Want gun control? Fight smart.

[OldLady]

Don't you dare "you moron" me. I don't give a shit what it looks like. If it can fire dozens of bullets per minute into a crowd, we don't need it on the streets.

How many guns made do you think CANT do that? Good lord.

I've heard that bullshit argument before. You know AR-15's are faster and more powerful. Why are you lying?

Faster and powerful? You obviously know nothing of firearms whatsoever. Now go run along to your safe space, snowflake you have no credibility on the matter...

Yes, they're faster and more powerful and I've heard Chief of Police and DOJ officials admit it. THEY know about guns. Do you want them to all go back to their safe spaces, too?

Most AR15s are .223/5.56 a very common cartridge they are no different wheather they are in a bolt gun, lever action or single. They are not anymore powerful and faster. Dumbass
They are telling you that they know nothing about firearms to because you obviously know absolutely nothing about them...

You tell that to Old Rocks

 

[Old Rocks]

Any firearm that can be fired a high rate, and has a magazine capability. That includes semi pistols, gatling guns, and semi's that can be loaded with high capacity magazines. That would actually allow the old Garand, as it had only an eight shot magazine, and you would have to alter it to have to a larger magazine. Such alteration would earn you a felony and jail term.

LLMMAAOOO effectively just outlawed everything but revolvers and some shotguns.....yet again libs want to change definitions to further their agenda of disarming you...

You are full shit. That does not effect lever guns, bolt action rifles, pump guns, or guns like the single shot rifles.

Did you or did you not just suggest a ban on the vast majority of guns sold today...be honest....numbers are easy to find

If the majority of guns sold today are assault weapons, then those buying them would be required to have a class 3 license. And those possessing these weapons already woul be required to have a class 3 license to have them off their property. That is not a ban or confiscation. If we get many more of these shootings because people like you prevent any measures from being taken to prevent them, I will support an outright ban and confiscation. As will many others, maybe enough to get that law passed. It is now up to you people that want these guns to take action to prevent them from getting in the hands of crazies, or the rest of us will take action to prevent anyone from possessing these guns, period.

I would like not to use threats here, but I think you're right. Absolute refusal to work for improvement is eventually going to end with what you predict.

Probably to a point that even I will not like it. A few more bad mass shootings, and there will be a really sharp reaction.

 

[BlackSand]

Well, asshole, she is not making money of selling murder weapons as you are. I hope that you end up bankrupt, and out on the street, begging.

You just failed the Fight smart curriculum

Yep ... He just skipped right to the swing blindly chapter ...

.

 

[TNHarley]

I hope that you end up bankrupt, and out on the street, begging.

Ahhh, i see why you claim to care so much about people.

There are people that I intensely dislike, like you and Rustic. I bet you crow with delight about every school shooting. You see, it is easy to post really stupid shit.

But, as Old Lady posted, we have a real problem, and we need to solve it. And you are not even offering a suggestion for solving it. As we have seen in the paper on the indictments of the Russians, there are people actively devoted to preventing any solutions to the problems in our nation. People that seek only to divide and weaken our nation. By the posting here, I think that we can identify some of those people.

I completely agree that we do. We need to focus on the problem and go from there.
Its hard to have a discussion with someone that is completely ignorant and has no idea what they are talking about, though. Doncha think?
Like when retards say we need to ban all guns that will shoot dozens of rounds in a minute. Or we need to do something about guns that were designed to kill.
Drop your fucking cliches and rhetoric, and lets do this!

 

[Rustic]

yes, you can hunt with an AR15, but as we get talking, no one I've talked to actually uses one for hunting.

No surprise that. On several hunting enthusiast sites one finds lists of the editors' top pics for deer hunting.

• Outdoor Life
• Game and Fish
• Field and Stream
  • Sub $1000 options
• American Whitetail
• Grand View Outdoors

Of all the rifles mentioned, only once is an AR-15 variant cited as among the best rifles for hunting deer.

I also checked a few sites/listings focused on big game hunting. Again, the AR-15 ilk of guns didn't appear.

• I Like Big Guns and I Cannot Lie: Best Big Bore Rifles - Pew Pew Tactical
  
• You Can Hunt Any Animal in the World with Just These 4 Guns
  
• The Best Big Game Rifles of All Time - Petersen's Hunting
  
• The 20 Best Elk Hunting Rifles Ever Made

So while one may or may not be able to use an AR-15-like rifle for hunting, there are plenty of alternatives up and down the the price spectrum.

AR-15s are not really good weapons for deer hunting. They are fine for smaller animals such as young hogs, wolves and coyotes.

You do realize ARs are available in several cartridges? Btw .223 is a great deer round.. shit for brains

Nope, unless you're shooting at less than 100 yards, it is not a GREAT deer round. And, though I'm sure you felt like such a man for labeling me "shit for brains", all you really did is show your immaturity.

