Rick Scott's police state

[Synthaholic]

It loses its "private" property status when the Governor elects to use that land as a platform upon which he conducts the PUBLIC's business, BriPat.

Its a nice legalistic rationalization to hold a PUBLIC press conferences on private land so you can eliminate the public you don't want there.

But its unethical and an affront to the concept of this democratic republic to play that game.

You must be joking. So if the government attends the Republican convention for Florida, does that mean Democrats have to be admitted? Public property is public property, and private property is private property, regardless of who is using it or for what purpose. According to your theory, the governor's personal residence is now public property.

Don't be frikken absurd.

He shouldn't have advertised the event as "open to the public," but that's the only error he made. He violated no laws or committed any unethical acts.

This is purely a trumped up fuax scandal, as are most media attacks on Republicans.

The Republican convention is not doing the public's business, fool.

 

[Synthaholic]

Repubs claim that gov't doesn't work & prove it every time they're elected.

Amen.

Democrats also prove it.

You're a child.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Now you're claiming this is a First Amendment violation?

Your ignorance and hatred merely reminds me of what the Framers worked to avoid.

You state only ‘loyal republicans’ should be allowed to attend, the same was practiced in pre-Foundation Era Europe when only those of a certain class were allowed into the halls of power. You accuse the democrats of ‘causing trouble,’ like a petty third world dictator who accuses the opposition of ‘treason’ and has opposition leaders shot.

I’m claiming you’re an ignorant, tedious partisan hack – too stupid to realize he’s trampling on our most cherished tenets of the Republic: the right to assemble, the right to petition government.

 

[bripat9643]

The Republican convention is not doing the public's business, fool.

Who said the governor's speech was "doing the public's business?" Is giving speeches part of the governor's official duties?

The Republican Party leased the space, not the state government of Florida.

If the Republican party wants to exclude Democrats from its event, it's perfectly free to do so according to the First Amendment.

 

[bripat9643]

Amen.

Democrats also prove it.

You're a child.

Nyah Nyah! I'm rubber. You're glue . . . . . .

 

[asterism]

I saw McCollum and Sink operate up close. I used to dislike McCollum back in the 90s but I did a complete 180 and wanted him as governor, including over Sink. But why was Sink's record as CFO dismal?

She was completely incompetent in preventing the graft and corruption. She oversaw the massive mismanagement of the state pension system. She ran for CFO on a pro-business platform and didn't deliver anything but anti-business policies. She wasn't even a competent watchdog, blinded (perhaps willfully so) by her own bias that government employees are trustworthy.

That's nonsense. I know the pension fund well. There isn't massive mismanagement at the state pension fund. The pension fund is one of the best run in the country. Scott tried to paint her as being responsible for the $24 billion decline during the financial crisis, but the trustees - the governor, CFO and AG - do not make investment decisions. And Sink had no more to do with the pension fund than Crist or McCollum, or Bush before her.

Oh, and the St Pete Times is full of shit, in case you want to go there.

I did find it odd that a typically liberal St. Pete Times did that expose on it a few years ago. That said you don't think the CFO is responsible?

 

[asterism]

The asshole should be in Leavenworth, not the governor's mansion. Just shows what 'Conservatives' admire in people.


However, federal investigators found that Scott took part in business practices at Columbia/HCA that were later found to be illegal -- specifically, that Scott and other executives offered financial incentives to doctors in exchange for patient referrals, in violation of federal law, according to lawsuits the Justice Department filed against the company in 2001.

The doctor payments were among 10 different kinds of fraud identified by the Justice Department in its 10-year probe of the company, records show. Three years after Scott left Columbia/HCA, the company admitted wrongdoing, pleading guilty to 14 felonies -- most committed during Scott's tenure -- in addition to paying two sets of fines totaling $1.7 billion.



Read more: Rick Scott and his role in Columbia/HCA scandal - Political Currents - MiamiHerald.com

That's a very valid point. Unfortunately the choice for governor last year was a right of center swindling con artist and a left of center financial moron. Alex Sink's record as CFO is dismal.

Bullshit. Back up your lies or shut the fuck up.

State: State retiree loophole costs Florida $300M a year

Fund Frozen, Florida Towns Feel the Pinch - New York Times

This was even before the crash.

 

[Synthaholic]

The Republican convention is not doing the public's business, fool.

Who said the governor's speech was "doing the public's business?" Is giving speeches part of the governor's official duties?

The Republican Party leased the space, not the state government of Florida.

