14 yr old rape victim lashed to death

[Bosun]

somewhere it was written about the non believers,

يُرِيدُونَ أَن يُطْفِئُواْ نُورَ ٱللَّهِ بِأَفْوَاهِهِمْ وَيَأْبَىٰ ٱللَّهُ إِلاَّ أَن يُتِمَّ نُورَهُ وَلَوْ كَرِهَ
ٱلْكَافِرُونَ

They (Kafiroon) want to extinguish Allah's Light with their mouths, but Allah will not
allow it except that His Light should be perfected even though the Kafiroon
hate it!
(at-Taubah: 32)

 

[Kalam]

OK if a friend, associate, or someone close to you were to reject the word of allah and become an apostate, what would you do?

may allah grant you and those close to you peace and prosperity...

If I lived in a truly Islamic society with courts that observed Shari'ah, I'd defer to their judgment and trust that they'd make the proper decision based on the Word of Allah ta'ala and the example provided by his Messenger, Muhammad (SAWS).

He has; don't worry.

I am not Ian and I am not Mr. Astaslem.

I know, Ian, it was my idea of a joke.

I am not a native speaker of Arabic. But I have studied some.... I hope that you do not hold it against me that I will not understand the Qur'an or the teachings of Muhammad because I am not a native speaker...

I suspect that your misunderstanding of the Qur'an and the Sunnah has little to do with your level of proficiency in Arabic. But all of that remains to be seen.

 

[Kalam]

By the way Shari'ah is the truth and the way of Islam, isn't it.. I figured because Shari'ah reflects the words of allah, then it would have fit in perfectly.... By the way I edited my posts to take out any mention of you know what. I kindly respect that you will edit your quotes of me.

Of course.

I did not realize that I would be in violation of TOS for mentioning offspring in a non negative way.... it was simply a question posed.

I understand. I didn't mean to imply that I was offended by the question in any way; I simply didn't want you to get in trouble for making an honest mistake.

Would Shari'ah totally accept an Apostate's right to reject allah's word and move to the Kafr?

No, it would not. Depending on the circumstances of their rejection of Islam, they may face the possibility of execution. However, the example given to us by the Prophet (SAWS) when he made no effort to pursue the Bedouin who apostatized in Madinah tells us that execution is not the appropriate course of action in every case.

somewhere it was written about the non believers,

يُرِيدُونَ أَن يُطْفِئُواْ نُورَ ٱللَّهِ بِأَفْوَاهِهِمْ وَيَأْبَىٰ ٱللَّهُ إِلاَّ أَن يُتِمَّ نُورَهُ وَلَوْ كَرِهَ
ٱلْكَافِرُونَ

They (Kafiroon) want to extinguish Allah's Light with their mouths, but Allah will not
allow it except that His Light should be perfected even though the Kafiroon
hate it!
(at-Taubah: 32)

Yes, it was. That ayah sits on my desktop.

 

[Bosun]

we may have some interesting discussions... I have a copy of the Qur'an next to me and have studied it some... I understand that you (collectively, not literally) believe that God gave mankind 104 books, many were lost on the way..... however, of that, four remaining books are the books of Moses, the Psalms of David, the Gospels of Christ, and the Qur’an..

Do you believe that the People of the Book altered the words of God and therefore corrupted them (except for the Qur'an) and that the Qur'an was revealed to and recited by Muhammad to restore the truth to mankind?

After all, from what I understand, the Qur'an corrects the mistakes of the past......

We (also) sent (Our prophets) to peoples before thee...and We sent down the Book to thee for the express purpose, that thou shouldst make clear to them those things in which they differ” (Qur’an 16:63,64)

 

[Kalam]

Do you believe that the People of the Book altered the words of God and therefore corrupted them (except for the Qur'an) and that the Qur'an was revealed to and recited by Muhammad to restore the truth to mankind?

I suppose that's one way of putting it.

 

[mdn2000]

OK if a friend, associate, or someone close to you were to reject the word of allah and become an apostate, what would you do?

may allah grant you and those close to you peace and prosperity...

If I lived in a truly Islamic society with courts that observed Shari'ah, I'd defer to their judgment and trust that they'd make the proper decision based on the Word of Allah ta'ala and the example provided by his Messenger, Muhammad (SAWS).

He has; don't worry.

