So Mitt is in the same tax bracket as Buffet but Mitt is bad and Buffet is good

[Jarhead]

I am not the one who used the term "fair share"

Obama did.

I made it quite clear that fair share was an inaccurate and childish term to use...

Yet for some reason you felt the need to pin it on me.

Well...if that makes you feel good go for it.

But you are acting as childish as our President.

Oh, so you never said this:

Yes, the wealthiest Americans pay the bulk of the revenue coming into the federal government. They most certainly pay more than the lions share....more than their fair share.

According to you, Obama is wrong to say that they are not paying their fair share, but would be right to say they are paying more than their fair share. In other words, you're still advocating that the argument should be about "fair" share. You claim it's childish, yet you advocate still invoking it. You're right about one thing. It's childish. Nobody should be even asking whether people are paying their "fair" share. It's a childish notion, BOTH ways.

Whatever....

I negated it...I tossed in fair sharew showing how he could have used it in a proper way...

You just wanted to nit pick.

Go for it.

Your posts are generally worthless to me anyway.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Funny how things come full circle. They both pay the same rate basically but since Buffet cries about it he gets a pass? Have I got this right? Can I rob my neighbor as long as I condemn it while I do it?

LOL. You poor asses. The differance is that Mitt thinks he pays too much, and Buffet thinks that he pays too little. But go ahead and kiss the asses of the 1%. Maybe they will throw you a dime.

They throw me more than dimes. In fact they throw me thousands weekly. I then throw hundreds weekly at my help. Who then throw hundreds into our economy. All because they have money left to throw after taxes.

 

[Decepticon]

Yeah, pointing out that rich people commit tax fraud to the tune of over 300 BILLION dollars a year is irrelevant in a discussion about taxation and someone who says they minimize their taxes whenever they can.

Yes, I should instead concentrate on meaningless feel good statements without basis in reality that I don't have to think about.

Conservatives have this LOVELY habit of IGNORING inconvenient truths if they can find what they think is a chink in your armor.
Taxes are at their lowest rate in 50 years. Fact. Why are taxes too high again?
Spending is in line with historic norms, no higher than it was under Reagan. Why is spending too high again?

It's the intellectual dishonesty that cons MUST engage in that leads to their inevitable undoing. For in asserting what they BELIEVE to be truths, without supporting empirical evidence, their claims about taxation ring hollow. All conservatism is nowadays is a "clever" intellectual rationalization for being a selfish asshole and sticking it to everyone else, lest they get something you don't.

It's a pity that there's not a simulator which could show CONS the outcome of their social darwinistic approach. I'm sure that stepping over the frozen corpses of the elderly whose heating assistance they would cut to preserve their low tax rates, might loosen their purse strings if they smelled the consequences of their actions.

 

[rightwinger]

Funny how things come full circle. They both pay the same rate basically but since Buffet cries about it he gets a pass? Have I got this right? Can I rob my neighbor as long as I condemn it while I do it?

Buffet says this system is not fair and should be changed....that makes Buffet good

Romney says I like this system the way it is and i should keep paying the same rate.....that makes Romney bad

Spin...

Better said...

Buffet says the syetmen needs an adjustment...that means Buffet agrees with those that feel the wealthier Americans need to pay more taxes

Romney says the system does not need an adjustment for it will have a negative affect on the job creators...that means Romney feels that the problem is spending, not revenue and any increase in taxes will have an adverse affect on employment

TO say one is good and one is bad is childish.

I was just keeping with the spirit of the OP in terms of good and bad

I am perfectly fine with Romney paying 15%. Let him explain to the American people why it is preferable for him to pay a lower tax rate than they do. I'd like to see the job numbers myself

If people agree with Romneys tax rate, they can vote for him

Let Romney run as the champion of the one per centers and let the voters decide

 

[Jarhead]

Yeah, pointing out that rich people commit tax fraud to the tune of over 300 BILLION dollars a year is irrelevant in a discussion about taxation and someone who says they minimize their taxes whenever they can.

Yes, I should instead concentrate on meaningless feel good statements without basis in reality that I don't have to think about.

Conservatives have this LOVELY habit of IGNORING inconvenient truths if they can find what they think is a chink in your armor.
Taxes are at their lowest rate in 50 years. Fact. Why are taxes too high again?
Spending is in line with historic norms, no higher than it was under Reagan. Why is spending too high again?

It's the intellectual dishonesty that cons MUST engage in that leads to their inevitable undoing. For in asserting what they BELIEVE to be truths, without supporting empirical evidence, their claims about taxation ring hollow. All conservatism is nowadays is a "clever" intellectual rationalization for being a selfish asshole and sticking it to everyone else, lest they get something you don't.

