CDZ Social Security Trust Fund will go broke in 17 years

[Moonglow]

Make Social Security an off budget item again and stop the theft...

 

[Toro]

Just one question for you "the trust fund" has $TRILLs of value in it" morons.

WHO is paying this bill?

We are paying that.

But that would look absolutely no different if the trusts were filled with Treasury securities.

We would still be paying it.

We pay for all government debt.

The SS trusts are like a pension plan that owns 100% government bonds.

If you have any pension, you have government bonds. All corporate pension plans own government bonds. Corporate pension plans are comprised of anywhere between 5% to 50% government bonds. And government bonds are liabilities of the US government.

The difference between most pensions and SS is that the pensions aren't comprised 100% of government liabilities like SS. But both own "promises to pay" or "IOUs" of the US government.

 

[martybegan]

But remember SS was sold as something separate, people paying into a system over time and taking that money out when they retired.
Government run, but technically not government funded. Once they started using the surplus to prop up the general fund, however, even that veneer of independence disappeared.

The surplus should have been invested in real securities like any other pension fund.

I would not structure SS as it is structured today. I'd structure SS like a real pension plan. Canada Pension Plan - the SS north of the border - is a real pension plan that invests in all sorts of assets. That's how SS should be structured, IMO.

But the idea behind SS was that it would be invested in the safest assets so that it would be there for when people retired. In finance, the safest investment is government debt. It (mostly) doesn't matter if the SS trusts are invested 100% in publicly-traded government or if it is structured the way it is today. The economics are exactly the same.

And though I think SS should be structured like a real pension plan and invest in stocks and bonds and real estate, etc., that runs counter to what social security was set up to be and violates the law. Thus, SS could not invest the surplus in anything other than government debt as it is currently structured.

The government bond thing may have been a good idea, but the problem is congress got too used to having that guaranteed income for the yearly budget.

 

[flacaltenn]

We are paying that.

But that would look absolutely no different if the trusts were filled with Treasury securities.

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities. You're just in denial about it. We wouldn't being paying cascading double interest on the same stolen dollars if the Treasury had BOOKED that debt and PAID IT over the years -- like it does with a REAL bond.

Crap Yeah. YOU'RE paying it. And the reason you're paying it is that YOU were robbed of money going into a segregated UNIVERSAL Insurance Fund. That is now heading for insolvency. With NOTHING of value from the stolen money to defer costs. It's criminal..

 

[flacaltenn]

Make Social Security an off budget item again and stop the theft...

The time to do that buddy old pal, was when SS was running surpluses and there were enough workers. 10,000 people A DAY are retiring.. Can't fix that now..

You're Dem buddies KILLED the idea of USING the Surplus to defer future costs under Bush. That move was criminal also. Because as fiduciaries if that fund, they acted against using the collected FICA in ways to benefit the Fund's future...

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

We are paying that.

But that would look absolutely no different if the trusts were filled with Treasury securities.

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities. You're just in denial about it. We wouldn't being paying cascading double interest on the same stolen dollars if the Treasury had BOOKED that debt and PAID IT over the years -- like it does with a REAL bond.

Crap Yeah. YOU'RE paying it. And the reason you're paying it is that YOU were robbed of money going into a segregated UNIVERSAL Insurance Fund. That is now heading for insolvency. With NOTHING of value from the stolen money to defer costs. It's criminal..

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities.

If they bought "real Treasuries" instead of "fake Treasuries" the result would have been unchanged.

We wouldn't being paying cascading double interest on the same stolen dollars

We aren't.

if the Treasury had BOOKED that debt and PAID IT over the years -- like it does with a REAL bond.

It pays the same way as on any other real bond it issues.

Don't worry about it. Plenty of people don't understand accounting. You're not alone.

 

[flacaltenn]

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities.

If they bought "real Treasuries" instead of "fake Treasuries" the result would have been unchanged.

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true. Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund". We're talking 100s of $Bills... And it wouldn't have HURT them to honor that discipline. But they are CROOKS and felons...

 

[Moonglow]

Make Social Security an off budget item again and stop the theft...

