Americans see a US in decline, finds Pew survey

Personal Opinion:

We have been riding on the back of our victory in WWII for a very, very long time.

The war left us as the only Major Power on the face of the planet which had not suffered grievous damage to our infrastructure and manufacturing plant, and which had not suffered massive civilian casualties alongside its military casualties.

The war fueled our economy in a dozen different ways and propped it up in the postwar years as we floated the 'rebuild' of Europe and several other areas around the world, and as we beat our swords back into plowshares, however imperfectly.

Of course, the advent of the Cold War, and the sporadic outbreak of related Hot Skirmishes, caused us to start spending beyond our means, again, to begin playing World Policeman - given that we were the only ones still capable of fulfilling the role.

But we have been burning through cash and making war on-credit for a long time now in the World Policeman role - and the pseudo-Imperial roles which the Policeman mindset eventually leads to, in small increments - until a nation wakes-up one day to find itself more Imperium than Police Station. I don't think we've sunk quite that far yet, but we may be further along the road to that outcome than we realize without giving it some serious reflection.

Until, it sometimes seems, we can no longer recognize Real Need to Intervene from a sound-byte call-to-arms in today's equivalent of Yellow Journalism rags (and those exist on both the Right AND Left sides of the aisle) planted in those rags by special interest groups.

It seems that we make war at the drop of a hat nowadays, on the thinnest of excuses, for no better reason than because Fearless Leader A or B say we should. And they (leaders) all do it... Left, Right, whatever.

I did find it interesting that the Congress had begun to line itself up, to oppose the President and his Administration's plans to intervene in Syria. I saw that as a hopeful sign of some vague willingness on the part of Congress to begin to revere that war-at-the-drop-of-a-hat trend. But, of course, Vladimir Putin came to the rescue and bailed-out our latest Fearless Leader before the Congress (including one helluva lot of Democrats) could hand him his head back on a platter, in voting-down a Syria adventure.

But, all that aside, on the macro level, and in the final analysis, we are still lurching forward under the momentum of WWII and our victory and the benefits we derived from that victory. But even the colossal advantages gained by a large power remaining intact through a global war - even such a colossal range of advantages are finite, and must come to an end or must level-off and decline, eventually. We're there, and have been already, for some years.

That advantage and that momentum have thinned-out to the point where our forward progress seems to be measured nowadays in fits-and-starts rather than the smoother, more consistent and high-speed progress of those earlier times of the late 1940s and the 1950s and early 1960s.

I, for one, rightly or wrongly, see us in decline in several areas...

* sensible foreign policy, and resultant credibility on the international scene
* manufacturing capability
* macro-level economic planning and oversight and outcomes
* the Middle Class - the economic well-being of the majority of our working-age folk
* healthcare - with more prospect of further degeneration looming on the near horizon
* sensible provision for our poor (safety net)
* popular education
* science, and space exploration and exploitation
* and other things that I'm forgetting as part of a quick bit of morning extempore

I'm also reasonably confident that we will eventually get our heads out of our asses and fix what's wrong, but it's going to take years - decades, maybe.

But first, we have to come to consensus that we are in need of a 'major overhaul' before we can set about doing it.

Given our present-day extreme political polarization, just reaching consensus on the need to fix things might prove to be the most difficult early challenge that we need to master.

Or so it seems to this observer.
 
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We don't solve problems anymore. We create them. Case in point, we can't even establish a workable web-site in the same time frame it took to win WWII.
Hell, even our astronauts have to hitch a ride to get into space.
 
Educators? What do you mean, like philosophers? Yea, I would agree, modern day teachers and professors, not so much, unless we are talking STEM.

There is a lot of overlap between money and elite. Most of the greatest men of the west came from the elite, the aristocracy. Not always a monetary elite, it can be a military or religious elite, but generally military or religious elite had money as well.

That's what "educators" are to you? Philosophers?

Oh my God.

Try to figure out how the computer you are typing on "happened".

Plato and Socrates were philosophers, and teachers as well, for example.

So that's who dragged us into today's "MODERN" world? People dead thousands of years?
 
