CDZ WHY do you have to belong to a tribe?

[Grumblenuts]

Tribalism isn't about picking, it's about belonging.

Good point. And then there are those that really don't care about belonging to any tribe. And then there are those that seriously don't want to belong to any tribe. And then there are those that don't believe there really are any tribes, just the Super Haves vs. the Rest of Us. Unfortunately, they comprise a tiny minority because most of the Rest of Us are Super Haves Wannabe Sheeple.. who always worry about belonging to a tribe and never look up at the real problem.

 

[1srelluc]

You’re a typical republican if it makes no sense to you. Not a scientist

Well I've about had a belly full of politicized "science" over the last couple years. The CC hoax "science" is no different in that regard.....It's all about control. Enjoy your EV car while wearing your face diaper.

 

[Jets]

I think we can agree that humans can be tribal to begin with. I don't think that's a big debate. The question is whether we can move beyond that, and yeah, that requires what we think of as "critical thinking".

My theory has always been that ideology is not a function of intelligence. There are plenty of smart people on both ends. To me, an ideology is something that afflicts someone, like a virus. It distorts perceptions, thought processes, and behaviors.

Or... I'm just missing something, hence the thread

There’s the rub.

How much does one’s tribalism affect their ideology.

 

[Polishprince]

I'd put the odds of a civil, interesting conversation here at about 100 to 1, but let's give it a shot. I'm really hopeful something interesting will pop up.

Let's take a THEORETICAL person who has strong and sincere disagreements with BOTH PARTIES. This person's opinions on the issues are every bit as strong as that of hardcore party members, but they just don't coincidentally all fall into place with those of a party. Most of this person's views really don't jibe with those of EITHER party, so he practices a little independent thought and comes up with his OWN ideas, sometimes taking parts from both sides, sometimes creating his own ideas.

So tell me: Should this person belong to one of the tribes? Should this person pick a tribe and run with it? Should they submit to the obligation that they have to spin and deflect and lie and attack for their tribe when it is under attack, even when that person really doesn't agree with the tribe? Should this person be allowed to express opinions that don't fall in line with the tribe, without being attacked by the tribe?

Finally, is it in America's best interest for members of the tribe to behave that way? If so, why?

Serious questions.

People can do what they want as its a free country.

But people aren't fooled when someone says they are against both parties, but only attacks one of them disproportionately.

 

[pknopp]

Way to accomplish some honest discourse, starting out by saying that you are smarter than 99% of the people here.

I read the replies here and I think that at least for the most part he did at least set the bar pretty low.

That out of the way, it isn't about being "smarter". It's about having principles. People are smart enough to know their party is lying to them. I can't explain why they just accept that.

I believe we need to balance the budget. Neither party cares about that except when the other party is in power so there is nothing there for me to support.

I'm pro-life BUT that includes after a person is born so neither party attracts me there either.

I believe we need to quit sending troops all over the world.......nope, both party loses me there.

I could continue this list all day.

 

[pknopp]

People can do what they want as its a free country.

But people aren't fooled when someone says they are against both parties, but only attacks one of them disproportionately.

I believe people see only what they want to see. I get accused of this all the time but I've said many times that I do not support Biden's programs because he won't pay for them. I've said Hillary is every bit as crooked as Trump. I've said Obama deserves his special place in Hell. I've said Trump won (in 2016) fair and square. I didn't want Trump to win but I did want Hillary to lose. I said the first impeachment was total BS.

But it makes no difference to the true believers.

 

[BlackSand]

I'd put the odds of a civil, interesting conversation here at about 100 to 1, but let's give it a shot. I'm really hopeful something interesting will pop up.

Let's take a THEORETICAL person who has strong and sincere disagreements with BOTH PARTIES. This person's opinions on the issues are every bit as strong as that of hardcore party members, but they just don't coincidentally all fall into place with those of a party. Most of this person's views really don't jibe with those of EITHER party, so he practices a little independent thought and comes up with his OWN ideas, sometimes taking parts from both sides, sometimes creating his own ideas.

So tell me: Should this person belong to one of the tribes? Should this person pick a tribe and run with it? Should they submit to the obligation that they have to spin and deflect and lie and attack for their tribe when it is under attack, even when that person really doesn't agree with the tribe? Should this person be allowed to express opinions that don't fall in line with the tribe, without being attacked by the tribe?

