and if i have to kill millions of civilians to do it then so be it, because we will loses millions and millions more, if we continue fighting the p.c. war, out of fear of offending muslims)

and it's opinions like your's which perpetuate the problem.

 

[Shogun]

and it's opinions like your's which perpetuate the problem.

true.

 

[doniston]

I concur:

http://www.internationalwallofprayer.org/A-022-Martin-Luther-King-Zionism.html

Concur all you like, but to equate anti-zionism, anti Jewism, and anti-sematism, is flat out garbage. They are all different
Neither the jews or the arabs are the guiding force behind the Israli government, any more than Christiandom is the guiding force behind the Bush administration

 

[GHook93]

oh well.. THATS an easy answer.

anti-zionist=anti-semite.


say, YOu hate it when your anti-illegal imigrant opinion simply gets tossed into the racist basket, dont you? meanwhile you play the same strategy by ignoring a valid concern for humans in palestine.


why don't you muslim hating fuckers just cut to the chase and rationalize an israeli verwsion of their own Final Solution, eh? Please, PLEASE don't figure out how ironic it is to demonize anything that even lightly criticizes israel while having night terrors about mexicans flooding into OUR nation. I'd hate for that cold splash of irony to interupt your Second Coming of Jesus hardon.

The Jewish Final Solution. LOL, both the populations of the Israeli Arabs and the Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza are growing! If the Jews are commiting genocide then they are doing a pretty poor job it it.


One form of antisemitism is comparing Israel to the Nazis my friend!

 

[GHook93]

Concur all you like, but to equate anti-zionism, anti Jewism, and anti-sematism, is flat out garbage. They are all different
Neither the jews or the arabs are the guiding force behind the Israli government, any more than Christiandom is the guiding force behind the Bush administration

That can be different, but that vast majority of the time they overlap! I would say 95% of the so-called anti-zionist are using it as a mask for their anti-semitism!

 

[Shogun]

can you provide a source for that stat or can I pull some numbers out of my ass too?

 

[Shogun]

The Jewish Final Solution. LOL, both the populations of the Israeli Arabs and the Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza are growing! If the Jews are commiting genocide then they are doing a pretty poor job it it.
One form of antisemitism is comparing Israel to the Nazis my friend!

you can label me a jew hating antisemite if it is easier than wrapping your brain around the same reaction that the Natives of our own country displayed. It sure wouldn't be the first time a zionist shrugged off your version of a "******-lover"

So, what, exactly, does a growing pal population have to do with state based marginalization based on ethnicity again? did the population of blacks also increase while slavery was rampant in the south?

Let's put it THIS way.. if America were to treat its jews like Israel treats its pals you would be screaming nazi every other word.


Again, I invite you to go find a native on a reservation and share your logic about the CREATION of israel regardless of the indegenous population. Ill tell you like I tell Jillian... History didn't begin in 1948. Write them off all you want to but America would react the SAME WAY as the pals if Atzlan all of a sudden sprung up in the Southwest on the legend of a burning bush.

 

[Denton]

Shogun, you are taking particular messages to particular churches and trying to make it fit Israel, but at the same time you are ignoring the scripture that makes it plain that the bones are no longer dead and scattered but now have muscle, sinew, and skin. Though they don't have life (spirituality, if you will, as evidenced by the predominantly secular culture of Israel today), it is going to come, as prophesied in Revelation.

How is it that you can blame Israel for the situation with the Arab-Palestinians? Why is it that looking at the cause is less significant than looking at the effect? Why is it that it is not desired to see how the problem arose and who is ultimately responsible for the problem? There is also a matter of the Jewish refugees, but that is also ignored.

Shogun, I think maybe this would better explain and save typing time. If you would, pelase read and tell me how it is wrong:
http://www.stopsharialaw.net/?p=30
Thanks!