Why Did You Leave Christianity Behind?

[Iceweasel]

Many Americans grew up steeped in Christian culture. Went to church events. Celebrated the holidays. Even took part in the rituals.

Then... Many have an awakening, or change of heart if you will. And ultimately walk away; or reject the Christian religion out right. In the end, there are probably as many reasons as there are people...

What was yours?

I got tired of wading through ugly troll posts and decided to answer your original post. I've ignored it, laughed at it, tried a couple other beliefs..then went to Christianity.
For me, there is no other way. I have all the "proof" I will ever need.

I'm glad to see you responding to the ordinal post. Because that's the question to which I'd like to read the replys for. Unfortunately, as you noticed; the thread was inundated with trolls. Oddly enough most of the trolls were christians who felt offended at the nature of the thread, and the responses from posters who answered honestly. I guess it makes them feel like crusaders. But the thread is really only here to offer a place for former Christians to discuss why they left Christianity behind. Nothing more. Nothing less. Hopefully the trolls won't keep other posters from sharing thier experiences with us.

Idk, I saw a different set of trolls. Were you trying to offer a "safe space" for former Christians.
jk, I really do value all peoples experiences...its just a little bit harder on here.

The thread title was too confusing for you? It apparently was like waving a red flag in from of a bull. I didn't see any calls to be saved. The Christian assumption is that you were drug away by deceitful forces or your weak nature. And they can't see how offense that is.

 

[Vastator]

Many Americans grew up steeped in Christian culture. Went to church events. Celebrated the holidays. Even took part in the rituals.

Then... Many have an awakening, or change of heart if you will. And ultimately walk away; or reject the Christian religion out right. In the end, there are probably as many reasons as there are people...

What was yours?

I got tired of wading through ugly troll posts and decided to answer your original post. I've ignored it, laughed at it, tried a couple other beliefs..then went to Christianity.
For me, there is no other way. I have all the "proof" I will ever need.

I'm glad to see you responding to the ordinal post. Because that's the question to which I'd like to read the replys for. Unfortunately, as you noticed; the thread was inundated with trolls. Oddly enough most of the trolls were christians who felt offended at the nature of the thread, and the responses from posters who answered honestly. I guess it makes them feel like crusaders. But the thread is really only here to offer a place for former Christians to discuss why they left Christianity behind. Nothing more. Nothing less. Hopefully the trolls won't keep other posters from sharing thier experiences with us.

Idk, I saw a different set of trolls. Were you trying to offer a "safe space" for former Christians.
jk, I really do value all peoples experiences...its just a little bit harder on here.

The thread title was too confusing for you? It apparently was like waving a red flag in from of a bull. I didn't see any calls to be saved. The Christian assumption is that you were drug away by deceitful forces or your weak nature. And they can't see how offense that is.

 

[Vastator]

I posted the question because most people have no real experience with G_d. They have an idea in their head of what they think G_d is or what they have been told what G_d is but how many people have ever really been in a place where they have encountered something outside of themselves that breaks all the laws they understand as reality in an event they are a part of. When that happens to you your whole paradigm of reality changes! Most people read the Bible as a Book of fiction or fairy tails but when those pages step of into your realty everything changes and nothing can ever be the same again. I understand 99.5% of humanity has no frame of reference but there are those who understand exactly what I am speaking about.

I'm not going to go far afield here but I am one who has experienced near death and other experiences. I understand falling away and not believing all too well. I was not always a believer and I am far from a perfect Christian but seek G_d and He will answer you.

Well I'm afraid it does go far afield... In fact it takes the conversation in the exact opposite direction from that intended by the thread. It does merit a thread of its own. But in the context of this thread it's trolling. Your discussion would be about what confirmed/ reaffirmed your faith. This thread is about why people left it.

Actually you do have a point. My responses were mostly meant to be light hearted though and not meant to take it off topic. ::quietly exiting::

Your willingness to respect the intended nature of the thread better exemplifies the positive aspects of many Christians I've met, and have come to respect; than some other "Christian" posters who've been attracted to this thread. Thank for not trolling. Christianity could use more Christians like you.

 

[featherlite]

Many Americans grew up steeped in Christian culture. Went to church events. Celebrated the holidays. Even took part in the rituals.

Then... Many have an awakening, or change of heart if you will. And ultimately walk away; or reject the Christian religion out right. In the end, there are probably as many reasons as there are people...

