CDZ The Sickness In American Culture

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Spare_change, Sep 14, 2017.

  1. Picaro
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    Picaro Gold Member

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    Corporate culture destroys real individuality, demands more conformity, and the mindless pursuit of wealth, and is not at all 'family friendly'; there is practically no difference between a corporate drone and a Stalinist era Communist Party member re labor viewpoints; all values is on economic service to the 'company'. Certainly morals take a distant place in the list of priorities, with the exception one is not supposed to lie to the 'company'; lying to customers and the like is encouraged more often than not, of course. Massive consumption is supposed to be a substitute outlet, and one's 'value' is determined by 'the marketplace'.

    You don't have to buy it; it exists, and as moral standards and values decline, it becomes more and more prevalent; the poor merely 'follow the leader' in culture wars, they don't innovate independently, just via a smaller set of options available to them than for Burb Brats. Consumption is supposed to alleviate all ills.

    And that is true on both wings of the 'culture wars'. Marxism and big business get along great, as long as the Marxists keep those uppity proles in line and working those 14 hour days 7 days a week for 2 cents an hour, less the usual fines for things like going to the toilet or getting sick.
     
  2. Andylusion
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    Andylusion Gold Member

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    I don't know anyone working 14 hours, 7 days a week, for 2¢ an hour. Big business usually pays better wages, than the average economy.

    Corporate culture destroys real individuality, demands more conformity, and the mindless pursuit of wealth, and is not at all 'family friendly'; there is practically no difference between a corporate drone and a Stalinist era Communist Party member re labor viewpoints; all values is on economic service to the 'company'. Certainly morals take a distant place in the list of priorities, with the exception one is not supposed to lie to the 'company'; lying to customers and the like is encouraged more often than not, of course. Massive consumption is supposed to be a substitute outlet, and one's 'value' is determined by 'the marketplace'.

    Ok, that's kind of what I thought. There is no universal version of "corporate culture". There are many companies that are excessively family oriented.

    I've actually worked at companies where they had a bring your family to work day. Very little got done, but people were encouraged to bring their kids, bring their wives, and husbands, and have a family day at work. They even complained at people who didn't bring their family to work.

    They encouraged people to use all their vacation time. In fact.... we had a one manager that called the family of a particular man, to tell them he had 4 full weeks of vacation time saved up, and that he should use it. (special situation which I'm not at liberty to discuss here).

    But the idea that corporate culture destroys real individuality is ridiculous. Just ridiculous.

    I never met anyone, that said "I used to be an individual until I started my career at CultureCorp." And quite frankly, we have more individualistic people today than ever before.

    If corporations had half as much influence on society as you claim, things would be improving, not getting worse.

    For example: Most companies I have been in support family life, and discourage office romance. We had a guy where I work, that was messing with the girls, while he was married. The manager got wind of it, and laid off both of them. Screwing around at work, when you are supposed to be working, is not acceptable. He is gone, and so is the girl.

    Tell me how much corporate culture is influencing society? We have more cheaters, and more family break down than ever before.

    Another example: Every company I have worked for had strict rules on how to deal with disagreements. You don't get violent, or start trying to attack people. You work through problems, and find a solution. People that scream and yell, end up fired.

    Tell me how much corporate culture is influencing society? Where is that in our society?

    Another example: You tolerate people with differing opinions. You can support Bush, and I can support Obama, but you accept the fact, and move on. You tolerate the people have different opinions, and act in a professional manor. I have people I work with every single day, that outside of the job I would not associate, with for various reasons. But at work, I smile, I talk politely, and work with in a profession way.

    Tell me how much corporate culture is influencing society? Where do you see that influence? Where is it? Where was it in Charlottesville?

    I'll even give you the simplest example.... communication. Every company I have ever worked for discouraged cursing and swearing. In most cases it was grounds for a write up, or removal.

    Where is that corporate influence in culture? Where do you see it on this forum?

    I'm sorry, but if you want to make your case, then I want something specific. Show me a specific example, of how 'corporate culture' has any influence.

    Because people want to buy stuff? People always want to have things. I was listening to an interview with a missionary to a central African tribe. They asked him what the single worst problem was in this isolated tribe. He said "greed and materialism".

    The interviewer himself was shocked. How can people in a mud hut, in some isolated part of Africa, have a problem with greed and materialism?

    The guy answered that if one guy gets a new pelt, others want a new pelt. If one makes a bigger crop, others want a bigger crop. If one makes a larger mud hut, everyone wants a larger mud hut. If one gets a better grass skirt, others want a better grass skirt. If one finds a bunch of feathers and weaves them into their hair, the others want feathers and weaved into their hair.

    People being stuck in materialism is not caused by corporations, or corporate culture. It is a fact of the human condition, specifically the human condition when they lose sight of anything larger than themselves.

    When you don't believe in G-d. Don't believe in a greater cause. Don't have anything in this world more important than "My, myself, and I".... then everything is all about what you want. Since you have nothing else to make you happy (because there is nothing else in your world more important than you), then naturally you crave stuff that you think will make you happy.

    And that will happen whether you are in the deepest darkest isolated parts of the world, or in the middle of New York City skyscrapers.

    Consumption is supposed to alleviate all ills.


    While I agree that is what people act on... I don't see that as being something instituted by society.

    I think it's more caused by left-wing ideology.

    People are miserable because they have no morals and values. Because they have no morals and values, they also do poorly economically.

    Meanwhile, people that have morals and values, often are happy. At the same time, they are also often successful.

    The problem is, Left-wing ideology says that it isn't because you lack morals, character, values that you are miserable. No, it's rather because you don't have stuff. They then point to the happy people, that also tend to be successful, and do not connect their happiness to their values and character, but rather to the stuff they have, not realizing that the reason they have stuff is because of their morals and character.

    They wrongly conclude the reason they are happy is because to of the stuff. The reason others are miserable is because of the lack of stuff. So the entire left-wing ideology is a greed and envy driven attempt to take stuff from those who have it, to give to those that don't, thinking that is the solution to their misery.

    It is not.
     
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  3. Moonglow
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    Moonglow Diamond Member

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    You really shouldn't read my uncle's BS...But culture changes, we are not the same nation we were 250 years ago..Is it good, is it bad? Well...That's hard to say..
     
  4. Spare_change
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    Spare_change Gold Member

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    Actually, it's not hard to say ... at all.
     
  5. Moonglow
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    Moonglow Diamond Member

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    There has always been disgruntled folks and abuses of the system....Why 150 years ago many died over slavery and straying outside of social norms would get you lynched or driven out of the state...Yet the nation survived and continues to forge ahead, even with the distractions...
     
  6. Windparadox
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    The decay that has enveloped the general US populace, has been very slow, spanning back many generations and is not so simplistic as to sum it up it's causes to just one or two reasons. The disease of self-righteous extremism, as portrayed by both the left and right, have become intransigent to a degree that neither side is rational.
     
  7. Moonglow
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    Moonglow Diamond Member

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    Damn if the US didn't ruin folks by becoming a superpower and rich..
     
  8. Spare_change
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    Spare_change Gold Member

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    The difference, of course, is one was a push toward better values - the better instincts of man, the more Christian values, if you will - while what we experience today is a flight FROM those very same values.
     
  9. ScienceRocks
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    ScienceRocks Democrat all the way!

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    Same thing the islamic thugs over in the middle east think. Christianity really is as much of a disease as islam.
     
  10. Windparadox
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    I think it definitely contributed to it. The same can also be said for certain religious sects, including some versions of christianity.
     

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