The time to do that buddy old pal, was when SS was running surpluses and there were enough workers. 10,000 people A DAY are retiring.. Can't fix that now..

You're Dem buddies KILLED the idea of USING the Surplus to defer future costs under Bush. That move was criminal also. Because as fiduciaries if that fund, they acted against using the collected FICA in ways to benefit the Fund's future...

The fund was changed to a on budget item during Reagan and that is when it became a fund for politicians to dip into..

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities.

If they bought "real Treasuries" instead of "fake Treasuries" the result would have been unchanged.

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true. Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund". We're talking 100s of $Bills... And it wouldn't have HURT them to honor that discipline. But they are CROOKS and felons...

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true

Yes, I've seen your error, multiple times.

Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund".

The Trust Funds gets interest yearly. $106 billion in 2013 alone.

But they are CROOKS and felons...

Which has nothing to do with your confusion about the Trust Fund.

 

[flacaltenn]

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities.

If they bought "real Treasuries" instead of "fake Treasuries" the result would have been unchanged.

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true. Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund". We're talking 100s of $Bills... And it wouldn't have HURT them to honor that discipline. But they are CROOKS and felons...

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true

Yes, I've seen your error, multiple times.

Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund".

The Trust Funds gets interest yearly. $106 billion in 2013 alone.

But they are CROOKS and felons...

Which has nothing to do with your confusion about the Trust Fund.

That "interest" was never booked and paid by the Treasury. WILL be booked and paid NOW by issuing NEW debt to cover the old interest.

The Fed Reserve has room for a "Lock Vault" for pallets of cash dedicated to the SS Trust Fund. Never happened.. Just pallets of cash to add to the MOUNTAIN of pallets of cash kept there. And the DISCIPLINE of having the Govt BUDGET that interest payment -- would have been a POSITIVE mgt practice to REDUCE THE CURRENT shortfalls.

The fiction is -- SS is "living off interest".. The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities.

If they bought "real Treasuries" instead of "fake Treasuries" the result would have been unchanged.

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true. Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund". We're talking 100s of $Bills... And it wouldn't have HURT them to honor that discipline. But they are CROOKS and felons...

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true

Yes, I've seen your error, multiple times.

Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund".

The Trust Funds gets interest yearly. $106 billion in 2013 alone.

But they are CROOKS and felons...

Which has nothing to do with your confusion about the Trust Fund.

That "interest" was never booked and paid by the Treasury. WILL be booked and paid NOW by issuing NEW debt to cover the old interest.

The Fed Reserve has room for a "Lock Vault" for pallets of cash dedicated to the SS Trust Fund. Never happened.. Just pallets of cash to add to the MOUNTAIN of pallets of cash kept there. And the DISCIPLINE of having the Govt BUDGET that interest payment -- would have been a POSITIVE mgt practice to REDUCE THE CURRENT shortfalls.

The fiction is -- SS is "living off interest".. The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

That "interest" was never booked and paid by the Treasury.

It was credited to the Trust Fund.
Every single year.

WILL be booked and paid NOW by issuing NEW debt to cover the old interest.

When Social Security was running a surplus, it didn't "need" the earned interest to pay benefits.
So the interest "bought" more bonds, making the balance of the fund larger.

This was no different than if the fund had bought bonds in the open market and re-invested interest and principal payments into new bonds.

Now that the fund is paying out more than it collects, yes, the Treasury has to sell new bonds to give the Trust Fund the money needed to pay benefits.

The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

It was paid and bought more bonds. Just like real bonds re-investing the interest.

 

[flacaltenn]

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities.

If they bought "real Treasuries" instead of "fake Treasuries" the result would have been unchanged.

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true. Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund". We're talking 100s of $Bills... And it wouldn't have HURT them to honor that discipline. But they are CROOKS and felons...

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true

Yes, I've seen your error, multiple times.

Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund".

The Trust Funds gets interest yearly. $106 billion in 2013 alone.

But they are CROOKS and felons...

Which has nothing to do with your confusion about the Trust Fund.

