A very specific "off ramp" to end to the shutdown, majority rules. (Poll)

[DonGlock26]

Meanwhile back in reality....

Flood prone areas (largely in red states) are seeing a delay in home sales. Why? Because flood insurance isn't being sold due to the Trump shutdown.

The Democrats' Schumer Shutdown is hurting working Americans.

 

[kyzr]

Strange how these shut downs never seem to happen until the GOP wants to do something insane. In the last term, you blob shut down the government to get his wall built. This time, he wants to blow apart health insurance.

We need the wall to keep criminals and drugs out. 100,000 Americans die a year just from opioids. Obamacare had a TEMPORARY subsidy, just until the end of 2025. Letting the subsidy adds $30 a month to low incomes to $150 a month for higher incomes, back to what they were, no one is "canceling" anything. In fact, the BBB "no tax on tips or OT" gives more money than the subsidy costs, so democrats are hurting workers not helping.

And they have almost zero political power. Comparing the two is rather moronic.

Comparing "the squad" to "professional politicians" is moronic.

Oh...did he find that out after adding $8T in debt in his first term? LOL

Trump had the Covid shutdown to deal with. Biden also added $8T to the debt with no excuse, he paid for food and housing for 12,000,000 illegals. Trump is putting the US back on a sound fiscal track, might even balance the budget.

Money that could be used for business expansion by the importers is now being turned over to the government...the thing you hate most in the world. Or are you still pretending exporters pay tariffs?

Why would importers expand? They just import. We want tariffs and CAPEX here in the US, more US manufacturing and more US employment. Trump has $17T in commitments from foreign companies to build new plants here. You're welcome.

CBO says its' going to add $3T in new debt. That's "fantastic" in your book?

Not true. The new revised CBO number is $2.4T over 10-years, or $240b a year.

H.R. 1, One Big Beautiful Bill Act (Dynamic Estimate)

As passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, 2025

www.cbo.gov

What is fantastic is that the CBO assumptions that the $240b annual deficit can be turned into a surplus fairly easily.
1. Congress needs to codify the $205b in savings that DOGE identified
2. As the Fed lowers interest rates 1%, that saves $300b annually in interest on the $37T
3. As the economy improves above the CBO assumed 1.8% GDP growth additional tax revenue will be generated.
4. Tariffs generate about $350b in new revenue annually

Child please.... dumbfuck didn't even know people died from the flu.

Maybe you don't watch the daily press conferences Trump gives the "free press"?
You prefer the "autopen president" that can't give press conferences because he's too senile?
We saw what happened when Trump debated Biden, that was a disaster for democrats.
Kamala was just as bad, her answers were nothing but "word salads"

p.s I'm no child, I'm a great-grandfather.

 

[Greenbeard]

Not true. The new revised CBO number is $2.4T over 10-years, or $240b a year.

H.R. 1, One Big Beautiful Bill Act (Dynamic Estimate)

As passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, 2025

www.cbo.gov

What is fantastic is that the CBO assumptions that the $240b annual deficit can be turned into a surplus fairly easily.

That's not a projection of a $240 billion annual deficit, it's a projection of an additional $240 billion per year on top of existing deficits. Which were already on track to be around $2 trillion a year before Trump added another $240 billion on top.

 

[TimFitz]

I really don't want to see that. For one thing, the entire exercise is silly. Someone has to stand there, talk, they can't sit down? Its bizarre on the face of it, discriminates against someone who may have physical handicapped, and (one test I put out for almost all things); if we were starting it today...would we put these draconian and bizarre requirements on lawmakers? Nope.

Yes, but the TV camera never blinks.

The talking filibuster was abolished befor the era of 24/7 television news, or the internet.

One of the reasons Republicans stood aside, was because Consevative Democrats (who were all succeeded by similarly racist Republicans) owned all the records for the longest filibusters, with Strom Thurmond as the record holder.

Racist politicians used the filibuster consistantly to oppose any civil right legislation.

Since the core appeal of Trumpism is the very thing that Thurmond et Al hated the most, the political dynamics haven’t really changed.

So, bring back the talking filibuster so the whole world can watch them strut and squirm talking up racism and fear.

 

[TimFitz]

We need the wall to keep criminals and drugs out. 100,000 Americans die a year just from opioids. Obamacare had a TEMPORARY subsidy, just until the end of 2025. Letting the subsidy adds $30 a month to low incomes to $150 a month for higher incomes, back to what they were, no one is "canceling" anything. In fact, the BBB "no tax on tips or OT" gives more money than the subsidy costs, so democrats are hurting workers not helping.

Comparing "the squad" to "professional politicians" is moronic.

Trump had the Covid shutdown to deal with. Biden also added $8T to the debt with no excuse, he paid for food and housing for 12,000,000 illegals. Trump is putting the US back on a sound fiscal track, might even balance the budget.

