A World Without Capitalism and Tradable Shares?

[Andylusion]

Oh joy! Another commie circle-jerk. Someday - the state will run everyfuckingthing and you'll be in heaven.

Did you even bother to peruse the 4-minute read or consider the author's credentials?
Economist and Former Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis to Give 2020 Gamble Memorial Lecture | College of Social & Behavioral Sciences

Imagining a world without capitalism – Financial News – Yanis Varoufakis

"Imagine that shares resemble electoral votes, which can be neither bought nor sold.

"Like students who receive a library card upon registration, new staff receive a single share granting a single vote to be cast in all-shareholder ballots deciding every matter of the corporation – from management and planning issues to the distribution of net revenues and bonuses.

"Suddenly, the profit-wage distinction makes no sense and corporations are cut down to size, boosting market competition.

"When a baby is born, the central bank automatically grants her or him a trust fund (or personal capital account) that is periodically topped up with a universal basic dividend.

"When the child becomes a teenager, the central bank throws in a free checking account.

"Workers move freely from company to company, carrying with them their trust-fund capital, which they may lend to the company they work in or to others.

"Because there are no equities to turbocharge with massive fictitious capital, finance becomes delightfully boring — and stable.

"States drop all personal and sales taxes, instead taxing only corporate revenues, land, and activities detrimental to the commons."

How would you vote on taxing only corporate revenues, land, and activities detrimental to the commons?

Have you checked this guys credentials? Because I knew this guy, before you posted here. Do you know anything about what this guy was involved in?

This guy is a complete and total idiot, and all you have do is read up his 'credentials'.

1. Both of his parents were activist members of the Socialist party in Greece known as PASOK.

2. He joined the communist party in the UK, a system which has destroyed every country that ever tried it.

3. He was involved with the wildly corrupt African National Congress, and the terrorist PLO.

4. He joined "The Black Student Alliance" and when everyone pointed out 'hey stupid, you are not black' his response was "that black was a political term and, as a Greek, on the grounds of ethnicity he had as much reason to be there as anyone else."

You really don't need more proof than that, that this guy is an idiot... but there is more proof, so I'll continue.

5. He returned to Greece, where he became advisor to George Papandreou, who the leader of PASOK the socialist party of Greece. The exact same party that led Greece straight into the economic ruins of the 2010s.

6. After trying to distance himself from PASOK which destroyed the country, he joined Syriza. Syriza was the NEW socialist party to replace the destroyed socialist party.

Because socialists never learn. They never do. No matter how many die, how much the economy declines, they simply act like toddlers and find someone to blame.

Syriza gained power by promising Greeks that they would 'force' the EU to give them loans without requiring austerity. Instead they bankrupted the country again, and defaulted on their loans, dragging out the crash for years.

Did you even bother to peruse the 4-minute read or consider the author's credentials?

So to answer your question.... YES.... We did check his credentials which is EXACTLY why we know his advice and theories are trash.

This guy has done nothing but get involved in disasters since he's been alive. He is a train wreck in human form.

But wait.... wait wait..... I'll tell you what..... I'm open minded. I am. This 20 year long train wreck, is still in office. He is a member of the Greek Parliament.

You tell this idiot, to put in place his plans you just posted here, in Greece. Do that. Have him make those all those plans, happen in Greece. Let's see what happens. Because I already know, but you want to believe in myths. Here's your chance to prove the myth. Put that plan in place, in Greece. It's not like they haven't had several economic crashes, might as well go for another, if you think his plan is so brilliant. Do it. Prove it to us, by actually doing it. Let's see how it works for 5 years.

 

[Andylusion]

Dude...just get a fucking job and pay your own way.

Bro...I've done my time working for the one percent.
I retired in 2012.
Some day you will understand (maybe)

What do you mean "done your time"? There is no point in time, where you are just magically entitled to the hard work of others.

And by the way, you were not working for the 1%. You were working for you. And when you live off the government, you are not living of the 1%, you are living off the hard work of others. You are a leech. A blood sucking tick on the butt of society.

 

[Andylusion]

Trump was nothing more than a lesser evil alternative. He was about as much as I could stomach to keep the Marxist horde from overrunning the FedGov, but now that is a certainty.

You're about 75 years too late to worry about any Marxist hordes. Big business Republicans and Jim Crow Democrats took care of that problem immediately after FDR died:

Organized labor's decline in the US is well-known. But what drove it? | Richard Wolff

"Organized labor's decline in the US over the past half century is well-known; what drove that decline, less so.

"The New Deal's enemies – big business, Republicans, conservatives – had developed a coordinated strategy by the late 1940s.

"They would break up the coalition of organized labor, socialist and communist parties: the mass base that had forced through the 1930s New Deal.

"Then each coalition member could be individually destroyed."