It's a pity that there's not a simulator which could show CONS the outcome of their social darwinistic approach. I'm sure that stepping over the frozen corpses of the elderly whose heating assistance they would cut to preserve their low tax rates, might loosen their purse strings if they smelled the consequences of their actions.

you did not point out that rich people commit tax fraud.

Instead, you called a poster out as being unpatriotic for not paying his trax laibility when, in fact, he did...and he said he did.

You dont seem to understand how this debate board works. You can quote someone and respond to their post OR you can simply hit "post" and write whatever you want on the topic.

As for the rest of what you said.....irrelevant becuase all of us understand the problems we have and what has been happening....

 

[Jarhead]

Buffet says this system is not fair and should be changed....that makes Buffet good

Romney says I like this system the way it is and i should keep paying the same rate.....that makes Romney bad

Spin...

Better said...

Buffet says the syetmen needs an adjustment...that means Buffet agrees with those that feel the wealthier Americans need to pay more taxes

Romney says the system does not need an adjustment for it will have a negative affect on the job creators...that means Romney feels that the problem is spending, not revenue and any increase in taxes will have an adverse affect on employment

TO say one is good and one is bad is childish.

I was just keeping with the spirit of the OP in terms of good and bad

I am perfectly fine with Romney paying 15%. Let him explain to the American people why it is preferable for him to pay a lower tax rate than they do. I'd like to see the job numbers myself

If people agree with Romneys tax rate, they can vote for him

He does not pay a lower tax rate than anyone else. That, too is spin.

He pays 15% on capital gains...like everytone else.

He pays 38% on his adjusted gross income like everyone else in his tax bracket.

Now...you want to say the 15% cap gains tax is unfair....I undersdtand. Many think it is.

But to say he pays less taxes than everyone else is disingenuous....and exactly what our politicians are doing....playing on those that are naive.

 

[Decepticon]

Talk about being disingenous....

You're saying that paying the capital gains tax is equal for everyone who pays the capital gains tax.

Now Romney HIMSELF said he pays about 15% tax rate...total.

That means that someone like Paris Hilton, who does not have to WORK for any of her income, gets a lower tax rate than say, a nurse who goes to work week in, week out, providing an actual SERVICE.

Do you think that WORK should be rewarded more than an accident of birth?

 

[rightwinger]

Spin...

Better said...

Buffet says the syetmen needs an adjustment...that means Buffet agrees with those that feel the wealthier Americans need to pay more taxes

Romney says the system does not need an adjustment for it will have a negative affect on the job creators...that means Romney feels that the problem is spending, not revenue and any increase in taxes will have an adverse affect on employment

TO say one is good and one is bad is childish.

I was just keeping with the spirit of the OP in terms of good and bad

I am perfectly fine with Romney paying 15%. Let him explain to the American people why it is preferable for him to pay a lower tax rate than they do. I'd like to see the job numbers myself

If people agree with Romneys tax rate, they can vote for him

He does not pay a lower tax rate than anyone else. That, too is spin.

He pays 15% on capital gains...like everytone else.

He pays 38% on his adjusted gross income like everyone else in his tax bracket.

Now...you want to say the 15% cap gains tax is unfair....I undersdtand. Many think it is.

But to say he pays less taxes than everyone else is disingenuous....and exactly what our politicians are doing....playing on those that are naive.

I am perfectly fine with that

Let Mitt defend why we need to preserve that low capital gains rate. I am sure the public will accept why his money is taxed lower than the money they work for.

Buffet has said it is unfair. Let Mitt run for president on why it is fair

 

[Jarhead]

Talk about being disingenous....

You're saying that paying the capital gains tax is equal for everyone who pays the capital gains tax.

Now Romney HIMSELF said he pays about 15% tax rate...total.

That means that someone like Paris Hilton, who does not have to WORK for any of her income, gets a lower tax rate than say, a nurse who goes to work week in, week out, providing an actual SERVICE.

Do you think that WORK should be rewarded more than an accident of birth?

You are making some very interesting assumptions here.

where did I say that I agree with a 15% cap gains tax?

Since when was "tax" a reward system?

You seem stuck on envy....the fact that you mentioned that twit Hilton.....but thats irrelevant.

All I have been doing is trying to correct the spin of how things are being presented......I nowhere offered my senitments on whether or not 15% cap gains tax is appropriate.

I know the following for sure...

1) we have a deficit every year...and therefore our debt is growing beyond belief
2) we better do something about it
3)we cant turn to the poor and we cant turn to the middle class becuase both classes cant afford to bail us out
4) You sure arent goinbg to get the upper class to "agree" by telling the other classes that they (the upper class) are cheap and greedy

There is something known as rationalizing....and that takes me back to what I said earlier....

Maybe Obama should have said..