That "interest" was never booked and paid by the Treasury. WILL be booked and paid NOW by issuing NEW debt to cover the old interest.

The Fed Reserve has room for a "Lock Vault" for pallets of cash dedicated to the SS Trust Fund. Never happened.. Just pallets of cash to add to the MOUNTAIN of pallets of cash kept there. And the DISCIPLINE of having the Govt BUDGET that interest payment -- would have been a POSITIVE mgt practice to REDUCE THE CURRENT shortfalls.

The fiction is -- SS is "living off interest".. The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

That "interest" was never booked and paid by the Treasury.

It was credited to the Trust Fund.
Every single year.

WILL be booked and paid NOW by issuing NEW debt to cover the old interest.

When Social Security was running a surplus, it didn't "need" the earned interest to pay benefits.
So the interest "bought" more bonds, making the balance of the fund larger.

This was no different than if the fund had bought bonds in the open market and re-invested interest and principal payments into new bonds.

Now that the fund is paying out more than it collects, yes, the Treasury has to sell new bonds to give the Trust Fund the money needed to pay benefits.

The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

It was paid and bought more bonds. Just like real bonds re-investing the interest.

You're sandbagging about it being "credited". It never was BUDGETED by Congress. Never BOOKED as a yearly debt. In other words --- NOTHING happened. And NOTHING of value got placed in the Trust Fund to defer future liabilities. That's NOT how normal Treasury Bonds or MOST bonds work..

It's a sham. A Crock of Shit. And the biggest lie ever to come out of the Swamp....

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

I've told you 4 times why it WOULD be much different if they HAD been real securities.

If they bought "real Treasuries" instead of "fake Treasuries" the result would have been unchanged.

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true. Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund". We're talking 100s of $Bills... And it wouldn't have HURT them to honor that discipline. But they are CROOKS and felons...

Just told you FIVE times now -- why that is not true

Yes, I've seen your error, multiple times.

Getting the interest on the "bonds" paid YEARLY would have provided ACTUAL LIQUIDITY to the "trust fund".

The Trust Funds gets interest yearly. $106 billion in 2013 alone.

But they are CROOKS and felons...

Which has nothing to do with your confusion about the Trust Fund.

That "interest" was never booked and paid by the Treasury. WILL be booked and paid NOW by issuing NEW debt to cover the old interest.

The Fed Reserve has room for a "Lock Vault" for pallets of cash dedicated to the SS Trust Fund. Never happened.. Just pallets of cash to add to the MOUNTAIN of pallets of cash kept there. And the DISCIPLINE of having the Govt BUDGET that interest payment -- would have been a POSITIVE mgt practice to REDUCE THE CURRENT shortfalls.

The fiction is -- SS is "living off interest".. The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

That "interest" was never booked and paid by the Treasury.

It was credited to the Trust Fund.
Every single year.

WILL be booked and paid NOW by issuing NEW debt to cover the old interest.

When Social Security was running a surplus, it didn't "need" the earned interest to pay benefits.
So the interest "bought" more bonds, making the balance of the fund larger.

This was no different than if the fund had bought bonds in the open market and re-invested interest and principal payments into new bonds.

Now that the fund is paying out more than it collects, yes, the Treasury has to sell new bonds to give the Trust Fund the money needed to pay benefits.

The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

It was paid and bought more bonds. Just like real bonds re-investing the interest.

You're sandbagging about it being "credited". It never was BUDGETED by Congress. Never BOOKED as a yearly debt. In other words --- NOTHING happened. And NOTHING of value got placed in the Trust Fund to defer future liabilities. That's NOT how normal Treasury Bonds or MOST bonds work..

It's a sham. A Crock of Shit. And the biggest lie ever to come out of the Swamp....

You're sandbagging about it being "credited". It never was BUDGETED by Congress.

Do you think Congress budgets interest payments on debt? LOL!

Never BOOKED as a yearly debt.

Sure it was.

Trust Fund Data

And NOTHING of value got placed in the Trust Fund to defer future liabilities.

Just a promise to pay. Like any other Treasury Bond.