What was yours?

I got tired of wading through ugly troll posts and decided to answer your original post. I've ignored it, laughed at it, tried a couple other beliefs..then went to Christianity.
For me, there is no other way. I have all the "proof" I will ever need.

I'm glad to see you responding to the ordinal post. Because that's the question to which I'd like to read the replys for. Unfortunately, as you noticed; the thread was inundated with trolls. Oddly enough most of the trolls were christians who felt offended at the nature of the thread, and the responses from posters who answered honestly. I guess it makes them feel like crusaders. But the thread is really only here to offer a place for former Christians to discuss why they left Christianity behind. Nothing more. Nothing less. Hopefully the trolls won't keep other posters from sharing thier experiences with us.

Idk, I saw a different set of trolls. Were you trying to offer a "safe space" for former Christians.
jk, I really do value all peoples experiences...its just a little bit harder on here.

The thread title was too confusing for you? It apparently was like waving a red flag in from of a bull. I didn't see any calls to be saved. The Christian assumption is that you were drug away by deceitful forces or your weak nature. And they can't see how offense that is.

There are opposing views sometimes harshly opposing views on most every thread
I can see how that would be offensive, although they aren't meant to be.

 

[Iceweasel]

Many Americans grew up steeped in Christian culture. Went to church events. Celebrated the holidays. Even took part in the rituals.

Then... Many have an awakening, or change of heart if you will. And ultimately walk away; or reject the Christian religion out right. In the end, there are probably as many reasons as there are people...

What was yours?

I got tired of wading through ugly troll posts and decided to answer your original post. I've ignored it, laughed at it, tried a couple other beliefs..then went to Christianity.
For me, there is no other way. I have all the "proof" I will ever need.

I'm glad to see you responding to the ordinal post. Because that's the question to which I'd like to read the replys for. Unfortunately, as you noticed; the thread was inundated with trolls. Oddly enough most of the trolls were christians who felt offended at the nature of the thread, and the responses from posters who answered honestly. I guess it makes them feel like crusaders. But the thread is really only here to offer a place for former Christians to discuss why they left Christianity behind. Nothing more. Nothing less. Hopefully the trolls won't keep other posters from sharing thier experiences with us.

Idk, I saw a different set of trolls. Were you trying to offer a "safe space" for former Christians.
jk, I really do value all peoples experiences...its just a little bit harder on here.

The thread title was too confusing for you? It apparently was like waving a red flag in from of a bull. I didn't see any calls to be saved. The Christian assumption is that you were drug away by deceitful forces or your weak nature. And they can't see how offense that is.

There are opposing views sometimes harshly opposing views on most every thread
I can see how that would be offensive, although they aren't meant to be.

Why you left Christianity isn't an opposing view.

 

[Brynmr]

You answered a question that was never asked.

Not really, I just gave an answer that was different than what was expected.

Q: Why Did You Leave Christianity Behind?

A: I chose Christianity because....

LOL Yeah, right.

 

[Brynmr]

How many of you have ever seen or experienced something that defies the laws of physics? Call it a miracle or what ever you wish have you ever experienced anything you cannot explain? Like having having survived something when by all rights you should have died?

Me me me! LOL

I agree with Vastator though. You should start a thread. HOWEVER... AHEM.... trolls will trash it up toot suite so be prepared.

 

[ding]

I was around 12 and realized the stories in church were not much different than Santa Claus

Wisdom is not given to just anyone. You see what you want to see.

At a certain age you develop a bull shit meter

Really? I always thought that as we age we become more wise so that instead of painting what something isn't, we paint what it is.

Yes we do

But you don't. You paint what it isn't and then tell yourself that you are a critical thinker when in reality you are practicing critical theory.

 

[ChrisL]

Exactly!

Its not a matter of belief its a matter of perception and understanding.

Many people who do not believe in satan have had conversations with people who fit the detailed description of the mythological being perfectly and for some mysterious reason cannot make the connection between a teaching in a fairy tale and the actual reality it alludes to even though they have been stalked by, bitten, or disputing with talking serpents in one disguise or another for their entire lives..


astonishing!

What is astonishing is that grown people would believe such things!

Its astonishing that grown people should believe what things?

That the bible uses figurative language and hidden instruction like any fairy tale that teaches among other things that there are despicable and deceitful lowlifes in the world, talking serpents, who take advantage of the gullible and fuck up their minds for life?

