Socialism is GOOD for EVERYONE!

[Annie]

Where do you get the idea that if something works for Europe that it will also work in America ?

That wasn't "My" quote, someone else said that.

 

[Chris]

Where do you get the idea that if something works for Europe that it will also work in America ?

Every other Western democracy has a single payer system, and the pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare. Why? Because they don't have to pay liability lawyers, insurance companies, and Big Pharma. There are inherent cost savings with a single payer system. The Germans have had one since 1886!

With a single payer system you would still pick your doctor, and your doctor would still own his practice. There would just be one insurance company, and that would be the government.

 

[dilloduck]

Every other Western democracy has a single payer system, and the pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare. Why? Because they don't have to pay liability lawyers, insurance companies, and Big Pharma. There are inherent cost savings with a single payer system. The Germans have had one since 1886!

With a single payer system you would still pick your doctor, and your doctor would still own his practice. There would just be one insurance company, and that would be the government.

ahh one size fits all.

 

[del]

you sound ridiculous. dems haven't controlled the budget in 8 years.

are you so vapid that you think that a one vote majority in the senate (with lieberman, who isn't a dem, being the vote) does anything?

and yet the republicans in the 107th Congress (50/50) 108th Congress (51/48/1) and the 109th Congress (55/45), where they never had enough votes to force cloture were able to ruin the economy all by themselves in just 6 years.

interesting......

 

[alupka]

Every other Western democracy has a single payer system, and the pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare. Why? Because they don't have to pay liability lawyers, insurance companies, and Big Pharma. There are inherent cost savings with a single payer system. The Germans have had one since 1886!

With a single payer system you would still pick your doctor, and your doctor would still own his practice. There would just be one insurance company, and that would be the government.

That's how it is here in China. Everyone can go to the doctor/hospital for nearly free. No scheduling appointments...nothing! Just go. Wait about 15 minutes for the doctor to finish with his current patient. And then show him the problem. If there are prescriptions you'll have to pay for them, but not much. The actual cost for service varies, but the average for my visits is around $10 U.S. And there are absolutely ZERO monthly premiums to pay.

There's not a poor farmer here who thinks it's difficult or expensive to get medical help when he needs it.

How is it possible? because the government completely eliminates the corrupt insurance industry altogether, who make billions off people's illnesses in the U.S.

Of course, none of the doctors here ever actually fixed any of my problems. The only one who accomplished anything was the Chinese dentist who broke my jaw bone with a hammer and chisel. This is not a joke. When I went to a different dentist, he told me we would have to break it again and reset it. I asked him how we were going to do that. With a hammer and chisel of course...is there any other way??

I actually had to fly back to America just to fix the problem. When I told my dentist about some of my experiences in China, he told me that American medical professionals haven't be using those techniques since the 1950s.

I don't know what you can conclude from it, but it's a real life example to consider.

 

[Chris]

Here's another real life example...

Mythbusting Canadian Health Care -- Part I | OurFuture.org

 

[Richard-H]

It is completely inaccurate to compare the United States with either the Soviet Union or China. The history of these societies have nothing in common. It would be more accurate to compare socialist China or socialist Russia with the pre-socialist conditions of these countries. In both cases these societies progressed more in the 50 years of socialism than they did in the 5000 years pre-socialist.

Here in the U.S. we were blessed with a virgin continent. Our founding fathers were children of the enlightenment and the vast majority of the people came here to escape the repression of the socially and economically stagnant soceities of the 'Old World'. We were, for most of the first 200 years, the leaders of the world wide rebellion against the domination of the world by the socio-economic elite: Royalty.

Then after WWII, we no longer were the champions of equality and Democracy, but of capitalism and elitism.

It is the domination of a society by a tiny minority of socio-economic elite that causes societies to stagnate or even regress. Sometimes for thousands of years. Unfortunately, forming strongly hierarchial, elitist societies seem to be the instinctual tendancy of the human race. It has only been the past 200 years that the human race has started to evolve into societies based on equality, and there is a strong effort to reform this country into an elitist nation.