 

[flacaltenn]

You're sandbagging about it being "credited". It never was BUDGETED by Congress.

Do you think Congress budgets interest payments on debt? LOL!

It's in EVERY ANNUAL budget. Shows as a debit for that YEAR. All the time. You're screwed on this one. CBO makes the distinction that "interest" paid to Soc Soc is NOT a budgeted debt for that year.

If you don't understand this and think that massive Bond debt is not actually budgeted, booked and PAID every year for "normal borrowing" -- than I pretty much done here. Those book entries for the "trust fund" were NEVER budgeted, booked and paid.. That's why you're getting a SECOND TIME for the same damn stolen money and phony interest....

Federal Debt and Interest Costs

Interest Payments and Receipts
The government pays and collects interest in various ways. Its net interest outlays are equal to the interest it pays minus the interest it receives. Net interest outlays are dominated by the interest paid to holders of the debt that the Treasury issues to the public. Although the Treasury also issues debt to trust funds and other government accounts, the payment of interest to those accounts is an intragovernmental transaction that has no effect on net interest outlays or on the budget deficit.
The federal government’s interest payments depend primarily on interest rates and the amount of debt held by the public. Other factors, such as the rate of inflation and the maturity structure of outstanding securities, also affect interest costs (for example, long-term bonds generally carry higher interest rates than do short-term bills). Interest rates are determined by a combination of market forces and the policies of the Federal Reserve. Debt held by the public is determined mostly by cumulative budget deficits, which depend on policy choices about spending and revenues and on economic conditions and other factors.
Although the federal government has increased its net borrowing by more than $3 trillion in the past two years, net interest costs dropped from $253 billion in 2008 to $197 billion in 2010 because of remarkably low interest rates. The amounts of net interest shown in the budget include interest paid on all Treasury securities ($413 billion in 2010), minus the portion of that interest that is received by trust funds ($186 billion in 2010) and the net amount of other interest received by the government ($30 billion in 2010). The last category consists primarily of net receipts to the Treasury from the financing accounts for federal loan programs (those accounts are not included in the federal budget).


--------------------------------

No wonder you're not irate. You don't seem to know how this stuff works. That's HOW they robbed you twice.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You're sandbagging about it being "credited". It never was BUDGETED by Congress.

Do you think Congress budgets interest payments on debt? LOL!

It's in EVERY ANNUAL budget. Shows as a debit for that YEAR. All the time. You're screwed on this one. CBO makes the distinction that "interest" paid to Soc Soc is NOT a budgeted debt for that year.

If you don't understand this and think that massive Bond debt is not actually budgeted, booked and PAID every year for "normal borrowing" -- than I pretty much done here. Those book entries for the "trust fund" were NEVER budgeted, booked and paid.. That's why you're getting a SECOND TIME for the same damn stolen money and phony interest....

Federal Debt and Interest Costs

Interest Payments and Receipts
The government pays and collects interest in various ways. Its net interest outlays are equal to the interest it pays minus the interest it receives. Net interest outlays are dominated by the interest paid to holders of the debt that the Treasury issues to the public. Although the Treasury also issues debt to trust funds and other government accounts, the payment of interest to those accounts is an intragovernmental transaction that has no effect on net interest outlays or on the budget deficit.
The federal government’s interest payments depend primarily on interest rates and the amount of debt held by the public. Other factors, such as the rate of inflation and the maturity structure of outstanding securities, also affect interest costs (for example, long-term bonds generally carry higher interest rates than do short-term bills). Interest rates are determined by a combination of market forces and the policies of the Federal Reserve. Debt held by the public is determined mostly by cumulative budget deficits, which depend on policy choices about spending and revenues and on economic conditions and other factors.
Although the federal government has increased its net borrowing by more than $3 trillion in the past two years, net interest costs dropped from $253 billion in 2008 to $197 billion in 2010 because of remarkably low interest rates. The amounts of net interest shown in the budget include interest paid on all Treasury securities ($413 billion in 2010), minus the portion of that interest that is received by trust funds ($186 billion in 2010) and the net amount of other interest received by the government ($30 billion in 2010). The last category consists primarily of net receipts to the Treasury from the financing accounts for federal loan programs (those accounts are not included in the federal budget).


