Widening Of The Buffer Zone

[RoccoR]

toastman, et al,

This has to do with the definition of what it means to be "Occupied."

Rocco, I have a quick question for you. You might have explained it already, so I might have missed it.

How is it that the West Bank was 'sovereign Jordanian territory' if they occupied it?

(ANSWER)

When the Arab Palestinians of the West Bank joined the Jordanian Parliamentary Process, the "effective control" was no longer held by a "Hostile" Army.

• Art. 42. Territory is considered occupied when it is actually placed under the authority of the hostile army.
  The occupation extends only to the territory where such authority has been established and can be exercised.

There is no case of coercion, without the "hostile" component --- there is no true "occupation."

v/r
R

 

[toastman]

toastman, et al,

This has to do with the definition of what it means to be "Occupied."

Rocco, I have a quick question for you. You might have explained it already, so I might have missed it.

How is it that the West Bank was 'sovereign Jordanian territory' if they occupied it?

(ANSWER)

When the Arab Palestinians of the West Bank joined the Jordanian Parliamentary Process, the "effective control" was no longer held by a "Hostile" Army.

• Art. 42. Territory is considered occupied when it is actually placed under the authority of the hostile army.
  The occupation extends only to the territory where such authority has been established and can be exercised.

There is no case of coercion, without the "hostile" component --- there is no true "occupation."

v/r
R

Ah, got it. Thanks.

 

[P F Tinmore]

In this context, the intention was to communicate a "Palestine" ----- as in: "the territories to which the Mandate for Palestine applies, hereinafter described as Palestine."

OK, but the foreigners did not declare themselves to be a state in Palestine until after the mandate left.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

When the Mandate terminated, the Mandate converted to a Trusteeship under Chapter XII of the Charter (Article 77 Para 1a). When the Mandatory left, the Successor Government assumed the responsibility.

In this context, the intention was to communicate a "Palestine" ----- as in: "the territories to which the Mandate for Palestine applies, hereinafter described as Palestine."

OK, but the foreigners did not declare themselves to be a state in Palestine until after the mandate left.

(COMMENT)

The Jewish Agency (not foreigners), in coordination with the Successor Government (UNPC), exercised their right to self-determination in accordance with the Step Preparatory to Independence, as established by UN GA Resolution 181(II). The territory, formerly under Mandate for Palestine, did not change names or status.

Likewise, the Arab Higher Committee, exercised their right to self-determination (in the negative sense) by rejection participation in the Partition Plan.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

It wasn't "their Palestine."

Are you saying that Palestine is not the Palestinian's?

You are going weird on us.

 

[RoccoR]

P F Tinmore, et al,

No

It wasn't "their Palestine."

Are you saying that Palestine is not the Palestinian's?

You are going weird on us.

(COMMENT)

You are taking this out of context and in the improper timeline.

The State of Palestine did not come under Palestinian Sovereignty until 1988.

Most Respectfully,
R

 

[P F Tinmore]

The Jewish Agency (not foreigners),..

The foreign Jewish Agency was created in Zurich by the foreign World Zionist Organization.

The Jewish Agency was created to work with the mandate and served at its pleasure. It had no legitimate function outside of the mandate that left Palestine.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

No

It wasn't "their Palestine."

Are you saying that Palestine is not the Palestinian's?

You are going weird on us.

(COMMENT)

You are taking this out of context and in the improper timeline.

The State of Palestine did not come under Palestinian Sovereignty until 1988.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians right to sovereignty predate the 1988 declaration that did nothing for their sovereignty.

 

[toastman]

The Jewish Agency (not foreigners),..

The foreign Jewish Agency was created in Zurich by the foreign World Zionist Organization.

The Jewish Agency was created to work with the mandate and served at its pleasure. It had no legitimate function outside of the mandate that left Palestine.

Where did you read that ?

 

[toastman]

P F Tinmore, et al,

No

It wasn't "their Palestine."

Are you saying that Palestine is not the Palestinian's?

You are going weird on us.

(COMMENT)

You are taking this out of context and in the improper timeline.

The State of Palestine did not come under Palestinian Sovereignty until 1988.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians right to sovereignty predate the 1988 declaration that did nothing for their sovereignty.

Notice how Rocco provides valid links, while you provide nothing but your opinion along with propaganda ?
If what you said was true, then why did they declare independence in 1988?? For fun?

 

[P F Tinmore]

The Jewish Agency (not foreigners),..

The foreign Jewish Agency was created in Zurich by the foreign World Zionist Organization.

The Jewish Agency was created to work with the mandate and served at its pleasure. It had no legitimate function outside of the mandate that left Palestine.

Where did you read that ?

History.

 

[P F Tinmore]

P F Tinmore, et al,

No

It wasn't "their Palestine."

Are you saying that Palestine is not the Palestinian's?

You are going weird on us.

(COMMENT)

You are taking this out of context and in the improper timeline.

The State of Palestine did not come under Palestinian Sovereignty until 1988.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians right to sovereignty predate the 1988 declaration that did nothing for their sovereignty.​

Notice how Rocco provides valid links, while you provide nothing but your opinion along with propaganda ?
If what you said was true, then why did they declare independence in 1988?? For fun?​

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

A RES 3236 XXIX of 22 November 1974​

1974 predates 1988 and the Palestinian's right to sovereignty predate that resolution.

Why the PLO declared independence again in 1988 is a good question.

 

[P F Tinmore]

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

A RES 3236 XXIX of 22 November 1974​

Damn, there is that pesky in Palestine thing again.

How can the Palestinians have inalienable rights in Palestine unless there is a Palestine?