We don't solve problems anymore. We create them. Case in point, we can't even establish a workable web-site in the same time frame it took to win WWII.
Hell, even our astronauts have to hitch a ride to get into space.

Please. There is more technology in one website servicing a couple of hundred million people than all the technology used in WWII. Airlines decided to honor the free tickets their website gave away. Amazon is still paying for the hundred dollar books it sold for a dollar. How many complaints for even simple technology like X-box and I-pods?

Worse, Republicans have been screaming for years that we need to privatize the space industry. So Obama is doing it, and very successfully, and they insist it's failed, the fuckers.

List of private spaceflight companies
 
We don't solve problems anymore. We create them. Case in point, we can't even establish a workable web-site in the same time frame it took to win WWII.
Hell, even our astronauts have to hitch a ride to get into space.

Please. There is more technology in one website servicing a couple of hundred million people than all the technology used in WWII. Airlines decided to honor the free tickets their website gave away. Amazon is still paying for the hundred dollar books it sold for a dollar. How many complaints for even simple technology like X-box and I-pods?

Worse, Republicans have been screaming for years that we need to privatize the space industry. So Obama is doing it, and very successfully, and they insist it's failed, the fuckers.

List of private spaceflight companies

So we're doing less with more technology.
Thanks for helping to prove the threads' point! :smoke:
 
Personal Opinion:

We have been riding on the back of our victory in WWII for a very, very long time.

The war left us as the only Major Power on the face of the planet which had not suffered grievous damage to our infrastructure and manufacturing plant, and which had not suffered massive civilian casualties alongside its military casualties.

The war fueled our economy in a dozen different ways and propped it up in the postwar years as we floated the 'rebuild' of Europe and several other areas around the world, and as we beat our swords back into plowshares, however imperfectly.

Of course, the advent of the Cold War, and the sporadic outbreak of related Hot Skirmishes, caused us to start spending beyond our means, again, to begin playing World Policeman - given that we were the only ones still capable of fulfilling the role.

But we have been burning through cash and making war on-credit for a long time now in the World Policeman role - and the pseudo-Imperial roles which the Policeman mindset eventually leads to, in small increments - until a nation wakes-up one day to find itself more Imperium than Police Station. I don't think we've sunk quite that far yet, but we may be further along the road to that outcome than we realize without giving it some serious reflection.

Until, it sometimes seems, we can no longer recognize Real Need to Intervene from a sound-byte call-to-arms in today's equivalent of Yellow Journalism rags (and those exist on both the Right AND Left sides of the aisle) planted in those rags by special interest groups.

It seems that we make war at the drop of a hat nowadays, on the thinnest of excuses, for no better reason than because Fearless Leader A or B say we should. And they (leaders) all do it... Left, Right, whatever.

I did find it interesting that the Congress had begun to line itself up, to oppose the President and his Administration's plans to intervene in Syria. I saw that as a hopeful sign of some vague willingness on the part of Congress to begin to revere that war-at-the-drop-of-a-hat trend. But, of course, Vladimir Putin came to the rescue and bailed-out our latest Fearless Leader before the Congress (including one helluva lot of Democrats) could hand him his head back on a platter, in voting-down a Syria adventure.

But, all that aside, on the macro level, and in the final analysis, we are still lurching forward under the momentum of WWII and our victory and the benefits we derived from that victory. But even the colossal advantages gained by a large power remaining intact through a global war - even such a colossal range of advantages are finite, and must come to an end or must level-off and decline, eventually. We're there, and have been already, for some years.

That advantage and that momentum have thinned-out to the point where our forward progress seems to be measured nowadays in fits-and-starts rather than the smoother, more consistent and high-speed progress of those earlier times of the late 1940s and the 1950s and early 1960s.

I, for one, rightly or wrongly, see us in decline in several areas...

