Abortion as Murder.

[BenNatuf]

For those who claim abortion is a medical procedure and is not killing an innocent human being I have a question.

Dr. Kermit Gosnell, 69, faces eight counts of murder in the deaths of a woman following a botched abortion at his office, along with the deaths of seven other babies who, prosecutors allege, were born alive following illegal late-term abortions and then were killed by severing their spinal cords with a pair of scissors.

would these children have been any less viable had this piece of human trash cut them up in utero as opposed to after birth? If Roe is the standard, and the standard it sets is "viability", how is a fetus, any fetus, unviable after about 4 1/2 months of pregnancy? All of them are viable given proper medical care, so what is the difference between murdering them in utero or out?

Philly Abortion Doctor Facing 8 Counts Of Murder CBS Philly – News, Sports, Weather, Traffic and the Best of Philadelphia

I predict the whole abortion issue will be settled in this thread.

Good thing you thought of these points and made this entirely novel thread.

maybe you actually have something cogent to add to it?


Nah, that would be out of character for you.

 

[BenNatuf]

So your telling me you don't want to be responsible for feeding and clothing the kids? I understand, taking care of children is very expensive isn't it? and from what you are saying, you don't want any financial responsibility for kids that are not yours, I understand. What you are saying is true, people need to responsible for their actions and need to take precautions when they have sex but this is far from a perfect world, women get pregnant unexpectedly everyday, and they have been since the beginning of time. We are never going to get to a point where everyone is responsible and plans to have children. Abortion needs to be available because even though you disagree with it, you just basically said right now you want nothing to do with providing financial support for these unwanted children.

That's the thing I don't disagree with abortion legally.....up to a point. I used to be super anti-abortion. None at anytime for any reason. Now, the more I like it the more I think in terms of abortion anyway Roe v. Wade got it right. My problem is the killing of innocent people. I believe at some point in a pregnancy a fetus is biologically a human being, a person. There is also a stage in a pregnancy where that sack of cells is clearly not a person. I don't have any legal issues with allowing abortions during that time period. I may find it irresponsible, but the harsh reality is all your doing is expelling a collection of cells. The point is it takes an awful lot of bad choices to get to the latter portion of a pregnancy where you're put in the position of having to choose to kill an innocent life. And at some point people need to be held accountable.

Oh I definently agree people need to be held accountable, from what I understand most women who do get abortions have a heavy weight on their soul afterwards.

So do most people who bash kids with hammers, but we don't leave them walking around.

 

[BenNatuf]

hey fucktard the fetus is nothing more than a parasite.
You are a wad of cells you moron, and given your name and post here, you are worth about as much as jizz rag.

i dont care if you want to call it killing. In the eyes of the law its not, and in my eyes its none of your stupid fucks business.

I am not seeing your education here....Must be missing like an aborted fetus.

No one is seeing your 'education' either. You're right though, it is a very simple concept. Murder is murder is murder is murder. You say it's no one's business but yours? Well in every other case of the killing of an innocent human being the state has decided it is indeed someone elses business. There are only two ways to even attempt to legally or morally justify abortion. 1) You define a whatever you want to call it in the womb as somthing less than a person or human being for the whole nine months until it is born, therefore you can't murder what is not human, or 2) you acknowledge at some point in the pregnancy that a fetus is a human person, but murder in that case is justifiable somehow. Pick one.

its not murder.
fetus do not have the protection of the state.so that angle is a fail.

yes they do and Roe and Casey are what says they do. A viable fetus is a person entitled to protections. Granted the court used up some circular logic in granting the state had an interest in protecting them while also attempting top claim they are not "persons". That is the inconsistancy. if the state has an interest, they must be persons as the state only has an interest in protecting a persons life, liberty or property. They have no interest in lumps of flesh

lets say they did..its still not the state nor yours business.
i feel the sameway about drugs,food,and seatbelts.
its not my problem.

murder is the states business.