Finally, is it in America's best interest for members of the tribe to behave that way? If so, why?

Serious questions.

.

Deciding not to be part of a tribe in no way influences the degree to which a tribe can try to make you do something or spend your money either way.
If a person doesn't want to associate with a tribe, their best course of action is to get everything they cherish as far away from any tribe as they can.

At that point, support for any tribalism is just a means by which to support whatever separation from the tribes and their influence they can achieve.

.​

 

[Blues Man]

Why would i want to be a member of any political tribe?

 

[pknopp]

Why would i want to be a member of any political tribe?

I'd rather join them. Be who you are and live and let live.

 

[Blues Man]

I'd rather join them. Be who you are and live and let live.

Where did I imply anythin g other than live and let live?

 

[pknopp]

Where did I imply anythin g other than live and let live?

I didn't say you did. I said I could not join either side but would far prefer to join the one you posted.

Editing this.......if you watch the movie, they were for accepting people as they were until they became hateful individuals.

 

[Mac1958]

There’s the rub.

How much does one’s tribalism affect their ideology.

Chicken-or-the-egg thing, maybe.

It could be a process, where a person is drawn to an ideology generally, and over time it causes them to relax their opinions on issues on which they'd usually disagree. Then the tribal aspect, the spirit of belonging, takes over and that person chooses to remain in an ideological echo chamber. That's when it all becomes amplified.

Seems to me that all of this stuff is just human nature to a degree.

 

[Blues Man]

Chicken-or-the-egg thing, maybe.

It could be a process, where a person is drawn to an ideology generally, and over time it causes them to relax their opinions on issues on which they'd usually disagree. Then the tribal aspect, the spirit of belonging, takes over and that person chooses to remain in an ideological echo chamber. That's when it all becomes amplified.

Seems to me that all of this stuff is just human nature to a degree.

Groupthink

I do everything I can to avoid it.

 

[Mac1958]

Groupthink
I do everything I can to avoid it.

It's insidious as hell. It could be argued that everyone is ideological to some degree, and that some are simply more prone to becoming controlled by it. Like some people have more addictive personalities than others, and are therefore more prone to alcoholism or cigarettes.

 

[Mac1958]

Funny stuff, considering this clown's Party promotes violent tribalism and racially motivated hate crimes, murdering police officers, and feeding grade school kids hate literature based on 'critical race theory' and feeds kids propaganda and brainwashing them into believing extreme sexual mutilations are good for them.

I've never belonged to a party, and I could never be a Democrat.

But I appreciate the way you've jumped in to illustrate my point for me.

 

[BlackSand]

It's insidious as hell. It could be argued that everyone is ideological to some degree, and that some are simply more prone to becoming controlled by it. Like some people have more addictive personalities than others and are more prone to alcoholism or cigarettes.

.

You hit on a good point there, and people have the ability to self-govern to a degree.
We do it every moment we are awake.

The US Constitution isn't 50,000 pages long ...
And at some point, people need to realize that there are some things we are just going to have to do for ourselves.

The inability to approach that matter in a more responsible manner, is the core of what tribalism has sold us with enough consent and someone's money...
And what they will do their best to enforce in any way we allow them to.

.​

 

[Woodznutz]

I think its wise to take your ideas to one political party and change them from within

the Tweeners are always going to be out of power and chronic complainers

If neither party seems to know what they are doing complaining is certainly justified. (Of course it's worse if they actually know what they are doing).

 

[Mac1958]

If neither party seems to know what they are doing complaining is certainly justified. (Of course it's worse if they actually know what they are doing).

That's a function of our political "system" - it incentivizes and rewards each party for being more and more tribal, and it all just feeds on itself.

That's the reason I've become a one-issue voter for now. If we don't change our electoral system, I don't see how any of this improves.


#ForwardParty

 

[BlackSand]

#FowardParty

.

Any third tribe with sufficient strength or substance, will be Devoured by one of the other two.

.​

 

[Mac1958]

This isn't you. You're a die-hard DNC cultist and everyone here knows it.

I suppose this falls under the category of the thread.

So tell me: What makes you think that?

Exactly?