What Really Is Hell? non-believers and my fellow Christians.

[edthecynic]

Each person gain eternal life or eternal death I can't make it any clearer.

Here is a little help for you.

Creed - My Own Prison (with lyrics) - YouTube


They will be granted eternal life or they will destroyed in the lake of fire,the punishment is eternal death.

But how can one suffer a punishment if you are not conscious of it?????

"There is no death. Only a change of worlds."
— Chief Seattle

You want me to say there is gonna be pain and suffering with their judgment but that just is not true.

1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety! Then sudden destruction comes on them, as travail upon a woman with child. And they shall not escape.

Why if the plan was to torment evil people in this place called Hell for eternity,then why is there a battle of armageddon where he destroy's the evil.

The people who God has put to death since mans beginning have already been judged. They are dead and they will not be resurrected.

The ones that are resurrected will have eternal life or eternal death.

The people put to death at the battle of armorgeddon received their punishment of eternal death.

I'm not sure why so many have a problem grasping this concept.

So basically you are saying the Atheists were right all along, that death is the eternal bliss of nothingness. Whereas heaven is the hell of being around Christians for eternity.

 

[amrchaos]

God judges by the heart and dahmer payed the price for his sin with his death. Most will pay the price for sin which is death.

So if someone is insane that should be held against him by God ?

Do you know if dahmer converted before his death ?

God say's the wages of sin is death is that not what we all eventually do is die. We have foregiveness for our sins but we still sin and die.

There will be some who never die but they have to have the right heart condition to not exp death.

Why does it matter if Dahmer converted or not?
Should not a sinner be punished according to his sin? Or is asking forgiveness an escape out of hell card?

Even if he asked for forgiveness and converted with all the sincerity in the world, why should he go unpunished? The argument of a persons realization before punishment is utter BS! What if he become sincere while he is being punished, should God then let him off with a half-sentence?

There is nothing in scriptures that says so, thus suggesting being forgiven before punishment is a load of crap.

Punish the sinner according to his sin. That is justice.
Forgiven a sinner because he asked to be forgiven, because he converted to a certain religion or because some mystic claim that this is so is an attempt to usurp justice. Your heart is what lead you to the sin, why should it become your Judge?

Hell isn't about punishment. NOTHING about the Christian view of the afterlife really has anything to do with punishment, although that is a common misconception human beings project onto it.

If you insist on confusing God and the afterlife with the criminal justice system, you're going to get nothing but wrong answers and confusion.

No, you are sugesting that I am comparing the Christian view of Justice with the American criminal system for justice.

I never made that comparison. How could I when I based my argument on the condition of ones heart? The American criminal system does not weigh a mans heart or conviction in making a sentence.

But Christian claim God does. So is it possible that the heart does not change upon death, or after you die? If this is the case, then just exactly is the afterlife if change is not allowed? If the soul cannot change, is it alive? Or is the afterlife really make believe, when you die you are just that?

 

[Youwerecreated]

But how can one suffer a punishment if you are not conscious of it?????

"There is no death. Only a change of worlds."
— Chief Seattle

You want me to say there is gonna be pain and suffering with their judgment but that just is not true.

1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety! Then sudden destruction comes on them, as travail upon a woman with child. And they shall not escape.

Why if the plan was to torment evil people in this place called Hell for eternity,then why is there a battle of armageddon where he destroy's the evil.

The people who God has put to death since mans beginning have already been judged. They are dead and they will not be resurrected.

The ones that are resurrected will have eternal life or eternal death.

The people put to death at the battle of armorgeddon received their punishment of eternal death.

I'm not sure why so many have a problem grasping this concept.

So basically you are saying the Atheists were right all along, that death is the eternal bliss of nothingness. Whereas heaven is the hell of being around Christians for eternity.

When we die that is it until the resurrection.

If we gain eternal life mankind will gain from God what unfaithful man has longed for from man peace and security that will never happen through man.

 

[Youwerecreated]

There is such a place as Hell and everyone who dies go there.

