Taking Tea with the Lizards

[MaggieMae]

I think most Leftists have only one way to get to an agenda. Their way. Anybody with a different point of view is to be marginalized or destroyed. This is typical of sheep who have no clear concept of what they believe or why they believe it, but have accepted spoonfed propaganda and brainwashing.

Liberals do have a generally progressive agenda - one that we disagree on greatly, but we have no TEA Party organizing us, no propaganda machine, no Newt Gengrichs, Sarah Palins or Ronald Reagans to be our brainwashing Massiahs. We do have political leaders who are highly critizied by liberals and who often as not we do not support - for example - there has been a huge amount of critisim of President Obama by liberals since he has been in office.

In 2005 you could not find one single conservative that thought G.W. Bush was anything other than a perfect President - he could do no wrong. It wasn't until the 2006 election that they all abandoned him like rats from a sinking ship - a false massiah.

Tea Partiers, the mainstream of America, don't demand that everybody agree with them to be acceptable. They are allowed to have different points of view and there are probably many differences in what each person considers most important.

But they do agree that each and every aspect considered to be 'liberal' is catagorically wrong.



But what they fail to recognize is that 'Big' democratic government has historically been the greatest champion of freedom, liberty, choice and opportunity. Did not the U.S. government force the end of slavery? Wasn't the U.S. government the primary force in destroying the Nazis? Didn't the U.S. government lead the cold war fight against Marxist dictatorships? All of these battles were fought by 'BIG' government.

Methinks that when conservatives talk about these values what they really mean is:

-The freedom to enslave
-The liberty to dictate behavior in accordance with conservative social values.
-The choice to stop people from having a choice
-The option to limit the working class economic opportunity
-The opportunity to thief.



But they also agree that the Costitution must only be interperted as they want it interperted. They want the General welfare clause blatantly ignored, they want to interpert the freedoms of the constitution only as they want it and that those freedoms that they approve of must be unlimited freedoms with no responsibilty whatsoever.



I'm sure that they do. But they refuse to recognise that they only have the money that they do because of the great society of which they are a member - a soceity that is what it is only because of the U.S. Government.

They feel they owe nothing to soceity - no responsibilty whatsoever.

They are agreed that a government that has grown as big and all emcompassing and so invasive as our government has grown will be out of touch with the hearts and minds of the people, and it must be put back in its place.

Our Government is the leading protector of our privacy and freedom.

Apparently, since the President and congress were elected overwhelmingly, in a free and fair election, it is the TEA Party that is grossly "out of touch with the hearts and minds of the people".

The are agreed that in America the people want to govern themselves. They want the government to do what the Constitution says it is supposed to do and then leave them the hell alone to live their lives.

The American people do govern themselves thru Democracy. Are you saying that the elections were fraudulant?

Or are you saying that when the elections don't go the way you want them to, you will suddenly declare that we do not have representative goverment?

The Government does "leave them the hell alone to live their lives." Except for times of extreme war, when national defense requires conscripture AND in the case of taxation.

And that's really what this is all about isn't it?

The TEA Party is a congress of greedy self-centered people who do not care in the least for America. They want the government to protect their freedom, but do NOT want to pay the taxes to support our military. They do not want to pay the taxes for a government that promotes the general welfare of the people.

They want government for themselves and by themselves, with no responsibilties whatsoever to America.

I short, nobody knows what the TEA Party is for, but what they are against can be summed up in one word:

AMERICA.

Bravo! Thank you for taking the time to deconstruct what "they" are all about. I can't rep you yet, but will remember to do so as soon as I'm out of the cage.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

You know, I've watched the tea party idiots, and I STILL can't figure out what they are for.

Why? Simple.........each and every one has a different agenda. So much for unity eh?

The TEA Party was born as an angry response to the fact that there was an extremely liberal government elected - anger at the liberals for having been elected and anger at the Republicans for having lost the election.

It may be true that it's hard to figure out what they're for. They'll be agreeable to any variation of a large number of conservative ideas based on conservative social and economic values, but they work in broad generalizations, not specifics - thereby having enormous leeway to draw in their constituients.

The uniting factor of the TEA Party is not what they are for, but what they are against:

-They are against liberalism in a very broad way.

-They are against taxes.