 

[BenNatuf]

I noticed everyone who supports abortion, has already been born.

i've noticed that a lot of people who OPPOSE abortion spend a LOT of time sharpening their guns getting ready for the next civil war so they can kill as many liberals and democrats as possible.....

We're against the killing of innocents

 

[BenNatuf]

then change the law, till then shut the fuck up and mind your own business.
Im sure the theory has been tested, but i dont care enough to go looking.....its not that important to me, nothing is going to change anyways.
Ill strike a deal with you, You can call tell women what to do with their bodies, so long as those women in return get to hit you in the face with a baseball bat each time you decide if they should have the kid or not.

That seems fair.

No, it hasn't. And if "shut the fuck up and mind your own business" is the extent of your debating skill... well, it's pretty laughable. The baby is not "their body" it is a seperate and distinct human being by any deffinition. That however is not the issue, the issue here is the legality of killing a viable fetus. When you finally wrap your mind around that (could be a while... I know), let us know.

are you such a RETARD that you dont understand the concept

WE all agree once the baby is born its murder to kill it . no one disagrees on that point and it isnt your business and should,nt be the govt,s what another human does with there body .

the baby is not their body

your definition is wrong and bigoted

when i need your opinion on my opinion... well, lets just say that ain't gonna happen

the featus is in FACT part of the mothers body it is not as you suggest a * seperate and distinct human* from her,
without her it would not servive

are you completely ignorant? The thread is about VIABLE fetus'. That would be those that WOULD survive outside of the mothers body. So while you're thinking up neat words to insult me with maybe next time you can actually come armed with a relevant argument.

, if she doesnt care to assist and support it in its development it will die , only she has control of that .as was pointed out in a previous post its a parasite

false, if that were true, they wouldn't be VIABLE fetus'.

in the 3rd trimester it is viable meaning it MAY servive with help from ANY human not just the mother .
Thats the concept you dont understand

read and learn meathead

it seems to be what YOU don't understand, medical science has pushed back the date of viability to about 4 1/2 months, that would be BEFORE the third trimester. next time you attempt to "educate" me maybe you should come armed with one, or perhaps just some basic reading comprehension.

 

[BenNatuf]

its not murder.
fetus do not have the protection of the state.so that angle is a fail.
lets say they did..its still not the state nor yours business.
i feel the sameway about drugs,food,and seatbelts.
its not my problem.

Unfortunately for your argument the state's basis is not a scientific one. It's a legal one. If you have TO tell yourself you're not committing murder through late term abortions because the state doesn't recognize a child in the womb as a human being, that ought to tell you something about the weakness of your argument.

It's also a little disturbing that you you think something that is alive is comparable to things that aren't.

Your moving those goal posts. I have no issue limiting 3rd trimester abortions to just if the mother is in danger etc.....i already stated such. If you are just going to make shit up and assign to me, ill move on. I dont debate retards

it is VIABILITY that is the issue not some artificial time constraint. Once viable the fetus is legally a person the state has an interest in protecting.

 

[BenNatuf]

then change the law, till then shut the fuck up and mind your own business.

how does one work to change the law while "shutting the fuck up and minding thier own business"?

Perhaps you could use some lessons in logical reasoning?

Im sure the theory has been tested, but i dont care enough to go looking.....its not that important to me, nothing is going to change anyways.

Casey already changed it some. VIABILITY is the standard not the mechanics of the trimester system

 

[BenNatuf]

For anyone who chooses i would like to see some cogent response to how the fact that medical science has progressed to the point that virtually every fetus that is the product of a normal preganancy is viable at 4 1/2months does not create an inconsistancy in Roe's mechanics. Roe stated quite clearly that the state does have an interest in protecting the life of viable persons, thats why they set up the mechanics of the trimester system. At the time virtually no baby born at less than 8 months lived. Now, children are born regularly and survive at 4 1/2 months showing conclusively that medical science has changed the point of viability considerably. If the states interest in protecting viable persons that Roe set up is to be honored, how is the trimester system consistant with it?