Define Sheol | Dictionary and Thesaurus

This is an opinion, not a fact. I know you confuse those two things at times. There is zero evidence for your views.

Can you show me any source that disagrees with me the word sheol does not mean the abode of the dead or hell ?

Not an opinion, the world of the dead is the grave or urn but it is the state of being dead either way.

 

[edthecynic]

You want me to say there is gonna be pain and suffering with their judgment but that just is not true.

1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety! Then sudden destruction comes on them, as travail upon a woman with child. And they shall not escape.

Why if the plan was to torment evil people in this place called Hell for eternity,then why is there a battle of armageddon where he destroy's the evil.

The people who God has put to death since mans beginning have already been judged. They are dead and they will not be resurrected.

The ones that are resurrected will have eternal life or eternal death.

The people put to death at the battle of armorgeddon received their punishment of eternal death.

I'm not sure why so many have a problem grasping this concept.

So basically you are saying the Atheists were right all along, that death is the eternal bliss of nothingness. Whereas heaven is the hell of being around Christians for eternity.

When we die that is it until the resurrection.

If we gain eternal life mankind will gain from God what unfaithful man has longed for from man peace and security that will never happen through man.

That is a mighty big IF, the peace and tranquility of eternal death is a certainty and eternal life is at best a big maybe, but I highly doubt that even God has the power to make life with Christians heavenly.

 

[hipeter924]

I just can't come to believe in heaven or hell, but both are just as horrible in my opinion. I have thought about heaven and hell, being conditional on the existence of the soul, and it makes more sense for souls to just float randomly through space, rather than have any designated place such as heaven or hell.

 

[Youwerecreated]

I just can't come to believe in heaven or hell, but both are just as horrible in my opinion. I have thought about heaven and hell, being conditional on the existence of the soul, and it makes more sense for souls to just float randomly through space, rather than have any designated place such as heaven or hell.

To answer your question we would need a thread about what a soul is. In short anything that lives and breathes are a soul. If not then you must believe animals have a soul according to the scriptures..

 

[Youwerecreated]

So basically you are saying the Atheists were right all along, that death is the eternal bliss of nothingness. Whereas heaven is the hell of being around Christians for eternity.

When we die that is it until the resurrection.

If we gain eternal life mankind will gain from God what unfaithful man has longed for from man peace and security that will never happen through man.

That is a mighty big IF, the peace and tranquility of eternal death is a certainty and eternal life is at best a big maybe, but I highly doubt that even God has the power to make life with Christians heavenly.

Are you saying that if there is a God he created all life and the universe .God would not be able to cleanse the earth of all sin and evil and bring everlasting peace and security to mankind ?

 

[whitehall]

Listening to Barny Frank speaking is my idea of a little bit of hell.

 

[edthecynic]

When we die that is it until the resurrection.

If we gain eternal life mankind will gain from God what unfaithful man has longed for from man peace and security that will never happen through man.

That is a mighty big IF, the peace and tranquility of eternal death is a certainty and eternal life is at best a big maybe, but I highly doubt that even God has the power to make life with Christians heavenly.

Are you saying that if there is a God he created all life and the universe .God would not be able to cleanse the earth of all sin and evil and bring everlasting peace and security to mankind ?

Hell no!

God could no more bring peace to mankind than he could change the past.

 

[Youwerecreated]

That is a mighty big IF, the peace and tranquility of eternal death is a certainty and eternal life is at best a big maybe, but I highly doubt that even God has the power to make life with Christians heavenly.

Are you saying that if there is a God he created all life and the universe .God would not be able to cleanse the earth of all sin and evil and bring everlasting peace and security to mankind ?

Hell no!

God could no more bring peace to mankind than he could change the past.

The past and present is a test for all mankind,he could have destroyed adam and eve and start again but the rebellion of satan and the fall of adam and eve brought up the question does God have the right to rule over mankind.

So we are going through this life to see what this world will become under the rule of satan and man.

Thank God he only allowed man and satan a short period of time according to God's time frame.

But surely the creator of all we see and can't see is capable of doing anything he pleases.