A. 223 is plenty accurate, effective and pounds for up around 300 yards on deer. Easy

 

[OldLady]

I've heard that bullshit argument before. You know AR-15's are faster and more powerful. Why are you lying?

You clearly no nothing about firearms, my God you are ignorant.

Sure, Mike, I'm sure there are guns faster and more powerful than an AR-15. They should be banned, also.

Lol
You are a stupid as a bag of hammers, educate yourself on the subject before you speak. You looping bitch

Well, asshole, she is not making money of selling murder weapons as you are. I hope that you end up bankrupt, and out on the street, begging.

You just failed the Fight smart curriculum

Have you got Rustic on ignore or something? Well, I don't blame you, actually. Anyway, you should see him. Went down in a real blaze of glory.

 

[Old Rocks]

Any firearm that can be fired a high rate, and has a magazine capability. That includes semi pistols, gatling guns, and semi's that can be loaded with high capacity magazines. That would actually allow the old Garand, as it had only an eight shot magazine, and you would have to alter it to have to a larger magazine. Such alteration would earn you a felony and jail term.

LLMMAAOOO effectively just outlawed everything but revolvers and some shotguns.....yet again libs want to change definitions to further their agenda of disarming you...

You are full shit. That does not effect lever guns, bolt action rifles, pump guns, or guns like the single shot rifles.

Did you or did you not just suggest a ban on the vast majority of guns sold today...be honest....numbers are easy to find

If the majority of guns sold today are assault weapons, then those buying them would be required to have a class 3 license. And those possessing these weapons already woul be required to have a class 3 license to have them off their property. That is not a ban or confiscation. If we get many more of these shootings because people like you prevent any measures from being taken to prevent them, I will support an outright ban and confiscation. As will many others, maybe enough to get that law passed. It is now up to you people that want these guns to take action to prevent them from getting in the hands of crazies, or the rest of us will take action to prevent anyone from possessing these guns, period.

You know they are...don't lie...semi - auto pistols are not assault weapons.....what was the stat on % of people who don't have $500 for an emergency .....all about the ban

You tell that the the people that were killed at Virginia Tech.

 

[Old Rocks]

There are different interpretations of the 2nd Amendment and I'm not a constitutional scholar, so I'm not going to get into it with you. However, I certainly don't think that EVERYONE believes as you do that the 2nd is an automatic stop sign forbidding regulation on gun ownership. You are stating an opinion as a fact.

What I want to believe about what other people think ...
What I want the Constitution to state or how I want other people to interpret it ...
In no way changes what the Constitution does actually state ... And that is the only fact.

People only have problems interpreting the Constitution if they want to make it mean something it doesn't ...

.

I'm not going to try to posit an educated opinion on a complex issue based on centuries of historic case law and interpretation. You go for it.
I'll let people who know what they're talking about argue the case. There are plenty who believe the 2nd would allow banning certain types of guns. AR-15's were illegal for 10 years and the law wasn't overturned. Why do you think that is?

Because it died a natural death. I'm not for stripping millions of citizens of their rights because of 1 maniac. That's insanity.

How about we teach kids to be good, and "Thou shalt not kill", and give them a little discipline when they get out of line, huh?

That's what worked for 100s of years.

It is not one maniac. How many mass shootings in the past ten years? Many maniacs with easy access to firearms, and that is what you are defending. You will not even admit there is a problem. You are a sick bastard.

 

[Rustic]

Wow! You really don't get that "shall not be infringed" is not among the debatable(-d) parts of the 2nd. Nobody but you think that is a part of the 2nd that's in dispute. Understanding that is why nobody with any sense is going to engage with you on what "shall not be infringed" means.

• History of the Second Amendment
• https://www.azcdl.org/Reynolds_ACriticalGuidetotheSecondAmendment.pdf
  
• The Embarrassing Second Amendment | Wilson Quarterly
  
• https://scholar.valpo.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2132&context=vulr
  
• https://amgoa.org/legal-reviews/Kates-Handgun-Prohib-And-Orig-Mng-of-2nd.pdf

Everything about the debate of guns and the 2nd comes down to the same thing much about the Constitution always has been: strict vs. broad constructionist interpretations.

I don't recall a lot of discussion about curbing gun rights until people started abusing the privilege of ownership and began shooting up the place. Someone had an excellent point yesterday--I don't remember if it was here or somewhere else, but....
50 years ago more people owned guns but there was less gun violence. Mass shootings were rare. What has changed in the past 50 years? Not the Constitution.

