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well if evidence is just a google away, post it! I have no fking idea what you believe to be evidence. so show me what you are calling evidence. I know for a fact there is zero observed measured evidence that man is causing any change in climate. I'm happy to read it once you post it though.Are you looking for evidence or proof? Evidence is just a Google away. Proof is not available now, maybe when it is too late you'll have your proof.there's evidence? where?Maybe because there is evidence?For example, if ocean levels have been rising for some 20,000 years, why do scientists allow environmentalists to get away with the claim that it's a result of man-made global warming?
let's say that if that happened, it wouldn't be in your lifetime. so you need to find something else to hang your hat on.There is a nightmare scenario concerning Antarctica. As the sea ice declines the forces holding the ice on land may allow a rapid release of that ice into the sea. An enormous amount of land ice would become sea ice rapidly enough we'd be hard pressed to compensate. Is it inevitable, probable, or merely possible? I'd rather not find out.how would the sea levels change? all of the ice in the arctic is sea ice except greenland. and Antarctica isn't melting in your lifetime. so again, what is your concern about ice? and why is it important to worry about?I care that sea levels may change. Mankind will certainly survive whatever flooding comes but men may die in the millions. Aside from the humanitarian issue, I don't want Floridians to migrate to my state before we can build a wall. On the other hand I may get some beachfront property. Winners and losers.you care that it's melting? why? it's been melting since the world was covered in it. we exist now, and you're concerned it's melting? you want us dead under ice? you're certainly very confused. Not sure why ice is so important in your life. BTW, it isn't melting in the arctic or antarctic.
so we know the earth once was completely frozen. why did it melt most all of the ice from that complete ice age? It should be a simple question to the twerks in here.let's say that if that happened, it wouldn't be in your lifetime. so you need to find something else to hang your hat on.There is a nightmare scenario concerning Antarctica. As the sea ice declines the forces holding the ice on land may allow a rapid release of that ice into the sea. An enormous amount of land ice would become sea ice rapidly enough we'd be hard pressed to compensate. Is it inevitable, probable, or merely possible? I'd rather not find out.how would the sea levels change? all of the ice in the arctic is sea ice except greenland. and Antarctica isn't melting in your lifetime. so again, what is your concern about ice? and why is it important to worry about?I care that sea levels may change. Mankind will certainly survive whatever flooding comes but men may die in the millions. Aside from the humanitarian issue, I don't want Floridians to migrate to my state before we can build a wall. On the other hand I may get some beachfront property. Winners and losers.you care that it's melting? why? it's been melting since the world was covered in it. we exist now, and you're concerned it's melting? you want us dead under ice? you're certainly very confused. Not sure why ice is so important in your life. BTW, it isn't melting in the arctic or antarctic.
Actually, jc....no.
They are exactly where they want to be.
The misunderstanding is that we and the greeniacs speak two different languages.....
When approach warming as though it were a science.
For them, it is a religion...
From the Amazon review of Godless, by Coulter…
Though liberalism rejects the idea of God and reviles people of faith, it bears all the attributes of a religion. In Godless, Coulter throws open the doors of the Church of Liberalism, showing us its sacraments (abortion), its holy writ (Roe v. Wade), its martyrs (from Soviet spy Alger Hiss to cop-killer Mumia Abu-Jamal), its clergy (public school teachers), its churches (government schools, where prayer is prohibited but condoms are free), its doctrine of infallibility (as manifest in the "absolute moral authority" of spokesmen from Cindy Sheehan to Max Cleland), and its cosmology (in which mankind is an inconsequential accident).
Then, of course, there's the liberal creation myth: Charles Darwin's theory of evolution.
For liberals, evolution is the touchstone that separates the enlightened from the benighted.
And....Franklin Delano Roosevelt, "...the Socialist Savior of the Democratic Party."
the Catechism: you didn't build that.....any success is just dumb luck
Sen. Mazie Hirono (D., Hawaii) on Tuesday called for liberal activists to believe in climate change as if it were a "religion."
Dem Senator Hirono: Believe in Climate Change Like a Religion
Are you looking for evidence or proof? Evidence is just a Google away. Proof is not available now, maybe when it is too late you'll have your proof.there's evidence? where?Maybe because there is evidence?For example, if ocean levels have been rising for some 20,000 years, why do scientists allow environmentalists to get away with the claim that it's a result of man-made global warming?
they know not what the word 'evidence' means.What evidence? I dare say that neither you nor all of climate science can provide a single piece of observed, measured evidence which supports the AGW hypothesis over natural variability. You people who believe in AGW are always going on about the "evidence", but don't seem to be able to actually produce any of it. Why do you suppose that is?Maybe because there is evidence?For example, if ocean levels have been rising for some 20,000 years, why do scientists allow environmentalists to get away with the claim that it's a result of man-made global warming?