"the wealthiest Americans are a great example of what America can do for any Citizen when they put their mind to it. We should applaud their success and thank them for creating jobs in America and contirbuting the bulk of our federal revenue. Whereas they may feel some of the pain others are feeling, they certainly have the resources to continue as they were. We can nopt ask the less fortunate Americans to help with this deficit and debt problem. Sure we can cut spending, and those in congress are explorting ways to do so. IN the meantime we have no other plcae to turn than to the most fortunate Americans for help and I am sure, in the spirit of America, they will do so when asked..."

THAT is how a leader should discuss raising taxes on the wealthiest.

Not by saying they are cheap and greedy.....and they need to pay their fair share.

 

[Sallow]

Funny how things come full circle. They both pay the same rate basically but since Buffet cries about it he gets a pass? Have I got this right? Can I rob my neighbor as long as I condemn it while I do it?

Lets talk when Warren Buffet runs for elected office.

 

[Jarhead]

I was just keeping with the spirit of the OP in terms of good and bad

I am perfectly fine with Romney paying 15%. Let him explain to the American people why it is preferable for him to pay a lower tax rate than they do. I'd like to see the job numbers myself

If people agree with Romneys tax rate, they can vote for him

He does not pay a lower tax rate than anyone else. That, too is spin.

He pays 15% on capital gains...like everytone else.

He pays 38% on his adjusted gross income like everyone else in his tax bracket.

Now...you want to say the 15% cap gains tax is unfair....I undersdtand. Many think it is.

But to say he pays less taxes than everyone else is disingenuous....and exactly what our politicians are doing....playing on those that are naive.

I am perfectly fine with that

Let Mitt defend why we need to preserve that low capital gains rate. I am sure the public will accept why his money is taxed lower than the money they work for.

Buffet has said it is unfair. Let Mitt run for president on why it is fair

lol...he wont be able to.

 

[rightwinger]

The big issue is that the wealthy are playing the system that they created. A guy making $35,000 working in the sewers has no choice in how he gets paid. It is all taxed as income

The wealthy CEO can spell out which percent of his compensation will be paid as salary and which percent gets paid as a capital gain. Guess how much these guys take as salary?

 

[Jarhead]

The big issue is that the wealthy are playing the system that they created. A guy making $35,000 working in the sewers has no choice in how he gets paid. It is all taxed as income

The wealthy CEO can spell out which percent of his compensation will be paid as salary and which percent gets paid as a capital gain. Guess how much these guys take as salary?

You dont get paid "capital gains"...that is not how it works.

A CEO can not claim any capital gains if he does not own the company.

But if he owns the company, anything he takes out is income....most take 52K a year...1K weekly...and then monthly ditributions.

Those distributions? Taxed as regular income.

SOme leave the money in the company and when the company uses that money for growth, it is labelled as capital gains.....but that is not cash they take home.

Most capital gains that are being disputed are from personal investements......which started as taxable income before it was invested.

 

[The Infidel]

The big issue is that the wealthy are playing the system that they created. A guy making $35,000 working in the sewers has no choice in how he gets paid. It is all taxed as income

Because he cant afford to invest any of his income?

 

[Jarhead]

The big issue is that the wealthy are playing the system that they created. A guy making $35,000 working in the sewers has no choice in how he gets paid. It is all taxed as income

Because he cant afford to invest any of his income?

I believe RW is a bit confused about capital gains...what they are. how they are collected, how they are taxed, and where they come from.

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

Funny how things come full circle. They both pay the same rate basically but since Buffet cries about it he gets a pass? Have I got this right? Can I rob my neighbor as long as I condemn it while I do it?

Lets talk when Warren Buffet runs for elected office.

Why? The left on here have been trumpeting Buffets words for months now. Suddenly its invalid?

 

[Sallow]

Talk about being disingenous....

You're saying that paying the capital gains tax is equal for everyone who pays the capital gains tax.

Now Romney HIMSELF said he pays about 15% tax rate...total.

That means that someone like Paris Hilton, who does not have to WORK for any of her income, gets a lower tax rate than say, a nurse who goes to work week in, week out, providing an actual SERVICE.

Do you think that WORK should be rewarded more than an accident of birth?

You are making some very interesting assumptions here.

where did I say that I agree with a 15% cap gains tax?

Since when was "tax" a reward system?

You seem stuck on envy....the fact that you mentioned that twit Hilton.....but thats irrelevant.

All I have been doing is trying to correct the spin of how things are being presented......I nowhere offered my senitments on whether or not 15% cap gains tax is appropriate.

I know the following for sure...

1) we have a deficit every year...and therefore our debt is growing beyond belief
2) we better do something about it
3)we cant turn to the poor and we cant turn to the middle class becuase both classes cant afford to bail us out
4) You sure arent goinbg to get the upper class to "agree" by telling the other classes that they (the upper class) are cheap and greedy

There is something known as rationalizing....and that takes me back to what I said earlier....

Maybe Obama should have said..