You don't believe this?

really?

Those are just scumbag people, not "talking serpents."

ugh. Whats the difference?


talking serpents are metaphorical for scumbag people who pretend to be enlightened and use religion based on distortions of the truth and perverse interpretations of scripture in particular as a means of deception and control over others..

Wouldn't scumbag people think that any story condemning talking serpents as the lowest form of life was a harmless delusional fantasy?

How would you warn your children about the dangers of falling under the spell of scumbag people during times when scumbag people could maim or kill you for trivial reasons and would slaughter your entire family for passing on such a seditious teaching?


It still works like a charm!


How do you think Jesus survived for so long openly condemning serpents and every sort of foul and loathsome beast or bird to their faces and all they could do in response was say "you're nuts" except by speaking over their heads?

If they understood what he was teaching do you think that he would have survived even one day after he started running amok?

And while those in high places were freaking out over the nutty things that Jesus said, lines were being drawn, storm clouds were gathering, and watchers were watching.

The difference is that people are not "talking serpents." Whenever I hear/see that type of language, I immediately cease to take the post seriously!

 

[hobelim]

Its not a matter of belief its a matter of perception and understanding.

Many people who do not believe in satan have had conversations with people who fit the detailed description of the mythological being perfectly and for some mysterious reason cannot make the connection between a teaching in a fairy tale and the actual reality it alludes to even though they have been stalked by, bitten, or disputing with talking serpents in one disguise or another for their entire lives..


astonishing!

What is astonishing is that grown people would believe such things!

Its astonishing that grown people should believe what things?

That the bible uses figurative language and hidden instruction like any fairy tale that teaches among other things that there are despicable and deceitful lowlifes in the world, talking serpents, who take advantage of the gullible and fuck up their minds for life?

You don't believe this?

really?

Those are just scumbag people, not "talking serpents."

ugh. Whats the difference?


talking serpents are metaphorical for scumbag people who pretend to be enlightened and use religion based on distortions of the truth and perverse interpretations of scripture in particular as a means of deception and control over others..

Wouldn't scumbag people think that any story condemning talking serpents as the lowest form of life was a harmless delusional fantasy?

How would you warn your children about the dangers of falling under the spell of scumbag people during times when scumbag people could maim or kill you for trivial reasons and would slaughter your entire family for passing on such a seditious teaching?


It still works like a charm!


How do you think Jesus survived for so long openly condemning serpents and every sort of foul and loathsome beast or bird to their faces and all they could do in response was say "you're nuts" except by speaking over their heads?

If they understood what he was teaching do you think that he would have survived even one day after he started running amok?

And while those in high places were freaking out over the nutty things that Jesus said, lines were being drawn, storm clouds were gathering, and watchers were watching.

The difference is that people are not "talking serpents." Whenever I hear/see that type of language, I immediately cease to take the post seriously!

I can understand why you dismiss it out of hand since what may believers claim is that God caused a snake to speak by some miracle in magical place where people could live forever and God walked with man..

I think thats a load of crap too.

I am saying something different, less spectacular, even obvious, that scriptural references to talking serpents or talking donkeys, sheep, dogs, pigs, goats, wolves, parasites, vultures, bottom feeders,etc., even angels and demons, are references to human beings just like people still compare other people to animals in the wild to either insult or praise another person.

In the garden of eden all of the wild beasts of the field that the Lord God made that Adam named were figurative comparisons to other tribes and well known types of people. Some did not think very deeply like swine that do not ruminate. some were scavengers like vultures that feed on the dead, , some religious charlatans, talking serpents who take advantage of the gullible, some are pack animals like wild dogs, others like teeming vermin, some were herd animals, some dumb as an ox, strong as a bull, others like an eagle, some like a lion, and then there were trees, like thinking men, with deep roots who produce fruit that is pleasing to the eye and good to eat..

Knowing this is the key to understanding the wisdom hidden in the divine commands, the key that opens the gate that leads to the tree of life, the key to understanding the mystery of God.

 

[ChrisL]

What is astonishing is that grown people would believe such things!

Its astonishing that grown people should believe what things?

That the bible uses figurative language and hidden instruction like any fairy tale that teaches among other things that there are despicable and deceitful lowlifes in the world, talking serpents, who take advantage of the gullible and fuck up their minds for life?