 

[toastman]

P F Tinmore, et al,

No

It wasn't "their Palestine."

Are you saying that Palestine is not the Palestinian's?

You are going weird on us.

(COMMENT)

You are taking this out of context and in the improper timeline.

The State of Palestine did not come under Palestinian Sovereignty until 1988.

Most Respectfully,
R

The Palestinians right to sovereignty predate the 1988 declaration that did nothing for their sovereignty.​

Notice how Rocco provides valid links, while you provide nothing but your opinion along with propaganda ?
If what you said was true, then why did they declare independence in 1988?? For fun?​

Guided by the purposes and principles of the Charter,

Recalling its relevant resolutions which affirm the right of the Palestinian people to self-determination,

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

2. Reaffirms also the inalienable right of the Palestinians to return to their homes and property from which they have been displaced and uprooted, and calls for their return;

A RES 3236 XXIX of 22 November 1974​

1974 predates 1988 and the Palestinian's right to sovereignty predate that resolution.

Why the PLO declared independence again in 1988 is a good question.

What you posted from 1974 is completely irrelevant. It does not say anything about Palestinians declaring independence. They did so in 1988 and that's when they got sovereignty. You cannot refute that,

 

[toastman]

The Jewish Agency (not foreigners),..

The foreign Jewish Agency was created in Zurich by the foreign World Zionist Organization.

The Jewish Agency was created to work with the mandate and served at its pleasure. It had no legitimate function outside of the mandate that left Palestine.

Where did you read that ?

History.

I think you made it up.

 

[toastman]

1. Reaffirms the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people in Palestine, including:

(a) The right to self-determination without external interference;

(b) The right to national independence and sovereignty;

A RES 3236 XXIX of 22 November 1974​

Damn, there is that pesky in Palestine thing again.

How can the Palestinians have inalienable rights in Palestine unless there is a Palestine?

When will you understand that this link you keep posting means nothing whatsoever??

 

[P F Tinmore]

The Jewish Agency (not foreigners),..

The foreign Jewish Agency was created in Zurich by the foreign World Zionist Organization.

The Jewish Agency was created to work with the mandate and served at its pleasure. It had no legitimate function outside of the mandate that left Palestine.

Where did you read that ?

History.

I think you made it up.

In 1929, the Palestine Zionist Executive was renamed, restructured and officially inaugurated as The Jewish Agency for Palestine by the 16th Zionist Congress, held in Zurich, Switzerland.

...the Jewish Agency for Palestine was recognized by the British in 1930, in lieu of the Zionist Organization, as the appropriate Jewish agency under the terms of the Mandate.

Jewish Agency for Israel - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia​

 

[toastman]

The Jewish Agency (not foreigners),..

The foreign Jewish Agency was created in Zurich by the foreign World Zionist Organization.

The Jewish Agency was created to work with the mandate and served at its pleasure. It had no legitimate function outside of the mandate that left Palestine.

Where did you read that ?

History.

I think you made it up.

In 1929, the Palestine Zionist Executive was renamed, restructured and officially inaugurated as The Jewish Agency for Palestine by the 16th Zionist Congress, held in Zurich, Switzerland.

...the Jewish Agency for Palestine was recognized by the British in 1930, in lieu of the Zionist Organization, as the appropriate Jewish agency under the terms of the Mandate.

Jewish Agency for Israel - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia​

And ? No mention of foreign.

 

[P F Tinmore]

The foreign Jewish Agency was created in Zurich by the foreign World Zionist Organization.

The Jewish Agency was created to work with the mandate and served at its pleasure. It had no legitimate function outside of the mandate that left Palestine.

Where did you read that ?

History.

I think you made it up.

In 1929, the Palestine Zionist Executive was renamed, restructured and officially inaugurated as The Jewish Agency for Palestine by the 16th Zionist Congress, held in Zurich, Switzerland.

...the Jewish Agency for Palestine was recognized by the British in 1930, in lieu of the Zionist Organization, as the appropriate Jewish agency under the terms of the Mandate.

Jewish Agency for Israel - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia​

And ? No mention of foreign.

Zurich Switzerland is not foreign to Palestine?

 

[Phoenall]

Legality of the naval blockade: The report does not reach a decision on this question, on

which the different commissions of inquiry have differences of opinion, because

according to the report, the legality of the naval blockade is relevant to only one of the

alleged crimes (the crime of intentionally directing an attack against civilian objects, that

is, the takeover of the Mavi Marmara) and does not impact on the assessment of the other

war crimes examined.

Substantive Crimes

Claims that were accepted: The report states that there is a reasonable basis to believe

that war crimes were committed by IDF soldiers, specifically, the willful killing and

injuring of protected civilians. The claim accepted by the Turkel Commission, that the

violent IHH activists should be seen as civilians taking direct part in hostilities, and

therefore, as a legitimate military target for attack, was rejected. According to the report,

all passengers on the ship, including these activists, are considered protected civilians and

thus may not be attacked. The report notes that the use of force against violent civilians

endangering the soldiers’ lives can be perhaps justified by self-defense. However, it

determined that this must be examined in the investigation and trial stages and not at the

stage of preliminary examination. The report also states that according to the information

available, at least in some instances, IDF soldiers appear to have used excessive force that

went beyond what was required for self-defense. In addition, the report states that there is

a reasonable basis to believe that IDF soldiers perpetrated war crimes against the

detainees on the Mavi Marmara, by committing “outrages upon personal dignity.” It also

notes that if Israel’s naval blockade of Gaza was unlawful
http://www.icc-cpi.int/iccdocs/otp/Referral-from-Comoros.pdf

And who was named in the arrest warrants issued on charges of war crimes ?