This case may highlight that inconsistancy and force the courts to revisit Roe if they wish to remain consistant with it. If the state has an interest in protecting viable persons then the trimester system prevents them from doing so.

What branch of medical science made that claim? OB/GYN? OB/GYNs happen to be the failures in Medical School. Did you know that?

Maybe someone smart should take the time to show them films of human egg and sperm interactions. I call that viable as viable can get.

what claim? I didn't say any branch of medical science made any claim.

I'll do some research on who and what in medical science has made those claims and will most assuredly post what I found. I expect to find a bunch of phony science in that deal.

It appears what they've done is attempt to redefine real science in favor of pseudo-science to support their wild claims. I expect to find a massive con job.

good luck Mr. Phelps. We know medical science has pushed viability back beyond the third trimester because children are born before then who live. You don't need a study to know that.

 

[BenNatuf]

are you a fucking retard?
I said in the eyes of the law, a fetus is not living and therefore you can not be brought up for murder. Otherwise a whole lot of women would be going to jail.

nevermind strike that, you are a fucking retard.

If the fetus is a wad of cells like you suggest, then the fetus is alive considering that HUMAN CELLS ARE LIVING ORGANISMS........They're actually considered by science to be the smallest unit of living organisms... Not saying I am on anyone's side, but your wad of cell argument is kind of retarded as well.

I think the distincition is of course they are alive, but at what point in gestation is it considered a human being or a peson.

Viability

 

[BenNatuf]

Is everyone who doesn't support abortion ok with people dropping those babies off at their houses once their born? we will see how long they stay anti abortion when they have to come out of pocket to support those kids.

Whether you believe people are selfish or not is irrelevant to the question.

Roe is incoinsistant in that it grants that states do have an interest in preserving the life of viable unborn persons, it then negates any and all action the state might do to actually protect those persons. These persons which is what Roe MUST describe them as, as the state has NO interest in preserving non-living, non-person, lumps of flesh, by virtue of the 14th amendment are entitled to the same protections under the law as any other person. Including having their murederers brought to justice.

Seriously I do not understand his opinion that if people actually had to take care of the child themselves they would suddenly start believing just killing them is a better answer. That is actually a very bizarre and totally off-the-wall thing to say. Does he think if people had to personally accept toddlers being dropped off at the doorstep they would suddenly believe killing them was suddenly acceptable? Or if people had to accept troubled teenagers being dropped off at their door they would suddenly approve of killing teenagers? You are not going to get a rational discussion from someone who has already made it clear that the shared humanity of others is insufficient for him to oppose killing them. Which frankly gives me the creeps. Our laws are not based on whether anyone is willing to take personal responsibility for someone before objecting to them being killed. It is based on their shared humanity alone that is sufficient justification for opposing their murders. But he is repeatedly insisting that is NOT sufficient.

I think this person has some serious emotional baggage of a very personal nature that has left him incapable of a dispassionate and rational discussion on the issue and why most of his posts are really just rage-filled rantings.

Or quite possibly ranting filled rages. Maybe he's off his meds?

 

[Father Time]

I noticed everyone who supports abortion, has already been born.

That's not clever in the least.

But fine I'll paraphrase Carlin

"The only people who care about the sanctity of life are living people. You never see dead people talking about how special life is"

 

[BrianH]

are you a fucking retard?
I said in the eyes of the law, a fetus is not living and therefore you can not be brought up for murder. Otherwise a whole lot of women would be going to jail.

nevermind strike that, you are a fucking retard.

If the fetus is a wad of cells like you suggest, then the fetus is alive considering that HUMAN CELLS ARE LIVING ORGANISMS........They're actually considered by science to be the smallest unit of living organisms... Not saying I am on anyone's side, but your wad of cell argument is kind of retarded as well.

I think the distincition is of course they are alive, but at what point in gestation is it considered a human being or a peson.

That's the question...and unfortunately, the answer is an opinion. IMO, that heart beats pretty early in the pregnancy...

