The Democrats war on babies.

[buckeye45_73]

I actually respect them for that.

I don't necessarily respect why they think the way they do... But I certainly don't mind people standing by their ideals.

I have respect for those who are pro-life across the board. Those who are opposed to abortion and IVF. I think there are some who are anti-abortion more than they are pro-life.

That's an interesting view. I'm going to think on that a while.

What is IVF, intravenous fertilization? What's wrong with that, some people need help to have kids.
Pro Life is a whole lot more consistant than Pro Choice, which is the biggest joke, they arent pro choice on a lot of other issues.

I'm against abortion (except in life of mother and rape/incest) and I'm against euthiasia, I am ok with killing in warfare (depends on the war) and I'm ok with killing criminals (my 4 capital crimes would be murder, rape, treason, and drug dealing (and no not pot, but anything stronger, yeah you're a menace to society, buh bye)

So in essence, I'm pro INNOCENT life........criminals and terrorists I have no use for and they give up that protection when they kill or seriously hurt others

 

[Shelzin]

What is IVF, intravenous fertilization? What's wrong with that, some people need help to have kids.

Yes... And *shrugs*

Pro Life is a whole lot more consistant than Pro Choice, which is the biggest joke, they arent pro choice on a lot of other issues.

I'm pro-choice. What other issues am I not pro-choice on? Edit: And why would that matter anyway even if I wasn't? /Edit

So in essence, I'm pro INNOCENT life........criminals and terrorists I have no use for and they give up that protection when they kill or seriously hurt others

Hey... Me too!

But I don't believe a body can be innocent or guilty of anything. It just is what it is until a person is born within it.

 

[AmyNation]

I have respect for those who are pro-life across the board. Those who are opposed to abortion and IVF. I think there are some who are anti-abortion more than they are pro-life.

That's an interesting view. I'm going to think on that a while.

What is IVF, intravenous fertilization? What's wrong with that, some people need help to have kids.
Pro Life is a whole lot more consistant than Pro Choice, which is the biggest joke, they arent pro choice on a lot of other issues.

I'm against abortion (except in life of mother and rape/incest) and I'm against euthiasia, I am ok with killing in warfare (depends on the war) and I'm ok with killing criminals (my 4 capital crimes would be murder, rape, treason, and drug dealing (and no not pot, but anything stronger, yeah you're a menace to society, buh bye)

So in essence, I'm pro INNOCENT life........criminals and terrorists I have no use for and they give up that protection when they kill or seriously hurt others

A woman who has an abortion, kills one fertilized egg. A woman who has IVF kills an average of 6 for every round she needs, and most need more than one round.

 

[buckeye45_73]

What is IVF, intravenous fertilization? What's wrong with that, some people need help to have kids.

Yes... And *shrugs*

What's the shrugs for? Is there something sinister about IVF I'm not aware of?

Pro Life is a whole lot more consistant than Pro Choice, which is the biggest joke, they arent pro choice on a lot of other issues.

I'm pro-choice. What other issues am I not pro-choice on?

Well, are you pro drugs, prostitution, polygammy, incest? Are you in favor of regulationg tstats, diet, cars, ect?

So in essence, I'm pro INNOCENT life........criminals and terrorists I have no use for and they give up that protection when they kill or seriously hurt others

Hey... Me too!
Not sure if you agreed, but if you did, good

But I don't believe a body can be innocent or guilty of anything. It just is what it is until a person is born within it.

This is where I love the discussion. So to you, a person isnt a person until birth?

 

[buckeye45_73]

That's an interesting view. I'm going to think on that a while.

What is IVF, intravenous fertilization? What's wrong with that, some people need help to have kids.
Pro Life is a whole lot more consistant than Pro Choice, which is the biggest joke, they arent pro choice on a lot of other issues.

I'm against abortion (except in life of mother and rape/incest) and I'm against euthiasia, I am ok with killing in warfare (depends on the war) and I'm ok with killing criminals (my 4 capital crimes would be murder, rape, treason, and drug dealing (and no not pot, but anything stronger, yeah you're a menace to society, buh bye)

So in essence, I'm pro INNOCENT life........criminals and terrorists I have no use for and they give up that protection when they kill or seriously hurt others

A woman who has an abortion, kills one fertilized egg. A woman who has IVF kills an average of 6 for every round she needs, and most need more than one round.