"the wealthiest Americans are a great example of what America can do for any Citizen when they put their mind to it. We should applaud their success and thank them for creating jobs in America and contirbuting the bulk of our federal revenue. Whereas they may feel some of the pain others are feeling, they certainly have the resources to continue as they were. We can nopt ask the less fortunate Americans to help with this deficit and debt problem. Sure we can cut spending, and those in congress are explorting ways to do so. IN the meantime we have no other plcae to turn than to the most fortunate Americans for help and I am sure, in the spirit of America, they will do so when asked..."
THAT is how a leader should discuss raising taxes on the wealthiest.

Not by saying they are cheap and greedy.....and they need to pay their fair share.

You must not be paying attention..but he's said this exact thing in several speeches.

In fact..I almost think you wrote the freakin speech..Jarhead.

 

[Sallow]

Funny how things come full circle. They both pay the same rate basically but since Buffet cries about it he gets a pass? Have I got this right? Can I rob my neighbor as long as I condemn it while I do it?

Lets talk when Warren Buffet runs for elected office.

Why? The left on here have been trumpeting Buffets words for months now. Suddenly its invalid?

Invalid in the context you are putting it? Yeah.

He's not making policy. You'd have a alot more traction with someone like Jeffrey Immelt.

 

[Jarhead]

Talk about being disingenous....

You're saying that paying the capital gains tax is equal for everyone who pays the capital gains tax.

Now Romney HIMSELF said he pays about 15% tax rate...total.

That means that someone like Paris Hilton, who does not have to WORK for any of her income, gets a lower tax rate than say, a nurse who goes to work week in, week out, providing an actual SERVICE.

Do you think that WORK should be rewarded more than an accident of birth?

You are making some very interesting assumptions here.

where did I say that I agree with a 15% cap gains tax?

Since when was "tax" a reward system?

You seem stuck on envy....the fact that you mentioned that twit Hilton.....but thats irrelevant.

All I have been doing is trying to correct the spin of how things are being presented......I nowhere offered my senitments on whether or not 15% cap gains tax is appropriate.

I know the following for sure...

1) we have a deficit every year...and therefore our debt is growing beyond belief
2) we better do something about it
3)we cant turn to the poor and we cant turn to the middle class becuase both classes cant afford to bail us out
4) You sure arent goinbg to get the upper class to "agree" by telling the other classes that they (the upper class) are cheap and greedy

There is something known as rationalizing....and that takes me back to what I said earlier....

Maybe Obama should have said..

"the wealthiest Americans are a great example of what America can do for any Citizen when they put their mind to it. We should applaud their success and thank them for creating jobs in America and contirbuting the bulk of our federal revenue. Whereas they may feel some of the pain others are feeling, they certainly have the resources to continue as they were. We can nopt ask the less fortunate Americans to help with this deficit and debt problem. Sure we can cut spending, and those in congress are explorting ways to do so. IN the meantime we have no other plcae to turn than to the most fortunate Americans for help and I am sure, in the spirit of America, they will do so when asked..."
THAT is how a leader should discuss raising taxes on the wealthiest.

Not by saying they are cheap and greedy.....and they need to pay their fair share.

You must not be paying attention..but he's said this exact thing in several speeches.

In fact..I almost think you wrote the freakin speech..Jarhead.

lol...

Sorry...but when one day you say that and the next day you say the rich need to pay their fair share......well....it doesnt fly well.

He has yet been able to make me feel like he appreciates me....a successful business owner who has created many jobs for people over the years...made a nice living...paid my taxes.....hired landscapers.....contractors.....etc...

Nope...he calims I dont pay my fair share.

FYI....retired as of this past monday.....long story but glad I did it.....actually gave my company to my number one employee...she has been with me for years...told her to run with it. I could have waited a few years when the economy was moving again and sold it.....but the look in her eyes when I transferred the stock over to her was priceless....worth it to me.

Now I am watching my wife grow her company she started not too long ago...already hiring people....and I am helping her with it.

 

[rightwinger]

The big issue is that the wealthy are playing the system that they created. A guy making $35,000 working in the sewers has no choice in how he gets paid. It is all taxed as income

The wealthy CEO can spell out which percent of his compensation will be paid as salary and which percent gets paid as a capital gain. Guess how much these guys take as salary?

You dont get paid "capital gains"...that is not how it works.

A CEO can not claim any capital gains if he does not own the company.

But if he owns the company, anything he takes out is income....most take 52K a year...1K weekly...and then monthly ditributions.

Those distributions? Taxed as regular income.

SOme leave the money in the company and when the company uses that money for growth, it is labelled as capital gains.....but that is not cash they take home.

Most capital gains that are being disputed are from personal investements......which started as taxable income before it was invested.

Let's put it this way

Instead of being paid salary, he gets paid in stock and stock options that he can defer until he needs them. Any increase in those stocks gets taxed as a capital gain