--------------------------------

No wonder you're not irate. You don't seem to know how this stuff works. That's HOW they robbed you twice.

It's in EVERY ANNUAL budget.

If Congress budgets $200 billion for interest but actually owes $250 billion, interest won't be paid? LOL!

If you don't understand this and think that massive Bond debt is not actually budgeted, booked and PAID every year for "normal borrowing"

Of course it's paid every year.

The amounts of net interest shown in the budget include interest paid on all Treasury securities ($413 billion in 2010), minus the portion of that interest that is received by trust funds

That's weird, you said the Treasury doesn't pay interest to the Trust Fund and then your own source says it does.

As I said before, don't worry about it.
Plenty of people don't understand accounting. You're not alone in your confusion.

 

[flacaltenn]

You're sandbagging about it being "credited". It never was BUDGETED by Congress.

Do you think Congress budgets interest payments on debt? LOL!

It's in EVERY ANNUAL budget. Shows as a debit for that YEAR. All the time. You're screwed on this one. CBO makes the distinction that "interest" paid to Soc Soc is NOT a budgeted debt for that year.

If you don't understand this and think that massive Bond debt is not actually budgeted, booked and PAID every year for "normal borrowing" -- than I pretty much done here. Those book entries for the "trust fund" were NEVER budgeted, booked and paid.. That's why you're getting a SECOND TIME for the same damn stolen money and phony interest....

Federal Debt and Interest Costs

Interest Payments and Receipts
The government pays and collects interest in various ways. Its net interest outlays are equal to the interest it pays minus the interest it receives. Net interest outlays are dominated by the interest paid to holders of the debt that the Treasury issues to the public. Although the Treasury also issues debt to trust funds and other government accounts, the payment of interest to those accounts is an intragovernmental transaction that has no effect on net interest outlays or on the budget deficit.
The federal government’s interest payments depend primarily on interest rates and the amount of debt held by the public. Other factors, such as the rate of inflation and the maturity structure of outstanding securities, also affect interest costs (for example, long-term bonds generally carry higher interest rates than do short-term bills). Interest rates are determined by a combination of market forces and the policies of the Federal Reserve. Debt held by the public is determined mostly by cumulative budget deficits, which depend on policy choices about spending and revenues and on economic conditions and other factors.
Although the federal government has increased its net borrowing by more than $3 trillion in the past two years, net interest costs dropped from $253 billion in 2008 to $197 billion in 2010 because of remarkably low interest rates. The amounts of net interest shown in the budget include interest paid on all Treasury securities ($413 billion in 2010), minus the portion of that interest that is received by trust funds ($186 billion in 2010) and the net amount of other interest received by the government ($30 billion in 2010). The last category consists primarily of net receipts to the Treasury from the financing accounts for federal loan programs (those accounts are not included in the federal budget).


--------------------------------

No wonder you're not irate. You don't seem to know how this stuff works. That's HOW they robbed you twice.

It's in EVERY ANNUAL budget.

If Congress budgets $200 billion for interest but actually owes $250 billion, interest won't be paid? LOL!

If you don't understand this and think that massive Bond debt is not actually budgeted, booked and PAID every year for "normal borrowing"

Of course it's paid every year.

The amounts of net interest shown in the budget include interest paid on all Treasury securities ($413 billion in 2010), minus the portion of that interest that is received by trust funds

That's weird, you said the Treasury doesn't pay interest to the Trust Fund and then your own source says it does.

As I said before, don't worry about it.
Plenty of people don't understand accounting. You're not alone in your confusion.

Net Interest -- YES.. Amount PAID --- NO. And that is the tremendous difference between borrowing with DISCIPLINE to PAY yearly interest and the phony fantasy that there was any INVESTMENT on the stolen funds.

NOTHING "paid" to Soc Sec was ever booked as debt or debit for all those years. Never created ANY value to the "trust fund". Just felonious book keeping.