Well due tell me, IVF they usually only implant 2 or maybe 3. But if they dont take, what can you do? It's diffent that killing something that was feritilized and implanted.

 

[AmyNation]

What is IVF, intravenous fertilization? What's wrong with that, some people need help to have kids.
Pro Life is a whole lot more consistant than Pro Choice, which is the biggest joke, they arent pro choice on a lot of other issues.

I'm against abortion (except in life of mother and rape/incest) and I'm against euthiasia, I am ok with killing in warfare (depends on the war) and I'm ok with killing criminals (my 4 capital crimes would be murder, rape, treason, and drug dealing (and no not pot, but anything stronger, yeah you're a menace to society, buh bye)

So in essence, I'm pro INNOCENT life........criminals and terrorists I have no use for and they give up that protection when they kill or seriously hurt others

A woman who has an abortion, kills one fertilized egg. A woman who has IVF kills an average of 6 for every round she needs, and most need more than one round.

Well due tell me, IVF they usually only implant 2 or maybe 3. But if they dont take, what can you do? It's diffent that killing something that was feritilized and implanted.

IVF is not one standard procedure, so there are diffrent ones.

You collect the eggs, you collect the sperm, you toss out the bad eggs, you toss out the bad sperm, you fertalize. You toss out the bad fertilized eggs, you implant. If they don't all die, you then toss out the unused fertilized eggs.

Some people save the fertilized eggs or donate, but simply having them desposed of isn't uncommon.

Then you can get into the whole .. "is it murder to create life knowing your uterus is a harsh climate and that they will most likely die?" lots of ethical issues if a fertalizied egg is a baby.

 

[AmyNation]

I'm tired and off to bed, but I thought this explained the process from a prolife point of view.

"IVF usually entails the creation of multiple human embryos to ensure a greater chance of successful implantation. These human embryos are then screened for genetic disorders, handicaps and sometimes even a particular gender. The “undesirable” embryos are discarded. Normally, an IVF practitioner transfers around four of the selected embryos into a woman’s uterus. If more than one (or two) successfully implant, a physician will selectively abort (kill) the remaining embryos (Nadya “Octomom” Suleman refused this “embryonic discarding”, resulting in her delivering octuplets). This selective mentality leads to the death of little humans based on their gender, physical and mental handicaps, and how many exist simultaneously."

Pro-Life Concerns About IVF Include Abortion, Exploitation | LifeNews.com

 

[Care4all]

What is IVF, intravenous fertilization? What's wrong with that, some people need help to have kids.
Pro Life is a whole lot more consistant than Pro Choice, which is the biggest joke, they arent pro choice on a lot of other issues.

I'm against abortion (except in life of mother and rape/incest) and I'm against euthiasia, I am ok with killing in warfare (depends on the war) and I'm ok with killing criminals (my 4 capital crimes would be murder, rape, treason, and drug dealing (and no not pot, but anything stronger, yeah you're a menace to society, buh bye)

So in essence, I'm pro INNOCENT life........criminals and terrorists I have no use for and they give up that protection when they kill or seriously hurt others

A woman who has an abortion, kills one fertilized egg. A woman who has IVF kills an average of 6 for every round she needs, and most need more than one round.

Well due tell me, IVF they usually only implant 2 or maybe 3. But if they dont take, what can you do? It's diffent that killing something that was feritilized and implanted.

FYI-
not according to the Catholic Church....as soon as an egg is fertilized, it is a separate human being...at conception it is a separate human being....not when the woman becomes pregnant, (when the conceived egg attaches to the uterus, but when the sperm fertilizes the egg)

THUS the Catholics consider killing a fertilized egg, KILLING equal to abortion.... and ALSO why they are against birth control pills and the morning after pill, because both prevent a fertilized egg from living because they prevent the egg from implanting in the uterus which eventually kills the fertilized egg....THE SEPARATE HUMAN BEING.

 

[Shelzin]

What is IVF, intravenous fertilization? What's wrong with that, some people need help to have kids.