I'm not a climate scientist are you? NASA's climate scientists wrote:Maybe because there is evidence?For example, if ocean levels have been rising for some 20,000 years, why do scientists allow environmentalists to get away with the claim that it's a result of man-made global warming?
It is all "theoretical", models all the way down.
Yes it is warming, but CO2 is obviously NOT the driver of it. Heck using Trenberth's own energy budget math, CO2 CAN'T cause global warming anyway. The amount of energy leaving the planet always exceeds the theoretical warm forcing of CO2, ALWAYS!
The real problem are ignorant people pushing a modeling construct, that doesn't exist in Nature at all. Some warmists here have always ignored the hard evidence because they are ignorant and stupid.
Why do you want to fight natural warming? Because extinction is natural too. Our world is based on the existing geography. If sea levels rise there is less land available and the best land will disappear first. Where will Floridians go? Bangladeshis? Will they go quietly and not disturb us here in the US?Alang1216 writes from post 6
=================================
- Climate changes. It always has and always will. In the past, NYC was under 100s of feet of ice. That has changed.
- Glaciers around the world are generally retreating, pointing to a global temperature rise.
- The rising temperatures may be natural or man-made but it doesn't matter, the effects will be the same.
- Anything we do to mitigate rising temperatures will have the same success, regardless of the cause.
- If we make reasonable efforts to make the world energy use more efficient and rising temperatures are real, we may mitigate its' worst effects, if rising temperatures are not real, we have made the world a richer place.
My line by line reply:
1) Everyone knows Climate changes, so why do warmists keep saying skeptics are climate change deniers, they do it because it is about politics, trying to force a stupid socialism program onto the people in the pretended effort to combat a non existent problem. You saw what Political Chick posted about what various people say, Eden Offenhoffer was very specific about what they really want to do.
Quote from post 3:
“Ottmar Edenhofer, lead author of the IPCC's fourth summary report released in 2007, speaking in 2010 advised: "One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy.
Instead, climate change policy is about how we redistribute de facto the world's wealth."
Quote from Post 5:
"Christine Stewart, Canada's former Minister of the Environment said: "No matter if the science is all phony, there are collateral environmental benefits. ... Climate change (provides) the greatest chance to bring about justice and equality in the world."
You going to continue to ignore them Alang?
2) Generally they are in retreat, but doesn't matter since CO2 isn't causing it. However warmists routinely ignore hard evidence that glaciers over all are growing since the beginning of the Negative insolation around 3,000 B.C.
Mt. Logan (#2 tallest Mt. in North America) most of the glaciers there is only 300 years old and growing, there are some fragments of 8,000 year old ice there that survived the interglacial period.
A Glacier in Northern Greenland didn't exist 6,000 years ago, the Hans Tausen Ice cap in Peary land.
Mt. Churchill in east Alaska, was free of ice before 500 A.D, it is now about 1,500 foot thick by 40 miles long.
Fremont Glacier in Wyoming is not even 300 year old, it is at 43 degrees north, a disturbing sign that the interglacial phase is decaying into a new Glaciation phase.
3) The warming phase is short and dominantly natural, that is what EMPIRICAL data tells us. It is good for the life of the planet too with the of increase CO2 in the atmosphere, life is responding by increasing productivity with more land becoming green.
4) Why do you want to fight natural warming? which will end soon when the forces of Nature changes to a cooling phase. This is what bothers me is the idea that a warmer Earth is bad for us when it is actually GOOD for us, heck we lived through the predicted year 2100 modeling temperature guesses easily just 8,000 years ago when the world in general was around 2-3C warmer than now. It was even warmer in the previous interglacial period Eemian when it was a LOT warmer than now. Polar Bears and Humans survived it well.
5) America is already the world most efficient user of energy, the rest of the world is laboring under daft climate action laws and resolutions have difficulty keeping up. Rising temperatures is temporary since the underlying trend since the Minoan times is COOLING.
If the western world would stop trying to prevent Africa and Asia from using proven stable energy sources, they will become richer and healthier, buy quiche eating ecoloony scumbags are trying hard to deny it. You one of them?