If the Republican party wants to exclude Democrats from its event, it's perfectly free to do so according to the First Amendment.

You're so fucking stupid. He was there doing the public's business: signing a bill.

 

[Synthaholic]

The Villages is all private property - every last square yard of it. The roads are private. the golf courses are private. And all the communal areas are private property.

And none of it is restricted area for the people who live there. The people kicked out live there.

Are you sure that the people kicked out lived there? Prove it!

It's in the OP.

 

[Synthaholic]

That's a very valid point. Unfortunately the choice for governor last year was a right of center swindling con artist and a left of center financial moron. Alex Sink's record as CFO is dismal.

Bullshit. Back up your lies or shut the fuck up.

State: State retiree loophole costs Florida $300M a year

Fund Frozen, Florida Towns Feel the Pinch - New York Times

This was even before the crash.

You're an imbecile.

What does either story have to do with Alex Sink? The first link is about a loophole, written into the law by REPUBLICANS. It sucks, but it's not corruption if it's legal.

The second story has nothing to do with the duties of Florida's CFO, so that's another FAIL from you.

I did find this part interesting, though:

Now angry depositors are asking much the same questions about Mr. Stipanovich, who was promoted to executive director in 2002 by then-Gov. Jeb Bush, and who worked closely with Lehman Brothers, the firm that sold Florida more of the subprime-tainted securities than any other firm.
Some of the purchases were in July and August, after the risks of subprime-mortgage related securities were widely known and most investors were shunning them. The timing of Florida’s purchases was first reported by Bloomberg News Service.


Mr. Stipanovich resigned on Dec. 4 and has declined to discuss his decisions.


Some local officials said in interviews that they were also eager to learn what role Mr. Bush might have played. A month after finishing his second term as governor last January, he formed a consulting firm, which in June was engaged by Lehman Brothers. Mr. Bush also sits on the board of Lehman Brothers’s private equity unit.
​

Thanks for more confirmation that Jeb is a sleazebag.

 

[Synthaholic]

Did you read the OP?

If so, I'm guessing that you are stupid.

LOL! Of course . . . that is, I read it. You're characterizing a political maneuver directed at reducing the size and power of the government as being something a police state would do. It's way over the top.

How is Scott's plan to make pregnant women have an ultrasound before getting an abortion reducing the power of government?

How is his making them pay for that ultrasound different than mandating people buy health insurance? Both are government forcing you to pay for medical-related things you may not want to pay for.

*bump* for the toady wingnuts.

 

[Political Junky]

LOL! Of course . . . that is, I read it. You're characterizing a political maneuver directed at reducing the size and power of the government as being something a police state would do. It's way over the top.

How is Scott's plan to make pregnant women have an ultrasound before getting an abortion reducing the power of government?

How is his making them pay for that ultrasound different than mandating people buy health insurance? Both are government forcing you to pay for medical-related things you may not want to pay for.

*bump* for the toady wingnuts.

Definitely big government.

 

[The Rabbi]

Yesterday, our Toad in Chief vetoed all kinds of programs that were popular: vets programs, whooping cough vaccines for the poor, etc....not unexpected but I thought this was very telling. I'm pretty sure these people are seniors that were strong armed out of a public place (The Villages is a Senior Community, I believe)

Members of The Villages Democratic Club were barred from the budget signing by Scott staffers who said the outdoor event in The Villages town square was “private.” Other staffers and Republican operatives scoured the crowd and had Sumter County sheriff’s deputies remove those with anti-Scott signs or liberal-looking pins and buttons. They escorted more than a dozen people off the property.

Rick Scott vetoes record $615m from budget - Breaking News - MiamiHerald.com

Barring the public? I thought you were talking about an Obama town hall meeting.

 

[AVG-JOE]

It's not a "public area." It was private property.

It loses its "private" property status when the Governor elects to use that land as a platform upon which he conducts the PUBLIC's business, BriPat.

Its a nice legalistic rationalization to hold a PUBLIC press conferences on private land so you can eliminate the public you don't want there.

But its unethical and an affront to the concept of this democratic republic to play that game.

It does not. The owners of the property do not loose their property rights simply because they allow the governor to use it for something they think is important.

That said, I again reiterate that Scott's staff was wrong for excluding people from the event. I already said that, but if I do not say it again someone will think I am defending him.

If the governor wants to hold a partisan rally or any other private affair on private land with a private guest list he has my blessing.

The signing of the state budget hardly qualifies as private. As a citizen of Florida, I am politically offended.