Yes... And *shrugs*

What's the shrugs for? Is there something sinister about IVF I'm not aware of?


I'm pro-choice. What other issues am I not pro-choice on?

Well, are you pro drugs, prostitution, polygammy, incest? Are you in favor of regulationg tstats, diet, cars, ect?

So in essence, I'm pro INNOCENT life........criminals and terrorists I have no use for and they give up that protection when they kill or seriously hurt others

Hey... Me too!
Not sure if you agreed, but if you did, good

But I don't believe a body can be innocent or guilty of anything. It just is what it is until a person is born within it.

This is where I love the discussion. So to you, a person isnt a person until birth?

No... I believe it happens at the start of Rapid Brain Development. Do you still love the discussion?

Edit: reading what I have already said in this thread may be helpful to you.

 

[buckeye45_73]

Yes... And *shrugs*

What's the shrugs for? Is there something sinister about IVF I'm not aware of?


I'm pro-choice. What other issues am I not pro-choice on?

Well, are you pro drugs, prostitution, polygammy, incest? Are you in favor of regulationg tstats, diet, cars, ect?


Hey... Me too!
Not sure if you agreed, but if you did, good

But I don't believe a body can be innocent or guilty of anything. It just is what it is until a person is born within it.

This is where I love the discussion. So to you, a person isnt a person until birth?

No... I believe it happens at the start of Rapid Brain Development. Do you still love the discussion?

Yep, I love it, so lets get into details, what is that, when does it start?
I pick conception, pretty simple, egg is potential, sperm is potential, the two together are life, assuming it takes hold in the mother. Why do I pick it like this?

Well if you're 1, to get to 10 years old what do you NEED? Food (including water), oxygen and TIME, everything else is helpful like shelter, love, ect, but they dont grow you. So when the egg is feritlized what does it need before birth? Food, oxygen and time, that's it.

 

[Shelzin]

A woman who has an abortion, kills one fertilized egg. A woman who has IVF kills an average of 6 for every round she needs, and most need more than one round.

Well due tell me, IVF they usually only implant 2 or maybe 3. But if they dont take, what can you do? It's diffent that killing something that was feritilized and implanted.

FYI-
not according to the Catholic Church....as soon as an egg is fertilized, it is a separate human being...at conception it is a separate human being....not when the woman becomes pregnant, (when the conceived egg attaches to the uterus, but when the sperm fertilizes the egg)

THUS the Catholics consider killing a fertilized egg, KILLING equal to abortion.... and ALSO why they are against birth control pills and the morning after pill, because both prevent a fertilized egg from living because they prevent the egg from implanting in the uterus which eventually kills the fertilized egg....THE SEPARATE HUMAN BEING.

Oh... I didn't know that. Doesn't mean anything to my stance but it's interesting to know.

 

[Shelzin]

This is where I love the discussion. So to you, a person isnt a person until birth?

No... I believe it happens at the start of Rapid Brain Development. Do you still love the discussion?

Yep, I love it, so lets get into details, what is that, when does it start?

25 weeks.

I pick conception, pretty simple, egg is potential, sperm is potential, the two together are life, assuming it takes hold in the mother. Why do I pick it like this?

Life doesn't mean anything to me. A cockroach, cow, mosquito... All alive. I'd kill any one of them if they so much as annoyed me or I was hungry.

Well if you're 1, to get to 10 years old what do you NEED? Food (including water), oxygen and TIME, everything else is helpful like shelter, love, ect, but they dont grow you. So when the egg is feritlized what does it need before birth? Food, oxygen and time, that's it.

Yeah. But I'm not against killing life. I am against killing people. If you are a meat eater or own a pet you obviously aren't against killing life either. Human DNA is not important to me. People are. A person is.

Before 25 weeks all you have is a body. Not a person. While I'm all for a 16 week guidline as I don't know why anyone would need more time than that to decide... I'm only firmly against abortion after week 25.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Why Republicans only care about a fetus:

And don't care at all for babies or women is something I don't understand.

House GOP Would Kick 280,000 Children Off School Lunch Program To Protect Tax Cut For Millionaires

Well, maybe I do understand, but I think it's wrong.