The Republicans have done everything they can to change the U.S. into an elitist society. They believe in a government for and by the wealthy, the common people be damned.

The Republicans have, in the desparation of this election, resorted to red-baiting. Trying to instill a false fear of democrats by calling them socialists and marxists. This could not be further from the truth. The Democrats believe in capitalism tempered by regulation and a tax code that helps keep this a dynamic society.

Just as unfortunately, the open-minded and acedemic tendancies of liberals have allowed us to be drawn into a discussion of socialism, making it appear that we support such. That is not true. Very few if any Democrats support socialism, except as a temporary measure to deal with national crisis. Once again Democrats overwhelmingly believe in tempered capitalism. WE are the 'Compassionate Conservatives' that President Bush spoke of.

 

[dilloduck]

It is completely inaccurate to compare the United States with either the Soviet Union or China. The history of these societies have nothing in common. It would be more accurate to compare socialist China or socialist Russia with the pre-socialist conditions of these countries. In both cases these societies progressed more in the 50 years of socialism than they did in the 5000 years pre-socialist.

Here in the U.S. we were blessed with a virgin continent. Our founding fathers were children of the enlightenment and the vast majority of the people came here to escape the repression of the socially and economically stagnant soceities of the 'Old World'. We were, for most of the first 200 years, the leaders of the world wide rebellion against the domination of the world by the socio-economic elite: Royalty.

Then after WWII, we no longer were the champions of equality and Democracy, but of capitalism and elitism.

It is the domination of a society by a tiny minority of socio-economic elite that causes societies to stagnate or even regress. Sometimes for thousands of years. Unfortunately, forming strongly hierarchial, elitist societies seem to be the instinctual tendancy of the human race. It has only been the past 200 years that the human race has started to evolve into societies based on equality, and there is a strong effort to reform this country into an elitist nation.

The Republicans have done everything they can to change the U.S. into an elitist society. They believe in a government for and by the wealthy, the common people be damned.

The Republicans have, in the desparation of this election, resorted to red-baiting. Trying to instill a false fear of democrats by calling them socialists and marxists. This could not be further from the truth. The Democrats believe in capitalism tempered by regulation and a tax code that helps keep this a dynamic society.

Just as unfortunately, the open-minded and acedemic tendancies of liberals have allowed us to be drawn into a discussion of socialism, making it appear that we support such. That is not true. Very few if any Democrats support socialism, except as a temporary measure to deal with national crisis. Once again Democrats overwhelmingly believe in tempered capitalism. WE are the 'Compassionate Conservatives' that President Bush spoke of.

That might make sense if there weren't any rich democrats--but alas-.

 

[alupka]

It is completely inaccurate to compare the United States with either the Soviet Union or China. The history of these societies have nothing in common. It would be more accurate to compare socialist China or socialist Russia with the pre-socialist conditions of these countries...

Interesting post but...

I case some of you didn't get it when you read the original post, I wasn't talking about political theories any more than I was really agreeing that income redistribution works!

It's called satire.

So for those of you who don't get it, I was simply and specifically making the point that Obama's economic plan is stupid. That's the issue here.

And there's nothing in any part of your post that explains how Obama's plan to redistribute wealth is going to benefit average Americans in the long-term.

 

[jillian]

and yet the republicans in the 107th Congress (50/50) 108th Congress (51/48/1) and the 109th Congress (55/45), where they never had enough votes to force cloture were able to ruin the economy all by themselves in just 6 years.

interesting......

you do know that during that six year period, not a single bill was put on the floor that needed a single democratic vote to pass, right?

And if you take the national credit card and max it out so the debt can't be paid, while at the same time running a fake war of choice that cost 200 billion dollars, and cutting income (again, for the FIRST TIME IN HIStory).... it isn't all that difficult.

 

[alupka]

Here's another real life example...