I don’t thing someone else abusing a right is cause to limit anyone else’s right. And if you go back 50 years and see how treatment of the mentally ill has changed, the answer to your question becomes evident

You know, we take the right to drive an automobile on public roads away from people that have proven themselves to be a danger to others. And we require that people have a licence that proves that they at least are aware of the rules of the road. There is no reason at all that we cannot require a class 3 license for anyone to purchase or possess one of these weapons of war off of their property.

Driving a car is a privilege, not a right

Wrong. Driving a car on a public road is a privilege, it is a right on your own property. I would apply the same reasoning to having an assault weapon or a pistol with a high capacity magazine. Such a law would not keep a law abiding, mentally stable citizen from aquiring such weapons if they desire them. It would prevent a person such as the Parkland shooter from aquiring such weapons. If you can afford the cost of one of the assault weapons, you can afford a one time fee of $500 dollars for the background check that will assure the rest of the people in this nation that you will not murder their children.

Paying for a right?
Most definitely communist/socialist

 

[OldLady]

Sorry to have to leave and miss all the name calling. I do so love it. Gotta go.

 

[Manonthestreet]

LLMMAAOOO effectively just outlawed everything but revolvers and some shotguns.....yet again libs want to change definitions to further their agenda of disarming you...

You are full shit. That does not effect lever guns, bolt action rifles, pump guns, or guns like the single shot rifles.

Did you or did you not just suggest a ban on the vast majority of guns sold today...be honest....numbers are easy to find

If the majority of guns sold today are assault weapons, then those buying them would be required to have a class 3 license. And those possessing these weapons already woul be required to have a class 3 license to have them off their property. That is not a ban or confiscation. If we get many more of these shootings because people like you prevent any measures from being taken to prevent them, I will support an outright ban and confiscation. As will many others, maybe enough to get that law passed. It is now up to you people that want these guns to take action to prevent them from getting in the hands of crazies, or the rest of us will take action to prevent anyone from possessing these guns, period.

You know they are...don't lie...semi - auto pistols are not assault weapons.....what was the stat on % of people who don't have $500 for an emergency .....all about the ban

You tell that the the people that were killed at Virginia Tech.

so if someone died from a weapon its an assault weapon.....nothing like good ol duplicity and lies

 

[BlackSand]

I would like not to use threats here, but I think you're right. Absolute refusal to work for improvement is eventually going to end with what you predict.

Probably to a point that even I will not like it. A few more bad mass shootings, and there will be a really sharp reaction.

It doesn't require threats nor reactions ... Old Lady.
It doesn't require you to feel a particular way ... Nor desire to work with someone towards a solution.

That's what shyster politicians in Washington DC do.
That's how they feed you a line a crap about how much they have accomplished.

It requires changing the Constitution ... Shit or get off the pot.
You have nothing to negotiate with ... Nothing to compromise.
You are not looking for cooperation ... You want submission ... And we are armed (that's a fact and not a threat).

.

 

[MikeK]

[...]
Even if, he would have just used something else. So, what kind of law would have stopped him from shooting up that school?

That is a critically important point which the anti-semi-auto and anti-"assault-type" rifle factions either carefully avoid or are simply too gun-ignorant to understand the significance of. If the semi-autos and "assault-type" firearms are banned, the next massacre will be carried out with a 12-gauge pump-action shotgun, which is one of the most common and popular sporting guns of all -- but which when loaded with #00 buckshot is an eminently lethal "mass-shooting" weapon.,

 

[Old Rocks]

You brought up rights, not me.

The whole discussion is about rights

The OP was about how to approach each other about gun violence in order to have an effective discussion and hopefully come to some sort of agreement on solutions. Guns are only one piece of that.

Then approach the subject from a position of respecting my rights, unless I have misused them.

Sorry, that has been the current approach, and all too many people have died in schools, churches, and outdoor music concerts. We have to find a way to prevent crazies from getting their hands on these weapons. I have suggested a manner of doing so without an outright ban on the weapons. You fellows keep on preventing a reasonable way of preventing the murderers from getting these weapons, and there will be an outright ban on the assault weapons.

That has NOT been the "current approach"
Good gawd man, where have you been?

Really? What laws have been passed to make it more difficult for crazies to get their hands on these weapons? What funding has been passed for the aid of the people that have severe mental problems?

 

[Manonthestreet]

Well, asshole, she is not making money of selling murder weapons as you are. I hope that you end up bankrupt, and out on the street, begging.

You just failed the Fight smart curriculum

Yep ... He just skipped right to the swing blindly chapter ...

.

its worse than that.....gee why cant we have a debate 101...libs always end up wishing destruction on others

 

[Rustic]

No, I would not. All the guns I have are hunting guns, I have no use for a weapon of war. A one time fee of $500 for a person not engaged in selling guns would be adequate. And they would have to start paying the annual fee, should they sell more than 3 guns in any one year.

Well then ... Sorry, it has been previously ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court to hinder the exercise of a Constitutionally protected right.
Your agreement on whatever price you think is acceptable is not required.