 

[High_Gravity]

Is everyone who doesn't support abortion ok with people dropping those babies off at their houses once their born? we will see how long they stay anti abortion when they have to come out of pocket to support those kids.

Whether you believe people are selfish or not is irrelevant to the question.

Roe is incoinsistant in that it grants that states do have an interest in preserving the life of viable unborn persons, it then negates any and all action the state might do to actually protect those persons. These persons which is what Roe MUST describe them as, as the state has NO interest in preserving non-living, non-person, lumps of flesh, by virtue of the 14th amendment are entitled to the same protections under the law as any other person. Including having their murederers brought to justice.

Whatever you don't have any interest in these kids either, your not doing anything to help but sitting here typing bullshit. At least people who are ok with abortion are honest, you anti abortion clowns are the biggest fucking liars I ever seen in my life.

 

[High_Gravity]

First of all I'm a woman and apparently you didn't bother to read an earlier post of mine. Your foul mouthed rantings are NEVER going to affect my opinion on this you immoral asshole. FOR A REASON!

I

I suspect the real reason you are engaging in this overblown insane raging rants -is because you probably pressured a woman to kill your child and she did. SO LIVE WITH IT NOW and stop demanding everyone else needs to change their opinion about it in order to make you feel better about what you had done to your own child. It is no one's job to make you feel better about it.

.

You know what I don't give a fuck what you are man or woman, you are bat shit crazy and that is evident by your posts. I am not denying whether the babies that are aborted are humans or not you are putting words in my mouth and creating a strawman. I stand by what I said, you are all talk, full of shit and just a big liar. If you were put on the spot and a few women who were thinking of having abortions asked you if you would help raise their children so they wouldn't have to get the abortion, you would fold like a fucking belt, spout off with some ridiculous rhetoric and flee. You have said nothing to prove that you have done anything to help the orphans that are currently alive so why do you give a fuck about people having abortions? You don't give a fuck about these dead kids so stop fucking lying, you care about yourself and your family thats it.

Your nonstop overblown rage-filled rantings confirms what I suspected in the first place -see above.

Your opinion is irrelevant and extremist. It is WOMEN who oppose abortion in the first place. Your phony bullshit about caring about women when it comes to abortion is just that -BULLSHIT. WOMEN disagree with you about abortion and they disagree that supporting abortion is "caring" about women! You can't deal with that. And even though you want to convince yourself that women who go have an abortion would back YOU up on this -think again. A woman who has had an abortion herself is 6 times more likely to become a pro-life activist than a pro-abortion one.

The majority of ALL women reject the opinion of men like you -whether they have had an abortion themselves or are facing an unwanted pregnancy right at this minute or never had a child. The majority of ALL women disagree with YOUR insistence there is nothing wrong if they kill their unborn child. THEY say there is. Deal with it and since they are the ones left holding the bag, THEIR opinion counts for a hell of a lot more than yours.

Any intelligent woman can figure out why you are so hot under the collar about the topic. No doubt pretended to be oh so caring when you drove a woman to an abortion clinic to make sure she killed your kid, huh. And heaved a big sigh of relief that you were off the hook. But she couldn't deal with it later and dumped you like a sack of rotten potatoes. Too bad. But telling yourself there was nothing immoral about what happened is a lie. And you know it which is why you keep doing the insane ranting thing -hoping someone will agree with you. Doesn't matter if someone does or not -because it is the vast majority of the women in the first place who disagree with YOU about it, reject your phony "concern" for them, reject your opinion that a woman's convenience is more important than someone's life - and don't want your opinion to prevail. Deal with it and get over yourself because the majority women already have. Its time to deal with why YOU would support something in the phony pretense of "caring" for women when it is women themselves who REJECT that as "caring" and oppose abortion on demand.

Looking for company won't ease your guilty conscience -coming to grips with it and insuring it doesn't happen again is your only hope. Not trying to spread the evil. If you go back to your first rage-filled foul mouthed insanely ranting post -the one you were responding to was nothing like that. It was the first clue that this is something really personal for you and why you so quickly went off the deep end about it. Its personal for me too but for a different reason and your need to ease your guilty conscience is never going to change my opinion on this issue.