* sensible foreign policy, and resultant credibility on the international scene (like the Iraq fiasco)
* manufacturing capability (2001 to 2008 millions of jobs moved to China helped with GOP subsidies)
* macro-level economic planning and oversight and outcomes (GOP calls that socialism)
* the Middle Class - the economic well-being of the majority of our working-age folk (GOP calls them the 47% they won't represent)
* healthcare - with more prospect of further degeneration looming on the near horizon (medical bills the number one cause of bankruptcy. Finally we have a president who is doing something about it. Even with GOP sabotage.)
* sensible provision for our poor (safety net) (Andre Bauer, Michelle Bachmann - don't fee them)
* popular education (magical creation is "popular education". The way to hamstring children)
* science, and space exploration and exploitation (see previous post)
* and other things that I'm forgetting as part of a quick bit of morning extempore

I'm also reasonably confident that we will eventually get our heads out of our asses and fix what's wrong, but it's going to take years - decades, maybe.

But first, we have to come to consensus that we are in need of a 'major overhaul' before we can set about doing it.

Given our present-day extreme political polarization, just reaching consensus on the need to fix things might prove to be the most difficult early challenge that we need to master.

Or so it seems to this observer.

If you want to do anything for this country, you have to stay away from the GOP and their destructive and damaging policies.
 
Perception is everything.

1470091_683432278345307_1272998436_n.jpg

Obama has not cut the deficit in half.

The US national debt has increased exponentially ever since he has been in office. How much do you get paid to post this shit?

U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time
 
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We don't solve problems anymore. We create them. Case in point, we can't even establish a workable web-site in the same time frame it took to win WWII.
Hell, even our astronauts have to hitch a ride to get into space.

Please. There is more technology in one website servicing a couple of hundred million people than all the technology used in WWII. Airlines decided to honor the free tickets their website gave away. Amazon is still paying for the hundred dollar books it sold for a dollar. How many complaints for even simple technology like X-box and I-pods?

Worse, Republicans have been screaming for years that we need to privatize the space industry. So Obama is doing it, and very successfully, and they insist it's failed, the fuckers.

List of private spaceflight companies

So we're doing less with more technology.
Thanks for helping to prove the threads' point! :smoke:

Websites that service hundreds of millions of people? Space planes? You call that "less". That's just dopey.
 
Perception is everything.

1470091_683432278345307_1272998436_n.jpg

Obama has not cut the deficit in half.

The US national debt has increased exponentially ever since he has been in office. How much do you get paid to post this shit?

U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time

He has cut the rate.

Republicans and the Bush Tax Cuts.

The two unfunded wars.

The movement of millions of jobs to China.

The crash of the Deregulated economy.

What has Obama spent the money on? All these things go back to the 6 years the GOP held the entire government hostage. Then they handed that big bag of shit to the Democrats and Obama.
 
.

While the wingers predictably want to point the finger at the "other side", our clear and relatively rapid decay is cultural in its DNA. But that's too complicated to think about; partisan bullshit is much easier.

.

No he has not. You and Neddite are liars of the highest water.
 
.

While the wingers predictably want to point the finger at the "other side", our clear and relatively rapid decay is cultural in its DNA. But that's too complicated to think about; partisan bullshit is much easier.

.

Partisan is very easy when one party is 90% white and is desperately trying to stay in power though subverting democracy, voter suppression and gerrymandering. Kind of hard for them to deny it when so many of their high ranking "party" members admit it.
 
.

While the wingers predictably want to point the finger at the "other side", our clear and relatively rapid decay is cultural in its DNA. But that's too complicated to think about; partisan bullshit is much easier.

.

No he has not. You and Neddite are liars of the highest water.


What are you talking about?

.
 
Please. There is more technology in one website servicing a couple of hundred million people than all the technology used in WWII. Airlines decided to honor the free tickets their website gave away. Amazon is still paying for the hundred dollar books it sold for a dollar. How many complaints for even simple technology like X-box and I-pods?

Worse, Republicans have been screaming for years that we need to privatize the space industry. So Obama is doing it, and very successfully, and they insist it's failed, the fuckers.

List of private spaceflight companies

So we're doing less with more technology.
Thanks for helping to prove the threads' point! :smoke:

Websites that service hundreds of millions of people? Space planes? You call that "less". That's just dopey.

