CDZ Will any USMB abortion proponents admit that an abortion kills a child?

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Chuz Life, May 27, 2017.

  1. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    Even the smallest of governments have a legitimate role to play in defending human rights. "Sin" doesn't have anything to do with it.

    The Constitution clearly says that "all persons" are entitled to the "equal protections of our laws." Our supreme court acknowledged that fact (see my sig.)

    So, it all comes back to whether or not a person in the first days of their life, growth and development is a human being / person or not.

    The science (not religion) tells me that they are.
     
  2. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    The sooner the better.
     
  3. Toronado3800
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    Toronado3800 VIP Member

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    Huh, I remember what science and religion had to say about what orbits what.

    In this case we are protecting those who believe differently than you and those with a strange urge to control what their bodies do.

    Your belief is legitimate though. We are not going to force you to have an abortion. I'm also not going to let the government force you to face Mecca a couple times a day.
     
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  4. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    Does the government have a legitimate role to play in defending human rights from the moment a person's life (and constitutional rights) begin? Or not?

    Yes or no?
     
  5. Toronado3800
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    Toronado3800 VIP Member

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    Yes.

    The government is compelled to protect you from what I believe. I might believe crazy religious stuff like you need to be dunked to prove you are not a witch.

    To speed the conversation along, on the surface, we have some inconsistencies in how we charge those who kill pregnant women with two counts of murder I'll admit. That is apparently the government saying it is up to the mother's faith to determine when the life begins in her, not the murderer, you or I.

    Its cool you believe abortion is murder. Personally I may agree but I don't believe I have a right to impose my view on you, or the gal next door, you all being equal in the eyes of the law. You post a lot about it so you obviously either feel very strongly or are paid to do so.
     
  6. Chuz Life
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    Chuz Life Gold Member

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    How can any person say (with a straight face) that a child's PERSONHOOD and Constitutional rights are to be determined by each and every individual woman - case by case - as she becomes pregnant? Then, add to that - that she can REVOKE that previously wanted child's personhood and pay Planned Parenthood to KILL him or her at just about anytime she wants to.... just by changing her mind.

    Do you even HEAR yourself?
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2017
  7. Toronado3800
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    Toronado3800 VIP Member

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    Yup, you, YOU Chuz Life, have no right according to our law to decide what she believes. Bothers you?

    If it makes you feel better, I in all my "glory" have no right to decide what you believe, even if I think you should listen to me ;)

    More seriously, I wonder if abortion being legal is a punishment for this sins of our society. Consider the problems we are having with Muslim extremists. Or the problems with Christian extremists which led some of the first colonists to America. Then the problems of Christian extremists IN America. Gotta keep the Muslim, Christian or my church out of government.
     
  8. C_Clayton_Jones
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    C_Clayton_Jones Diamond Member

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    Prior to birth, an embryo/fetus is not a person, and not entitled to Constitutional protections:

    ‘[T]he unborn have never been recognized in the law as persons in the whole sense." Id., at 162. Accordingly, an abortion is not "the termination of life entitled to Fourteenth Amendment protection." Id., at 159. From this holding, there was no dissent, see id., at 173; indeed, no member of the Court has ever questioned this fundamental proposition. Thus, as a matter of federal constitutional law, a developing organism that is not yet a "person" does not have what is sometimes described as a "right to life."’

    Planned Parenthood of Southeastern Pa. v. Casey, 505 U.S. 833 (1992)

    Consequently, abortion is not 'killing a child' – as a settled, accepted fact of law, one is not a child or person until after he is born.

    As an aside, it is perfectly appropriate and consistent to oppose abortion while at the same time recognizing and defending the right to privacy, and to oppose efforts by the states to compel a woman to give birth against her will through force of law.
     
  9. Witchit
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    Witchit VIP Member

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    I had an abortion 40 years ago. No regrets.
     
  10. Coyote
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    Coyote Varmint Staff Member Senior USMB Moderator Gold Supporting Member

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    This is a contentious topic - please remember folks, you are in CDZ. No flaming, insulting, or putting down posters.
     

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