I am not Ian and I am not Mr. Astaslem.

I know, Ian, it was my idea of a joke.

I am not a native speaker of Arabic. But I have studied some.... I hope that you do not hold it against me that I will not understand the Qur'an or the teachings of Muhammad because I am not a native speaker...

I suspect that your misunderstanding of the Qur'an and the Sunnah has little to do with your level of proficiency in Arabic. But all of that remains to be seen.

So in the case of this murder of a fourteen old girl, you would defer to the judgement of the culture in which this happened.

I know that is attempting to put words in your mouth but it does seem to be awfully close to contradiction.

Society would not miss the religion of Islam if it disappeared today, this girl would be alive if Islam was destroyed under George Bush's watch.

 

[Bosun]

OK if a friend, associate, or someone close to you were to reject the word of allah and become an apostate, what would you do?

may allah grant you and those close to you peace and prosperity...

If I lived in a truly Islamic society with courts that observed Shari'ah, I'd defer to their judgment and trust that they'd make the proper decision based on the Word of Allah ta'ala and the example provided by his Messenger, Muhammad (SAWS).

He has; don't worry.


I know, Ian, it was my idea of a joke.

I am not a native speaker of Arabic. But I have studied some.... I hope that you do not hold it against me that I will not understand the Qur'an or the teachings of Muhammad because I am not a native speaker...

I suspect that your misunderstanding of the Qur'an and the Sunnah has little to do with your level of proficiency in Arabic. But all of that remains to be seen.

So in the case of this murder of a fourteen old girl, you would defer to the judgement of the culture in which this happened.

I know that is attempting to put words in your mouth but it does seem to be awfully close to contradiction.

Society would not miss the religion of Islam if it disappeared today, this girl would be alive if Islam was destroyed under George Bush's watch.

ouchie.....

 

[Kalam]

So in the case of this murder of a fourteen old girl, you would defer to the judgement of the culture in which this happened.

Absolutely not. I said that I'd defer to the judgment of a Shari'i court that made decisions based on the Qur'an and the Sunnah; I made no mention of culture and we've seen that the arbitration in the case of the murdered girl was neither based on the revelations of Allah ta'ala nor on the Sunnah of his Messenger.

I know that is attempting to put words in your mouth

I'd say so.

 

[Grace]

I find it quite interesting how kalam seems very respectful to the other men in answering questions. Telling, in fact.

Bros before hos mentality.

 

[Kalam]

I find it quite interesting how kalam seems very respectful to the other men in answering questions. Telling, in fact.

Bros before hos mentality.

Are you insinuating that I'm a sexist? Please feel free to offer any statement of mine degrading women as evidence of this.

How do you know that these posters are men? How did you know that I'm a man?

 

[Trajan]

he reports said Hena was raped by her 40-year-old relative Mahbub on Sunday. Next day, a fatwa was announced at a village arbitration that she must be given 100 lashes. She fell unconscious after nearly 80 lashes.

Fatally injured Hena was rushed to Naria health complex where she succumbed to her injuries.

Govt asked to explain failure to stop fatwa

what the hell is a fatwa?

Definition: A fatwa is an Islamic religious ruling, a scholarly opinion on a matter of Islamic law.

A fatwa is issued by a recognized religious authority in Islam. But since there is no hierarchical priesthood or anything of the sort in Islam, a fatwa is not necessarily "binding" on the faithful. The people who pronounce these rulings are supposed to be knowledgable, and base their rulings in knowledge and wisdom. They need to supply the evidence from Islamic sources for their opinions, and it is not uncommon for scholars to come to different conclusions regarding the same issue.

Islamic Glossary: Fatwa

well part of the answer is the gov. has decided that this really has to be, as they need the islamic/fundie cooperation in their gov. which is collapsing, in that they are simply going through the motions, and expressed sppt. all be it in their own polite circles a sympathetic attitude for the body guard who assassinated a provincial gov. who was moderate and asked that blasphemy laws etc. be softened.....


see here..
Pakistani Religious Groups Cheer Bodyguard Who Murdered Moderate Governor (Video) | The Gateway Pundit

 

[Kalam]

he reports said Hena was raped by her 40-year-old relative Mahbub on Sunday. Next day, a fatwa was announced at a village arbitration that she must be given 100 lashes. She fell unconscious after nearly 80 lashes.