You don't believe this?

really?

Those are just scumbag people, not "talking serpents."

ugh. Whats the difference?


talking serpents are metaphorical for scumbag people who pretend to be enlightened and use religion based on distortions of the truth and perverse interpretations of scripture in particular as a means of deception and control over others..

Wouldn't scumbag people think that any story condemning talking serpents as the lowest form of life was a harmless delusional fantasy?

How would you warn your children about the dangers of falling under the spell of scumbag people during times when scumbag people could maim or kill you for trivial reasons and would slaughter your entire family for passing on such a seditious teaching?


It still works like a charm!


How do you think Jesus survived for so long openly condemning serpents and every sort of foul and loathsome beast or bird to their faces and all they could do in response was say "you're nuts" except by speaking over their heads?

If they understood what he was teaching do you think that he would have survived even one day after he started running amok?

And while those in high places were freaking out over the nutty things that Jesus said, lines were being drawn, storm clouds were gathering, and watchers were watching.

The difference is that people are not "talking serpents." Whenever I hear/see that type of language, I immediately cease to take the post seriously!

I can understand why you dismiss it out of hand since what may believers claim is that God caused a snake to speak by some miracle in magical place where people could live forever and God walked with man..

I think thats a load of crap too.

I am saying something different, less spectacular, even obvious, that scriptural references to talking serpents or talking donkeys, sheep, dogs, pigs, goats, wolves, parasites, vultures, bottom feeders,etc., even angels and demons, are references to human beings just like people still compare other people to animals in the wild to either insult or praise another person.

In the garden of eden all of the wild beasts of the field that the Lord God made that Adam named were figurative comparisons to other tribes and well known types of people. Some did not think very deeply like swine that do not ruminate. some were scavengers like vultures that feed on the dead, , some religious charlatans, talking serpents who take advantage of the gullible, some are pack animals like wild dogs, others like teeming vermin, some were herd animals, some dumb as an ox, strong as a bull, others like an eagle, some like a lion, and then there were trees, like thinking men, with deep roots who produce fruit that is pleasing to the eye and good to eat..

Knowing this is the key to understanding the wisdom hidden in the divine commands, the key that opens the gate that leads to the tree of life, the key to understanding the mystery of God.

I understand that the Bible is more than likely a book of parables. But that doesn't convince me that there is a 'god'. I think some smart guys (for their time) and wrote these 'stories.' I don't think they are words from any gods though.

 

[hobelim]

Its astonishing that grown people should believe what things?

That the bible uses figurative language and hidden instruction like any fairy tale that teaches among other things that there are despicable and deceitful lowlifes in the world, talking serpents, who take advantage of the gullible and fuck up their minds for life?

You don't believe this?

really?

Those are just scumbag people, not "talking serpents."

ugh. Whats the difference?


talking serpents are metaphorical for scumbag people who pretend to be enlightened and use religion based on distortions of the truth and perverse interpretations of scripture in particular as a means of deception and control over others..

Wouldn't scumbag people think that any story condemning talking serpents as the lowest form of life was a harmless delusional fantasy?

How would you warn your children about the dangers of falling under the spell of scumbag people during times when scumbag people could maim or kill you for trivial reasons and would slaughter your entire family for passing on such a seditious teaching?


It still works like a charm!


How do you think Jesus survived for so long openly condemning serpents and every sort of foul and loathsome beast or bird to their faces and all they could do in response was say "you're nuts" except by speaking over their heads?

If they understood what he was teaching do you think that he would have survived even one day after he started running amok?

And while those in high places were freaking out over the nutty things that Jesus said, lines were being drawn, storm clouds were gathering, and watchers were watching.

The difference is that people are not "talking serpents." Whenever I hear/see that type of language, I immediately cease to take the post seriously!

I can understand why you dismiss it out of hand since what may believers claim is that God caused a snake to speak by some miracle in magical place where people could live forever and God walked with man..

I think thats a load of crap too.

I am saying something different, less spectacular, even obvious, that scriptural references to talking serpents or talking donkeys, sheep, dogs, pigs, goats, wolves, parasites, vultures, bottom feeders,etc., even angels and demons, are references to human beings just like people still compare other people to animals in the wild to either insult or praise another person.