By the time Carter came to office Democrats began the process of abandoning working class voters, and Clinton sealed the deal with NAFTA and worse.

What does Jim Crow have to do with anything else you posted? You just randomly string unconnected phrases together, as if they have anything to do with each other.

 

[georgephillip]

Only the brainwashed minions of the Democrat Reich claim Trump was responsible for the COVID shutdown. I say "claim" rather than "believe" because even they don't believe it..

One year ago today (2/7/2020) the US reported its first COVID death; how many lies has Don the Con told since then?

 

[georgephillip]

If not capitalism and free markets then what?

Consider the possibility that Democracy is not compatible with capitalism but fascism is.

"Economic democracy is a socioeconomic philosophy that proposes to shift decision-making power from corporate managers and corporate shareholders to a larger group of public stakeholders that includes workers, customers, suppliers, neighbours and the broader public."

Economic democracy - Wikipedia.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

If not capitalism and free markets then what?

Consider the possibility that Democracy is not compatible with capitalism but fascism is.
View attachment 454247
"Economic democracy is a socioeconomic philosophy that proposes to shift decision-making power from corporate managers and corporate shareholders to a larger group of public stakeholders that includes workers, customers, suppliers, neighbours and the broader public."

Economic democracy - Wikipedia.

I'm not willing to give up my shares to any "public stakeholders".
If they want to vote my shares, they can buy them from me.

 

[georgephillip]

Those shares would be worth exactly what you paid for them.

To speculators.

"Money, as Karl Marx lamented, plays the largest part in determining the course of history.

"Once speculators are able to concentrate wealth into their hands they have, throughout history, emasculated government, turned the press into lap dogs and courtiers, corrupted the courts and hollowed out public institutions, including universities, to justify their looting and greed."

Overthrow the Speculators

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Those shares would be worth exactly what you paid for them.

To speculators.

"Money, as Karl Marx lamented, plays the largest part in determining the course of history.

"Once speculators are able to concentrate wealth into their hands they have, throughout history, emasculated government, turned the press into lap dogs and courtiers, corrupted the courts and hollowed out public institutions, including universities, to justify their looting and greed."

Overthrow the Speculators

"Money, as Karl Marx lamented, plays the largest part in determining the course of history.

Whined the loser who couldn't hold a real job.

 

[georgephillip]

LOL - "As Marx foretold ..." - love the reverent tone.

Context is important to all except partisan hacks and Hoppean snakes:

"Increasingly stressed and justifiably guilt-ridden, the ultra-rich—or those with any sense, at any rate—feel threatened by the crushing precariousness into which the majority are sinking.

"As Marx foretold, they form a supremely powerful minority that is proving unfit to preside over polarized societies that cannot guarantee non-asset owners a decent existence."

Opinion | A world without capitalism is not too hard to envision

 

[georgephillip]

So everyone gets an equal say. Steve Jobs has exactly as much influence as Carrot Top. Lovely.

Some German corporations already have union members with voting privileges sitting on their boards of directors, and some of those worker votes prevented German corporations from outsourcing their jobs to China. Most adults spend a third of their lives in a workplace where democracy does not apply. Changing that reality is what socialism is all about.

The Typical Workplace Is a Dictatorship. But It Doesn’t Have To Be.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

LOL - "As Marx foretold ..." - love the reverent tone.

Context is important to all except partisan hacks and Hoppean snakes:
View attachment 454264
"Increasingly stressed and justifiably guilt-ridden, the ultra-rich—or those with any sense, at any rate—feel threatened by the crushing precariousness into which the majority are sinking.

"As Marx foretold, they form a supremely powerful minority that is proving unfit to preside over polarized societies that cannot guarantee non-asset owners a decent existence."

Opinion | A world without capitalism is not too hard to envision

Yeah, the problem in Greece was they had too much capitalism.......DURR

 

[georgephillip]

Huh? How does this work? Are companies obligated to take on employees who want to "freely" move from company to company? Are they allowed to reject some and accept others?

Perhaps it would work similarly to free agency in professional sports; although, most capitalist workplaces don't provide employees with the same level, heavily regulated playing fields found in MLB, NBA, and the NFL.

 

[Mac-7]

If not capitalism and free markets then what?

Consider the possibility that Democracy is not compatible with capitalism but fascism is.
View attachment 454247
"Economic democracy is a socioeconomic philosophy that proposes to shift decision-making power from corporate managers and corporate shareholders to a larger group of public stakeholders that includes workers, customers, suppliers, neighbours and the broader public."

Economic democracy - Wikipedia.

We already have that to a some extent

In America consumers decide what the factories produce by what sells and what does

corporations are free to be worker owned and some like Harley Davidson are

but its not a very good system or most companies would be doing it

because where will a bunch of workers going to find the money to start a billion dollar business?

they may scrape a few bucks together, but not enough to get the project off the ground

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

If not capitalism and free markets then what?