 

[edthecynic]

Are you saying that if there is a God he created all life and the universe .God would not be able to cleanse the earth of all sin and evil and bring everlasting peace and security to mankind ?

Hell no!

God could no more bring peace to mankind than he could change the past.

The past and present is a test for all mankind,he could have destroyed adam and eve and start again but the rebellion of satan and the fall of adam and eve brought up the question does God have the right to rule over mankind.

So we are going through this life to see what this world will become under the rule of satan and man.

Thank God he only allowed man and satan a short period of time according to God's time frame.

But surely the creator of all we see and can't see is capable of doing anything he pleases.

The creator of Satan is powerless to change the past. The existence of his creation, Satan, proves God's limitations and evil nature since Satan is a reflection of his creator.

 

[Youwerecreated]

Hell no!

God could no more bring peace to mankind than he could change the past.

The past and present is a test for all mankind,he could have destroyed adam and eve and start again but the rebellion of satan and the fall of adam and eve brought up the question does God have the right to rule over mankind.

So we are going through this life to see what this world will become under the rule of satan and man.

Thank God he only allowed man and satan a short period of time according to God's time frame.

But surely the creator of all we see and can't see is capable of doing anything he pleases.

The creator of Satan is powerless to change the past. The existence of his creation, Satan, proves God's limitations and evil nature since Satan is a reflection of his creator.

We are all a reflections of our creator but he gave us the right to choose our own path.

Does a dictator say hey you can do it my way or your way it doesn't matter. No he doesn't so he is giving us all a choice man and satans world or God's world our choice.

Man and satan have messed up this world so much that man cannot see a way to fix the problems. Thank God that he is gonna take it out of the hands of satan and man.

 

[edthecynic]

The past and present is a test for all mankind,he could have destroyed adam and eve and start again but the rebellion of satan and the fall of adam and eve brought up the question does God have the right to rule over mankind.

So we are going through this life to see what this world will become under the rule of satan and man.

Thank God he only allowed man and satan a short period of time according to God's time frame.

But surely the creator of all we see and can't see is capable of doing anything he pleases.

The creator of Satan is powerless to change the past. The existence of his creation, Satan, proves God's limitations and evil nature since Satan is a reflection of his creator.

We are all a reflections of our creator but he gave us the right to choose our own path.

Does a dictator say hey you can do it my way or your way it doesn't matter. No he doesn't so he is giving us all a choice man and satans world or God's world our choice.

Man and satan have messed up this world so much that man cannot see a way to fix the problems. Thank God that he is gonna take it out of the hands of satan and man.

So you admit that the creator of Satan made a mistake putting the world in the hands of his creation, Satan, in the first place!
Thank you.

 

[Youwerecreated]

The creator of Satan is powerless to change the past. The existence of his creation, Satan, proves God's limitations and evil nature since Satan is a reflection of his creator.

We are all a reflections of our creator but he gave us the right to choose our own path.

Does a dictator say hey you can do it my way or your way it doesn't matter. No he doesn't so he is giving us all a choice man and satans world or God's world our choice.

Man and satan have messed up this world so much that man cannot see a way to fix the problems. Thank God that he is gonna take it out of the hands of satan and man.

So you admit that the creator of Satan made a mistake putting the world in the hands of his creation, Satan, in the first place!
Thank you.

Nope God did not put him in charge of the earth. God forced him to earth and gave him certain conditions and gave him so much time to prove God wrong and satan is failing miserably.

 

[Youwerecreated]

The creator of Satan is powerless to change the past. The existence of his creation, Satan, proves God's limitations and evil nature since Satan is a reflection of his creator.

We are all a reflections of our creator but he gave us the right to choose our own path.

Does a dictator say hey you can do it my way or your way it doesn't matter. No he doesn't so he is giving us all a choice man and satans world or God's world our choice.

Man and satan have messed up this world so much that man cannot see a way to fix the problems. Thank God that he is gonna take it out of the hands of satan and man.