In the garden of eden all of the wild beasts of the field that the Lord God made that Adam named were figurative comparisons to other tribes and well known types of people. Some did not think very deeply like swine that do not ruminate. some were scavengers like vultures that feed on the dead, , some religious charlatans, talking serpents who take advantage of the gullible, some are pack animals like wild dogs, others like teeming vermin, some were herd animals, some dumb as an ox, strong as a bull, others like an eagle, some like a lion, and then there were trees, like thinking men, with deep roots who produce fruit that is pleasing to the eye and good to eat..

Knowing this is the key to understanding the wisdom hidden in the divine commands, the key that opens the gate that leads to the tree of life, the key to understanding the mystery of God.

I understand that the Bible is more than likely a book of parables. But that doesn't convince me that there is a 'god'. I think some smart guys (for their time) and wrote these 'stories.' I don't think they are words from any gods though.

They are words of instruction that teaches a way to ascend to a higher realm of conscious existence above that of the wild beasts of the field, a more rich and fulfilling life free of many of the pitfalls and suffering experienced by those who live according to the law of the jungle.

The way to eternal life has been made clear. Follow the instruction or don't.

If you do God will make himself known to you and your mind will be opened to know all of the truth and then you will believe.

 

[ChrisL]

Those are just scumbag people, not "talking serpents."

ugh. Whats the difference?


talking serpents are metaphorical for scumbag people who pretend to be enlightened and use religion based on distortions of the truth and perverse interpretations of scripture in particular as a means of deception and control over others..

Wouldn't scumbag people think that any story condemning talking serpents as the lowest form of life was a harmless delusional fantasy?

How would you warn your children about the dangers of falling under the spell of scumbag people during times when scumbag people could maim or kill you for trivial reasons and would slaughter your entire family for passing on such a seditious teaching?


It still works like a charm!


How do you think Jesus survived for so long openly condemning serpents and every sort of foul and loathsome beast or bird to their faces and all they could do in response was say "you're nuts" except by speaking over their heads?

If they understood what he was teaching do you think that he would have survived even one day after he started running amok?

And while those in high places were freaking out over the nutty things that Jesus said, lines were being drawn, storm clouds were gathering, and watchers were watching.

The difference is that people are not "talking serpents." Whenever I hear/see that type of language, I immediately cease to take the post seriously!

I can understand why you dismiss it out of hand since what may believers claim is that God caused a snake to speak by some miracle in magical place where people could live forever and God walked with man..

I think thats a load of crap too.

I am saying something different, less spectacular, even obvious, that scriptural references to talking serpents or talking donkeys, sheep, dogs, pigs, goats, wolves, parasites, vultures, bottom feeders,etc., even angels and demons, are references to human beings just like people still compare other people to animals in the wild to either insult or praise another person.

In the garden of eden all of the wild beasts of the field that the Lord God made that Adam named were figurative comparisons to other tribes and well known types of people. Some did not think very deeply like swine that do not ruminate. some were scavengers like vultures that feed on the dead, , some religious charlatans, talking serpents who take advantage of the gullible, some are pack animals like wild dogs, others like teeming vermin, some were herd animals, some dumb as an ox, strong as a bull, others like an eagle, some like a lion, and then there were trees, like thinking men, with deep roots who produce fruit that is pleasing to the eye and good to eat..

Knowing this is the key to understanding the wisdom hidden in the divine commands, the key that opens the gate that leads to the tree of life, the key to understanding the mystery of God.

I understand that the Bible is more than likely a book of parables. But that doesn't convince me that there is a 'god'. I think some smart guys (for their time) and wrote these 'stories.' I don't think they are words from any gods though.

They are words of instruction that teaches a way to ascend to a higher realm of conscious existence above that of the wild beasts of the field, a more rich and fulfilling life free of many of the pitfalls and suffering experienced by those who live according to the law of the jungle.

The way to eternal life has been made clear. Follow the instruction or don't.

If you do God will make himself known to you and your mind will be opened to know all of the truth and then you will believe.

I do believe you simplify things. Lol. I understand these things. I've read the bible. I follow the rules of 'basic human decency' and then some. So there.

You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person. Understand?

 

[hobelim]

ugh. Whats the difference?


talking serpents are metaphorical for scumbag people who pretend to be enlightened and use religion based on distortions of the truth and perverse interpretations of scripture in particular as a means of deception and control over others..

Wouldn't scumbag people think that any story condemning talking serpents as the lowest form of life was a harmless delusional fantasy?