-They are against the U.S. Government insofar as they are opposed to 'BIG' government - another broad generalization.

-They are against homosexual marraige.

-They are against Universal Health Care.

-etc.

Now, stop for a second and ask yourself - What were the NAZI's for? Name 5 things that Hilter was for. Can you do it? Probably not.

Can you name 5 things that the Nazis were against? Easily!!!

I do not suggest that the political ends of the TEA Party or neo conservatives (however non-descript they may be) are equal to the Nazi agenda, but the political means that they employ are remarkably similar.

Tell me again what "TEA" Taxed Enough Already has to do with HOMOSEXUAL MARRIAGE!!!??? NOTHING!!!

 

[Foxfyre]

I think most Leftists have only one way to get to an agenda. Their way. Anybody with a different point of view is to be marginalized or destroyed. This is typical of sheep who have no clear concept of what they believe or why they believe it, but have accepted spoonfed propaganda and brainwashing.

Liberals do have a generally progressive agenda - one that we disagree on greatly, but we have no TEA Party organizing us, no propaganda machine, no Newt Gengrichs, Sarah Palins or Ronald Reagans to be our brainwashing Massiahs. We do have political leaders who are highly critizied by liberals and who often as not we do not support - for example - there has been a huge amount of critisim of President Obama by liberals since he has been in office.

In 2005 you could not find one single conservative that thought G.W. Bush was anything other than a perfect President - he could do no wrong. It wasn't until the 2006 election that they all abandoned him like rats from a sinking ship - a false massiah.

You have an agenda that you can't articulate in a way that allows dissent. I have been begging somebody on the Left to give a rational argument for any progressive agenda item that does NOT involve taking away freedoms from somebody else. So far, nobody has even been able to explain a rationale for why they believe what they believe, much less why they think their beliefs should be imposed on everybody.

And your comment that there was nobody in 2005 who was critical of George W. Bush is as indicative of 'brain washing' as any illustration I could give. I am pretty darn conservative and I had plenty of criticism for him as did every other conservative that I know. So you smashed your credibility with that statement alone.

Tea Partiers, the mainstream of America, don't demand that everybody agree with them to be acceptable. They are allowed to have different points of view and there are probably many differences in what each person considers most important.

But they do agree that each and every aspect considered to be 'liberal' is catagorically wrong.

You're wrong about that. Many Tea Partiers are pro choice. Pro gay marriage. Pro gay adoption. Pro smoking bans. Pro global warming agenda though I can't think of any who think cap and trade is the way to deal with it. I can't think of any of us who are opposed to healthcare reform; we just want it to be real reform and not socialization of the healthcare system.

So what aspects considered to be 'conservative' do you subscribe?

But what they fail to recognize is that 'Big' democratic government has historically been the greatest champion of freedom, liberty, choice and opportunity. Did not the U.S. government force the end of slavery? Wasn't the U.S. government the primary force in destroying the Nazis? Didn't the U.S. government lead the cold war fight against Marxist dictatorships? All of these battles were fought by 'BIG' government.

Methinks that when conservatives talk about these values what they really mean is:

-The freedom to enslave

That's funny. Many conservatives would say that about liberals. For instance, Conservatives see forcing Citizen A who lives his life honorably and responsibly to support Citizen B who doesn't as a form of enslavement. How do you see Conservatives 'enslaving' people?

-The liberty to dictate behavior in accordance with conservative social values.

Nope. While most do believe the primary function of government is to secure our unalienable, civil, legal, and Constitutional rights, most do otherwise promote the right of a state or community to establish a social contract that suits them. "Progressives' however want to dictate to me where I may pray out loud, what is acceptable speech, who it is acceptable to dislike, distrust, or hate, who I must associate with, and who I must be responsible for other than my own family. They presume to tell me what I must believe about progressive things in order to not be selfish, hateful, scum of the Earth and what I am not allowed to believe.

So which ideology is more dictatorial?

What do Conservatives tell you re how you must behave in accordance with conservative social values?

-The choice to stop people from having a choice

If you mean abortion, you're dead wrong. Many Conservatives AND Liberals are pro life. Pro lifers want everybody to have a choice including the unborn. And therein is the difference between Pro lifers and Pro choicers. Pro choicers want the right to deny life to the unborn at any stage of development for ANY reason whatsoever. Pro lifers want adults to accept responsiblity for the most helpless and innocent of God's creatures.