So you admit that the creator of Satan made a mistake putting the world in the hands of his creation, Satan, in the first place!
Thank you.

Here is where satan raised a question concerning man in front of the Angels and this is where God began proving satan wrong and the same thing is going on today.


Job 1:6 And a day came when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah. And Satan also came among them.
Job 1:7 And Jehovah said to Satan, From where do you come? Then Satan answered Jehovah and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
Job 1:8 And Jehovah said to Satan, Have you set your heart against My servant Job, because there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and upright man, one who fears God and turns away from evil?
Job 1:9 And Satan answered Jehovah and said, Does Job fear God for nothing?
Job 1:10 Have You not made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his livestock have increased in the land.
Job 1:11 But put forth Your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will curse You to Your face.
Job 1:12 And Jehovah said to Satan, Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only do not lay your hand upon him. And Satan went forth from the presence of Jehovah.
Job 1:13 And a day came when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house.
Job 1:14 And there came a messenger to Job and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them.
Job 1:15 And the Sabeans fell on and took them away. Yea, they have killed the servants with the edge of the sword. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:16 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, The fire of God has fallen from the heavens and has burned up the sheep and the servants, and destroyed them. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:17 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands and swooped down upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and have killed the servants with the edge of the sword. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:18 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, Your sons and your daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house.
Job 1:19 And, behold, a great wind came from the wilderness and struck the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:20 And Job arose, and tore his robe, and shaved his head, and fell down upon the ground and worshiped.
Job 1:21 And he said, I came naked out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return there. Jehovah gave, and Jehovah has taken away. Blessed be the name of Jehovah.
Job 1:22 In all this Job did not sin, nor charge God foolishly.

 

[edthecynic]

We are all a reflections of our creator but he gave us the right to choose our own path.

Does a dictator say hey you can do it my way or your way it doesn't matter. No he doesn't so he is giving us all a choice man and satans world or God's world our choice.

Man and satan have messed up this world so much that man cannot see a way to fix the problems. Thank God that he is gonna take it out of the hands of satan and man.

So you admit that the creator of Satan made a mistake putting the world in the hands of his creation, Satan, in the first place!
Thank you.

Here is where satan raised a question concerning man in front of the Angels and this is where God began proving satan wrong and the same thing is going on today.


Job 1:6 And a day came when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah. And Satan also came among them.
Job 1:7 And Jehovah said to Satan, From where do you come? Then Satan answered Jehovah and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
Job 1:8 And Jehovah said to Satan, Have you set your heart against My servant Job, because there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and upright man, one who fears God and turns away from evil?
Job 1:9 And Satan answered Jehovah and said, Does Job fear God for nothing?
Job 1:10 Have You not made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his livestock have increased in the land.
Job 1:11 But put forth Your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will curse You to Your face.
Job 1:12 And Jehovah said to Satan, Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only do not lay your hand upon him. And Satan went forth from the presence of Jehovah.
Job 1:13 And a day came when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house.
Job 1:14 And there came a messenger to Job and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them.
Job 1:15 And the Sabeans fell on and took them away. Yea, they have killed the servants with the edge of the sword. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:16 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, The fire of God has fallen from the heavens and has burned up the sheep and the servants, and destroyed them. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:17 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands and swooped down upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and have killed the servants with the edge of the sword. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:18 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, Your sons and your daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house.
Job 1:19 And, behold, a great wind came from the wilderness and struck the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:20 And Job arose, and tore his robe, and shaved his head, and fell down upon the ground and worshiped.
Job 1:21 And he said, I came naked out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return there. Jehovah gave, and Jehovah has taken away. Blessed be the name of Jehovah.
Job 1:22 In all this Job did not sin, nor charge God foolishly.

Why is God's creation, Satan, so powerful and your God so insecure that your God felt obligated to prove himself to his creation, Satan?

 

[Youwerecreated]

So you admit that the creator of Satan made a mistake putting the world in the hands of his creation, Satan, in the first place!
Thank you.

Here is where satan raised a question concerning man in front of the Angels and this is where God began proving satan wrong and the same thing is going on today.