Fatally injured Hena was rushed to Naria health complex where she succumbed to her injuries.

Govt asked to explain failure to stop fatwa

what the hell is a fatwa?

Definition: A fatwa is an Islamic religious ruling, a scholarly opinion on a matter of Islamic law.

A fatwa is issued by a recognized religious authority in Islam. But since there is no hierarchical priesthood or anything of the sort in Islam, a fatwa is not necessarily "binding" on the faithful. The people who pronounce these rulings are supposed to be knowledgable, and base their rulings in knowledge and wisdom. They need to supply the evidence from Islamic sources for their opinions, and it is not uncommon for scholars to come to different conclusions regarding the same issue.

Islamic Glossary: Fatwa

well part of the answer is the gov. has decided that this really has to be, as they need the islamic/fundie cooperation in their gov. which is collapsing, in that they are simply going through the motions, and expressed sppt. all be it in their own polite circles a sympathetic attitude for the body guard who assassinated a provincial gov. who was moderate and asked that blasphemy laws etc. be softened.....


see here..
Pakistani Religious Groups Cheer Bodyguard Who Murdered Moderate Governor (Video) | The Gateway Pundit

I believe this incident took place in Bangladesh, not Pakistan.

 

[Bosun]

I find it quite interesting how kalam seems very respectful to the other men in answering questions. Telling, in fact.

Bros before hos mentality.

Are you insinuating that I'm a sexist? Please feel free to offer any statement of mine degrading women as evidence of this.

How do you know that these posters are men? How did you know that I'm a man?

what if a female that you were close to emotionally and spiritually suddenly decided to become an Apostate, what would you be compelled to do?

 

[Kalam]

I find it quite interesting how kalam seems very respectful to the other men in answering questions. Telling, in fact.

Bros before hos mentality.

Are you insinuating that I'm a sexist? Please feel free to offer any statement of mine degrading women as evidence of this.

How do you know that these posters are men? How did you know that I'm a man?

what if a female that you were close to emotionally and spiritually suddenly decided to become an Apostate, what would you be compelled to do?

Exactly what I said the first time you asked this question, Ian.

 

[Bosun]

Kalam,

Some of us are following the case where the Iraqi, Faleh Almaleki , ran down his daughter and her boyfriend's mother in Arizona... Why on earth would he do such a thing. Was it an honour killing?

 

[Kalam]

Kalam,

Some of us are following the case where the Iraqi, Faleh Almaleki , ran down his daughter and her boyfriend's mother in Arizona... Why on earth would he do such a thing.

Did you want to provide a link to a story about this case...?

Was it an honour killing?

Define your terms.

 

[Bosun]

Are you insinuating that I'm a sexist? Please feel free to offer any statement of mine degrading women as evidence of this.

How do you know that these posters are men? How did you know that I'm a man?

what if a female that you were close to emotionally and spiritually suddenly decided to become an Apostate, what would you be compelled to do?

Exactly what I said the first time you asked this question, Ian.

I was hoping to get a more exact response from you. How would you feel, what would you want to do... What would a Shari'ah court say? In Saudi Arabia, the case may get a more direct response than in a more secular nation.

 

[Kalam]

I was hoping to get a more exact response from you. How would you feel, what would you want to do... What would a Shari'ah court say?

I think that would depend on the exact circumstances surrounding the act of apostasy.

In Saudi Arabia, the case may get a more direct response than in a more secular nation.

I hardly think that Saudi Arabia is a good example of Islamic governance.

 

[Bosun]

Did you want to provide a link to a story about this case...?

Iraqi immigrant Faleh Hassan Almaleki on trial for hit-run kill of 'westernised' daughter | Mail Online

Was it an honour killing?................
Define your terms.

“The investigation into these crimes revealed that the defendant was very angry with Noor for not living by traditional Iraqi values as she had, in his eyes, become too ‘westernized’ and brought dishonour on her family,” prosecutors wrote in a court document.

 

[Bosun]

I was hoping to get a more exact response from you. How would you feel, what would you want to do... What would a Shari'ah court say?

I think that would depend on the exact circumstances surrounding the act of apostasy.

In Saudi Arabia, the case may get a more direct response than in a more secular nation.

I hardly think that Saudi Arabia is a good example of Islamic governance.

that is right, you are not sunni are you?