The War on Journalism

[Coyote]

The abduction and likely death of Kashoggi. A surprisingly sycophantic attitude from an American President known for cosying to autocrats. It must be “rogue assassins”...or something. Or something.

To abduct a person from a consulate on another nation’s territory...against that nation’s laws, represents a new and much more dangerous assault on journalistic freedom. In fact...I think it is unheard of. And it puts the US in a tricky position. Saudi Arabia is our ally. But a free media and the rights of journalists to report, and to hold their governments responsible has long been an underpinning of American Democracy. We have censored allies before for bad behavior...withheld sales for example.

We are witnessing a demise journalistic freedomof around the world journalists are being threatened, killed and jailed for trying to do their jobs. They depend on bigger more powerful countries to look out for their rights should authoritarian states come down on them.

If we kow tow to the Saudi’s over this, what does that tell other dictators and what does it say to our values?

 

[Oddball]

If only y'all had been as shook up about the dead AMERICANS in Benghazi.

 

[saveliberty]

Trump has had several lame comments on this subject to be sure. On the other hand, ruining the economy over one person seems a pretty high price to pay. I find most journalists, are not. They are socialists with a mission. It would be great if we had journalists.

 

[Stratford57]

I remember when Teresa May said " highly likely Russia poisoned Skripals " in April without any evidence (still nobody has presented any credible evidence), over a hundred of Russian diplomats have been expelled from the EU, USA, Canada.
More than 130 Russian diplomats expelled by 20 countries, including US

Nothing like that will happen with Saudis as long as they keep having billions of dollars contracts with USA and controlling the oil prices. I doubt any US president (Dem or Rep, Obama or Bush) would ever condemn them. Even if they dismembered a human being live.

P.S. Speaking about war on journalism it was lost by journalism as soon as Soros owned Media started dominating all Western informational space.

 

[saveliberty]

To me it was like walking into a bank you knew was being robbed at the time. Is it possible he wanted to be a martyr?

 

[Correll]

The abduction and likely death of Kashoggi. A surprisingly sycophantic attitude from an American President known for cosying to autocrats. It must be “rogue assassins”...or something. Or something.

To abduct a person from a consulate on another nation’s territory...against that nation’s laws, represents a new and much more dangerous assault on journalistic freedom. In fact...I think it is unheard of. And it puts the US in a tricky position. Saudi Arabia is our ally. But a free media and the rights of journalists to report, and to hold their governments responsible has long been an underpinning of American Democracy. We have censored allies before for bad behavior...withheld sales for example.

We are witnessing a demise journalistic freedomof around the world journalists are being threatened, killed and jailed for trying to do their jobs. They depend on bigger more powerful countries to look out for their rights should authoritarian states come down on them.

If we kow tow to the Saudi’s over this, what does that tell other dictators and what does it say to our values?

What did we do when the UK jailed Tommy Robinson?

 

[Coyote]

Trump has had several lame comments on this subject to be sure. On the other hand, ruining the economy over one person seems a pretty high price to pay. I find most journalists, are not. They are socialists with a mission. It would be great if we had journalists.

I think that the claim it would ruin the economy is a straw man. The Saudi’s by 99.9% of their weapons systems from us. These are complex proprietary systems. Russian systems don’t talk to Chinese systems don’t talk to American systems etc. The Saudi’s have invested billions into our systems, they are not going to start from scratch with another supplier.

The other question is...are you proposing we give Carter Blanche to them? They can do whatever they want in the territory of another ally, Turkey? When do we take a stand?

Does journalistic freedom mean anything to you? I don’t like all journalists and reporting, but where do you draw the line? Authoritarianism vs a free media. And a free media is the only check on governments.

 

[Coyote]

To me it was like walking into a bank you knew was being robbed at the time. Is it possible he wanted to be a martyr?

No. I do not think so. I think he had every reason to believe he would be safe in a consulate.

 

[Rustic]

The abduction and likely death of Kashoggi. A surprisingly sycophantic attitude from an American President known for cosying to autocrats. It must be “rogue assassins”...or something. Or something.

To abduct a person from a consulate on another nation’s territory...against that nation’s laws, represents a new and much more dangerous assault on journalistic freedom. In fact...I think it is unheard of. And it puts the US in a tricky position. Saudi Arabia is our ally. But a free media and the rights of journalists to report, and to hold their governments responsible has long been an underpinning of American Democracy. We have censored allies before for bad behavior...withheld sales for example.

We are witnessing a demise journalistic freedomof around the world journalists are being threatened, killed and jailed for trying to do their jobs. They depend on bigger more powerful countries to look out for their rights should authoritarian states come down on them.

If we kow tow to the Saudi’s over this, what does that tell other dictators and what does it say to our values?

Muslims live to kill other people

 

[whitehall]

The Washington Post once brought down a republican president and there is no doubt that the Post has the resources to dig up dirt on any republican candidate in the Country in a heartbeat. Yet the Washington Post is strangely silent and apparently helpless or unwilling to get involved in the investigation of (apparently) the murder of one of their own. I smell a rat.

 

[Correll]

To me it was like walking into a bank you knew was being robbed at the time. Is it possible he wanted to be a martyr?

No. I do not think so. I think he had every reason to believe he would be safe in a consulate.

It was a Saudi consulate, ie their territory, was it not?

So, that doesn't make any sense.

