CDZ Welfare vs Charity

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Tommy Tainant, Jul 13, 2016.

  1. Tommy Tainant
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    Tommy Tainant Gold Member

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    Should we help the poor and jobless with charity or welfare ?

    Charity -

    Pros - No cost to the state
    Giver feels they are doing good.

    Cons - Not guaranteed
    Feudal

    Welfare -
    Pros - We all pay in so it is a right.
    Universal

    Cons - Subject to political interference.
    Workhouse stigma.

    Anybody can fall on hard times so how do we help them get through it and back on the road to success ?

    NB - I am not interested in the junkie round the corner who never works and drives a better car than you. Stick to the big picture.
     
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  2. Meathead
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    Meathead Gold Member

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    Get off the dole and get a job.
     
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  3. yiostheoy
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    yiostheoy Gold Member

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    FDR settled this when he took over office from Hoover.

    So why are you revisiting it now?
     
  4. tyroneweaver
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    tyroneweaver Gold Member

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    Welfare Square
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    [​IMG]
    Welfare Square grain silo
    Welfare Square is a complex in downtown Salt Lake City, Utah owned and operated by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church), to provide material assistance to poor and otherwise needy individuals and families. Welfare Square is part of the Church's Church Welfare System. It includes a 178-foot, 300,000 bushel grain silo, fruit orchards, a milk-processing plant, a cannery, a bakery, a Deseret Industries thrift store, a private employment office, and the LDS Church's largest[1] Bishop's storehouse, as well as associated administrative offices.[2]

    Most of the assistance provided at Welfare Square goes to those who are members of the LDS Church. [3]

    Welfare Square provides regular employment for around fifty people, in addition to the two hundred rotating volunteers needed to provide its services and run its operations. Fast offerings from local LDS congregations fund its operations.[2]



    Contents
    [hide]


    History[edit]
    Welfare Square was created in 1938,[2] under the direction of the Church's General Welfare Committee, which itself had been formed just two years earlier.[4] Throughout the 1930s and 1940s, as the United States was experiencing the Great Depression Welfare Square became the flagship of the Church's Welfare Program.

    A four-year renovation started in the late 1990s, and was completed in 2001. The 1940 granary building was the only structure on the site that was not significantly refurbished or newly built at that time.[5] The concrete grain elevator can hold 318,000 bushels of wheat (about 19 million pounds).[6]

    In 2011 the Utah legislature passed, and the governor signed, a bill commemorating the founding of the LDS Church's Welfare System,[7] of which Welfare Square is the centerpiece.[6]

    Values[edit]
    As part of the LDS Church's larger Welfare Program, all aid received at Welfare Square is based on personal responsibility, thrift, and work; recipients of aid may be asked to volunteer their time after receiving help.[8][9]
     
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  5. GaryDog
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    GaryDog Gold Member

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    Welfare is more often used by single mothers to raise their children. It is a vital (and economically beneficial) program.

    I remember once that Romney's wife during the '12 campaign talked about motherhood as the "hardest job on the planet", and therefore no one should question her struggle as a parent to 5 kids with a mega-rich husband. If that's the case, the REAL heroes in society are the single mothers. Unless you think motherhood is only a tough job if a man (and primarily a rich man) legitimizes it by agreeing to marry the mother in question.

    Charity is nice, but it's been proven to not be nearly enough. It's unreliable, often comes with undue religious strings, and it's not universal. No comparison here.
     
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  6. Tommy Tainant
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    Tommy Tainant Gold Member

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    What we are finding here is that welfare is now being supplemented by Charity. Most towns now have foodbanks which are run by the Salvation Army. You cant just turn up though.You have to be referred by a Dr or other kind of professional. Its a sticking plaster rather than a solution.
     
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  7. yiostheoy
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    yiostheoy Gold Member

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    In order to fund a "Mormon Church" on a larger scale and adopt their fictitious so called welfare program, you would first need to add a 10% gross income tax to everyone.

    That gross income tax would wipe out their private investments and future retirement funds.

    So the Mormons do not have any answers here either except for their usual door to door bullsh!t.
     
  8. Silent Warrior
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    Silent Warrior Gold Member

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    One of the advantages of charity, is the charity might cut off the able bodied person that just doesn't want to work and welfare never will. As far as single moms go I'm all for helping them out, but it is a little like rewarding them for there poor choices in husband material. I once bumped into a welfare queen with 9 kids by 9 different fathers. Welfare was her work of choice. Welfare IS needed, but we should do a lot more policing of recipients than we do. Of course that means more federal workers who can't be fired.
     
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  9. yiostheoy
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    yiostheoy Gold Member

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    In California lots of working poor are showing up at soup kitchens to eat. These are charitable too.

    Between the soup kitchens and the unemployment the out of luck people can barely eat and live.

    The Crash of 2008 is still with us in large measure.

    And it was all brought to us by Lehman Brothers.
     
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  10. Care4all
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    Care4all Warrior Princess Supporting Member

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    fyi

    Due to President GW Bush's "Faith Based Initiative" programs, the Charities are the ones dispersing the govt monies for the poorest....

    As example, Catholic Charities now receives 50% of its money for the poor from government entities...
     
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