Thanks Obuma!..Health Premiums Have Climbed $4,865 Since Obama Promised to Cut Them $2,500

[Sun Devil 92]

That's the second time you've said that. Please see my response to the first time.

Good...

Then discuss the post or concede the point...

Deflection counts as a loss.

Simple fact is they can't argue the OP and as with all 2 digit IQ'd liberals they must OCD on the littlest bullshit that means nothing in the discussion, OCDPogo is infamous for this and apparently this new is also!.... I think it might be a DNC talking points memo under the title "When they beat the shit out of you, find something insignificant to deflect with"..... who can argue this, if it isn't spelling or something else unobserved, that last "DELUSIONAL:" is always justified!

Yeah, I can tell...

When I started asking serious questions, the Idiot wanted to run on for pages about how I had to call the law by it's proper name...

And the damn fool kept calling it by the wrong one himself!!!

I can see why Libs need welfare.... They're too dim to screw in a light bulb...

Have you seen your costs go down 2,500 ?

I sure have not.

Mine went up, and the deductables went through the roof...

I've heard we are up to 16 million on Obamacare.

Fantastic.

They are all paying premiums to insurance companies with deductibles so high...they won't use the insurance.

I'll be the insurance companies see this as a dream come true.

1. We'll charge more for insurance that gives less and has high deductibles.
2. The government will make people buy it.

Can't beat that.

 

[Oldstyle]

Tell me something, Arian...if the ACA is really such a great deal for the Middle Class...why did Democrats have to lie to us to pass it?

The text of the bill was available online for anyone who could be bothered to read it.

You didn't answer my question...if the ACA was such a great deal...why did the Obama Administration and Democratic leaders like Reid and Pelosi feel the need to lie to the American people to get it passed?

 

[Oldstyle]

Tell me something, Arian...if the ACA is really such a great deal for the Middle Class...why did Democrats have to lie to us to pass it?

The text of the bill was available online for anyone who could be bothered to read it.

Before the vote???

Aww, the kiddies do love their sound bites, don't they?

My Tardis is in the shop so I can't verify that in retrospect, but there were plenty of fact sheets available on numerous sites: http://www.aarp.org/health/health-care-reform/health_reform_factsheets/ well before the fact, and the full text of the law has been available online since it was passed. Here it is again (along with the text of the Supreme Court decision):

Read the Law | HHS.gov/healthcare

As for the law itself, most of us would have preferred single-payer, but your Republican Congresscritters and their pet insurance companies kept chipping away at the original proposals until you ended up with the current version of the PPACA.

Now it's funny to watch those of you who were howling "THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH WHAT WE HAVE!!! I'VE GOT MINE AND FUCK EVERYONE ELSE!!!!1" crying for single-payer.

The U.S. will join the rest of the industrialized world in adapting a single-payer system eventually, probably along the lines of the French model, because the flaws in other models (notably the UK's) have been studied and we won't make the same mistakes.

Dude, did you just blame how the ACA was written on "Republican Congresscritters"? Have you forgotten that the ACA was written behind closed doors by Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi with almost zero contributions by Republicans? Things in the law weren't changed to appease the GOP...they were changed to buy Democratic Blue Dog votes that wouldn't go along with what Obama, Reid and Pelosi wanted.

 

[Oldstyle]

Good...

Then discuss the post or concede the point...

Deflection counts as a loss.

Simple fact is they can't argue the OP and as with all 2 digit IQ'd liberals they must OCD on the littlest bullshit that means nothing in the discussion, OCDPogo is infamous for this and apparently this new is also!.... I think it might be a DNC talking points memo under the title "When they beat the shit out of you, find something insignificant to deflect with"..... who can argue this, if it isn't spelling or something else unobserved, that last "DELUSIONAL:" is always justified!

Yeah, I can tell...

When I started asking serious questions, the Idiot wanted to run on for pages about how I had to call the law by it's proper name...

And the damn fool kept calling it by the wrong one himself!!!

I can see why Libs need welfare.... They're too dim to screw in a light bulb...

Have you seen your costs go down 2,500 ?

I sure have not.

Mine went up, and the deductables went through the roof...

I've heard we are up to 16 million on Obamacare.

Fantastic.

They are all paying premiums to insurance companies with deductibles so high...they won't use the insurance.

I'll be the insurance companies see this as a dream come true.

1. We'll charge more for insurance that gives less and has high deductibles.
2. The government will make people buy it.

Can't beat that.

Don't forget the part of this deal that nobody from the left wants to talk about...if costs to the insurance companies run higher than estimated...then the Federal Government (ie...the taxpayers!) will pay them the difference. Just wait until we get the bill for that!