Your typing all this useless nonsense but you haven't lifted a finger to help any kids in your real life, all you have is a bunch of hype and alot of useless rhetoric, shame on you.

 

[Bern80]

If the fetus is a wad of cells like you suggest, then the fetus is alive considering that HUMAN CELLS ARE LIVING ORGANISMS........They're actually considered by science to be the smallest unit of living organisms... Not saying I am on anyone's side, but your wad of cell argument is kind of retarded as well.

I think the distincition is of course they are alive, but at what point in gestation is it considered a human being or a peson.

That's the question...and unfortunately, the answer is an opinion. IMO, that heart beats pretty early in the pregnancy...

I don't think it's an opinion so much as there is no real black and white line you can draw that says prior to this day in a pregnancy it isn't a person and after it is.

I guess what I don't understand is that if Roe's ruling was no abortions if the fetus is viable, why we don't prosecute people that have abortions when they are indeed viable for murder. Do we prosecute them for anything at all?

 

[frazzledgear]

You know what I don't give a fuck what you are man or woman, you are bat shit crazy and that is evident by your posts. I am not denying whether the babies that are aborted are humans or not you are putting words in my mouth and creating a strawman. I stand by what I said, you are all talk, full of shit and just a big liar. If you were put on the spot and a few women who were thinking of having abortions asked you if you would help raise their children so they wouldn't have to get the abortion, you would fold like a fucking belt, spout off with some ridiculous rhetoric and flee. You have said nothing to prove that you have done anything to help the orphans that are currently alive so why do you give a fuck about people having abortions? You don't give a fuck about these dead kids so stop fucking lying, you care about yourself and your family thats it.

Your nonstop overblown rage-filled rantings confirms what I suspected in the first place -see above.

Your opinion is irrelevant and extremist. It is WOMEN who oppose abortion in the first place. Your phony bullshit about caring about women when it comes to abortion is just that -BULLSHIT. WOMEN disagree with you about abortion and they disagree that supporting abortion is "caring" about women! You can't deal with that. And even though you want to convince yourself that women who go have an abortion would back YOU up on this -think again. A woman who has had an abortion herself is 6 times more likely to become a pro-life activist than a pro-abortion one.

The majority of ALL women reject the opinion of men like you -whether they have had an abortion themselves or are facing an unwanted pregnancy right at this minute or never had a child. The majority of ALL women disagree with YOUR insistence there is nothing wrong if they kill their unborn child. THEY say there is. Deal with it and since they are the ones left holding the bag, THEIR opinion counts for a hell of a lot more than yours.

Any intelligent woman can figure out why you are so hot under the collar about the topic. No doubt pretended to be oh so caring when you drove a woman to an abortion clinic to make sure she killed your kid, huh. And heaved a big sigh of relief that you were off the hook. But she couldn't deal with it later and dumped you like a sack of rotten potatoes. Too bad. But telling yourself there was nothing immoral about what happened is a lie. And you know it which is why you keep doing the insane ranting thing -hoping someone will agree with you. Doesn't matter if someone does or not -because it is the vast majority of the women in the first place who disagree with YOU about it, reject your phony "concern" for them, reject your opinion that a woman's convenience is more important than someone's life - and don't want your opinion to prevail. Deal with it and get over yourself because the majority women already have. Its time to deal with why YOU would support something in the phony pretense of "caring" for women when it is women themselves who REJECT that as "caring" and oppose abortion on demand.

Looking for company won't ease your guilty conscience -coming to grips with it and insuring it doesn't happen again is your only hope. Not trying to spread the evil. If you go back to your first rage-filled foul mouthed insanely ranting post -the one you were responding to was nothing like that. It was the first clue that this is something really personal for you and why you so quickly went off the deep end about it. Its personal for me too but for a different reason and your need to ease your guilty conscience is never going to change my opinion on this issue.