How would you warn your children about the dangers of falling under the spell of scumbag people during times when scumbag people could maim or kill you for trivial reasons and would slaughter your entire family for passing on such a seditious teaching?


It still works like a charm!


How do you think Jesus survived for so long openly condemning serpents and every sort of foul and loathsome beast or bird to their faces and all they could do in response was say "you're nuts" except by speaking over their heads?

If they understood what he was teaching do you think that he would have survived even one day after he started running amok?

And while those in high places were freaking out over the nutty things that Jesus said, lines were being drawn, storm clouds were gathering, and watchers were watching.

The difference is that people are not "talking serpents." Whenever I hear/see that type of language, I immediately cease to take the post seriously!

I can understand why you dismiss it out of hand since what may believers claim is that God caused a snake to speak by some miracle in magical place where people could live forever and God walked with man..

I think thats a load of crap too.

I am saying something different, less spectacular, even obvious, that scriptural references to talking serpents or talking donkeys, sheep, dogs, pigs, goats, wolves, parasites, vultures, bottom feeders,etc., even angels and demons, are references to human beings just like people still compare other people to animals in the wild to either insult or praise another person.

In the garden of eden all of the wild beasts of the field that the Lord God made that Adam named were figurative comparisons to other tribes and well known types of people. Some did not think very deeply like swine that do not ruminate. some were scavengers like vultures that feed on the dead, , some religious charlatans, talking serpents who take advantage of the gullible, some are pack animals like wild dogs, others like teeming vermin, some were herd animals, some dumb as an ox, strong as a bull, others like an eagle, some like a lion, and then there were trees, like thinking men, with deep roots who produce fruit that is pleasing to the eye and good to eat..

Knowing this is the key to understanding the wisdom hidden in the divine commands, the key that opens the gate that leads to the tree of life, the key to understanding the mystery of God.

I understand that the Bible is more than likely a book of parables. But that doesn't convince me that there is a 'god'. I think some smart guys (for their time) and wrote these 'stories.' I don't think they are words from any gods though.

They are words of instruction that teaches a way to ascend to a higher realm of conscious existence above that of the wild beasts of the field, a more rich and fulfilling life free of many of the pitfalls and suffering experienced by those who live according to the law of the jungle.

The way to eternal life has been made clear. Follow the instruction or don't.

If you do God will make himself known to you and your mind will be opened to know all of the truth and then you will believe.

I do believe you simplify things. Lol. I understand these things. I've read the bible. I follow the rules of 'basic human decency' and then some. So there.

You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person. Understand?

I not only understand, I agree. You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person.

Thats not what I said or meant though.....

I've known plenty of good people capable of doing some very shitty things, over and over again..



Its more like becoming a strange new creature that speaks an unknown language, walks the earth upright, can see what is right in front of its eyes and actually learns from its mistakes.

Capisci?

 

[ChrisL]

The difference is that people are not "talking serpents." Whenever I hear/see that type of language, I immediately cease to take the post seriously!

I can understand why you dismiss it out of hand since what may believers claim is that God caused a snake to speak by some miracle in magical place where people could live forever and God walked with man..

I think thats a load of crap too.

I am saying something different, less spectacular, even obvious, that scriptural references to talking serpents or talking donkeys, sheep, dogs, pigs, goats, wolves, parasites, vultures, bottom feeders,etc., even angels and demons, are references to human beings just like people still compare other people to animals in the wild to either insult or praise another person.

In the garden of eden all of the wild beasts of the field that the Lord God made that Adam named were figurative comparisons to other tribes and well known types of people. Some did not think very deeply like swine that do not ruminate. some were scavengers like vultures that feed on the dead, , some religious charlatans, talking serpents who take advantage of the gullible, some are pack animals like wild dogs, others like teeming vermin, some were herd animals, some dumb as an ox, strong as a bull, others like an eagle, some like a lion, and then there were trees, like thinking men, with deep roots who produce fruit that is pleasing to the eye and good to eat..

Knowing this is the key to understanding the wisdom hidden in the divine commands, the key that opens the gate that leads to the tree of life, the key to understanding the mystery of God.

I understand that the Bible is more than likely a book of parables. But that doesn't convince me that there is a 'god'. I think some smart guys (for their time) and wrote these 'stories.' I don't think they are words from any gods though.