-The option to limit the working class economic opportunity

I think you have Conservatives confused with Progressives there. Conservatives wants EVERYBODY to have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness however happiness is defined short of infringing on the rights of others. But they see that as the responsibility of the individual to pursue. They do not want government to impose any barriers that would discourage or prevent any individual from pursuing their goals, dreams, and hopes. Most Conservatives see forced servitude of some citizens to provide for others as a dangerous corrupting policy for both those in government and those receiving charity via government edict.

Progressives want somebody else to provide for them and tend to despise those who accomplish their goals more efficiently and effectively than others.

-The opportunity to thief.

I have no clue what you mean by this, but I'm sure you will enlighten me.

But they also agree that the Costitution must only be interperted as they want it interperted. They want the General welfare clause blatantly ignored, they want to interpert the freedoms of the constitution only as they want it and that those freedoms that they approve of must be unlimited freedoms with no responsibilty whatsoever.

Most Tea Partiers I believe want the Constitution interpreted as it was written and intended. They have a very different view of the 'general welfare clause' than progressives do. And I think they put a great deal more emphasis on personal responsibility and accountability than any Progressive does.

Perhaps you could elaborate on that a bit more?

I'm sure that they do. But they refuse to recognise that they only have the money that they do because of the great society of which they are a member - a soceity that is what it is only because of the U.S. Government.

They feel they owe nothing to soceity - no responsibilty whatsoever.

This is so absurd as to defy discussion. Study after study after study has shown that Conservatives as a demographic are far more generous in charitable giving than are Progressives and are the ones most likely to fund the arts, building libraries, and hospital wings, and donate new science labs, and create charitable foundations. It is almost exclusively Conservatives running orphanages, ministering in leper colonies, working among the world's poorest and most miserable societiies, instituting thrift shops and soup kitchens. Oh sure Progressives kick in some donations now and then and occasionally do a benefit. But the day in and day out unpublicized and unglamorous work is being done by mostly Conservatives.

The difference is that Conservatives see charity as a personal responsibility. Progressives are quite generous with other people's money and see it as the right of government to take it away from some to give to others.

They are agreed that a government that has grown as big and all emcompassing and so invasive as our government has grown will be out of touch with the hearts and minds of the people, and it must be put back in its place.

Our Government is the leading protector of our privacy and freedom.

Apparently, since the President and congress were elected overwhelmingly, in a free and fair election, it is the TEA Party that is grossly "out of touch with the hearts and minds of the people".

Then how come the President's poll ratings continue to plummet? Because he lied about how he would govern and enough gullible fools believed him?

The are agreed that in America the people want to govern themselves. They want the government to do what the Constitution says it is supposed to do and then leave them the hell alone to live their lives.

The American people do govern themselves thru Democracy. Are you saying that the elections were fraudulant?

Or are you saying that when the elections don't go the way you want them to, you will suddenly declare that we do not have representative goverment?

The USA is not a democracy. It is a republic. And no, you are entirely missing the point I was making. Did you follow the link? I didn't think so. But if you had, you would get the point I was making.

The Government does "leave them the hell alone to live their lives." Except for times of extreme war, when national defense requires conscripture AND in the case of taxation.

And that's really what this is all about isn't it?

It isn't leaving me the hell alone when the government presumes to dictate to me what health insurance I MUST have or be penalized; when the government presumes to take away my freedoms, choices, options, opportunities and sacrifice them on the great alter of global warming through the most insidious legislation this Congress has come up with: cap & trade. Many other examples, but you should get my drift. Well, most people would get my drift.

The TEA Party is a congress of greedy self-centered people who do not care in the least for America. They want the government to protect their freedom, but do NOT want to pay the taxes to support our military. They do not want to pay the taxes for a government that promotes the general welfare of the people.

They want government for themselves and by themselves, with no responsibilties whatsoever to America.

I short, nobody knows what the TEA Party is for, but what they are against can be summed up in one word:

AMERICA.

And there is the mantra of the truly brainwashed and clueless. Because you cannot defend a word of it and will look really REALLY stupid if you try.