Job 1:6 And a day came when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah. And Satan also came among them.
Job 1:7 And Jehovah said to Satan, From where do you come? Then Satan answered Jehovah and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
Job 1:8 And Jehovah said to Satan, Have you set your heart against My servant Job, because there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and upright man, one who fears God and turns away from evil?
Job 1:9 And Satan answered Jehovah and said, Does Job fear God for nothing?
Job 1:10 Have You not made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his livestock have increased in the land.
Job 1:11 But put forth Your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will curse You to Your face.
Job 1:12 And Jehovah said to Satan, Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only do not lay your hand upon him. And Satan went forth from the presence of Jehovah.
Job 1:13 And a day came when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house.
Job 1:14 And there came a messenger to Job and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them.
Job 1:15 And the Sabeans fell on and took them away. Yea, they have killed the servants with the edge of the sword. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:16 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, The fire of God has fallen from the heavens and has burned up the sheep and the servants, and destroyed them. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:17 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands and swooped down upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and have killed the servants with the edge of the sword. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:18 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, Your sons and your daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house.
Job 1:19 And, behold, a great wind came from the wilderness and struck the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:20 And Job arose, and tore his robe, and shaved his head, and fell down upon the ground and worshiped.
Job 1:21 And he said, I came naked out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return there. Jehovah gave, and Jehovah has taken away. Blessed be the name of Jehovah.
Job 1:22 In all this Job did not sin, nor charge God foolishly.

Why is God's creation, Satan, so powerful and your God so insecure that your God felt obligated to prove himself to his creation, Satan?

Do you think maybe those intelligent angels witnessing the conversation between Satan and God might wonder if Satan might be right if God didn't prove him wrong ?

 

[edthecynic]

Here is where satan raised a question concerning man in front of the Angels and this is where God began proving satan wrong and the same thing is going on today.


Job 1:6 And a day came when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah. And Satan also came among them.
Job 1:7 And Jehovah said to Satan, From where do you come? Then Satan answered Jehovah and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
Job 1:8 And Jehovah said to Satan, Have you set your heart against My servant Job, because there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and upright man, one who fears God and turns away from evil?
Job 1:9 And Satan answered Jehovah and said, Does Job fear God for nothing?
Job 1:10 Have You not made a hedge around him, and around his house, and around all that he has on every side? You have blessed the work of his hands, and his livestock have increased in the land.
Job 1:11 But put forth Your hand now, and touch all that he has, and he will curse You to Your face.
Job 1:12 And Jehovah said to Satan, Behold, all that he has is in your power. Only do not lay your hand upon him. And Satan went forth from the presence of Jehovah.
Job 1:13 And a day came when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house.
Job 1:14 And there came a messenger to Job and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them.
Job 1:15 And the Sabeans fell on and took them away. Yea, they have killed the servants with the edge of the sword. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:16 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, The fire of God has fallen from the heavens and has burned up the sheep and the servants, and destroyed them. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:17 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands and swooped down upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and have killed the servants with the edge of the sword. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:18 While he was still speaking, there also came another and said, Your sons and your daughters were eating and drinking wine in their oldest brother's house.
Job 1:19 And, behold, a great wind came from the wilderness and struck the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead. And I only have escaped alone to tell you.
Job 1:20 And Job arose, and tore his robe, and shaved his head, and fell down upon the ground and worshiped.
Job 1:21 And he said, I came naked out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return there. Jehovah gave, and Jehovah has taken away. Blessed be the name of Jehovah.
Job 1:22 In all this Job did not sin, nor charge God foolishly.

Why is God's creation, Satan, so powerful and your God so insecure that your God felt obligated to prove himself to his creation, Satan?

Do you think maybe those intelligent angels witnessing the conversation between Satan and God might wonder if Satan might be right if God didn't prove him wrong ?

So it's the angels' fault your God is insecure!

 

[uscitizen]

As I recall Gabriel had to rally a bunch of angels to save gods ass from Satan's rebellion in heaven.