 

[Arianrhod]

I've heard we are up to 16 million on Obamacare.

Fantastic.

They are all paying premiums to insurance companies with deductibles so high...they won't use the insurance.

I'll be the insurance companies see this as a dream come true.

1. We'll charge more for insurance that gives less and has high deductibles.
2. The government will make people buy it.

Can't beat that.

Depending on the insurer, preventive care - i.e., screenings for common conditions such as diabetes, hypertension, and hypercholesterolemia - are grandfathered in. So is counseling for lifestyle changes (smoking cessation, diet, exercise) that can mitigate these conditions, often without the need for lifelong - costly - medication.

Cost savings.

 

[Arianrhod]

Don't forget the part of this deal that nobody from the left wants to talk about...if costs to the insurance companies run higher than estimated...then the Federal Government (ie...the taxpayers!) will pay them the difference. Just wait until we get the bill for that!

Which is why the next step in healthcare reform will address those high costs.

Single payer would have been preferable, but you guys screamed "SOSHULISM!!!111!' and Congress took you seriously.

 

[Arianrhod]

Dude, did you just blame how the ACA was written on "Republican Congresscritters"? Have you forgotten that the ACA was written behind closed doors by Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi with almost zero contributions by Republicans? Things in the law weren't changed to appease the GOP...they were changed to buy Democratic Blue Dog votes that wouldn't go along with what Obama, Reid and Pelosi wanted.

Written? No. Rewritten and gutted and rewritten again and again and chipped away at some more and rewritten again, yes.

The PPACA began as a virtual clone of RomneyCare, which was drafted by the Cato Institute.

IOW, the Republicans in Congress were for it before they were against it.

 

[Oldstyle]

Don't forget the part of this deal that nobody from the left wants to talk about...if costs to the insurance companies run higher than estimated...then the Federal Government (ie...the taxpayers!) will pay them the difference. Just wait until we get the bill for that!

Which is why the next step in healthcare reform will address those high costs.

Single payer would have been preferable, but you guys screamed "SOSHULISM!!!111!' and Congress took you seriously.

So the Middle Class asked for healthcare reform that addressed the high cost of healthcare...and you progressives gave them the Affordable Care Act...which as it turns out...isn't affordable at all? So NOW we're going to address that issue?

The truth is...Barry, Harry and Nancy couldn't get enough Democrats to get behind Single Payer...that's why it morphed into the mess that ObamaCare is...not because of anything conservatives did. The truth is...the ACA is a cluster fuck because you guys were rushing to pass what ever you could before the representatives that the people sent to Washington in 2010 got there and stopped you.

 

[Oldstyle]

Dude, did you just blame how the ACA was written on "Republican Congresscritters"? Have you forgotten that the ACA was written behind closed doors by Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi with almost zero contributions by Republicans? Things in the law weren't changed to appease the GOP...they were changed to buy Democratic Blue Dog votes that wouldn't go along with what Obama, Reid and Pelosi wanted.

Written? No. Rewritten and gutted and rewritten again and again and chipped away at some more and rewritten again, yes.

The PPACA began as a virtual clone of RomneyCare, which was drafted by the Cato Institute.

IOW, the Republicans in Congress were for it before they were against it.

And who was it that rewrote it...gutted it...and rewrote it again? It wasn't the GOP! They were sitting out in the hallway while Harry and Nancy wrote ObamaCare behind closed doors and made dozens of shady deals to lock up Democratic votes to pass it.

Don't even try and make the ACA a GOP problem...this mess is all yours!

 

[Arianrhod]

Dude, did you just blame how the ACA was written on "Republican Congresscritters"? Have you forgotten that the ACA was written behind closed doors by Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi with almost zero contributions by Republicans? Things in the law weren't changed to appease the GOP...they were changed to buy Democratic Blue Dog votes that wouldn't go along with what Obama, Reid and Pelosi wanted.

Written? No. Rewritten and gutted and rewritten again and again and chipped away at some more and rewritten again, yes.

The PPACA began as a virtual clone of RomneyCare, which was drafted by the Cato Institute.

IOW, the Republicans in Congress were for it before they were against it.

And who was it that rewrote it...gutted it...and rewrote it again? It wasn't the GOP! They were sitting out in the hallway while Harry and Nancy wrote ObamaCare behind closed doors and made dozens of shady deals to lock up Democratic votes to pass it.

Don't even try and make the ACA a GOP problem...this mess is all yours!