THAT'S the diff between REAL Treasury Debt instruments and fake ones. HAD that interest gotten credited every year like OTHER US debt --- There's be almost $1TRILL in cash on pallets at the Fed Reserve to pay this years $30B shortfall....

 

[flacaltenn]

The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

It was paid and bought more bonds. Just like real bonds re-investing the interest.

There weren't any bonds. There weren't any actual payments made. No reinvestment in ACTUAL BONDS. It's a book-keeping entry. AND the proper term for the JUNK that's in there is not bonds. They are called Inter-Governmental Dept Debit Memos.. They are NOT an investment. They are worthless IOUs with ZERO power to pay the bills. YOU'RE gonna be robbed again to pay for the money and phony interest that the Congress and Leadership stole from you 30 years ago.. And then did NOTHING to manage the situation..

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

You're sandbagging about it being "credited". It never was BUDGETED by Congress.

Do you think Congress budgets interest payments on debt? LOL!

It's in EVERY ANNUAL budget. Shows as a debit for that YEAR. All the time. You're screwed on this one. CBO makes the distinction that "interest" paid to Soc Soc is NOT a budgeted debt for that year.

If you don't understand this and think that massive Bond debt is not actually budgeted, booked and PAID every year for "normal borrowing" -- than I pretty much done here. Those book entries for the "trust fund" were NEVER budgeted, booked and paid.. That's why you're getting a SECOND TIME for the same damn stolen money and phony interest....

Federal Debt and Interest Costs

Interest Payments and Receipts
The government pays and collects interest in various ways. Its net interest outlays are equal to the interest it pays minus the interest it receives. Net interest outlays are dominated by the interest paid to holders of the debt that the Treasury issues to the public. Although the Treasury also issues debt to trust funds and other government accounts, the payment of interest to those accounts is an intragovernmental transaction that has no effect on net interest outlays or on the budget deficit.
The federal government’s interest payments depend primarily on interest rates and the amount of debt held by the public. Other factors, such as the rate of inflation and the maturity structure of outstanding securities, also affect interest costs (for example, long-term bonds generally carry higher interest rates than do short-term bills). Interest rates are determined by a combination of market forces and the policies of the Federal Reserve. Debt held by the public is determined mostly by cumulative budget deficits, which depend on policy choices about spending and revenues and on economic conditions and other factors.
Although the federal government has increased its net borrowing by more than $3 trillion in the past two years, net interest costs dropped from $253 billion in 2008 to $197 billion in 2010 because of remarkably low interest rates. The amounts of net interest shown in the budget include interest paid on all Treasury securities ($413 billion in 2010), minus the portion of that interest that is received by trust funds ($186 billion in 2010) and the net amount of other interest received by the government ($30 billion in 2010). The last category consists primarily of net receipts to the Treasury from the financing accounts for federal loan programs (those accounts are not included in the federal budget).


--------------------------------

No wonder you're not irate. You don't seem to know how this stuff works. That's HOW they robbed you twice.

It's in EVERY ANNUAL budget.

If Congress budgets $200 billion for interest but actually owes $250 billion, interest won't be paid? LOL!

If you don't understand this and think that massive Bond debt is not actually budgeted, booked and PAID every year for "normal borrowing"

Of course it's paid every year.

The amounts of net interest shown in the budget include interest paid on all Treasury securities ($413 billion in 2010), minus the portion of that interest that is received by trust funds

That's weird, you said the Treasury doesn't pay interest to the Trust Fund and then your own source says it does.

As I said before, don't worry about it.
Plenty of people don't understand accounting. You're not alone in your confusion.

Net Interest -- YES.. Amount PAID --- NO. And that is the tremendous difference between borrowing with DISCIPLINE to PAY yearly interest and the phony fantasy that there was any INVESTMENT on the stolen funds.

NOTHING "paid" to Soc Sec was ever booked as debt or debit for all those years. Never created ANY value to the "trust fund". Just felonious book keeping.

THAT'S the diff between REAL Treasury Debt instruments and fake ones. HAD that interest gotten credited every year like OTHER US debt --- There's be almost $1TRILL in cash on pallets at the Fed Reserve to pay this years $30B shortfall....