Why would importers expand? They just import. We want tariffs and CAPEX here in the US, more US manufacturing and more US employment. Trump has $17T in commitments from foreign companies to build new plants here. You're welcome.

Not true. The new revised CBO number is $2.4T over 10-years, or $240b a year.

H.R. 1, One Big Beautiful Bill Act (Dynamic Estimate)

As passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, 2025

www.cbo.gov

What is fantastic is that the CBO assumptions that the $240b annual deficit can be turned into a surplus fairly easily.
1. Congress needs to codify the $205b in savings that DOGE identified
2. As the Fed lowers interest rates 1%, that saves $300b annually in interest on the $37T
3. As the economy improves above the CBO assumed 1.8% GDP growth additional tax revenue will be generated.
4. Tariffs generate about $350b in new revenue annually


Maybe you don't watch the daily press conferences Trump gives the "free press"?
You prefer the "autopen president" that can't give press conferences because he's too senile?
We saw what happened when Trump debated Biden, that was a disaster for democrats.
Kamala was just as bad, her answers were nothing but "word salads"

p.s I'm no child, I'm a great-grandfather.

“
1. Congress needs to codify the $205b in savings that DOGE identified
2. As the Fed lowers interest rates 1%, that saves $300b annually in interest on the $37T
3. As the economy improves above the CBO assumed 1.8% GDP growth additional tax revenue will be generated.
4. Tariffs generate about $350b in new revenue annually”

The numbers don’t even come close to adding up.

In what fantasy world does the annual Federal deficit only add up to $240 billion a year?????????

Most of DOGE’s numbers are phony,

Trump actions are directly responsible for the collapse in GDP growth, as Trump’s unrealistic, reckless,and unstable declarations and abrupt policy shifts undermine planning and investment throughout the world.

Howard Lutnick promoted the whispered myth that we can tarrif our way to paying off the national debt, andor eliminating income taxes. His tongue was firmly in his cheek!

It takes a real fool to believe this idiotic nonsense.

 

[kyzr]

That's not a projection of a $240 billion annual deficit, it's a projection of an additional $240 billion per year on top of existing deficits. Which were already on track to be around $2 trillion a year before Trump added another $240 billion on top.

Nope. The CBO 10-yr projection is $2.4T for the BBB.

The Biden deficit was $1.85T in the last year. The BBB cut $1.5T off that, which equals a $350b annual deficit, somehow that gets reduced to $240b (tariffs - tax cuts for no OT or no tips??)

Anyway 10-yrs x $240b = $2.4T which is the revised CBO scoring

 

[Foxfyre]

How long can the shutdown last? A month? Two months?

We have two entrenched/obstinate political parties, neither willing to compromise.

The military and other "essential workers" get screwed by having their paychecks held up, but their bills aren't.

Here is one possibility:
1. Sen. Thune re-writes the senate rules for shutdowns, that if a shutdown lasts longer than 14-days, a clean CR can be passed by a simple majority.

2. If that CR expires, appropriations bills can also be passed with a simple majority.

The United States of America should not be held hostage by either political party. The senate majority, with the VP breaking ties, should be able to pass a budget.

The government fiscal year began on October 1. I get really frustrated with Congress passing CRs instead of having a budget on the President's desk for him to sign before that date.

At least the current GOP is getting close to having a 2026 budget completed.

The Founders did not envision or write a filibuster provision into the Constitution. Both houses of Congress had similar rule books with simple majorities cutting off debate. Somewhere in the back of my head, I am thinking it was Aaron Burr that got the Senate to drop that rule early in the 19th Century?

At any rate that opened the door for the filibuster to be created. It was rarely used through most of the 19th Century however, but became more popular as time went on. It is now used as a weapon. I think it may be time to do away with it entirely.

 

[TimFitz]

The government fiscal year began on October 1. I get really frustrated with Congress passing CRs instead of having a budget on the President's desk for him to sign before that date.

At least the current GOP is getting close to having a 2026 budget completed.

The Founders did not envision or write a filibuster provision into the Constitution. Both houses of Congress had similar rule books with simple majorities cutting off debate. Somewhere in the back of my head, I am thinking it was Aaron Burr that got the Senate to drop that rule early in the 19th Century?

At any rate that opened the door for the filibuster to be created. It was rarely used through most of the 19th Century however, but became more popular as time went on. It is now used as a weapon. I think it may be time to do away with it entirely.

I don’t know if it was Burr, but it might have been. It was around that time.

Open enrollment to ACA policies begins on Nov 1st.

Which is about the same time as notices go out to millions of Americans thst their health insurance premiums are going to more than double.

The GOP wants to kick the can down the road. With premium notices set to go out in a month, thst road is beginning to look like it runs off a cliff.