You should stop being easily lied too and learn to think logically and factually.
Propaganda should be avoided, why don't you try?
Maybe because you choose to ignore it?You people who believe in AGW are always going on about the "evidence", but don't seem to be able to actually produce any of it. Why do you suppose that is?
There's a raging debate among academics as to the causes and nature of mass hysteria ... it does seem fundamental to human nature and we can speculate all day long about the evolutionary benefit to such an intrinsic property of our societies ... I can certainly see why our rodent fore-bearers panicked at every snapping twig, before we evolved our nasty tasting flesh ...
In these modern times, we have no challenges left ... in some areas of the world there's nothing dangerous ... and at the genetic level we can't deal with this and have to invent things to be afraid of ... we have to save the polar bear, so we can worry about being eaten ... we have to reintroduce the wolf, so we can worry about being eaten ... we have to outlaw hunting mountain lions, so we can worry about being eaten ... look at all the stupid morons who blindly take their kids out into the woods and then cry when honey badger rips the kids into tiny pieces ... humans need to worry, or they go insane ...
It's always best to invent our fears in areas where very very little is known ... for example them damn rag-heads, if you don't read Arabic, then you know nothing of Islam ... that's frightening, billions of people out to kill each and every one of us, best we kill them first eh? (and then take their oil) ... DNA demands we worry about this ...
Climate is even better, we know virtually nothing ... the sky's the limit when it comes to dreaming up things to worry about ... no better subject material for mass hysteria, we're all going to die unless we do something right now, "prove how I'm wrong" ... ha ha ha ha ... hypercanes and hockey sticks, oceans boiling off, dogs sleeping with cats, the end of all life on Planet Earth ... at least the nuclear annihilation drills we did in grammar school has a bit of sense to it, under my desk was the safest place to be during vaporization ...
Climatology is a backwater discipline ... certain people struggle through two years of college calculus and the whole notion of taking a third year is out of the question ... finishing the degree program in climatology is a great way to get the diploma and Jenna Marbles has some great ideas (NSFW) on what to do with such ... my point here is that climatologists aren't the smartest people in the world ... maybe smarter than biologists, but not as smart as chemists ... if you take my meaning here ...
Democrats would have us fear climate change, Republicans would have us fear Islam ... time to read Orwell's 1984 again, and remember why those in power want us to be afraid, when there's absolutely nothing to be afraid of ... they need you to vote your fears, otherwise you'll vote your conscience, and then those in power will whither away ...
This was on TV ... apparently at the end of Orson Well's radio broadcast of War of the Worlds, a transformer blew up and sent a community into darkness ... it took weeks to find everybody hiding in the woods ... mass hysteria for fun and profit ...
It has often been pointed out that Left wing governance infantilizes the electorate.
Seems to be proof.
naw, it doesn't exist.Maybe because you choose to ignore it?You people who believe in AGW are always going on about the "evidence", but don't seem to be able to actually produce any of it. Why do you suppose that is?
So we know the earth once was completely frozen. why did it melt most all of the ice from that complete ice age?
It should be a simple question to the twerks in here.
Climate is even better, we know virtually nothing ...
Climatology is a backwater discipline ...
Climate is even better, we know virtually nothing ...
No, _you_ know virtually nothing. That doesn't mean anyone else shares your ignorance.
Climatology is a backwater discipline ...
Are you aware of what a huge whopper you just told? Probably not. My guess is you're just mindlessly repeating the propaganda that you've been fed, propaganda designed to make you hysterical.
Climate scientists usually have Ph.Ds and postdocs in physics, chemistry or other rock-hard science. Yet you claimed they were science washouts.
You were as wrong as it's possible to be there. Given how totally wrong you were, why should anyone take you seriously?
So the point there seems to be that your conspiracy cult web page just flat out faked a headline."Sen. Mazie Hirono (D., Hawaii) on Tuesday called for liberal activists to believe in climate change as if it were a "religion."
So the point there seems to be that your conspiracy cult web page just flat out faked a headline."Sen. Mazie Hirono (D., Hawaii) on Tuesday called for liberal activists to believe in climate change as if it were a "religion."
Being how everyone already knows that your cult fakes everything, that's really not news
So the point there seems to be that your conspiracy cult web page just flat out faked a headline."Sen. Mazie Hirono (D., Hawaii) on Tuesday called for liberal activists to believe in climate change as if it were a "religion."
Being how everyone already knows that your cult fakes everything, that's really not news