Your typing all this useless nonsense but you haven't lifted a finger to help any kids in your real life, all you have is a bunch of hype and alot of useless rhetoric, shame on you.

I would always rather be in the group of people who object to the murder of another human being for no reason but the fact they are human -than be among those who insist there is nothing immoral about killing someone just because their existence is "inconvenient".

Quit pretending you know a damn thing about me for a change. You aren't even close and you know that old saying about happens when you ASSUME something, right? It is just a CHILDISH stunt to try and deflect the discussion from this issue. This is how IMMATURE brains deal with issues that make them uncomfortable -they always try to just change the subject. So enough with this total bullshit that no one is entitled to an opinion that differs from your own unless they personally take responsibility for the children of someone else. THAT hasn't got a damn thing to do with anything at all. NO ONE is required to take personal responsibility for someone before they can legitimately object to their murder and it is mindbogglingly revolting that you would think otherwise! It means you don't even have a real foundation to your morals -it all hinges on how it PERSONALLY affects you before you decide something is right or wrong. That is exactly how the mind of a sociopath works -someone whose higher brain functions are more in line with that of a reptile than a human.

So you and your self-centered, inhumane, self-justifying total lack of morals have the balls to say "shame on ME?" Wow, very sick. What "shame" exists for defending the right of someone to keep their life? I don't have to be personally willing to take care of YOU to object to your murder. Oh THAT you have no problem with if its YOUR life I object to being murdered!! And you WANT people to object if its YOUR murder. I get it now. Its just taking the life of someone ELSE you have no problem with! Enough with your disgusting insistence that someone must be willing to take personal responsibility for someone before they can legitimately object to their murder. I'll NEVER EVER be willing to take personal responsibility for you -but I still object to your murder anyway.

Shame on YOU for believing these are the least bit connected issues you amoral crocodile.

 

[High_Gravity]

Your nonstop overblown rage-filled rantings confirms what I suspected in the first place -see above.

Your opinion is irrelevant and extremist. It is WOMEN who oppose abortion in the first place. Your phony bullshit about caring about women when it comes to abortion is just that -BULLSHIT. WOMEN disagree with you about abortion and they disagree that supporting abortion is "caring" about women! You can't deal with that. And even though you want to convince yourself that women who go have an abortion would back YOU up on this -think again. A woman who has had an abortion herself is 6 times more likely to become a pro-life activist than a pro-abortion one.

The majority of ALL women reject the opinion of men like you -whether they have had an abortion themselves or are facing an unwanted pregnancy right at this minute or never had a child. The majority of ALL women disagree with YOUR insistence there is nothing wrong if they kill their unborn child. THEY say there is. Deal with it and since they are the ones left holding the bag, THEIR opinion counts for a hell of a lot more than yours.

Any intelligent woman can figure out why you are so hot under the collar about the topic. No doubt pretended to be oh so caring when you drove a woman to an abortion clinic to make sure she killed your kid, huh. And heaved a big sigh of relief that you were off the hook. But she couldn't deal with it later and dumped you like a sack of rotten potatoes. Too bad. But telling yourself there was nothing immoral about what happened is a lie. And you know it which is why you keep doing the insane ranting thing -hoping someone will agree with you. Doesn't matter if someone does or not -because it is the vast majority of the women in the first place who disagree with YOU about it, reject your phony "concern" for them, reject your opinion that a woman's convenience is more important than someone's life - and don't want your opinion to prevail. Deal with it and get over yourself because the majority women already have. Its time to deal with why YOU would support something in the phony pretense of "caring" for women when it is women themselves who REJECT that as "caring" and oppose abortion on demand.

Looking for company won't ease your guilty conscience -coming to grips with it and insuring it doesn't happen again is your only hope. Not trying to spread the evil. If you go back to your first rage-filled foul mouthed insanely ranting post -the one you were responding to was nothing like that. It was the first clue that this is something really personal for you and why you so quickly went off the deep end about it. Its personal for me too but for a different reason and your need to ease your guilty conscience is never going to change my opinion on this issue.