 

[JamesInFlorida]

So you think a taxpayer, based upon their personal views, shouldn't be allowed entrance into the arena? Just trying to clarify. Because the taxpayers paid for the building to be built.

Wrong. The taxpayers didn't pay for diddly squat.

How is that NOT an example of big government?

I fail to see how it has anything whatsoever to do with big government. Big government is when the Republican Party rents a private space for the governor to give a speech? The "logic" of this claim is beyond my comprehension.

What about outside the event? Should they not be allowed there as well?

They are allowed to go wherever their contracts with The Villages say they are allowed to go.

"Outside the event is an awful big place.

I asked, and you responded about the RNC, which is being held in Tampa-NOT the villages situation. It's being held at the St. Pete Times Forum. Which WAS built with taxpayer dollars. Google it.

You're attempt at deflecting a simple straight forward question is pathetic.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Police state

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EbnglCij-A]YouTube - ‪ALERT! DON'T KISS IN PUBLIC IT IS AGAINST THE LAW NOW, MAKE THIS VIRAL‬‏[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UyiaR1PDhQ]YouTube - ‪Fox News - Five People Arrested for Dancing‬‏[/ame]

 

[Toro]

She was completely incompetent in preventing the graft and corruption. She oversaw the massive mismanagement of the state pension system. She ran for CFO on a pro-business platform and didn't deliver anything but anti-business policies. She wasn't even a competent watchdog, blinded (perhaps willfully so) by her own bias that government employees are trustworthy.

That's nonsense. I know the pension fund well. There isn't massive mismanagement at the state pension fund. The pension fund is one of the best run in the country. Scott tried to paint her as being responsible for the $24 billion decline during the financial crisis, but the trustees - the governor, CFO and AG - do not make investment decisions. And Sink had no more to do with the pension fund than Crist or McCollum, or Bush before her.

Oh, and the St Pete Times is full of shit, in case you want to go there.

I did find it odd that a typically liberal St. Pete Times did that expose on it a few years ago. That said you don't think the CFO is responsible?

The CFO is not responsible. The state pension fund is overseen by three individuals, the Governor, the AG and the CFO. They don't make investment decisions. Nor should they. Do you want politicians making investment decisions? They are responsible for the long-term solvency of the plan. And the pension fund is one of the strongest pension funds in the country, with one of the, if the highest, highest funded ratio. That's not because of Sink, or at least it doesn't have anything more to do with Sink than it did with Crist or McCollum or Bush or Gallagher, etc. But to say that there is massive mismanagement is simply untrue.

Do you know what has changed at the pension fund since Scott was elected? Absolutely nothing. And do you know why? Because there is no need to.

 

[Toro]

State: State retiree loophole costs Florida $300M a year

DROP is not mismanagement at the fund. DROP is a program that was passed into law by legislators that allows individuals who are fully vested to continue working for state government. This has nothing to do with the pension fund. The fund just manages the assets of the plan participants.

Fund Frozen, Florida Towns Feel the Pinch - New York Times

This was even before the crash.

This is a fair criticism, but it needs context. The guy who was responsible for the fund was fired, and it was Alex Sink who initiated the firing. And the reason why he was fired was because he induced a run on a cash pool managed by the pension fund for counties and cities in Florida. The pool had assets under management of $25 billion and it was yielding about 4.5% before it collapsed. It had invested in a small amount of cash derivative products. During the financial crisis, many pension plans both public and private got caught holding these instruments, but the head of the pension plan was incompetent at communicating to plan participants what the issues were. As cash demand soared during the financial crisis, it became more difficult to raise cash, and markets for cash derivatives disappeared. When pool participants began pulling out, the pension fund redeemed all requests and made everyone whole. But soon, they found that with parts of the cash market frozen, they were jeopardizing remaining members of the pool. So they froze it and carved out the liquid and illiquid assets. At first, it was estimated that $800 million was at risk, or ~3% of the fund. Now, the official position is that $80 million will not be recovered, or ~0.3% of the fund. In fact, the last time I had discussions with knowledgeable people at the fund, they believe it will be closer to $30 million, or 0.12% of the fund. IOW, had there not been a run on the cash pool, those investing in it would have received 4.38% instead of 4.5%. The guy at the top of the pension fund lost his job over this because he handled the optics of the cash pool very badly, essentially inducing a run on the cash pool and creating a political crisis. But stuff like this happened a fair amount during the financial crisis, its just that it was high profile in the state of Florida.