Net Interest -- YES.. Amount PAID --- NO.

I gave you the SocSec link that shows the amount paid to the Trust Fund.

NOTHING "paid" to Soc Sec was ever booked as debt or debit for all those years.

Except for the amount the Trust Fund got every year.

THAT'S the diff between REAL Treasury Debt instruments and fake ones.

Pretend the Trust Fund was held at Fidelity with "Real Treasury Debt Instruments".
In 2016, instead of crediting the Trust Fund with $88.356 billion in "fake Treasuries",
the Treasury pays out $88.356 billion in interest to that Fidelity account which then buys $88.356 billion
in real Treasury Debt to add to their position.

What is the difference to the US Treasury, the Trust Fund or the net debt position of the US government between those 2 scenarios?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

It was paid and bought more bonds. Just like real bonds re-investing the interest.

There weren't any bonds. There weren't any actual payments made. No reinvestment in ACTUAL BONDS. It's a book-keeping entry. AND the proper term for the JUNK that's in there is not bonds. They are called Inter-Governmental Dept Debit Memos.. They are NOT an investment. They are worthless IOUs with ZERO power to pay the bills. YOU'RE gonna be robbed again to pay for the money and phony interest that the Congress and Leadership stole from you 30 years ago.. And then did NOTHING to manage the situation..

There weren't any bonds.

You act like bonds don't count unless you can touch them.
Remember the final scene of Die Hard? All those Bearer Bonds fluttering around
after the building explodes? That was cool!

Treasury Bonds are all bookkeeping entries now.
They don't even send you a paper savings bond anymore.

All electronic.
I guess you can claim savings bonds are worthless IOUs.
I'll disagree with you there too.

YOU'RE gonna be robbed again to pay for the money and phony interest that the Congress and Leadership stole from you 30 years ago..

When the Trust Fund stops reinvesting the interest earned and starts redeeming bonds to pay benefits, it wouldn't make one bit of difference if the funds were held at Fidelity or held by the US government, that money is coming from the US taxpayers would cough up the dough every single time a bond matures.

 

[flacaltenn]

The FACT IS -- that interest was never paid during the life of the debt. Like it is on REAL bonds.

It was paid and bought more bonds. Just like real bonds re-investing the interest.

There weren't any bonds. There weren't any actual payments made. No reinvestment in ACTUAL BONDS. It's a book-keeping entry. AND the proper term for the JUNK that's in there is not bonds. They are called Inter-Governmental Dept Debit Memos.. They are NOT an investment. They are worthless IOUs with ZERO power to pay the bills. YOU'RE gonna be robbed again to pay for the money and phony interest that the Congress and Leadership stole from you 30 years ago.. And then did NOTHING to manage the situation..

There weren't any bonds.

You act like bonds don't count unless you can touch them.
Remember the final scene of Die Hard? All those Bearer Bonds fluttering around
after the building explodes? That was cool!

Treasury Bonds are all bookkeeping entries now.
They don't even send you a paper savings bond anymore.

All electronic.
I guess you can claim savings bonds are worthless IOUs.
I'll disagree with you there too.

YOU'RE gonna be robbed again to pay for the money and phony interest that the Congress and Leadership stole from you 30 years ago..

When the Trust Fund stops reinvesting the interest earned and starts redeeming bonds to pay benefits, it wouldn't make one bit of difference if the funds were held at Fidelity or held by the US government, that money is coming from the US taxpayers would cough up the dough every single time a bond matures.

Complete BS. As you've been denying, Bonds held at Fidelity provide YEARLY income, tangible assets and their VALUE floats with the markets. These are not bonds. The fund was ignored and feloniously mismanaged. If it were subject to SEC -- folks would be in jail...

And it DOES make about a $TRILL difference in BUDGETING and PAYING THAT DEBT.. ZERO was invested or paid during the 30 years of theft. They left that up to YOU to cover ever $$ of SS income shortfall TODAY.

NOTHING comes out of the Trust Fund to pay for ANYTHING..