Well becasue to you spending government money equals caring? Wow, I think you dont understand the word. I bet to you spanking kids and discipline ie mean and shouldnt be done, it shows hatred and uncaring? it's better to never say no to your kid and let them do whatever they want, yeah that's real caring to a liberal.......

There are other ways to raise children besides beating them. Anyone could be a bully. I bet when you found out that Mitt Romney had coerced 5 young men into tackling and taking down a shy and quiet kid so Mitt could assault the child who was screaming in fear and begging to be let go, hilarious? Am I right? Come on. Tell the truth. When you first heard that story, you chuckled, right?

Hey, dumbfuck, you do realize that's all been debunked?

 

[Care4all]

Well due tell me, IVF they usually only implant 2 or maybe 3. But if they dont take, what can you do? It's diffent that killing something that was feritilized and implanted.

FYI-
not according to the Catholic Church....as soon as an egg is fertilized, it is a separate human being...at conception it is a separate human being....not when the woman becomes pregnant, (when the conceived egg attaches to the uterus, but when the sperm fertilizes the egg)

THUS the Catholics consider killing a fertilized egg, KILLING equal to abortion.... and ALSO why they are against birth control pills and the morning after pill, because both prevent a fertilized egg from living because they prevent the egg from implanting in the uterus which eventually kills the fertilized egg....THE SEPARATE HUMAN BEING.

Oh... I didn't know that. Doesn't mean anything to my stance but it's interesting to know.

I didn't know that either, but in another abortion thread a member here mentioned it, so I googled and read up on it and their stance....which is, LIFE BEGINS AT CONCEPTION....well, conception is when the egg is fertilized, NOT when it attaches to the woman's uterus, which could take as long as 1-3 days after conception....when it does attach itself, a woman is considered pregnant, but according to most religious pro life stance, conception is the beginning of another human beings life, not pregnancy.

 

[buckeye45_73]

Well due tell me, IVF they usually only implant 2 or maybe 3. But if they dont take, what can you do? It's diffent that killing something that was feritilized and implanted.

FYI-
not according to the Catholic Church....as soon as an egg is fertilized, it is a separate human being...at conception it is a separate human being....not when the woman becomes pregnant, (when the conceived egg attaches to the uterus, but when the sperm fertilizes the egg)

THUS the Catholics consider killing a fertilized egg, KILLING equal to abortion.... and ALSO why they are against birth control pills and the morning after pill, because both prevent a fertilized egg from living because they prevent the egg from implanting in the uterus which eventually kills the fertilized egg....THE SEPARATE HUMAN BEING.

Oh... I didn't know that. Doesn't mean anything to my stance but it's interesting to know.

Well I am against the items to prevent an egg from attatching, it's one thing if it's natural, it's another if you prevent it. People just need to be responsible or take ownership of the kids they make. Abortion is not good, and shouldnt be seen as acceptable.
For things like birth control if it prevents and egg from being fertilized that Im ok with it, but if it kills a fertilized egg or prevents attaching, I'm not. I just dont think life is something you play with. I have no problem with IVF because you are trying to get pregnant, not prevent it.

 

[Londoner]

Big Government Consevatism

... turning the wombs of women into incubators for their God.

Welcome to the biggest government of all.

 

[Shelzin]

From a earlier post in this thread... I'll say it again here so you don't have to search and I think this really ties up my reasoning well.

That's true. However... Say there is a 30 year old that is brain dead in a hospital. The cognitive part of the brain does not, and will never work. Does the body have the right to life? I don't think so. There is no person there. It's just a body. But it's alive. It has life. It will continue to age and grow should you feed and water it. It has a heart beat, it has a nervous system... It'll even react to stimuli assuming the brain stem is still functioning. But there is no person there... Why should care if it lives? Why should I waste resources on it?