 

[asterism]

Bullshit. Back up your lies or shut the fuck up.

State: State retiree loophole costs Florida $300M a year

Fund Frozen, Florida Towns Feel the Pinch - New York Times

This was even before the crash.

You're an imbecile.

What does either story have to do with Alex Sink? The first link is about a loophole, written into the law by REPUBLICANS. It sucks, but it's not corruption if it's legal.

The second story has nothing to do with the duties of Florida's CFO, so that's another FAIL from you.

I did find this part interesting, though:

Now angry depositors are asking much the same questions about Mr. Stipanovich, who was promoted to executive director in 2002 by then-Gov. Jeb Bush, and who worked closely with Lehman Brothers, the firm that sold Florida more of the subprime-tainted securities than any other firm.
Some of the purchases were in July and August, after the risks of subprime-mortgage related securities were widely known and most investors were shunning them. The timing of Florida’s purchases was first reported by Bloomberg News Service.


Mr. Stipanovich resigned on Dec. 4 and has declined to discuss his decisions.


Some local officials said in interviews that they were also eager to learn what role Mr. Bush might have played. A month after finishing his second term as governor last January, he formed a consulting firm, which in June was engaged by Lehman Brothers. Mr. Bush also sits on the board of Lehman Brothers’s private equity unit.
​

Thanks for more confirmation that Jeb is a sleazebag.

So the CFO doesn't oversee any of this?

 

[asterism]

That's nonsense. I know the pension fund well. There isn't massive mismanagement at the state pension fund. The pension fund is one of the best run in the country. Scott tried to paint her as being responsible for the $24 billion decline during the financial crisis, but the trustees - the governor, CFO and AG - do not make investment decisions. And Sink had no more to do with the pension fund than Crist or McCollum, or Bush before her.

Oh, and the St Pete Times is full of shit, in case you want to go there.

I did find it odd that a typically liberal St. Pete Times did that expose on it a few years ago. That said you don't think the CFO is responsible?

The CFO is not responsible. The state pension fund is overseen by three individuals, the Governor, the AG and the CFO. They don't make investment decisions. Nor should they. Do you want politicians making investment decisions? They are responsible for the long-term solvency of the plan. And the pension fund is one of the strongest pension funds in the country, with one of the, if the highest, highest funded ratio. That's not because of Sink, or at least it doesn't have anything more to do with Sink than it did with Crist or McCollum or Bush or Gallagher, etc. But to say that there is massive mismanagement is simply untrue.

Do you know what has changed at the pension fund since Scott was elected? Absolutely nothing. And do you know why? Because there is no need to.

State: State retiree loophole costs Florida $300M a year

DROP is not mismanagement at the fund. DROP is a program that was passed into law by legislators that allows individuals who are fully vested to continue working for state government. This has nothing to do with the pension fund. The fund just manages the assets of the plan participants.

Fund Frozen, Florida Towns Feel the Pinch - New York Times

This was even before the crash.

This is a fair criticism, but it needs context. The guy who was responsible for the fund was fired, and it was Alex Sink who initiated the firing. And the reason why he was fired was because he induced a run on a cash pool managed by the pension fund for counties and cities in Florida. The pool had assets under management of $25 billion and it was yielding about 4.5% before it collapsed. It had invested in a small amount of cash derivative products. During the financial crisis, many pension plans both public and private got caught holding these instruments, but the head of the pension plan was incompetent at communicating to plan participants what the issues were. As cash demand soared during the financial crisis, it became more difficult to raise cash, and markets for cash derivatives disappeared. When pool participants began pulling out, the pension fund redeemed all requests and made everyone whole. But soon, they found that with parts of the cash market frozen, they were jeopardizing remaining members of the pool. So they froze it and carved out the liquid and illiquid assets. At first, it was estimated that $800 million was at risk, or ~3% of the fund. Now, the official position is that $80 million will not be recovered, or ~0.3% of the fund. In fact, the last time I had discussions with knowledgeable people at the fund, they believe it will be closer to $30 million, or 0.12% of the fund. IOW, had there not been a run on the cash pool, those investing in it would have received 4.38% instead of 4.5%. The guy at the top of the pension fund lost his job over this because he handled the optics of the cash pool very badly, essentially inducing a run on the cash pool and creating a political crisis. But stuff like this happened a fair amount during the financial crisis, its just that it was high profile in the state of Florida.

Dismal record. Spin it how you like, but the position is "Chief Financial Officer" and these are state finances being mismanaged.