 

[kyzr]

“
1. Congress needs to codify the $205b in savings that DOGE identified
2. As the Fed lowers interest rates 1%, that saves $300b annually in interest on the $37T
3. As the economy improves above the CBO assumed 1.8% GDP growth additional tax revenue will be generated.
4. Tariffs generate about $350b in new revenue annually”

The numbers don’t even come close to adding up.
In what fantasy world does the annual Federal deficit only add up to $240 billion a year?????????

The CBO's latest scoring for the BBB is $2.4T for 10-yrs, which equals a $240b annual deficit. (use google to verify)

Most of DOGE’s numbers are phony,

DOGE: Department of Government Efficiency

DOGE: Department of Government Efficiency

doge.gov

DOGE claims to save $214b
Clawing-back the democrat's slush funds can save $

Exclusive | $375B EPA slush fund handled by John Podesta gave billions to charities founded only months earlier

The EPA gave out $20 billion to environmental justice and green credit groups that had barely registered with the IRS.

nypost.com

Administrator Zeldin Terminates Biden-Harris $20B 'Gold Bar' Grants | US EPA

EPA News Release: Administrator Zeldin Terminates Biden-Harris $20B 'Gold Bar' Grants

www.epa.gov

Feds investigating Stacey Abrams-linked group’s ‘insane’ $2B EPA grant, Zeldin says

The massive grant was awarded to Power Forward Communities in April 2024 from environmental spending in former President Joe Biden’s Inflation Reduction Act of 2022.

nypost.com

Hurricane Highlights Failure of Shaheen's $42 Billion Broadband Access Program - NH Journal

New Hampshire - Hurricane Highlights Failure of Shaheen's $42 Billion Broadband Access Program - NH Journal - Politics

nhjournal.com

Trump actions are directly responsible for the collapse in GDP growth, as Trump’s unrealistic, reckless,and unstable declarations and abrupt policy shifts undermine planning and investment throughout the world.

The GDP for 3Q25 was just revised UP, duh

U.S. GDP expanded at a strong 3.8% pace in second-quarter revision

The U.S. economy's 3.8% growth from April through June represents a significant upgrade of the government's previous estimate.

www.cbsnews.com

Howard Lutnick promoted the whispered myth that we can tariff our way to paying off the national debt, and or eliminating income taxes. His tongue was firmly in his cheek! It takes a real fool to believe this idiotic nonsense.

Tariff revenue is about $350b annually. It can be used to help pay down the debt, or to save SS & Medicare, or other priorities.

 

[kyzr]

The government fiscal year began on October 1. I get really frustrated with Congress passing CRs instead of having a budget on the President's desk for him to sign before that date.
At least the current GOP is getting close to having a 2026 budget completed.
The Founders did not envision or write a filibuster provision into the Constitution. Both houses of Congress had similar rule books with simple majorities cutting off debate. Somewhere in the back of my head, I am thinking it was Aaron Burr that got the Senate to drop that rule early in the 19th Century?
At any rate that opened the door for the filibuster to be created. It was rarely used through most of the 19th Century however, but became more popular as time went on. It is now used as a weapon. I think it may be time to do away with it entirely.

I like the filibuster to keep one party from going too far left or right. But as you say, now it is used as a weapon.

My recommendation is to only use it for "permanent laws", not for appropriations, or appointments, that are not "permanent".

 

[Greenbeard]

Nope. The CBO 10-yr projection is $2.4T for the BBB.

That’s the incremental addition to the deficit from that legislation. You add that number to the baseline $22 trillion in deficit spending over that period if you want to know what the total deficit spending will be. Trump will be adding around $25 trillion to the debt over the next decade.

 

[kyzr]

That’s the incremental addition to the deficit from that legislation. You add that number to the baseline $22 trillion in deficit spending over that period if you want to know what the total deficit spending will be. Trump will be adding around $25 trillion to the debt over the next decade.

Provide a link proving what you just typed. The total Debt today is $37.7T. Here are the debt adds by recent presidents.
Biden's final add was $9.4T, see below.

Biden's Deficit Spending in Just 4 Years Accounts for Astounding Percentage of Overall Fed Debt

Just since fiscal year 2025 began on Oct. 1, the U.S. has spent more than $624 billion than it has taken in.

www.westernjournal.com

“Not only has the Biden admin racked up $8.4 trillion in debt, but they’ve also run down Treasury’s cash balance by $1.0 trillion – that’s a net overspending of $9.4 trillion, or more than 1/4 of the entire federal debt,” Heritage Foundation economist E.J. Antoni posted

Here is the revised CBO 10-yr projection of $2.4T for 2025-2034

H.R. 1, One Big Beautiful Bill Act (Dynamic Estimate)

As passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, 2025

www.cbo.gov

The Congressional Budget Office and the staff of the Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) previously reported that H.R. 1, the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, as passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, would increase the primary deficit by $2.4 trillion over the 2025-2034 period.[1] That estimate reflects a $3.7 trillion reduction in revenues and a $1.3 trillion reduction in noninterest outlay

 

[TimFitz]

I like the filibuster to keep one party from going too far left or right. But as you say, now it is used as a weapon.