Unfamiliar with the balance of powers and the legislative process, are you? Perhaps you'd prefer a dictatorship.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

Tell me something, Arian...if the ACA is really such a great deal for the Middle Class...why did Democrats have to lie to us to pass it?

The text of the bill was available online for anyone who could be bothered to read it.

And for those of us that did read it, when we tried to point out all of the many lies that obama was spewing, the left insisted that we were wrong and their master, the spawn of Satan, obama was telling the truth.
looks like the smart ones were right and the left was wrong. again.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

And employees are free to choose their own plans from the exchanges instead of sucking the corporate teat. Libertarians always promote individualism, except when it comes to their dependency on the Bossman. Interesting...

Employer provided health insurance is a fringe benefit, a part of your salary and compensation, and in most cases far more affordable than a health care exchange for most people. But please, keep regurgitating your idiocy. You're very entertaining.

 

[Arianrhod]

Tell me something, Arian...if the ACA is really such a great deal for the Middle Class...why did Democrats have to lie to us to pass it?

The text of the bill was available online for anyone who could be bothered to read it.

And for those of us that did read it, when we tried to point out all of the many lies that obama was spewing, the left insisted that we were wrong and their master, the spawn of Satan, obama was telling the truth.
looks like the smart ones were right and the left was wrong. again.

Now that you've had your little rant, can you cite specifics? Quote one passage from the legislation and show - using facts - how it's "a lie."

 

[Arianrhod]

Employer provided health insurance is a fringe benefit, a part of your salary and compensation

That's correct. But if you think you can go to your boss and say "Look, I don't want to be part of the company's group plan any more. Give me that monthly premium as a salary increase instead," you'd be laughed right out of his office.

and in most cases far more affordable than a health care exchange for most people.

Correct again. Group plans are always more affordable than individual coverage. However, employer-provided health insurance has been eroding for decades and if at some point your company says "Okay, everybody out of the pool," you'll have to provide for yourself. Alternatively, they might change your status from "employee" to "independent contractor" and take away all your bennies. Or just ship your job to China. Good luck with that.

 

[Maryland Patriot]

Tell me something, Arian...if the ACA is really such a great deal for the Middle Class...why did Democrats have to lie to us to pass it?

The text of the bill was available online for anyone who could be bothered to read it.

And for those of us that did read it, when we tried to point out all of the many lies that obama was spewing, the left insisted that we were wrong and their master, the spawn of Satan, obama was telling the truth.
looks like the smart ones were right and the left was wrong. again.

Now that you've had your little rant, can you cite specifics? Quote one passage from the legislation and show - using facts - how it's "a lie."

been through this before, its a waste of time to try and educate liberals.
Its online, how about you go ahead and read it. Spend some time looking at all the places the money is going to be coming from and then tell me who is going to be most affected by the increases.
Do you think there is a reason that most of these increases are going to be applied after obama leaves office?

 

[Maryland Patriot]

Employer provided health insurance is a fringe benefit, a part of your salary and compensation

That's correct. But if you think you can go to your boss and say "Look, I don't want to be part of the company's group plan any more. Give me that monthly premium as a salary increase instead," you'd be laughed right out of his office.

and in most cases far more affordable than a health care exchange for most people.

Correct again. Group plans are always more affordable than individual coverage. However, employer-provided health insurance has been eroding for decades and if at some point your company says "Okay, everybody out of the pool," you'll have to provide for yourself. Alternatively, they might change your status from "employee" to "independent contractor" and take away all your bennies. Or just ship your job to China. Good luck with that.

Thats right, you wont see any additional pay when everyone has to supply their own insurance. so what does that mean for the average worker that wont be eligible for subsidies? It means, less money to live on so those that dont work can get even more free stuff.
great thinking liberals. great thinking.

 

[Arianrhod]

Its online, how about you go ahead and read it.

I have read it. In fact, I've posted the link to it in several threads in this forum. You're the one who claims it's full of lies. Prove it.

 

[Arianrhod]

Thats right, you wont see any additional pay when everyone has to supply their own insurance. so what does that mean for the average worker that wont be eligible for subsidies?

Define "the average worker." Most would be eligible for subsidies. Have you ever actually plugged the numbers in on one of the exchange sites? You're allowed to do that without making a commitment. Try it, so the next time you come in here you might have a clearer understanding of what you're talking about. I promise it won't steal your soul or kill your dog.

 

[Sun Devil 92]

I haven't seen my 2,500.

Has anyone ?

 

[Arianrhod]

I haven't seen my 2,500.

We'd need to have more information in order to determine the veracity of that statement, but it's doubtful you'd be willing to share your personal information, so we'll assume you're just parroting the Righty talking points.