They are words of instruction that teaches a way to ascend to a higher realm of conscious existence above that of the wild beasts of the field, a more rich and fulfilling life free of many of the pitfalls and suffering experienced by those who live according to the law of the jungle.

The way to eternal life has been made clear. Follow the instruction or don't.

If you do God will make himself known to you and your mind will be opened to know all of the truth and then you will believe.

I do believe you simplify things. Lol. I understand these things. I've read the bible. I follow the rules of 'basic human decency' and then some. So there.

You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person. Understand?

I not only understand, I agree. You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person.

Thats not what I said or meant though.....

I've known plenty of good people capable of doing some very shitty things, over and over again..



Its more like becoming a strange new creature that speaks an unknown language, walks the earth upright, can see what is right in front of its eyes and actually learns from its mistakes.

Because they are human, and humans are fallible. There is no such thing as a person who is good all the time. That person doesn't exist.

 

[hobelim]

I can understand why you dismiss it out of hand since what may believers claim is that God caused a snake to speak by some miracle in magical place where people could live forever and God walked with man..

I think thats a load of crap too.

I am saying something different, less spectacular, even obvious, that scriptural references to talking serpents or talking donkeys, sheep, dogs, pigs, goats, wolves, parasites, vultures, bottom feeders,etc., even angels and demons, are references to human beings just like people still compare other people to animals in the wild to either insult or praise another person.

In the garden of eden all of the wild beasts of the field that the Lord God made that Adam named were figurative comparisons to other tribes and well known types of people. Some did not think very deeply like swine that do not ruminate. some were scavengers like vultures that feed on the dead, , some religious charlatans, talking serpents who take advantage of the gullible, some are pack animals like wild dogs, others like teeming vermin, some were herd animals, some dumb as an ox, strong as a bull, others like an eagle, some like a lion, and then there were trees, like thinking men, with deep roots who produce fruit that is pleasing to the eye and good to eat..

Knowing this is the key to understanding the wisdom hidden in the divine commands, the key that opens the gate that leads to the tree of life, the key to understanding the mystery of God.

I understand that the Bible is more than likely a book of parables. But that doesn't convince me that there is a 'god'. I think some smart guys (for their time) and wrote these 'stories.' I don't think they are words from any gods though.

They are words of instruction that teaches a way to ascend to a higher realm of conscious existence above that of the wild beasts of the field, a more rich and fulfilling life free of many of the pitfalls and suffering experienced by those who live according to the law of the jungle.

The way to eternal life has been made clear. Follow the instruction or don't.

If you do God will make himself known to you and your mind will be opened to know all of the truth and then you will believe.

I do believe you simplify things. Lol. I understand these things. I've read the bible. I follow the rules of 'basic human decency' and then some. So there.

You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person. Understand?

I not only understand, I agree. You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person.

Thats not what I said or meant though.....

I've known plenty of good people capable of doing some very shitty things, over and over again..



Its more like becoming a strange new creature that speaks an unknown language, walks the earth upright, can see what is right in front of its eyes and actually learns from its mistakes.

Because they are human, and humans are fallible. There is no such thing as a person who is good all the time. That person doesn't exist.

Good all the time? Some people haven't even begun....they've been distracted by the holy work of criminalizing and persecuting woman, doctors, foreigners, people who love each other, and any sort of despicable unbeliever who hasn't yet learned the fear of the Lord or his wrath lovingly expressed by his many humble and dedicated servants who just happen to be crawling on their bellies, and eating dust.......

 

[ChrisL]

I understand that the Bible is more than likely a book of parables. But that doesn't convince me that there is a 'god'. I think some smart guys (for their time) and wrote these 'stories.' I don't think they are words from any gods though.

They are words of instruction that teaches a way to ascend to a higher realm of conscious existence above that of the wild beasts of the field, a more rich and fulfilling life free of many of the pitfalls and suffering experienced by those who live according to the law of the jungle.

The way to eternal life has been made clear. Follow the instruction or don't.

If you do God will make himself known to you and your mind will be opened to know all of the truth and then you will believe.

I do believe you simplify things. Lol. I understand these things. I've read the bible. I follow the rules of 'basic human decency' and then some. So there.

You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person. Understand?

I not only understand, I agree. You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person.

Thats not what I said or meant though.....

I've known plenty of good people capable of doing some very shitty things, over and over again..