.

Wrong. You cannot own a fully auto .45 Thompson without a class 3 firearms license. And in 13 states, the states have laws against private citizens owning them. Those laws have not been declared unconstitutional, nor has the ban on ownership without the class 3 license. The same could be applied to the ownership of the assault weapons. I suggested a way that would allow private citizens of good character to own them without undue financial hardship. You want to go full bore on no limits at all, and you are going to end up with an outright ban of private ownership of guns such as the AR 15. That will be on your head, and no skin off my nose.

Ok, go ahead and confiscate everyones firearms through this...

With maps like these...

2016 Presidential election by county..

Good luck...

 

[Old Rocks]

Now what are you talking about? Dozens of rounds in a couple of minutes? The AR shoots very rapidly, here is a demonstration.

I said dozens of rounds in a minute, and TN & Co. said all guns can do that and I'm incredibly ignorant and have no right to an opinion on gun control I'm so stupid. This whole argument started with my statement, which I have heard over and over again from people who know, that AR-15's are faster and more powerful than other rifles. I'm a no-nothing dipshit for saying that.
I still believe what I've heard, though. They were cops and hunters and people who know guns.

Neither the pump .308 nor the lever .250 I own will fire dozens of rounds in a couple of minutes. Your have five shots, then you have to reload. In the years I hunted, I never emptied the magazine. In most cases, I took the deer home and had four unfired cartridges in my pocket from the gun.

The AR 15 fires a .22 caliber bullet at over 3000 fps. When it hits a person, the length of the bullet makes it tumble inside the victim, creating a horrible wound. It is a gun solely designed for killing other people, as many as possible, as fast as possible. And we have seen it's efficiency demonstrated in our schools and at an outdoor music concert.

How many firearms arent designed for killing? LOL Seriously?

All firearms are designed for killing. However, the hunting guns are designed for killing animals. And most states limit how many rounds the gun can carry. The assault weapons were designed only for one purpose, the killing of human beings, as many as possible. as fast as possible. So they have very large magazines that can be changed as fast as possible. For the AR 15, that is about 2 seconds. So, as we have found out all too well, they are really efficient at there intended purpose in churches, schools, outdoor music concert, night club, and Christmas parties.

Yea, i see a lot of people hunting deer with a glock. Which is weird, because i heard they were made for ducks

Are you a Russian? Because you seem to be making no sense, only injecting vitriol into what should be a serious discussion about a very serious problem in this nation.

 

[BlackSand]

its worse than that.....gee why cant we have a debate 101...libs always end up wishing destruction on others

Because debates require a thorough understanding of the material ...
Guided by vision, judgment, critical thinking and principles.

Good Luck ...

.

 

[DrLove]

Aside from the usual gaslighters and kooks, this thread nominated for OP of the Month thus far

Thanks OL

Yes helping criminals is always a win for you scum

Do you have any ideas for how to curtail mass shootings in this country?

Your asking miketx? C'mon OL, You know better. Mikey's only idea is pretty much lining up and shooting all lib-ruls.

 

[TNHarley]

I said dozens of rounds in a minute, and TN & Co. said all guns can do that and I'm incredibly ignorant and have no right to an opinion on gun control I'm so stupid. This whole argument started with my statement, which I have heard over and over again from people who know, that AR-15's are faster and more powerful than other rifles. I'm a no-nothing dipshit for saying that.
I still believe what I've heard, though. They were cops and hunters and people who know guns.

Neither the pump .308 nor the lever .250 I own will fire dozens of rounds in a couple of minutes. Your have five shots, then you have to reload. In the years I hunted, I never emptied the magazine. In most cases, I took the deer home and had four unfired cartridges in my pocket from the gun.

The AR 15 fires a .22 caliber bullet at over 3000 fps. When it hits a person, the length of the bullet makes it tumble inside the victim, creating a horrible wound. It is a gun solely designed for killing other people, as many as possible, as fast as possible. And we have seen it's efficiency demonstrated in our schools and at an outdoor music concert.

How many firearms arent designed for killing? LOL Seriously?

All firearms are designed for killing. However, the hunting guns are designed for killing animals. And most states limit how many rounds the gun can carry. The assault weapons were designed only for one purpose, the killing of human beings, as many as possible. as fast as possible. So they have very large magazines that can be changed as fast as possible. For the AR 15, that is about 2 seconds. So, as we have found out all too well, they are really efficient at there intended purpose in churches, schools, outdoor music concert, night club, and Christmas parties.

Yea, i see a lot of people hunting deer with a glock. Which is weird, because i heard they were made for ducks

Are you a Russian? Because you seem to be making no sense, only injecting vitriol into what should be a serious discussion about a very serious problem in this nation.

bless your heart