My recommendation is to only use it for "permanent laws", not for appropriations, or appointments, that are not "permanent".

The filibuster was always used as a weapon.

 

[Zincwarrior]

Why stop the shut down? More fed money goes to welfare MAGA states.

 

[kyzr]

Why stop the shut down? More fed money goes to welfare MAGA states.

So I don't hear Republicans whining. We agree, don't stop the shutdown, fire all non-essential government employees.

 

[TimFitz]

Provide a link proving what you just typed. The total Debt today is $37.7T. Here are the debt adds by recent presidents.
Biden's final add was $9.4T, see below.

View attachment 1170124

Biden's Deficit Spending in Just 4 Years Accounts for Astounding Percentage of Overall Fed Debt

Just since fiscal year 2025 began on Oct. 1, the U.S. has spent more than $624 billion than it has taken in.

www.westernjournal.com

“Not only has the Biden admin racked up $8.4 trillion in debt, but they’ve also run down Treasury’s cash balance by $1.0 trillion – that’s a net overspending of $9.4 trillion, or more than 1/4 of the entire federal debt,” Heritage Foundation economist E.J. Antoni posted

Here is the revised CBO 10-yr projection of $2.4T for 2025-2034

H.R. 1, One Big Beautiful Bill Act (Dynamic Estimate)

As passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, 2025

www.cbo.gov

The Congressional Budget Office and the staff of the Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) previously reported that H.R. 1, the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, as passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, would increase the primary deficit by $2.4 trillion over the 2025-2034 period.[1] That estimate reflects a $3.7 trillion reduction in revenues and a $1.3 trillion reduction in noninterest outlay

It’s pretty obvious that youare conflating statistics.

This is very obvious when you claim that the budget deficit is only $250 billion. It is actually expected o top out at $1.7 trillion for FY2026.

 

[WorldWatcher]

The CBO's latest scoring for the BBB is $2.4T for 10-yrs, which equals a $240b annual deficit. (use google to verify)

The CBO's latest scoring for the BBB is for a $3.4 Trillion INCREASE in the deficits from 2025-2034. Not that the it is all the deficiet. An increase over the baseline attributed to the BBB.

Also note that the deficets accellerate greatly just after Trump leaves office as a result of the BBB.

WW

\

https://www.cbo.gov/system/files/2025-08/61659-SPAYGO.pdf

 

[kyzr]

It’s pretty obvious that you are conflating statistics.
This is very obvious when you claim that the budget deficit is only $250 billion. It is actually expected o top out at $1.7 trillion for FY2026.

From the horses mouth...

H.R. 1, One Big Beautiful Bill Act (Dynamic Estimate)

As passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, 2025

www.cbo.gov

The Congressional Budget Office and the staff of the Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) previously reported that H.R. 1, the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, as passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, would increase the primary deficit by $2.4 trillion over the 2025-2034 period.[1] That estimate reflects a $3.7 trillion reduction in revenues and a $1.3 trillion reduction in noninterest outlay

 

[Greenbeard]

The Congressional Budget Office and the staff of the Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) previously reported that H.R. 1, the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, as passed by the House of Representatives on May 22, would increase the primary deficit by $2.4 trillion over the 2025-2034 period.[1]

The baseline primary deficit that CBO is working off is $22.083 trillion over the 2025-2034 period. They're saying the OBBBA will increase that by $2.4 trillion.

That means when the new baseline is published in January and incorporates the impacts of the OBBBA, the ten-year deficit is going to be larger (that's what "increases the primary deficit" means). You seem to have to somehow confused yourself into believing it'll have gotten smaller. No such luck.

 

[kyzr]

The CBO's latest scoring for the BBB is for a $3.4 Trillion INCREASE in the deficits from 2025-2034. Not that the it is all the deficit. An increase over the baseline attributed to the BBB.
Also note that the deficits accelerate greatly just after Trump leaves office as a result of the BBB.
WW

The baseline primary deficit that CBO is working off is $22.083 trillion over the 2025-2034 period. They're saying the OBBBA will increase that by $2.4 trillion.

That means when the new baseline is published in January and incorporates the impacts of the OBBBA, the ten-year deficit is going to be larger (that's what "increases the primary deficit" means). You seem to have to somehow confused yourself into believing it'll have gotten smaller. No such luck.

We are not on the same planet regarding the Federal budget. This is what I'm referring to, revenue vs expenditures:

So for Biden's budget and the 10-yr CBO score it would be about $18.3T

My post #138 shows the current CBO score based on the GOP cutting $1.5T off Biden's budget. We can agree to disagree.