Your typing all this useless nonsense but you haven't lifted a finger to help any kids in your real life, all you have is a bunch of hype and alot of useless rhetoric, shame on you.

I would always rather be in the group of people who object to the murder of another human being for no reason but the fact they are human -than be among those who insist there is nothing immoral about killing someone just because their existence is "inconvenient".

Quit pretending you know a damn thing about me for a change. You aren't even close and you know that old saying about happens when you ASSUME something, right? It is just a CHILDISH stunt to try and deflect the discussion from this issue. This is how IMMATURE brains deal with issues that make them uncomfortable -they always try to just change the subject. So enough with this total bullshit that no one is entitled to an opinion that differs from your own unless they personally take responsibility for the children of someone else. THAT hasn't got a damn thing to do with anything at all. NO ONE is required to take personal responsibility for someone before they can legitimately object to their murder and it is mindbogglingly revolting that you would think otherwise! It means you don't even have a real foundation to your morals -it all hinges on how it PERSONALLY affects you before you decide something is right or wrong. That is exactly how the mind of a sociopath works -someone whose higher brain functions are more in line with that of a reptile than a human.

So you and your self-centered, inhumane, self-justifying total lack of morals have the balls to say "shame on ME?" Wow, very sick. What "shame" exists for defending the right of someone to keep their life? I don't have to be personally willing to take care of YOU to object to your murder. Oh THAT you have no problem with if its YOUR life I object to being murdered!! And you WANT people to object if its YOUR murder. I get it now. Its just taking the life of someone ELSE you have no problem with! Enough with your disgusting insistence that someone must be willing to take personal responsibility for someone before they can legitimately object to their murder. I'll NEVER EVER be willing to take personal responsibility for you -but I still object to your murder anyway.

Shame on YOU for believing these are the least bit connected issues you amoral crocodile.

Keep posting your lies bitch, so I can laugh at you. You have done nothing to help unwanted children, so why do you care about babies being aborted? secretly you do agree with abortions because you want nothing to do with taking care of someone elses kids.

 

[Bern80]

Your typing all this useless nonsense but you haven't lifted a finger to help any kids in your real life, all you have is a bunch of hype and alot of useless rhetoric, shame on you.

I would always rather be in the group of people who object to the murder of another human being for no reason but the fact they are human -than be among those who insist there is nothing immoral about killing someone just because their existence is "inconvenient".

Quit pretending you know a damn thing about me for a change. You aren't even close and you know that old saying about happens when you ASSUME something, right? It is just a CHILDISH stunt to try and deflect the discussion from this issue. This is how IMMATURE brains deal with issues that make them uncomfortable -they always try to just change the subject. So enough with this total bullshit that no one is entitled to an opinion that differs from your own unless they personally take responsibility for the children of someone else. THAT hasn't got a damn thing to do with anything at all. NO ONE is required to take personal responsibility for someone before they can legitimately object to their murder and it is mindbogglingly revolting that you would think otherwise! It means you don't even have a real foundation to your morals -it all hinges on how it PERSONALLY affects you before you decide something is right or wrong. That is exactly how the mind of a sociopath works -someone whose higher brain functions are more in line with that of a reptile than a human.

So you and your self-centered, inhumane, self-justifying total lack of morals have the balls to say "shame on ME?" Wow, very sick. What "shame" exists for defending the right of someone to keep their life? I don't have to be personally willing to take care of YOU to object to your murder. Oh THAT you have no problem with if its YOUR life I object to being murdered!! And you WANT people to object if its YOUR murder. I get it now. Its just taking the life of someone ELSE you have no problem with! Enough with your disgusting insistence that someone must be willing to take personal responsibility for someone before they can legitimately object to their murder. I'll NEVER EVER be willing to take personal responsibility for you -but I still object to your murder anyway.

Shame on YOU for believing these are the least bit connected issues you amoral crocodile.