Fetus = Brain dead body

 

[buckeye45_73]

FYI-
not according to the Catholic Church....as soon as an egg is fertilized, it is a separate human being...at conception it is a separate human being....not when the woman becomes pregnant, (when the conceived egg attaches to the uterus, but when the sperm fertilizes the egg)

THUS the Catholics consider killing a fertilized egg, KILLING equal to abortion.... and ALSO why they are against birth control pills and the morning after pill, because both prevent a fertilized egg from living because they prevent the egg from implanting in the uterus which eventually kills the fertilized egg....THE SEPARATE HUMAN BEING.

Oh... I didn't know that. Doesn't mean anything to my stance but it's interesting to know.

I didn't know that either, but in another abortion thread a member here mentioned it, so I googled and read up on it and their stance....which is, LIFE BEGINS AT CONCEPTION....well, conception is when the egg is fertilized, NOT when it attaches to the woman's uterus, which could take as long as 1-3 days after conception....when it does attach itself, a woman is considered pregnant, but according to most religious pro life stance, conception is the beginning of another human beings life, not pregnancy.

Because most people take the attaching for granted. Which is why people like me dont approve of things that prevent the attaching. Again if it happens naturally, not much you can do, but if you do it on purpose, then that's an issue.
Look the reason abortion is so big for liberals is they want women to have the same sexual freedom as men, and sorry but it doesnt work that way. Having said that, I dont see a guy banging tons of chicks any better than a women that bangs tons of guys, they're both whores and can easily prevent having to get to this point.

 

[buckeye45_73]

From a earlier post in this thread... I'll say it again here so you don't have to search and I think this really ties up my reasoning well.

That's true. However... Say there is a 30 year old that is brain dead in a hospital. The cognitive part of the brain does not, and will never work. Does the body have the right to life? I don't think so. There is no person there. It's just a body. But it's alive. It has life. It will continue to age and grow should you feed and water it. It has a heart beat, it has a nervous system... It'll even react to stimuli assuming the brain stem is still functioning. But there is no person there... Why should care if it lives? Why should I waste resources on it?

Fetus = Brain dead body

Well it's a legitimate point. I would be one to stay keep it going. WHy? well, I look as life as a little different, I love effeciency and dont like to waste money, while not many have come out of comas and such, there have been some people and I guess I believe in it the same way a person might believe in cryogenics, because I'm hopeful they might find a way to bring someone back, even if the odds are very very slim, again that's because we are dealing with life, which I put above all, again INNOCENT life, if you're a killer, then it's time for you to go.

 

[Care4all]

Oh... I didn't know that. Doesn't mean anything to my stance but it's interesting to know.

I didn't know that either, but in another abortion thread a member here mentioned it, so I googled and read up on it and their stance....which is, LIFE BEGINS AT CONCEPTION....well, conception is when the egg is fertilized, NOT when it attaches to the woman's uterus, which could take as long as 1-3 days after conception....when it does attach itself, a woman is considered pregnant, but according to most religious pro life stance, conception is the beginning of another human beings life, not pregnancy.

Because most people take the attaching for granted. Which is why people like me dont approve of things that prevent the attaching. Again if it happens naturally, not much you can do, but if you do it on purpose, then that's an issue.
Look the reason abortion is so big for liberals is they want women to have the same sexual freedom as men, and sorry but it doesnt work that way. Having said that, I dont see a guy banging tons of chicks any better than a women that bangs tons of guys, they're both whores and can easily prevent having to get to this point.

they don't have to be whores or screwing the football team, just 1 sexual encounter can result in pregnancy.....in addition to this, many married couples with many children or who are very poor with a few children already, or if the pregnancy occurred within a couple of months after the delivery of a child, or for a number of reasons, also choose abortions. This myth that all females having abortions are whores having all this fun f-ing 24 hours a day, any men they can, is just that, a myth created by the imagination of men.

In vitro fertilization is a huge huge huge NO NO with the Catholic church, it's not permitted, due to all the fertilized eggs that are killed....not just killed when they are inserted, but also killed when 6 of them take, the doctors usually go back in and essencially abort/terminate the extra attached eggs if the mother only wants 1 or 2 children, And the 30 other fertilized eggs that may have not been needed if it worked the first time around, are then later incinerated.....killed. Some religious couples are now donating their 30 left over fertilized eggs to other couples that can't conceive with their own eggs and sperm so that their left over fertilized eggs are not all incinerated.