Mythbusting Canadian Health Care -- Part I | OurFuture.org

Great post.

Thanks for the article. Very informative. I wouldn't have a problem with a system like that.

 

[editec]

you do know that during that six year period, not a single bill was put on the floor that needed a single democratic vote to pass, right?

And if you take the national credit card and max it out so the debt can't be paid, while at the same time running a fake war of choice that cost 200 billion dollars, and cutting income (again, for the FIRST TIME IN HIStory).... it isn't all that difficult.

There you go again with your fact based retorts.

You're a Truth BULLY, Jillian.

You know that beating people with real facts isn't fair in this venue.

Save that truth-bully crap for the courts where things like facts actually matter.

 

[Modbert]

For the record, we've had some great Socialist mayors in history:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/conspiracy-theories/63134-socialism-is-communism.html

There is a pattern when they enter office, they get rid of corruption.

 

[Wade]

For the record, we've had some great Socialist mayors in history:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/conspiracy-theories/63134-socialism-is-communism.html

There is a pattern when they enter office, they get rid of corruption.

Oh my, you've never had to pay a bribe to get you "stamp" in a socialist country, have you. Socialist countries are generally more corrupt, than less. I think you confuse a honest person, with a dishonest person, rather than a socialist and a capitalist.

 

[Modbert]

Oh my, you've never had to pay a bribe to get you "stamp" in a socialist country, have you. Socialist countries are generally more corrupt, than less. I think you confuse a honest person, with a dishonest person, rather than a socialist and a capitalist.

Might want to read those links.

I'm no socialist but:

Capitalism: The system where the rich give the poor enough stuff so the poor doesn't uprise and take the rich people's stuff.

 

[Annie]

Might want to read those links.

I'm no socialist but:

Capitalism: The system where the rich give the poor enough stuff so the poor doesn't uprise and take the rich people's stuff.

Well maybe after you've traveled a bit and met some of those lucky folks who've lived under draconian socialism you might see things a bit differently.

The Europeans and even some Canadians are trying to reverse the clock, which is much more difficult than not going down that road in the first place.

 

[Modbert]

Well maybe after you've traveled a bit and met some of those lucky folks who've lived under draconian socialism you might see things a bit differently.

The Europeans and even some Canadians are trying to reverse the clock, which is much more difficult than not going down that road in the first place.

Socialism is government take overs of land, businesses, property and BANKS. That bears repeating that last part; Socialism is the government take over of Banks.

So therefore, under the definition of Socialism; Comrade John McCain and Comrade George W Bush are now members!



Welcome Brothers!

 

[Modbert]

Like, Socialism: Comment: The New Yorker

You know who else was called a socialist by the way?

MLK JR and JFK are two great examples.

You know who else would of been called a Socialist?

That Community Organizer, wanting to turn the other cheek, raising taxes, favoring more government handouts for the poor, soft on crime and war on terror bastard otherwise known as..Jesus of Nazareth.

 

[Wade]

Socialism is government take overs of land, businesses, property and BANKS. That bears repeating that last part; Socialism is the government take over of Banks.

So therefore, under the definition of Socialism; Comrade John McCain and Comrade George W Bush are now members!

View attachment 6278

Welcome Brothers!

No comrade, the difference is those banks will (hopefully) be back private as soon as their worth something. The US government has no business owning them.

Capitalism is where you have the opportunity to make anything out of your life that your willing to work for. Even a welfare child in Hawaii can one day grow up to run for president of the US. And, there will be a peaceful succession of power to someone in January.

 

[Wade]

Like, Socialism: Comment: The New Yorker

You know who else was called a socialist by the way?

MLK JR and JFK are two great examples.

You know who else would of been called a Socialist?

That Community Organizer, wanting to turn the other cheek, raising taxes, favoring more government handouts for the poor, soft on crime and war on terror bastard otherwise known as..Jesus of Nazareth.

I always thought of MLK as a hardcore socialist. Don't know about JFK, he was too busy trying to get the world blown up.