Consider the possibility that Democracy is not compatible with capitalism but fascism is.
View attachment 454247
"Economic democracy is a socioeconomic philosophy that proposes to shift decision-making power from corporate managers and corporate shareholders to a larger group of public stakeholders that includes workers, customers, suppliers, neighbours and the broader public."

Economic democracy - Wikipedia.

We already have that to a some extent

In America consumers decide what the factories produce by what sells and what does

corporations are free to be worker owned and some like Harley Davidson are

but its not a very good system or most companies would be doing it

because where will a bunch of workers going to find the money to start a billion dollar business?

they may scrape a few bucks together, but not enough to get the project off the ground

Worker owned United Airlines worked.........for a few years. LOL!

 

[Andylusion]

Only the brainwashed minions of the Democrat Reich claim Trump was responsible for the COVID shutdown. I say "claim" rather than "believe" because even they don't believe it..

One year ago today (2/7/2020) the US reported its first COVID death; how many lies has Don the Con told since then?

It was not a lie. He honestly believed this would be a nothing burger.

And honestly he was right. It is a nothing burger.

 

[Andylusion]

If not capitalism and free markets then what?

Consider the possibility that Democracy is not compatible with capitalism but fascism is.
View attachment 454247
"Economic democracy is a socioeconomic philosophy that proposes to shift decision-making power from corporate managers and corporate shareholders to a larger group of public stakeholders that includes workers, customers, suppliers, neighbours and the broader public."

Economic democracy - Wikipedia.

No, Democracy is perfectly compatible with Captialism. Economic Democracy, is just a tyranny of the poor, it's not democracy, and I agree it is completely incompatable with Capitalism. Capitalism requires the freedom of the individual to own their own labor and property. So-called "economic Democracy" is an affront to that.

Economic Democracy, is basically theft, and immoral.

The concept of economic democracy, only works when you only apply it to other people, and not yourself.

For example, if you spent months living out of your car, at the plant parking lot, and worked 16 hour days, 6 to 7 days a week... would you agree to letting employees that spend ZERO of their own money, and ZERO of their own time, and risked ZERO chance of being in debt for millions... now dictating to you how you run your company?

And the answer for every single left-winger everywhere is... no. You would never do that.

But the kicker is, few if any left-wingers spend $1 Million of their own money, opening a store. Few if any, spent months on months, staying up until 4 AM in a Seattle Garage like Bezos did, to make Amazon successful. Few if any, have done much of anything at all worth while in their lives that benefit all of society.

So it's easy to suggest others should give up what they spend their money, time, and blood sweat and tears into, when you have given up nothing, and most of the left, have nothing of any value to give up in the first place.

That's the only reason "economic democracy" can make sense to a left-winger, is because they never apply the concept to themselves.

 

[Andylusion]

Those shares would be worth exactly what you paid for them.

To speculators.

"Money, as Karl Marx lamented, plays the largest part in determining the course of history.

"Once speculators are able to concentrate wealth into their hands they have, throughout history, emasculated government, turned the press into lap dogs and courtiers, corrupted the courts and hollowed out public institutions, including universities, to justify their looting and greed."

Overthrow the Speculators

Just factually wrong. There is no example anywhere, where 'speculators' emasculated governments.

Now do they hollow out public institutions.

Nor have they destroyed universities.

So... wrong. Just wrong.

 

[Andylusion]

LOL - "As Marx foretold ..." - love the reverent tone.

Context is important to all except partisan hacks and Hoppean snakes:
View attachment 454264
"Increasingly stressed and justifiably guilt-ridden, the ultra-rich—or those with any sense, at any rate—feel threatened by the crushing precariousness into which the majority are sinking.

"As Marx foretold, they form a supremely powerful minority that is proving unfit to preside over polarized societies that cannot guarantee non-asset owners a decent existence."

Opinion | A world without capitalism is not too hard to envision

But Marx was wrong. So. The fact this idiot is quoting someone proven wrong, seems even more evidence that my statements about him were dead on correct. He's an idiot.

 

[georgephillip]

Hmmm... sucks to have ability.

The ability of a few to exploit the human labor of the many sucks even more.

From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs - Wikipedia

"In a higher phase of communist society, after the enslaving subordination of the individual to the division of labor, and therewith also the antithesis between mental and physical labor, has vanished; after labor has become not only a means of life but life's prime want; after the productive forces have also increased with the all-around development of the individual, and all the springs of co-operative wealth flow more abundantly—only then can the narrow horizon of bourgeois right be crossed in its entirety and society inscribe on its banners: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need."

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The ability of a few to exploit the human labor of the many sucks even more.

But enough about the Soviet Union.