Keep posting your lies bitch, so I can laugh at you. You have done nothing to help unwanted children, so why do you care about babies being aborted? secretly you do agree with abortions because you want nothing to do with taking care of someone elses kids.

High, you don't get it. You never will. She's right. People like you have ZERO moral integrity. Your principles are for sale obviously when the situation personally affects you.

You also don't get the fundamental difference that gives those that would not choose to have more children the right to object to those who kill the unborn they did choose to become and stay pregnant with.

 

[High_Gravity]

I would always rather be in the group of people who object to the murder of another human being for no reason but the fact they are human -than be among those who insist there is nothing immoral about killing someone just because their existence is "inconvenient".

Quit pretending you know a damn thing about me for a change. You aren't even close and you know that old saying about happens when you ASSUME something, right? It is just a CHILDISH stunt to try and deflect the discussion from this issue. This is how IMMATURE brains deal with issues that make them uncomfortable -they always try to just change the subject. So enough with this total bullshit that no one is entitled to an opinion that differs from your own unless they personally take responsibility for the children of someone else. THAT hasn't got a damn thing to do with anything at all. NO ONE is required to take personal responsibility for someone before they can legitimately object to their murder and it is mindbogglingly revolting that you would think otherwise! It means you don't even have a real foundation to your morals -it all hinges on how it PERSONALLY affects you before you decide something is right or wrong. That is exactly how the mind of a sociopath works -someone whose higher brain functions are more in line with that of a reptile than a human.

So you and your self-centered, inhumane, self-justifying total lack of morals have the balls to say "shame on ME?" Wow, very sick. What "shame" exists for defending the right of someone to keep their life? I don't have to be personally willing to take care of YOU to object to your murder. Oh THAT you have no problem with if its YOUR life I object to being murdered!! And you WANT people to object if its YOUR murder. I get it now. Its just taking the life of someone ELSE you have no problem with! Enough with your disgusting insistence that someone must be willing to take personal responsibility for someone before they can legitimately object to their murder. I'll NEVER EVER be willing to take personal responsibility for you -but I still object to your murder anyway.

Shame on YOU for believing these are the least bit connected issues you amoral crocodile.

Keep posting your lies bitch, so I can laugh at you. You have done nothing to help unwanted children, so why do you care about babies being aborted? secretly you do agree with abortions because you want nothing to do with taking care of someone elses kids.

High, you don't get it. You never will. She's right. People like you have ZERO moral integrity. Your principles are for sale obviously when the situation personally affects you.

You also don't get the fundamental difference that gives those that would not choose to have more children the right to object to those who kill the unborn they did choose to become and stay pregnant with.

Morals and integrity don't pay the bills, there are plenty of people with good morals that end up homeless on the streets. Bottom line is if a woman is unable to care for a child and wants to get an abortion its none of your business, unless your willing to step in and adopt a couple of these would be aborted kids but not you or frazzledgear are willing to do that, you offer nothing but useless rhetoric.

 

[BenNatuf]

Is everyone who doesn't support abortion ok with people dropping those babies off at their houses once their born? we will see how long they stay anti abortion when they have to come out of pocket to support those kids.

Whether you believe people are selfish or not is irrelevant to the question.

Roe is incoinsistant in that it grants that states do have an interest in preserving the life of viable unborn persons, it then negates any and all action the state might do to actually protect those persons. These persons which is what Roe MUST describe them as, as the state has NO interest in preserving non-living, non-person, lumps of flesh, by virtue of the 14th amendment are entitled to the same protections under the law as any other person. Including having their murederers brought to justice.

Whatever you don't have any interest in these kids either, your not doing anything to help but sitting here typing bullshit. At least people who are ok with abortion are honest, you anti abortion clowns are the biggest fucking liars I ever seen in my life.

You don't know me, you don't know anything about me, and if "fuck you faggot" was the best you could come up with when you dissed me then you're not a very imaginative homophobe. When you have something to add about the subject instead of fantasizing about posters... come back and try again. And try to stay on topic.