You and Charlie Sheen are in the same zone of winning.........so sad.......


[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pipTwjwrQYQ]CHARLIE SHEEN - WINNING - YouTube[/ame]
 
The biggest loser of WW II ended up being the Marxist, giving military aid to Russia proved to be a grave mistake for millions of innocent people who died because of the life line the USA gave to the Communist.

That kind of ideology does not die over night, the momentum carries it forward, it gets re-branded, the covers are changed on the books, the Marxist give themselves another name and attack the people who gave freedom, liberty, and life to more people than any other Nation in history.

So here is a thread full of dozens of lies, not a thread of fact in the entire thread.

Yes, Socialism, Liberalism, spending beyond their means, destroying countries, starting wars, while pointing their finger at everyone else.
 
Americans see a US in decline, finds Pew survey

BBC World News - 3 December 2013 Last updated at 14:07 ET

For the first time in 40 years, a majority of Americans say the US plays a less important and powerful role in the world than it did a decade ago.

The Pew survey also found that 70% of Americans saw the US as less respected than in the past, nearly the same (71%) as under President George W Bush.

More than half of Americans (52%) - for the first time in 50 years - said the US should "mind its own business".

Some 56% disapproved of President Barack Obama's foreign policy.

Fifty-three percent of the public felt the US played a less important or powerful role as a world leader than a decade previously. The last time more than half of the public held that view was in 1974.

A decade ago, just 20% of Americans felt the same way.

...

The survey also showed support for a less active US in world affairs. Some 51% of respondents said the US does "too much" to solve world problems.

Fifty-three percent of Republicans, 46% of Democrats and 55% of independents said the US should mind its own business.

The public also thought the US should be less engaged internationally.

A plurality of respondents (39%) believed the US should be less involved in seeking to resolve the Israel-Palestinian conflict.

Some 36% thought Washington's current level of engagement in that issue was enough.

But the survey did not suggest an entirely isolationist outlook was taking hold among Americans.

...

President Obama's foreign policy was approved of by only 34% of respondents in the Pew survey.

The public overwhelmingly viewed dimly his handling of Syria, Iran, China and Afghanistan. Only on terrorism did more respondents approve (51%) than disapprove of his approach.

While Islamic extremist groups such as al-Qaeda were still considered the top threat by survey respondents, 70% ranked cyber-attacks from other countries as a major threat, placing them on par with concerns about Iran and North Korean's nuclear programmes.

The survey of the general public was conducted between 30 October and 6 November among 2,003 adults, said Pew Research Center.

BBC News - Americans see a US in decline, finds Pew survey


=========================================

War Exhaustion?

Donor Exhaustion?

Pocketbook Exhaustion?

Surrender Monkeys?

Reality Grounded?

Temporary?

Permanent?

Unwelcome?

About time?

Rubbish?

Even worse than we think?

Your thoughts?

And yet the truth of the matter is that the United States is still the most powerful country on Earth with a military force unequaled in human history. Al Queda isn't the biggest threat, we are. Al Queda doesn't have drones or 500 Minuteman missile silos buried in the ground and ready to fire. We do.

The U.S. still has the largest economy in the world, too, despite the fact that we think it's China. We are still a major manufacturer and exporter (in the top 3 worldwide) of goods and raw resources. And the U.S. dollar is still the international reserve currency.

Want to take your country back, because we are slipping? Turn Congress upside down and shake. And then kick their lousy asses to the curb.

Take the money out of politics and start putting people into office who don't have PACs. Make all the lobbyists inside the Beltway go home. That's what we call a good start.
 
.

While the wingers predictably want to point the finger at the "other side", our clear and relatively rapid decay is cultural in its DNA. But that's too complicated to think about; partisan bullshit is much easier.

.

Partisan is very easy when one party is 90% white and is desperately trying to stay in power though subverting democracy, voter suppression and gerrymandering. Kind of hard for them to deny it when so many of their high ranking "party" members admit it.

Somebody, what is the racist equivalent of Godwin's law? There must be one. Although I must admits surprise that the "R" word was held back this long.
 

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