Its more like becoming a strange new creature that speaks an unknown language, walks the earth upright, can see what is right in front of its eyes and actually learns from its mistakes.

Because they are human, and humans are fallible. There is no such thing as a person who is good all the time. That person doesn't exist.

Good all the time? Some people haven't even begun....they've been distracted by the holy work of criminalizing and persecuting woman, doctors, foreigners, people who love each other, and any sort of despicable unbeliever who hasn't yet learned the fear of the Lord, courtesy of his dedicated servants.......

True. I agree that there are some people who claim they are 'good' but are not really good at all. But you are not telling me anything that I don't already know.

 

[hobelim]

They are words of instruction that teaches a way to ascend to a higher realm of conscious existence above that of the wild beasts of the field, a more rich and fulfilling life free of many of the pitfalls and suffering experienced by those who live according to the law of the jungle.

The way to eternal life has been made clear. Follow the instruction or don't.

If you do God will make himself known to you and your mind will be opened to know all of the truth and then you will believe.

I do believe you simplify things. Lol. I understand these things. I've read the bible. I follow the rules of 'basic human decency' and then some. So there.

You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person. Understand?

I not only understand, I agree. You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person.

Thats not what I said or meant though.....

I've known plenty of good people capable of doing some very shitty things, over and over again..



Its more like becoming a strange new creature that speaks an unknown language, walks the earth upright, can see what is right in front of its eyes and actually learns from its mistakes.

Because they are human, and humans are fallible. There is no such thing as a person who is good all the time. That person doesn't exist.

Good all the time? Some people haven't even begun....they've been distracted by the holy work of criminalizing and persecuting woman, doctors, foreigners, people who love each other, and any sort of despicable unbeliever who hasn't yet learned the fear of the Lord, courtesy of his dedicated servants.......

True. I agree that there are some people who claim they are 'good' but are not really good at all. But you are not telling me anything that I don't already know.

Right, I have only told you what you already know. thats why now you can stop saying that there is no such thing as a talking serpent. Your eyes have been opened.

You are a believer!

 

[ChrisL]

I do believe you simplify things. Lol. I understand these things. I've read the bible. I follow the rules of 'basic human decency' and then some. So there.

You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person. Understand?

I not only understand, I agree. You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person.

Thats not what I said or meant though.....

I've known plenty of good people capable of doing some very shitty things, over and over again..



Its more like becoming a strange new creature that speaks an unknown language, walks the earth upright, can see what is right in front of its eyes and actually learns from its mistakes.

Because they are human, and humans are fallible. There is no such thing as a person who is good all the time. That person doesn't exist.

Good all the time? Some people haven't even begun....they've been distracted by the holy work of criminalizing and persecuting woman, doctors, foreigners, people who love each other, and any sort of despicable unbeliever who hasn't yet learned the fear of the Lord, courtesy of his dedicated servants.......

True. I agree that there are some people who claim they are 'good' but are not really good at all. But you are not telling me anything that I don't already know.

Right, I have only told you what you already know. thats why now you can stop saying that there is no such thing as a talking serpent. Your eyes have been opened.

You are a believer!

No, I still don't believe in talking serpents! I believe in assholes though!

 

[hobelim]

I not only understand, I agree. You don't have to believe in gods to be a good person.

Thats not what I said or meant though.....

I've known plenty of good people capable of doing some very shitty things, over and over again..



Its more like becoming a strange new creature that speaks an unknown language, walks the earth upright, can see what is right in front of its eyes and actually learns from its mistakes.

Because they are human, and humans are fallible. There is no such thing as a person who is good all the time. That person doesn't exist.

Good all the time? Some people haven't even begun....they've been distracted by the holy work of criminalizing and persecuting woman, doctors, foreigners, people who love each other, and any sort of despicable unbeliever who hasn't yet learned the fear of the Lord, courtesy of his dedicated servants.......

True. I agree that there are some people who claim they are 'good' but are not really good at all. But you are not telling me anything that I don't already know.

Right, I have only told you what you already know. thats why now you can stop saying that there is no such thing as a talking serpent. Your eyes have been opened.

You are a believer!

No, I still don't believe in talking serpents! I believe in assholes though!

Thats terrific! Because of your keen insight, many people will come to believe in assholes too!
Even in balaam's she-ass who ran away every time it saw the angel of the Lord.


Well done!