 

[Coyote]

The abduction and likely death of Kashoggi. A surprisingly sycophantic attitude from an American President known for cosying to autocrats. It must be “rogue assassins”...or something. Or something.

To abduct a person from a consulate on another nation’s territory...against that nation’s laws, represents a new and much more dangerous assault on journalistic freedom. In fact...I think it is unheard of. And it puts the US in a tricky position. Saudi Arabia is our ally. But a free media and the rights of journalists to report, and to hold their governments responsible has long been an underpinning of American Democracy. We have censored allies before for bad behavior...withheld sales for example.

We are witnessing a demise journalistic freedomof around the world journalists are being threatened, killed and jailed for trying to do their jobs. They depend on bigger more powerful countries to look out for their rights should authoritarian states come down on them.

If we kow tow to the Saudi’s over this, what does that tell other dictators and what does it say to our values?

What did we do when the UK jailed Tommy Robinson?

Didn’t he willfully break the law and admit it?

 

[Coyote]

To me it was like walking into a bank you knew was being robbed at the time. Is it possible he wanted to be a martyr?

No. I do not think so. I think he had every reason to believe he would be safe in a consulate.

It was a Saudi consulate, ie their territory, was it not?

So, that doesn't make any sense.

Yes but it was on Turkish territory.

 

[saveliberty]

Trump has had several lame comments on this subject to be sure. On the other hand, ruining the economy over one person seems a pretty high price to pay. I find most journalists, are not. They are socialists with a mission. It would be great if we had journalists.

I think that the claim it would ruin the economy is a straw man. The Saudi’s by 99.9% of their weapons systems from us. These are complex proprietary systems. Russian systems don’t talk to Chinese systems don’t talk to American systems etc. The Saudi’s have invested billions into our systems, they are not going to start from scratch with another supplier.

The other question is...are you proposing we give Carter Blanche to them? They can do whatever they want in the territory of another ally, Turkey? When do we take a stand?

Does journalistic freedom mean anything to you? I don’t like all journalists and reporting, but where do you draw the line? Authoritarianism vs a free media. And a free media is the only check on governments.

I think it is up to Turkey to take care of problems in Turkey. The Saudis are under no pressure to buy anything this year or next. That is billions lost. Also there is this thing called oil....

 

[Coyote]

Trump has had several lame comments on this subject to be sure. On the other hand, ruining the economy over one person seems a pretty high price to pay. I find most journalists, are not. They are socialists with a mission. It would be great if we had journalists.

I think that the claim it would ruin the economy is a straw man. The Saudi’s by 99.9% of their weapons systems from us. These are complex proprietary systems. Russian systems don’t talk to Chinese systems don’t talk to American systems etc. The Saudi’s have invested billions into our systems, they are not going to start from scratch with another supplier.

The other question is...are you proposing we give Carter Blanche to them? They can do whatever they want in the territory of another ally, Turkey? When do we take a stand?

Does journalistic freedom mean anything to you? I don’t like all journalists and reporting, but where do you draw the line? Authoritarianism vs a free media. And a free media is the only check on governments.

I think it is up to Turkey to take care of problems in Turkey. The Saudis are under no pressure to buy anything this year or next. That is billions lost. Also there is this thing called oil....

So we don’t stand for anything?

 

[saveliberty]

So we don’t stand for anything?

I did not say that now did I? What do you propose is the proper response?

 

[Correll]

The abduction and likely death of Kashoggi. A surprisingly sycophantic attitude from an American President known for cosying to autocrats. It must be “rogue assassins”...or something. Or something.

To abduct a person from a consulate on another nation’s territory...against that nation’s laws, represents a new and much more dangerous assault on journalistic freedom. In fact...I think it is unheard of. And it puts the US in a tricky position. Saudi Arabia is our ally. But a free media and the rights of journalists to report, and to hold their governments responsible has long been an underpinning of American Democracy. We have censored allies before for bad behavior...withheld sales for example.

We are witnessing a demise journalistic freedomof around the world journalists are being threatened, killed and jailed for trying to do their jobs. They depend on bigger more powerful countries to look out for their rights should authoritarian states come down on them.

If we kow tow to the Saudi’s over this, what does that tell other dictators and what does it say to our values?

What did we do when the UK jailed Tommy Robinson?

Didn’t he willfully break the law and admit it?

I'm sure that the saudis can say that this reporter broke some law too. Hell, if they knew you wanted it, I'm sure they could have provided video of him admitting he broke the law.

 

[saveliberty]

The whole "War on Journalism" is a farce. The Saudis had a beef with this particular writer, hardly an all out assault on all journalists.

 

[Tilly]

If only y'all had been as shook up about the dead AMERICANS in Benghazi.

Thank you!
And all the other innocent victims of Islamic terrorism, including the children of Manchester.
There are so many to choose from.

 

[Correll]

To me it was like walking into a bank you knew was being robbed at the time. Is it possible he wanted to be a martyr?

No. I do not think so. I think he had every reason to believe he would be safe in a consulate.

It was a Saudi consulate, ie their territory, was it not?

So, that doesn't make any sense.

Yes but it was on Turkish territory.

Depends. Often they, the consulate's nation, has some extraterritoriality status. Indeed, a lot of people assume they are the territory of the consulate's nation, not the host nation.


Regardless, it is obvious that Turkey was not in control of what happened in there.